Scotland V Israel/Faroes. Official double match thread.

[davemclaren]

Just now, milky_26 said:

i missed that thread as well, however watt is only 27 so still has a chance

Not impossible but very unlikely imo. 

[milky_26]

1 hour ago, Lfhearts said:

You Tony Watts love child he has absolutely no chance of ever getting near squad.

Nisbet miles better 

oh look another thread where you are bumming up a hibs player and getting all aggressive and abusive. as i pointed out this season watt has more goals than nisbet thus is not miles better on current form

[kila]

Tony Watt wouldn’t be the worst choice to have on the bench considering our striking options right now.

[milky_26]

1 minute ago, davemclaren said:

Not impossible but very unlikely imo. 

i do agree it is probably unlikely however with the lack of real striking options surely he should be looked at. he might have been looked at by clarke and decided no.

[Unknown user]

7 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

Just feel you are being harsh on a guy who has been pivotal to our points tally calling him a weak link. A weak link is someone who is not capable of doing their job. What is the job of a Center forward? Has he done that job last 3 games? For me he has been one of the big positives at the minute. Maybe it’s just temporary but, playing his club football at a good level, improving himself, developing. Age 26 I think it’s perfectly possible he is about to have his peak years ahead of him which could be massive for Scotland if he can finish these balls in from the left, as he did last night magnificently, because that is one area we are very strong with 2 world class crossers of a ball. They will put balls on a plate which is meat and drink for a CF 

 

That's not true, a weak link is someone noticeably weaker than others. I don't think he's great at his main job either tbqh but he doesn't have much competition.

[Baxfee]

Thought adams was poor last night. Dykes worked his socks off although should have scored with the header. Been years since I’ve enjoyed a Scotland game like I did last night 

[wavydavy]

4 hours ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

I agree with this. He certainly isn't shite. He's not the best but he is an integral part of the team. He should have had a hattrick but his goal was a ripper.

 

Now Olly McBurnie. He is shite.

 

I think Dykes has something about him and I like his Aussie mentality.

 

Exactly.

[wavydavy]

Just now, Baxfee said:

Thought adams was poor last night. Dykes worked his socks off although should have scored with the header. Been years since I’ve enjoyed a Scotland game like I did last night 

 

I agree with Adams but he was involved in the lead up to McGinn's goal.

[A_A wehatethehibs]

2 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

That's not true, a weak link is someone noticeably weaker than others. I don't think he's great at his main job either tbqh but he doesn't have much competition.

It is true, the weak link is a guy whos let the team down and done nothing to make amends for it. Think you are judging him by the wrong standard mate this is the Scotland national team not Man United. He’s the first Scotland player to get 3 goals in 3 consecutive competitive games since Mo Johnson in 1989 😂

[Cruyff]

Dykes brings a lot to the team, he does a shit tonne of donkey work. Adams is meant to be the better striker of the two but he's not upto much. Dykes misses chances but at least he gets into positions to miss them, Adams doesn't even do that. 

[wavydavy]

6 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

Dykes brings a lot to the team, he does a shit tonne of donkey work. Adams is meant to be the better striker of the two but he's not upto much. Dykes misses chances but at least he gets into positions to miss them, Adams doesn't even do that. 

 

I agree totally. It is one area of the team where we really struggle as we don't have many decent strikers to choose from.

[Doc Rob]

44 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

Watt is a journeyman and his chance has passed.

Tony Watt is actually the opposite of a journeyman, which is usually used to mean ‘reliable but not outstanding’. Watt has talent - that has never been in doubt, and he has shown it in flashes throughout his career. But he has been unreliable at every club he has played for to date. For us, his first few games had us all excited that he might be the real deal, but after that he stank the place out and was rapidly moved on. The regularity with which this has happened in his career suggests his attitude is a big problem.

 

However, IF he can show some sustained form (and 4 goals in 8 games is better form than he has shown in many years) then I’d happily give him a chance. Big if, though.

[Unknown user]

15 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

It is true, the weak link is a guy whos let the team down and done nothing to make amends for it. Think you are judging him by the wrong standard mate this is the Scotland national team not Man United. He’s the first Scotland player to get 3 goals in 3 consecutive competitive games since Mo Johnson in 1989 😂

 

Aye, and well done to him for that.

But you're setting up a definition of weak link that he passes by focussing on his strengths. I still think he's a weak link in the team, below the standard of the rest.

It's likely that any other striker we bring in would be like too, which is a shame, but it is what it is

[A_A wehatethehibs]

20 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Aye, and well done to him for that.

But you're setting up a definition of weak link that he passes by focussing on his strengths. I still think he's a weak link in the team, below the standard of the rest.

It's likely that any other striker we bring in would be like too, which is a shame, but it is what it is

I think the difference here between us is I am using facts / objective measures to back up my point whereas you’re just saying “I think” - his goals over the last 3 games show him to be a strong link, not a weak link. He has delivered for us when we needed him most, absolutely pivotal in bagging these 9 points from 9 at the crucial moment in the group. Many a Scotland player has failed to deliver that type of goods when the chips were down. 

[Unknown user]

10 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

I think the difference here between us is I am using facts / objective measures to back up my point whereas you’re just saying “I think” - his goals over the last 3 games show him to be a strong link, not a weak link. He has delivered for us when we needed him most, absolutely pivotal in bagging these 9 points from 9 at the crucial moment in the group. Many a Scotland player has failed to deliver that type of goods when the chips were down. 

 

I think the difference is you're trying to win and I don't care, it's just a conversation. I don't agree with you, a decent striker would be doing much better IMO.

 

Plus, if he's scored 3 in 3 that means he scored 2 in the previous 16. 

It's great that he's having a purple patch but his record suggests it's the outlier rather than the norm.

 

We'll see, I'll be quite happy for him to become a great goalscorer for Scotland, right now I think he's a weak link.

[Hesh]

Can we have another McPhee thread please 😂

[gregzy2k7]

4 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

 

Would take Watt back at hearts, he's been on fire this season.

[bringonthesevco]

I think the debate about whether Dykes is a weak link or not is largely irrelevant .

 

is he brilliant = No

Do we have better = No

 

for all those saying he’s rubbish who do you propose playing up front !!

[ri Alban]

16 minutes ago, bringonthesevco said:

I think the debate about whether Dykes is a weak link or not is largely irrelevant .

 

is he brilliant = No

Do we have better = No

 

for all those saying he’s rubbish who do you propose playing up front !!

I'd give Christie a wee run up front beside Dykes. I like Adams, but he's not at the races atm.

[Mikey1874]

4 hours ago, kila said:

Tony Watt wouldn’t be the worst choice to have on the bench considering our striking options right now.

 

His intelligence and hold up play make him an option for Che Adams. 

 

But probably Clarke will stick with what he has unless there are injuries. 

Edited October 10, 2021 by Mikey1874

[stirlo]

5 hours ago, Cruyff said:

Dykes brings a lot to the team, he does a shit tonne of donkey work. Adams is meant to be the better striker of the two but he's not upto much. Dykes misses chances but at least he gets into positions to miss them, Adams doesn't even do that. 

 

Absolutely right. One thing I've noticed about Dykes the last few games, including the Euros, is that although he 'misses' a fair few chances in the sense of not scoring, he rarely misses the target. The header last night was a case in point. He didn't do a lot wrong. He headed the ball towards goal with plenty of power. Either side of the goalkeeper and it's a goal. If he just improves the accuracy of his finishing a bit, he would easily double his goals. The finish for his goal was very good and it would have been easy to miss. He's clearly not world class, but he's a very decent striker and the fact is he's considerably better than most of the strikers that have been capped for Scotland the last 20 years. Kenny Miller was decent but apart from him I really struggle to think of anyone else who would be on a level with Dykes.   

[Doc Rob]

15 minutes ago, stirlo said:

 

Absolutely right. One thing I've noticed about Dykes the last few games, including the Euros, is that although he 'misses' a fair few chances in the sense of not scoring, he rarely misses the target. The header last night was a case in point. He didn't do a lot wrong. He headed the ball towards goal with plenty of power. Either side of the goalkeeper and it's a goal. If he just improves the accuracy of his finishing a bit, he would easily double his goals. The finish for his goal was very good and it would have been easy to miss. He's clearly not world class, but he's a very decent striker and the fact is he's considerably better than most of the strikers that have been capped for Scotland the last 20 years. Kenny Miller was decent but apart from him I really struggle to think of anyone else who would be on a level with Dykes.   

The commentators made the point with the header that if he had headed it down into the ground rather than forward, the keeper would never have stopped it.

 

The difference between Dykes and a number of other players we’ve tried up front who are supposedly more technically gifted is that he actually scores goals, and on a regular basis. Oli McBurnie has 16 caps and hasn’t scored once.

Edited October 10, 2021 by Doc Rob

[iantjambo]

Dykes might not be the best but he’s doing the job for us. Scored in his last 3 games for us. 2 of them match winners.

[Jambo61]

7 hours ago, Gizmo said:

iPlayer doesn't even have last nights Sportscene highlights available yet unless I'm missing something. 

Sometimes I think we get what we deserve in terms of being treated with utter disdain by the broadcasters, what with the woeful worn out old blazers in the SFA and idiot-works Doncaster talking our game down all the time. 

The EWPL is being marketed well above our man's game, and probably earning much more!

[Unknown user]

2 hours ago, bringonthesevco said:

I think the debate about whether Dykes is a weak link or not is largely irrelevant .

 

is he brilliant = No

Do we have better = No

 

for all those saying he’s rubbish who do you propose playing up front !!

 

I said I didn't rate him, but I also don't think we've got anyone much better right now. If we had any quality up front we'd be pretty exciting just now, to be honest I'm starting to see the case for Watt, an international team needs a maverick who can make the difference IMO

He was unlucky with us but he is a talented lad

[Savage Vince]

Apologies if it's been mentioned but what was the mobile phone thing at 70 minutes all about? 

[Jambo92]

Unreal night last night, went along for first Scotland game in years and it was perfect, highs, lows, drama, karma, had everything.  Horrible location, horrible sightlines but 50,000 Scots will always sound like 500,000. 

 

On the performance itself, I felt the team was too scared in first half, too many easy passes, when we played quick ball and stretched wide we carved them open.

 

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

If Tony Watt played for Hibs with the exact same stats he’d have been called up.

[Bazzas right boot]

10 hours ago, Jambo61 said:

The EWPL is being marketed well above our man's game, and probably earning much more!

 

 

Yip, it has billing over our game on the BBC Web site. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

8 hours ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

If Tony Watt played for Hibs with the exact same stats he’d have been called up.

 

 

Good shout. 

 

 

[DG_HMFC]

10 hours ago, Savage Vince said:

Apologies if it's been mentioned but what was the mobile phone thing at 70 minutes all about? 

 

No idea, looked pretty good though.

[Cruyff]

Tony Watt has always been a good player it's just that he's had more experience and screwed the nut in the last few years. He can link play, hold the ball and create chances, not a great goalscorer but he offers something at least and with the very few options Scotland has upfront, he'd be worth a shot. 

[leginten]

21 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

His intelligence and hold up play make him an option for Che Adams. 

 

But probably Clarke will stick with what he has unless there are injuries. 

I keep expecting things to click for Adams in a Scotland shirt. He has skill, physique and he’s not the slowest. But it hasn’t really happened yet.

 

Thought Dykes had one of his better games all round, penalty and sitter notwithstanding. Decent first touch and actually went past defenders a couple of times. He was a handful.

[drumie jambo]

7 hours ago, DG_HMFC said:

 

No idea, looked pretty good though.

Same at the Moldova game. Feck knows why but maybe someone will enlighten us.

[will-i-am-a-jambo]

On 09/10/2021 at 18:32, jonnothejambo said:

Flower of Scotland and dicks in the crowd waving their phone torches...

 

Jesus wept. 

 

My brother was telling me during the game the phone torches were a tribute to Denis Law. 

[Morgan]

23 hours ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

If Tony Watt played for Hibs with the exact same stats he’d have been called up.

That is actually a pretty damning point.  👍

 

A point that is both correct and a wee bit ridiculous, when you think about it.

[Guest ToqueJambo]

10 hours ago, Cruyff said:

Tony Watt has always been a good player it's just that he's had more experience and screwed the nut in the last few years. He can link play, hold the ball and create chances, not a great goalscorer but he offers something at least and with the very few options Scotland has upfront, he'd be worth a shot. 

 

Also has a bit of gallusness that comes from having performed at a high level - certainly higher than Nisbet - that could help him perform on the international stage. 

[Smoked-Glass]

Can we play Israel every week 

[Bazzas right boot]

10 minutes ago, Smoked-Glass said:

Can we play Israel every week 

 

 

We do? 

[Smoked-Glass]

When is the draw for the play off

[highlandjambo3]

Any links to the game yet?

[Mikey1874]

[Longbaws]

Get into these ancient Egyptian ******* Scotland!!!

 

We're scoring at least 6 tonight 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

 

 

 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

I know the main focus today for Scotland is to collect all three points and keep Israel and Austria at a safe distance, but just looking at the seeding pots Scotland are in a knot of a lot of teams at 11 points, with a couple of teams not having played their sixth game yet. (No I don't expect Portugal to finish second either but things happen).

 

Seems that given the importance of GD, GF, and away goals, putting 4-5 across today should be a target.

 

 

 

[Kiwidoug]

Find it hard to credit that the Faroes are as good as they clearly are.  How many people live there?

Anyway, 3-0 win and I hope Fraser shows up well.

[Mikey1874]

 

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, Led Tasso said:

I know the main focus today for Scotland is to collect all three points and keep Israel and Austria at a safe distance, but just looking at the seeding pots Scotland are in a knot of a lot of teams at 11 points, with a couple of teams not having played their sixth game yet. (No I don't expect Portugal to finish second either but things happen).

 

Seems that given the importance of GD, GF, and away goals, putting 4-5 across today should be a target.

 

 

 

 

Are the top 2 through automatically?

[CostaJambo]

5 minutes ago, Kiwidoug said:

Find it hard to credit that the Faroes are as good as they clearly are.  How many people live there?

Anyway, 3-0 win and I hope Fraser shows up well.

Bit of a surprise that one, agree it's about time he had a really good game for Scotland. Nice to see Nesbit on the bench after talking himself up for a start in the press.

[Cruyff]

19 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

I'd take a punt at

 

                      Gordon 

          Hendry Hanley Tierney 

Fraser McTominay Gilmour Robertson 

              Christie    McGinn

                       Dykes 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Are the top 2 through automatically?

in each group, yes. 10 groups of top 2, plus two teams from Nations League who didn't make it otherwise.

 

Those 12 go into a seeding pot ranked by points, then GD, then away goals, then wins, then away wins (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_FIFA_World_Cup_qualification_–_UEFA_Second_Round).

 

Top six go into a pot and bottom six go into a pot. Random draw into three playoffs with four teams each.

 

So it's no golden ticket but obviously better to be in the top group than the bottom.