Thinking ahead

[Lfhearts]

2 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

I think yu will see us bid for players sooner rather than later. 

 

The midfield lad at St Mirren and Fuchs at Utd are the type of players I'd like us see bid for. 

Thank xxxx you are not in charge of recruitment, we are overrun with midfielders we need a cover right back and that's about it, subject to injuries.

[Pasquale for King]

9 minutes ago, theshed said:

 

Sorry but no chance we will be paying £500k for a player 

Throw in wages for this £500k player then your talking over a million so it ain’t happening 

 

Rangers drop two points at home after winning last 20 odd games in a row and all of a sudden we are talking about challenging for the league 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

 

We cant beat a terrible Aberdeen team and hibs at home and will be at least 20 points behind rangers and Celtic in a few months 

 

 

 

 

You’re right about not beating Aberdeen and Hibs, we let them off the hook. 
Celtic haven’t won away from home since February and are definitely there to be shot at, Rangers don’t look great either. Whether the manager can get the best out of the great team that’s been put together to get nearer to the uglies is another thing. 

Edited September 19, 2021 by Pasquale for King

[jr ewing]

37 minutes ago, part_time_jambo said:

It would make no difference. This squad still can't beat Hibs, Aberdeen or the mighty Ross County.

Make a huge difference. 

[part_time_jambo]

4 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

No. Nothing has changed, Budge still runs the club 

ok, to continue this train of thought, if some Arab or Russian zillionaires came in next week and purchased the FOH shares, would they be in charge, or still answer to Mrs Budge?

Not knocking Mrs Budge as she has done a lot for the club, but the setup seems strange to me that the owners don't control what they own.

[Guest ToqueJambo]

38 minutes ago, part_time_jambo said:

It would make no difference. This squad still can't beat Hibs, Aberdeen or the mighty Ross County.

 

On the other hand we're a point off the top, unbeaten in the league after a hard start. Not bad considering the predictions of bottom 6 and worse from many at the start of the season.

[EH11 2NL]

There will probably be a 10 in a row before there's a non old firm side wins the league unfortunately. More frequent 3rd place finishes, European group stages and a few more cups would be a challenging enough target for us. 

[part_time_jambo]

Just now, ToqueJambo said:

 

On the other hand we're a point off the top, unbeaten in the league after a hard start. Not bad considering the predictions of bottom 6 and worse from many at the start of the season.

I don't disagree, but it's frustrating because we should be in an even better position.

[Pasquale for King]

Just now, part_time_jambo said:

ok, to continue this train of thought, if some Arab or Russian zillionaires came in next week and purchased the FOH shares, would they be in charge, or still answer to Mrs Budge?

Not knocking Mrs Budge as she has done a lot for the club, but the setup seems strange to me that the owners don't control what they own.

Nobody can buy the FoH shares unless a huge percentage of us vote for it, might be 75% or 90/95% I’m not sure. Any new owner would obviously choose who ran the club. 
We are the major shareholders but Budge has surrounded herself with friends and hand picked guys like Stewart Wallace who admit they can’t challenge her. 
At present the two FoH nodding dogs on the board would need to be forced into calling an EGM to get rid of her. 

[1971fozzy]

2 minutes ago, part_time_jambo said:

I don't disagree, but it's frustrating because we should be in an even better position.

we were in the championship last season .  Think we are doing rather well  personally 

[GinRummy]

7 minutes ago, EH11 2NL said:

There will probably be a 10 in a row before there's a non old firm side wins the league unfortunately. More frequent 3rd place finishes, European group stages and a few more cups would be a challenging enough target for us. 

It shouldn’t be that challenging to finish third regularly though. We sell more season tickets and have FoH pumping in over £1.4 million a year. We need to get passed seeing 3rd as a challenge and start seeing anything less as a failure. 

Edited September 19, 2021 by GinRummy

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

14 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

No. Nothing has changed, Budge still runs the club 

Yip - franks reply totally irrelevant - gets mega triggered and doesn’t think it thru

 

 

[Jambo61]

17 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

In theory.  But shareholders would maybe have something to say. That would be a huge gamble and not please all their customers either

Maybe a bank??????????????

[luckydug]

25 minutes ago, part_time_jambo said:

On that point, how does it work that the majority shareholder/owners don't control what happens at the club? It didn't work that way with Robinson, Vlad, Budge etc.

Can you imagine the Man City owners for example putting in all that money, buying the club, then saying "ok, you can run it for me, I don't get a say in any decisions"? 

FOH pledgers should meet every Thursday in the Gorgie Suite and pick the team for the weekend. 

Substitutions could be made at half time by text voting. 

It's only fair😂

[Jambo61]

6 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Nobody can buy the FoH shares unless a huge percentage of us vote for it, might be 75% or 90/95% I’m not sure. Any new owner would obviously choose who ran the club. 
We are the major shareholders but Budge has surrounded herself with friends and hand picked guys like Stewart Wallace who admit they can’t challenge her. 
At present the two FoH nodding dogs on the board would need to be forced into calling an EGM to get rid of her. 

The 2 FoH nodding dogs are a minority on any board!

[CARDIFFBOY]

2 minutes ago, 1971fozzy said:

we were in the championship last season .  Think we are doing rather well  personally 

Too right pal, we have come a long way and with the right investment we can improve further. I am well happy with the current squad and the management team too. I see a top 4 finish this season no problem. HHGH

[Guest ToqueJambo]

3 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

Yip - franks reply totally irrelevant - gets mega triggered and doesn’t think it thru

 

 

 

Is she running the club the same way though? She's not is she - don't think anyone could say that. She's admitted certain mistakes and so far seems to have rectified the worst ones - well the worst one relying on one person too much and maybe letting sentimentality get in the way of decisions. She's also stepped back from the day to day.

 

At the same time she's sticking by what she's always done which is back every manager with cash to build the best team they can. You have to acknowledge that people can learn from mistakes surely?

Edited September 19, 2021 by ToqueJambo

[Pasquale for King]

6 minutes ago, Jambo61 said:

The 2 FoH nodding dogs are a minority on any board!

As owners maybe they should represent us more, don’t you think? 

[Pasquale for King]

11 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

It shouldn’t be that challenging to finish third regularly though. We sell more season tickets and have FoH pumping in over £1.4 million a year. We need to get passed seeing 3rd as a challenge and start seeing anything less as a failure. 

Hear hear. 

[frankblack]

7 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

Yip - franks reply totally irrelevant - gets mega triggered and doesn’t think it thru

 

 

 

No, its just you parroting the usual negative bollocks with the usual scapegoats without any thought that the club is now fan owned.

 

Budge is only there because FOH asked her to guide the club through the new transition of ownership.

[EH11 2NL]

7 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

It shouldn’t be that challenging to finish third regularly though. We sell more season tickets and have FoH pumping in over £1.4 million a year. We need to get passed seeing 3rd as a challenge and start seeing anything less as a failure. 

Yeah I do agree, but 2 3rd place finishes in 10 years, and 4 maybe 5? In 20 would suggest its a hard enough target for us. Hopefully the FOH can push us clear as the 3rd club. 

[GinRummy]

1 minute ago, EH11 2NL said:

Yeah I do agree, but 2 3rd place finishes in 10 years, and 4 maybe 5? In 20 would suggest its a hard enough target for us. Hopefully the FOH can push us clear as the 3rd club. 

Fair do’s. Walk before we can run type of thing. 

[luckydug]

3 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Is she running the club the same way though? She's not is she - don't think anyone could say that. She's admitted certain mistakes and so far seems to have rectified the worst ones - well the worst one relying on one person too much and maybe letting sentimentality get in the way of decisions. She's also stepped back from the day to day.

 

At the same time she's sticking by what she's always done which is back every manager with cash to build the best team they can. You have to acknowledge that people can learn from mistakes surely?

There is a section of our support (or any support for that matter) who are going to give the person running the club grief. 

What other way can the FOH model work ? 

We have to rely on individuals heading up the club and making decisions. 

Even when Vlad was around and we were able to spend money on good players some people were whinging. 

Now that we are trying to run the club on a sensible financial model folk are still moaning and wanting to sack people without having a clue as to who we could realistically appoint within our budget. 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

1 minute ago, luckydug said:

There is a section of our support (or any support for that matter) who are going to give the person running the club grief. 

What other way can the FOH model work ? 

We have to rely on individuals heading up the club and making decisions. 

Even when Vlad was around and we were able to spend money on good players some people were whinging. 

Now that we are trying to run the club on a sensible financial model folk are still moaning and wanting to sack people without having a clue as to who we could realistically appoint within our budget. 

 

 

I tend to think if the owner is backing the manager with cash, that's almost as good as it gets owner-wise because not every one does to the degree Budge does, probably because she is a genuine fan.

[GinRummy]

2 minutes ago, luckydug said:

There is a section of our support (or any support for that matter) who are going to give the person running the club grief. 

What other way can the FOH model work ? 

We have to rely on individuals heading up the club and making decisions. 

Even when Vlad was around and we were able to spend money on good players some people were whinging. 

Now that we are trying to run the club on a sensible financial model folk are still moaning and wanting to sack people without having a clue as to who we could realistically appoint within our budget. 

Like when Ann sacked Levein and dithered, then went on holiday, before finding a successor?

[luckydug]

8 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

As owners maybe they should represent us more, don’t you think? 

Maybe they do. 

Maybe their ideas just differ from yours. 

We've all got our own opinions on how things are run. 

So I'm not understanding what representing the fans means when these FOH guys on the board are fans themselves ? 

 

 

[portobellojambo1]

16 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

It shouldn’t be that challenging to finish third regularly though. We sell more season tickets and have FoH pumping in over £1.4 million a year. We need to get passed seeing 3rd as a challenge and start seeing anything less as a failure. 

 

Agree. I'm actually looking forward to the game, even though it seems I'll just have to follow it on the BBC website or TV as it appears we will not be offered an allocation of tickets for the game (something I'm discussing with FoH to see if we can achieve something which will see no tickets being allocated to Rangers for the fixture at Tynecastle in December).

 

I just want the team to go there accepting that when the game kicks off it is 11 versus 11, and we aren't starting the game in any sort of negative position. Don't take to the field shitting ourselves before the game kicks off, lets look and see what we can do if we function correctly. While I much prefer to see us winnnig football games this upcoming game at Ibrox is one where I'd be relatively happy if we could take a point and over the moon if we could do enough to secure all three points. They are just a football team and as such all football teams are beatable and can drop points.

[GinRummy]

2 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

Agree. I'm actually looking forward to the game, even though it seems I'll just have to follow it on the BBC website or TV as it appears we will not be offered an allocation of tickets for the game (something I'm discussing with FoH to see if we can achieve something which will see no tickets being allocated to Rangers for the fixture at Tynecastle in December).

 

I just want the team to go there accepting that when the game kicks off it is 11 versus 11, and we aren't starting the game in any sort of negative position. Don't take to the field shitting ourselves before the game kicks off, lets look and see what we can do if we function correctly. While I much prefer to see us winnnig football games this upcoming game at Ibrox is one where I'd be relatively happy if we could take a point and over the moon if we could do enough to secure all three points. They are just a football team and as such all football teams are beatable and can drop points.

That’s exactly the type of attitude we should have. 

[Wee Mikey]

2 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

Even outwith wining the league, 3rd place could be very rewarding. 

The of will be way out in front at some point tho, unfortunately. 

1st sentence, agreed.

2nd sentence, I'm not so sure about that (January window notwithstanding).

2 hours ago, Smith's right boot said:

I think yu will see us bid for players sooner rather than later. 

 

The midfield lad at St Mirren and Fuchs at Utd are the type of players I'd like us see bid for. 

1st sentence, agreed, although I've got a funny feeling that (given the quality already brought in) that Savage and the other people seeking talent will pull a rabbit out of the hat. Might be a free, or a loan, or an amazing whelmtastic coup at a cost.

 

2nd sentence, nah; methinks we've got enough midfield talent right now. A striker equivalent to Beni's quality (i.e. a proper talent not getting game time in a league stuffed fu' o' talent) plus the same for a RWB and we're sorted.

2 hours ago, Leveins Battalion said:

We need to get to a point where we are only signing 2/3 players per window.

 

Pretty sure soon with the continued level of FoH pledges we will be very competitive in the transfer market.😎

Totally true.

 

39 minutes ago, Robbies Tackle said:

Any team challenging the old firm in january will be pillaged to weaken us. 

Not just to weaken us, though; weaken any other team. Not to mention then either keeping said players warming the bench or loaning them out so as to have potential challengers taking points off each other.

 

I'm hoping that the days of the OF simply hoovering up players from whatever team is doing well (and simultaneously moaning about a lack of competition) is over (they decimated Dun U not so long ago as but one example). Doubt it though ... you're likely correct. Mind you, Celtic, in particular, have had that 'bicuit tin mentality' recently hence missing out on some solid players whilst shelling out literally MILLIONS on dross - oh, and somehow not valuing Craig Gordon to our glee and advantage. Just take a look at their 'keepers recently. Must've cost them multiple x our entire squad!

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

14 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

No, its just you parroting the usual negative bollocks with the usual scapegoats without any thought that the club is now fan owned.

 

Budge is only there because FOH asked her to guide the club through the new transition of ownership.

you probably won’t be surprised to hear that I don’t agree with your post here mate

 

[stevie1874]

5 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

Agree. I'm actually looking forward to the game, even though it seems I'll just have to follow it on the BBC website or TV as it appears we will not be offered an allocation of tickets for the game (something I'm discussing with FoH to see if we can achieve something which will see no tickets being allocated to Rangers for the fixture at Tynecastle in December).

 

I just want the team to go there accepting that when the game kicks off it is 11 versus 11, and we aren't starting the game in any sort of negative position. Don't take to the field shitting ourselves before the game kicks off, lets look and see what we can do if we function correctly. While I much prefer to see us winnnig football games this upcoming game at Ibrox is one where I'd be relatively happy if we could take a point and over the moon if we could do enough to secure all three points. They are just a football team and as such all football teams are beatable and can drop points.

Well said 👏👏

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

23 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Is she running the club the same way though? She's not is she - don't think anyone could say that. She's admitted certain mistakes and so far seems to have rectified the worst ones - well the worst one relying on one person too much and maybe letting sentimentality get in the way of decisions. She's also stepped back from the day to day.

 

At the same time she's sticking by what she's always done which is back every manager with cash to build the best team they can. You have to acknowledge that people can learn from mistakes surely?

whether accurate or not none of that makes franks reply any less irrelevant

 

as a big Craig levein fan while it’s great to see the difference savage appears to be making it’s also uncomfortable viewing as really highlighting how much levein lost his way

 

 

[frankblack]

3 minutes ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

you probably won’t be surprised to hear that I don’t agree with your post here mate

 

 

I'm absolutely fine with that. 👍

[frankblack]

1 minute ago, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

whether accurate or not none of that makes franks reply any less irrelevant

 

as a big Craig levein fan while it’s great to see the difference savage appears to be making it’s also uncomfortable viewing as really highlighting how much levein lost his way

 

 

 

It also makes your argument that Budge has given Neilson a free pass to fail look nonsense doesn't it?

[portobellojambo1]

15 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

As owners maybe they should represent us more, don’t you think? 

 

I think things will change in the not too distant future, with more being relayed to the FoH contributors. The one thing, strange though it may seem, is that FoH contributors have to understand that collectively we are effecively the owners of the club but the football board runs the club, many still don't seem to fully understand that.

 

The two persons on the board did raise many points at board meetings, but then it was effectively just as additional persons on the board. Now, the two persons from FOH on the football board are effectively speaking on behalf of the majority shreholding and hopefully the football board will take their comments on board a bit more, without the potential need for EGM's being called every other month

[Portable Badger]

22 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

As owners maybe they should represent us more, don’t you think? 

The reason most people signed up for FoH was the fact that it would be “fan owned but not fan run” !!!    Why can’t people get that simple phrase into their heads is beyond me !!   If we ran the club I would NOT have signed up to the FoH.   We, as fans, have enough of a say and influence on the Board imho

[Pasquale for King]

1 minute ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

I think things will change in the not too distant future, with more being relayed to the FoH contributors. The one thing, strange though it may seem, is that FoH contributors have to understand that collectively we are effecively the owners of the club but the football board runs the club, many still don't seem to fully understand that.

 

The two persons on the board did raise many points at board meetings, but then it was effectively just as additional persons on the board. Now, the two persons from FOH on the football board are effectively speaking on behalf of the majority shreholding and hopefully the football board will take their comments on board a bit more, without the potential need for EGM's being called every other month

We can only hope, Budge will make the decisions though as things stand. 

[Wee Mikey]

36 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

On the other hand we're a point off the top, unbeaten in the league after a hard start. Not bad considering the predictions of bottom 6 and worse from many at the start of the season.

Precisely. The next few games will be telling. Something is gonna give for the teams at or near the top and our upcoming fixtures vis-a-vis the others' is looking good. This is exactly when we have to gel properly (new signings will do so, IMO) and for Robbie and the players to get it right.

 

Too many posters seeking perfection whilst myopic to reality. We're clearly coming good.

 

I've tended to ignore the EPL last few seasons but, having watched MOTD last couple of weeks, that top league is littered with mistakes and downright howlers. Numerous point-blank misses, misplaced back-passes (that fella Mings last week anyone, just as one example?) As for some of the goal-keeping!!! And all from players who, individually, are getting paid more than our entire squad!

 

 

[Pasquale for King]

1 minute ago, Portable Badger said:

The reason most people signed up for FoH was the fact that it would be “fan owned but not fan run” !!!    Why can’t people get that simple phrase into their heads is beyond me !!   If we ran the club I would NOT have signed up to the FoH.   We, as fans, have enough of a say and influence on the Board imho

How can you have any idea what most fans signed up for?
Budge coined that phrase in her usual sneering manner when talking about fans that criticise her. She believes she’s untouchable, she’s not. 

It’s up to the FoH and those who contribute to decide how the club is run, collectively, no one person will decide this, the governance model can be changed in the future if we want it too. 

 

[Kiwidoug]

Imo there are two circumstances where we could pay a couple of million for players.  The first is all our income sources inc benefactors being buoyant.  The 2nd is that we get really big money for a player like Souttar.  Either is quite possible.

 

I don't think the board will be overly conservative.  I'm sure they would love to see us win the league and will be prepared to invest in it.

[stevie1874]

3 minutes ago, Kiwidoug said:

Imo there are two circumstances where we could pay a couple of million for players.  The first is all our income sources inc benefactors being buoyant.  The 2nd is that we get really big money for a player like Souttar.  Either is quite possible.

 

I don't think the board will be overly conservative.  I'm sure they would love to see us win the league and will be prepared to invest in it.

I know he’s not long arrived but when the time comes and we receive a good offer for Baningime (hopefully not this season or next) then maybe some of the transfer fee could be used to entice another such player in the same mould, ie young player not quite making at epl side. 

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

19 minutes ago, frankblack said:

 

It also makes your argument that Budge has given Neilson a free pass to fail look nonsense doesn't it?

still gnawing away mate

 

where did I say that?

 

 

[frankblack]

1 minute ago, Pasquale for King said:

How can you have any idea what most fans signed up for?
Budge coined that phrase in her usual sneering manner when talking about fans that criticise her. She believes she’s untouchable, she’s not. 

It’s up to the FoH and those who contribute to decide how the club is run, collectively, no one person will decide this, the governance model can be changed in the future if we want it too. 

 

 

You clearly have personal issues, with a deep hatred for someone who saved the club and has kept her word to hand it over to the fans.

 

The rest of your post shows a clear lack of understanding of FOH and how the club is to be run, with a naive understanding of business.  The fans will never control the day to day running of the club.

[Kiwidoug]

1 minute ago, stevie1874 said:

I know he’s not long arrived but when the time comes and we receive a good offer for Baningime (hopefully not this season or next) then maybe some of the transfer fee could be used to entice another such player in the same mould, ie young player not quite making at epl side. 

That's right imo.  We should set our sights high but within our means.

[Portable Badger]

4 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

How can you have any idea what most fans signed up for?
Budge coined that phrase in her usual sneering manner when talking about fans that criticise her. She believes she’s untouchable, she’s not. 

It’s up to the FoH and those who contribute to decide how the club is run, collectively, no one person will decide this, the governance model can be changed in the future if we want it too. 

 

 

5 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

How can you have any idea what most fans signed up for?
Budge coined that phrase in her usual sneering manner when talking about fans that criticise her. She believes she’s untouchable, she’s not. 

It’s up to the FoH and those who contribute to decide how the club is run, collectively, no one person will decide this, the governance model can be changed in the future if we want it too. 

 

It was pretty clear to me from the outset that the model was fan owned not fan run.   The Board can remove Budge not us.  We can tell the FoH members of our feelings and they communicate that to the Board.  It is the Boards decision to remove AB if they also feel she is not performing her duties effectively.

i will let others who know the intricacies of the governance model answer the last part but I do not belief we ,FoH, can just go ahead and change it without at least a supermajority if at all.

[frankblack]

Just now, MoncurMacdonaldMercer said:

still gnawing away mate

 

where did I say that?

 

 

 

The first post I quoted you on clearly implied that.

[frankblack]

1 minute ago, Portable Badger said:

 

It was pretty clear to me from the outset that the model was fan owned not fan run.   The Board can remove Budge not us.  We can tell the FoH members of our feelings and they communicate that to the Board.  It is the Boards decision to remove AB if they also feel she is not performing her duties effectively.

i will let others who know the intricacies of the governance model answer the last part but I do not belief we ,FoH, can just go ahead and change it without at least a supermajority if at all.

 

[Pasquale for King]

10 minutes ago, Portable Badger said:

 

It was pretty clear to me from the outset that the model was fan owned not fan run.   The Board can remove Budge not us.  We can tell the FoH members of our feelings and they communicate that to the Board.  It is the Boards decision to remove AB if they also feel she is not performing her duties effectively.

i will let others who know the intricacies of the governance model answer the last part but I do not belief we ,FoH, can just go ahead and change it without at least a supermajority if at all.

Fair enough, that’s two of you at least. I signed up to help the club, who ran it wasn’t an issue back then. 
Budge can be removed by the board not voting her back onto it, unlikely as it’s a group of hand picked people who are loyal to her. 
The FoH can call an EGM to change the board if it sees fit, again unlikely as she’s picked folk like Wallace, who admitted he can’t challenge her on any issue. 
It’s all explained by folk that know better than me, here. 

 

Edited September 19, 2021 by Pasquale for King

[part_time_jambo]

1 hour ago, luckydug said:

FOH pledgers should meet every Thursday in the Gorgie Suite and pick the team for the weekend. 

Substitutions could be made at half time by text voting. 

It's only fair😂

Now you've just gone too far.

[Portable Badger]

2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Fair enough, that’s two of you at least. I signed up to help the club, who ran it wasn’t an issue back then. 
Budge can be removed by the board not voting her back onto it, unlikely as it’s a group of hand picked people who are loyal to her. 
The FoH can call an EGM to change the board if it sees fit, again unlikely as she’s picked folk like Wallace, who admitted he can’t challenge her on any issue. 

I would hope all of who signed up to FoH was to help the club but the one thing I personally wanted reassurance was that the lunatics would not be running the asylum before I committed my money.

I sort of get some people’s thirst for AB to be removed but I personally don’t want that at all.   Yes she has made mistakes, yes certain could have been better/earlier/quicker but for me, over the piece, she’s done Avery good job. I want her around for the next few years to help bed in J Anderson & the other benefactors, the new CEO, etc ... and then go an enjoy her retirement.  I have been frustrated like others but I don’t “lose my shit” over it.

[Jambo61]

1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said:

As owners maybe they should represent us more, don’t you think? 

But a minority can't do much, can it?