Coronavirus Super Thread ( merged )

[vegas-voss]

10 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

The time to judge Sweden will be in a couple of years once the bigger picture becomes clearer. Sure they've taken a hit with excess deaths this year, but nobody yet knows how they will fare with second/third waves (if they come) with any increased level of antibodies in the general population on account of higher infection rates this time around. It may yet have proved a prudent tactic as other countries are forced back into stricter lockdowns. 

There's plenty of opposing expert opinion floating around but nobody really knows for sure.

Testing in Spain has revealed that the level of infected that develop antibodies is very low around 5% and other studies saying imunity from the virus could only be a matter of months.Sorry putting a downer on things would love to see some positive spin from other scientist.I take hope from the Italian reports though and hopefully the virus is weakening to levels that will change the game.

Edited July 15, 2020 by vegas-voss

[Governor Tarkin]

1 minute ago, vegas-voss said:

Testing in Spain has revealed that the level of infected that develop antibodies is very low around 5% and other studies saying imunity from the virus could only be a matter of months.Sorry putting a downer o  things would love to see some positive spin for other scientist.I take hope from the Italian reports though and hopefully the virus is weakening to levels that will change the game.

 

That's one study in one country.

 

You're not putting a downer on anything, just being pragmatic, but if you're generally worried about coronavirus you'll be naturally inclined to suck up the negative news.

 

They may well turn out be right, but the final proof will be in the pudding. No point in fretting too much until then.

 

 

 

[vegas-voss]

1 minute ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

That's one study in one country.

 

You're not putting a downer on anything, just being pragmatic, but if you're generally worried about coronavirus you'll be naturally inclined to suck up the negative news.

 

They may well turn out be right, but the final proof will be in the pudding. No point in fretting too much until then.

 

 

 

I keep an open mind about it now.

[Cade]

27 minutes ago, vegas-voss said:

Testing in Spain has revealed that the level of infected that develop antibodies is very low around 5% and other studies saying imunity from the virus could only be a matter of months.Sorry putting a downer on things would love to see some positive spin from other scientist.I take hope from the Italian reports though and hopefully the virus is weakening to levels that will change the game.

UK did a similar (and more in depth) study and found the same results.

Seems that Covid-19 antibodies don't last very long and reinfection is very possible.

 

[jack D and coke]

1 hour ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

The time to judge Sweden will be in a couple of years once the bigger picture becomes clearer. Sure they've taken a hit with excess deaths this year, but nobody yet knows how they will fare with second/third waves (if they come) with any increased level of antibodies in the general population on account of higher infection rates this time around. It may yet have proved a prudent tactic as other countries are forced back into stricter lockdowns. 

There's plenty of opposing expert opinion floating around but nobody really knows for sure.

Correct. As bonkers as it looks in the states who’s to say in 2-3 years they won’t be over  the worst of it and have a lot of immunity and we’re still at the messing about with lockdowns stage.  
Nobody knows. 

Edited July 15, 2020 by jack D and coke

[Taffin]

1 hour ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

That's one study in one country.

 

You're not putting a downer on anything, just being pragmatic, but if you're generally worried about coronavirus you'll be naturally inclined to suck up the negative news.

 

They may well turn out be right, but the final proof will be in the pudding. No point in fretting too much until then.

 

 

 

 

You can also view it positively that if people can be reinfected, it means they survived it the first time so you'd like to think they will the second time 👍

[The Real Maroonblood]

12 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Correct. As bonkers as it looks in the states who’s to say in 2-3 years they won’t be over  the worst of it and have a lot of immunity and we’re still at the messing about with lockdowns stage.  
Nobody knows. 

Are you in the pub yet?

[Jambo-Jimbo]

1 hour ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

That's one study in one country.

 

You're not putting a downer on anything, just being pragmatic, but if you're generally worried about coronavirus you'll be naturally inclined to suck up the negative news.

 

They may well turn out be right, but the final proof will be in the pudding. No point in fretting too much until then.

 

 

 

 

A study in the UK by a team from Kings College London got similar results to the Spanish research.

Seems that after around about 3 months many patients had no anti-bodies detected to the virus.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/12/immunity-to-covid-19-could-be-lost-in-months-uk-study-suggests

Edited July 15, 2020 by Jambo-Jimbo

[Pasquale for King]

9 hours ago, Georgecowie said:

Double the deaths with twice the population is not much of a headline is it? More testing done? Or I guess a soft lockdown would lead to more cases. But if the deaths per capita are pretty similar who is right and who is wrong? 

Slightly more than double the deaths and less than a quarter of cases would indicate we were right,they were slow to start testing but as it’s ramped up more cases were obviously found. Can’t see any comparisons or actual numbers regarding theirs and ours. 
https://www.reuters.com/article/health-coronavirus-sweden/coronavirus-cases-hit-daily-record-in-sweden-as-tests-ramp-up-idUSL8N2DO3PN

[Governor Tarkin]

6 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

A study in the UK by a team from Kings College London got similar results to the Spanish research.

Seems that after around about 3 months many patients had no anti-bodies detected to the virus.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/12/immunity-to-covid-19-could-be-lost-in-months-uk-study-suggests

 

The second wave had better hurry up then.

 

Seriously though, it's not surprising. We've all had the common cold more than once. Often more than once a year. Perhaps some populations will become acustomed to living/dealing with covid-19 in much the same way as we do with many other viruses. Nobody can say for certain whether countries who have fared the worst this time around may have a head start in this. Was there not someone who posted on here saying that they knew a person who had been infected twice, and the second time around the symptoms were much milder? I know that's anecdotal but we would do well to retain a level of measured optimism until we have greater visibility on how things may eventually pan out. This is unlikely to be until the other side of next winter at the earliest, imo.

 

6 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Are you in the pub yet?

 

And now down to more important matters.

[The Real Maroonblood]

Just now, Governor Tarkin said:

 

The second wave had better hurry up then.

 

Seriously though, it's not surprising. We've all had the common cold more than once. Often more than once a year. Perhaps some populations will become acustomed to living/dealing with covid-19 in much the same way as we do with many other viruses. Nobody can say for certain whether countries who have fared the worst this time around may have a head start in this. Was there not someone who posted on here saying that they knew a person who had been infected twice, and the second time around the symptoms were much milder? I know that's anecdotal but we would do well to retain a level of measured optimism until we have greater visibility on how things may eventually pan out. This is unlikely to be until the other side of next winter at the earliest, imo.

 

 

And now down to more important matters.

🍺👍

[JudyJudyJudy]

33 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Correct. As bonkers as it looks in the states who’s to say in 2-3 years they won’t be over  the worst of it and have a lot of immunity and we’re still at the messing about with lockdowns stage.  
Nobody knows. 

I'm a mindfulness person. Did a few courses .  I like the theory of it.  Basically there is nothing one can do about the past and  nothing you can do about the future . The only time we live in is the present.  Therefore it's no use worrying about the past as you cant change it and no use worrying about the future as you can't predict it. 

[Jambo 4 Ever]

[jack D and coke]

45 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Are you in the pub yet?

 meeting my mate back of 2😋💪🏼

21 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

I'm a mindfulness person. Did a few courses .  I like the theory of it.  Basically there is nothing one can do about the past and  nothing you can do about the future . The only time we live in is the present.  Therefore it's no use worrying about the past as you cant change it and no use worrying about the future as you can't predict it. 

[Governor Tarkin]

No deaths for a week, and the pub is open.

 

What a day to be alive.

 

 

 

Edit. Death rate below the five year average for three weeks in a row. Excellent news, although probably something to do with the pub being shut.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Governor Tarkin

[Dawnrazor]

2 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

No deaths for a week, and the pub is open.

 

What a day to be alive.

 

 

 

Edit. Death rate below the five year average for three weeks in a row. Excellent news, although probably something to do with the pub being shut.

And masks?!

[Don Dan]

Nicola Sturgeon LIVE: Seventh straight day with no further Covid-19 deaths in Scotland
 

very happy with this. 

[Governor Tarkin]

1 minute ago, Dawnrazor said:

And masks?!

 

Don't need them in the pub, twit.

[Dawnrazor]

1 minute ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Don't need them in the pub, twit.

😅

[Jambo-Jimbo]

24 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

The second wave had better hurry up then.

 

Seriously though, it's not surprising. We've all had the common cold more than once. Often more than once a year. Perhaps some populations will become acustomed to living/dealing with covid-19 in much the same way as we do with many other viruses. Nobody can say for certain whether countries who have fared the worst this time around may have a head start in this. Was there not someone who posted on here saying that they knew a person who had been infected twice, and the second time around the symptoms were much milder? I know that's anecdotal but we would do well to retain a level of measured optimism until we have greater visibility on how things may eventually pan out. This is unlikely to be until the other side of next winter at the earliest, imo.

 

 

And now down to more important matters.

 

That was me who posted that, it was a nurse at the BGH.

 

Totally agree there is still so much that we don't know about this thing, especially long term, will it become weaker, if you've had it once will you be less ill a second or third time you catch it, why are some people more badly affected than others are especially with the same comorbidities etc etc, this is why I'm on a clinical study being run by Edinburgh University exploring the question of is there something in your DNA which makes one person more susceptible to serious illness if you catch covid-19 from someone else.  It's all part of medical research trying to learn more about this thing.

[Ray Gin]

10 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

Nicola Sturgeon LIVE: Seventh straight day with no further Covid-19 deaths in Scotland
 

very happy with this. 

 

Great news. Stick to the FACTS guidelines and let's keep those deaths at zero. 

[SE16 3LN]

13 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

Nicola Sturgeon LIVE: Seventh straight day with no further Covid-19 deaths in Scotland
 

very happy with this. 

Great News

 

I was also happy to read today that NS doesn't have an anti English bone in her body, she is in  fact partly English and leads a party full of English people.

 

Come on Engerland

Edited July 15, 2020 by SE16 3LN
mistake

[Ray Gin]

2 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

Great News

 

I was also happy to read today that SG doesn't have an anti English bone in her body, she is in  fact partly English and leads a party full of English people.

 

Come on Engerland

 

Of course, being Pro-Scotland does not mean being anti-English.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Ray Gin

[Walter Bishop]

Alistair Haimes

@AlistairHaimes

30m

UK: #COVID19 triage call data, from NHS. The great thing about this highly infectious respiratory virus is that it doesn't spread by celebrations, protests, riots, pubs or restaurants. Good thing my 3 kids all missed a term of school though, because you know - just in case.

 

[Governor Tarkin]

1 minute ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

That was me who posted that, it was a nurse at the BGH.

 

Totally agree there is still so much that we don't know about this thing, especially long term, will it become weaker, if you've had it once will you be less ill a second or third time you catch it, why are some people more badly affected than others are especially with the same comorbidities etc etc, this is why I'm on a clinical study being run by Edinburgh University exploring the question of is there something in your DNA which makes one person more susceptible to serious illness if you catch covid-19 from someone else.  It's all part of medical research trying to learn more about this thing.

 

Excellent stuff Jimbo. Hopefull you get through the study with no ill effects or without too much hassle, and thanks for doing your bit in the pagger against this shitey disease.

[Dawnrazor]

47 minutes ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 Was there not someone who posted on here saying that they knew a person who had been infected twice, and the second time around the symptoms were much milder? 

I posted about my mates Dad who died of Covid after contracting it for a second time.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Dawnrazor

[Governor Tarkin]

1 minute ago, Dawnrazor said:

I posted about my mated Dad who died of Covid after contracting it for a second time.

 

That's rubbish mate.

 

Following on from Jambo-Jimbos post above, it just goes to show the unpredictable nature of the infection.

[Beni]

20 minutes ago, Walter Bishop said:

Alistair Haimes

@AlistairHaimes

30m

UK: #COVID19 triage call data, from NHS. The great thing about this highly infectious respiratory virus is that it doesn't spread by celebrations, protests, riots, pubs or restaurants. Good thing my 3 kids all missed a term of school though, because you know - just in case.

 

 

This guy also has also posted this meme

 

 

 

If my maths are correct, according to this meme with 575000 deaths so far, that works out at 172 billion people who have had the virus so far.

Seems legit.

 

 

[ri Alban]

4 hours ago, Lord BJ said:

Modelling isn’t designed to give a definitive answer. By their nature they have a large number of variables. These variable are tweaked to provide a variety of scenarios, 

 

These scenarios aren’t used to determine what happens. It more gives you a view of the direction of travel against other scenarios. 

 

Modelling is far from the be all and end all or even close to it. It’s just pieces of information that decision makers use to inform decisions. . 
 

As @Smithee points out the Neil Ferguson produced a variety of models that triggered the decision to make a lock down. However, the 400k scenario was just a scenario which was essentially do nothing. There were lots of alternate scenarios produced, willing to wager one or two won’t be a million miles away. What made it a ‘valuable’ piece of info is gave a indicator of the delta in terms of key factors between different strategies. 
 

As an aside Ferguson has came out after he resigned and claimed if we went into lockdown earlier we would have halved the death rate U.K. wide. 
 

Experts in something like this are in someways similar to  most people they don’t know the answer. They have a opinion which will be based on varying degrees of knowledge, access to info, Psychological biases etc.
 

Whilst, I’m of the belief they are probably they are best informed it doesn’t mean they are right.  It’s really a case of which expert you pick to believe🤷🏻‍♂️
 

@JamesM48 made a good post talking about the damage that lockdown has done and will do from economical and social aspect. I have to say I look at the damage lockdown has done and will do and finding myself wondering if the cure will turn out to be more damaging than the actual virus. Time will tell. 
 

We desperately need to get the wheels turning in Scotland. No one thinks the risk has disappeared, however, as humans we live with risks everyday. This Is another risk that we will learn to have to live with. However, following some pretty common sense procedures should see us ok. 

Ohh and @Governor Tarkin has clearly moved from Oxgangs and started residing in a number of posters mind. His ability to trigger posters😂

 

Must be pretty weak if  lockdown caused you to lose your mind. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

12 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Must be pretty weak if  lockdown caused you to lose your mind. 

It’s no wonder male suicide is at an all time high if people are described as “weak” cause they have struggled with lockdown . 

[Governor Tarkin]

32 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Must be pretty weak if  lockdown caused you to lose your mind. 

 

Come on, mate, eh. Ffs.

[Jambo 4 Ever]

1 hour ago, Dannie Boy said:

Nicola Sturgeon LIVE: Seventh straight day with no further Covid-19 deaths in Scotland
 

very happy with this. 

Good news

 

now everyone MUST follow all the social distancing rules and wearing of masks to keep the numbers down!

[Taffin]

18 minutes ago, JamesM48 said:

It’s no wonder male suicide is at an all time high if people are described as “weak” cause they have struggled with lockdown . 

 

It probably is indicative of being weak minded, but in the same way that if you found someone weak in the gym you shouldn't judge or laugh at them, instead you should try and help build them up. It's certainly nothing to be ashamed of and people should be encouraged to reach out for support and others should be forthcoming in giving that support as best they can.

 

Lockdown has hardly been the worst thing in the world, and if it has been for others then they should count themselves quite lucky. That doesn't mean they should be mocked or judged but instead helped and supported. I hope ri wasn't meaning his comment in a pejorative sense...but I have my doubts.

[Governor Tarkin]

1 hour ago, jonesy said:

Not at all. I don’t think any lives matter. That’s why I don’t wear a mask. 

 

 

[Cade]

 

[Don Dan]

excuse the link paper but sounds promising.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8525393/Hopes-build-UK-Covid-vaccine-Oxford-drug-trials-work.html

 

 

 

Hopes for a working Covid-19 vaccine are growing as two projects in the UK and US have reported promising results in their early experiments.

Teams from Oxford University and the American pharmaceutical company Moderna have both revealed people in their studies are showing signs of immunity.

They have been developing experimental jabs for months to try to protect millions of people from catching the coronavirus in future.   

Oxford scientists have already said they are '80 per cent' confident they can have a jab available by September.

People being given the Oxford vaccine have been developing antibodies and white blood cells called T cells which will help their bodies fight off the virus if they get infected, the researchers say.

And experts at Moderna, based in Cambridge, Massachusetts, said participants in their trial all successfully developed antibodies.

The vaccines work by tricking the body into thinking it's infected with Covid-19 and causing it to produce immune substances that have the ability to destroy it.

While early research focused on antibodies, scientists are increasingly turning to a type of immunity called T cell immunity — which is controlled by white blood cells — which has shown signs of promise.

One source on the Oxford project told ITV News: 'An important point to keep in mind is that there are two dimensions to the immune response: antibodies and T-cells. 

'Everybody is focused on antibodies but there is a growing body of evidence suggesting that the T-cells response is important in the defence against coronavirus.

 

https://www.itv.com/news/2020-07-15/positive-news-is-coming-on-oxford-covid-19-vaccine-writes-robert-peston

 

Edited July 15, 2020 by Dannie Boy

[Jambo-Jimbo]

2 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Excellent stuff Jimbo. Hopefull you get through the study with no ill effects or without too much hassle, and thanks for doing your bit in the pagger against this shitey disease.

 

There's nothing really much involved in it tbh, online questionaire/s & a DNA sample (which I had my raw data file already).

It's really just to compare different people who have and haven't had the virus, from all walks of life, health, ethnicity etc etc etc, in an effort to see if there is something which marks out certain people from others, in terms of either catching or developing worse symptoms between different people.

 

As we know BAME folks seem to be worse affected, is it something in their DNA, that's the sort of thing Edinburgh University wants to try and answer, but to do it they need people to give up their time & a DNA sample, maybe they'll find something maybe nothing.  Every wee bit helps, I reckon.

[Ray Gin]

2 hours ago, Walter Bishop said:

Alistair Haimes

@AlistairHaimes

30m

UK: #COVID19 triage call data, from NHS. The great thing about this highly infectious respiratory virus is that it doesn't spread by celebrations, protests, riots, pubs or restaurants. Good thing my 3 kids all missed a term of school though, because you know - just in case.

 

 

In that graph I'm seeing a rapid decline that levels off after VE day, raplidly declines again 2 weeks later, slightly rises after the BLM protests, drops again and then has maintained at much the same level for the past week or so.

It is also worth noting that those taking part in VE Day celebrations and BLM potests were relatively low compared to the general population.

 

 

[Taffin]

27 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

I think the statement of lockdown has hardly been the worst thing in the world is a bit subjective.

 

Quote

 

If sitting working from home or getting Boris bucks it may not be that bad. Not everyone is in that situation. 
 

If it’s caused you to loose your business or job and now worrying about how to pay bills, I suspect your view would be very different. Then there are people who suffered beareveremets and couldn’t say good bye to their loved one, couldn’t receive medical treatment for cancer, living in close quarters with abusive partners, isolation for many individual who weren’t permitted to see or have social interaction etc etc. 

 

Whilst a great deal of our civil liberties were restricted like never before. 
 

The lockdown hasn’t been without pretty severe consequences for people and many of the problems still need to dealt with. Lockdown will have undoubtably compounded the issues for many. These things to do tend effect the most vulnerable in society, as ri demonstrates from his many melt downs. 

I don’t think many people understand or want to understand the damage lockdown has done and still has to do from economic and social aspects. It will make the fall out of the financial crisis look like a mere blip. 

 

 

Don't disagree with any of that apart from that it's not the worst thing in the world. It may feel that way for some and I think the impact of lockdown will be huge and very damaging for many people but there's definitely worse things by a significant margin...mass famine, genocide, war, environmental devastation. All the things you mention are terrible things but they're a reality for people every day all over the world when lockdown isn't/wasn't in place. That's an awful thing to accept and it's terrible for those people but whilst they may feel it's the worst thing in the world right now, I think there's thing that would make it worse and as such it can't be the worst thing in the world.

Edited July 15, 2020 by Taffin

[ri Alban]

1 hour ago, Governor Tarkin said:

 

Come on, mate, eh. Ffs.

 

 

2 hours ago, Lord BJ said:

You must be incredibly weak minded, judging by your non sensical ramblings. Can’t say I’m surprised 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

 

 

 

 

Triggered, you say?! 

[jack D and coke]

No idea why it’s displaying sideways but welcome back into my life you thing of beauty😋

[JudyJudyJudy]

53 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

I think the statement of lockdown has hardly been the worst thing in the world is a bit subjective.

 

If sitting working from home or getting Boris bucks it may not be that bad. Not everyone is in that situation. 
 

If it’s caused you to loose your business or job and now worrying about how to pay bills, I suspect your view would be very different. Then there are people who suffered beareveremets and couldn’t say good bye to their loved one, couldn’t receive medical treatment for cancer, living in close quarters with abusive partners, isolation for many individual who weren’t permitted to see or have social interaction etc etc. 

 

Whilst a great deal of our civil liberties were restricted like never before. 
 

The lockdown hasn’t been without pretty severe consequences for people and many of the problems still need to dealt with. Lockdown will have undoubtably compounded the issues for many. These things to do tend effect the most vulnerable in society, as ri demonstrates from his many melt downs. 

I don’t think many people understand or want to understand the damage lockdown has done and still has to do from economic and social aspects. It will make the fall out of the financial crisis look like a mere blip. 

Great posting . Perfectly summarised . I think the lack of control over our lives , the feelings of doom and worry about myself or my loved ones and friends catching it has been a tremendous stress . Most people have felt this . It’s been unprecedented in our living memory . As you say Imagine gong through this and also losing your job or and a loved one . It’s been hell . No use saying it hasn’t . 

[OBE]

1 minute ago, jack D and coke said:

No idea why it’s displaying sideways but welcome back into my life you thing of beauty😋

 

Did you take a sip before taking it's photo? If not thats proper restraint...

[jack D and coke]

1 minute ago, OBE said:

 

Did you take a sip before taking it's photo? If not thats proper restraint...

Its not my first tbf☺️

[Frank]

2 hours ago, Natural Orders said:

Good news

 

now everyone MUST follow all the social distancing rules and wearing of masks to keep the numbers down!

OK, Karen.

[Taffin]

13 minutes ago, Lord BJ said:

I think we are probably in semantics territory.

 

Agreed.

 

Quote

 

Suffering is subjective, the issues you point out are hardly the worst thing in the world if they don’t effect you.  It’s not something that can be objectively stated. If someone lost there life as couldn’t receive a treatment. I would find it hard to disagree with subjective view that was worst thing in world tbh. 

 

Yes, agreed, but I said it in reference to lockdown. Lockdown in itself, isn't the worst thing in the world imo. Things that happen indirectly as a result of it may be for and individual though. 

 

Quote

 

I could make a very good argument that this crisis and all that’s comes from it is much worst than the issues raised. If for nothing else it impacts pretty much every person in the world, 

 

The virus and all that's come from, yeh sure, maybe you can make a good argument for that and I don't disagree but again I was speaking about lockdown only.

 

Quote

 

‘It could be worst’ is a just a bit of a sucker punch for those who have suffered I suggest. 

Whilst, I dread to think what the suffering is like in third world countries where the thing will just run riot. We have already seen mass graves in the like of Brazil

 

Anyway as I say think we’re in semantics territory. ‘It did comes across as though you were suggesting It wasn’t that big a issue.

 

Unfortunately it most certainly has been and the suffering for many had been great. Worsened by the fact most these people didn’t even have the opportunity to even turn anywhere in their tough time’s. 
 

 

 

Certainly not my intention to say it's not a big issue. It's a huge one, I'm firmly in the camp that the impact the measures will have may well outweigh the damage of the virus itself. I was just meaning that staying in your house for a couple of months (lockdown in and of itself) isn't the worst thing in the world; the indirect consequences of that and direct consequences of the virus itself are of course are horrific for many as you say.

 

 

Edit: I was actually in the main just trying to be positive from the perspective of it's hard for most of us but if we can find our blessings (be it recognising it's temporary, it could be worse, others are suffering more etc) then most (not all of course as they're the ones suffering more) of us can find solace in that and for those who don't have the strength to do that then we should help and support them to do so. 

Edited July 15, 2020 by Taffin

[milky_26]

5 minutes ago, OBE said:

 

Did you take a sip before taking it's photo? If not thats proper restraint...

i bet the first didn't touch the sides

[ri Alban]

1 minute ago, Lord BJ said:

 

😂

 

No just concerned for you. You have had a fair few meltdowns, even by your standard. You’ve clearly been struggling. 🤷🏻‍♂️
 

I'm great, bud. I just miss my Maw and Da at times. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

15 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

No idea why it’s displaying sideways but welcome back into my life you thing of beauty😋

What a beautiful site !  

[Jambo 4 Ever]

9 minutes ago, Frank said:

OK, Karen.

Eh?

who’s Karen?