Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 33 minutes ago, Cruyff said: Of course not but the US have said it was an accidental firing of a missle and Iran are saying mechanical failure. It's as if the Americans are trying to cover Iran's ass. So how do the Americans know it was an accident when the Iranians don't even want to admit it was a missle. It's absolutely ludicrous and they are both lying to cover up the real reasons. The Americans/West are giving Iran a diplomatic out here by saying it could have been an accident, can you not see that. And the reason is simple, the World and his dog knows that Iran have overstepped the mark here by shooting down a passenger plane, the Americans/West can now exert huge pressure on Iran to get back around the negotiating table and quite possibly the Russians could be applying pressure as well, why, because a few minutes before the Ukrainian plane was shot down an Aeroflot flight bound for Russia took off from the same airport, it could easily have been a Russian plane that was shot down instead of the Ukrainian plane. But whatever I say it's all just a waste of time because you are convinced it's all a conspiracy and no matter what I, the Americans or the Iranians say you'll still think it's all a conspiracy because that's what you want to believe and that won't change no matter what evidence comes to light, therefore there is no point in discussing this matter further with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Evil beings control this Earth! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, John Findlay said: It was mechanical failure. The Iranian SAM hit the planes engine, therefore causing it to have a mechanical failure. I'm not certain, but I'm fairly positive that the testing of a passenger planes engine doesn't include that it can withstand the impact of a SAM...so not sure how it could be classed as failure. Edited January 10, 2020 by Taffin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Taffin said: I'm not certain, but I'm fairly positive that the testing of a passenger planes engine doesn't include that it can withstand the impact of a SAM...so not sure how it could be classed as failure. Mate I think he was being facetious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 hours ago, Victorian said: New video footage seems to leave very little doubt. All those people snuffed out because of an epic **** up or a murderous deliberate act. It might be a decent idea to prevent them becoming a nuclear armed power then. Oh wait... Where's this footage available? 23 minutes ago, Taffin said: I'm not certain, but I'm fairly positive that the testing of a passenger planes engine doesn't include that it can withstand the impact of a SAM...so not sure how it could be classed as failure. Based upon what I saw (and without seeing Victorian's clip), the mechanicals looked pretty failed to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, I P Knightley said: Where's this footage available? Based upon what I saw (and without seeing Victorian's clip), the mechanicals looked pretty failed to me. Video on all sorts of media sites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Pictures of the plane wing show clear entry points of fragmentation from the air burst munition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, Victorian said: Video on all sorts of media sites. Ha-ha! That's what I get for coming to JKB before reading any news sites. Right at the top of the BBC News page - of course it is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, Victorian said: Video on all sorts of media sites. Which of course the Iranians are disputing the veracity of, quelle surprise there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 43 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Mate I think he was being facetious. 😂😂 Woosh for me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DETTY29 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 24 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Which of course the Iranians are disputing the veracity of, quelle surprise there. Expert on Radio Scitland says they look real enough, but can be easily photoshopped too. Covering all bases then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 2 hours ago, Cade said: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Having seen the video but being totally missile ignorant, I can say that the clear statement that the moving light in the sky was a missile, the explosion that followed was exactly what I would accept as being an impact between the missile and an aircraft. I also watched Donald Trumps press briefing. I am convinced that his personal motivation is to go and missile the country of Iran off the planet. However he did during the talk use language that was more conciliatory, I again have no doubt that he was well counselled prior to his appearance to keep the heid. If still going to Vegas my betting money would be that this is not over and that there will be in the not too distant future another serious loss of life. When you have two entities absolutely craving to do the other harm, it is more than likely to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maple Leaf Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 15 hours ago, indianajones said: I heard on the radio this morning that a certain Canadian city has a lot of Iranians living it. I think they even called it something like 'iranto'. That's a new one on me. There are about 95,000 Iranians in Toronto. In a population of about 4 million, that isn't much, and certainly isn't the biggest ethnic group. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said: That's a new one on me. There are about 95,000 Iranians in Toronto. In a population of about 4 million, that isn't much, and certainly isn't the biggest ethnic group. Come on. When did the media ever let the truth get in the way of a good story. Though in saying that 95,000 about half the population of the city of Dundee. Edited January 10, 2020 by John Findlay Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruyff Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Accident 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swanny17 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 See that video footage, would it not be reasonable to expect a larger explosion in the sky if a missile hit a passenger aircraft? Daft laddie question I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Swanny17 said: See that video footage, would it not be reasonable to expect a larger explosion in the sky if a missile hit a passenger aircraft? Daft laddie question I know. Only if the strike instantly ignited the fuel in the tanks. Anti-aircraft missiles don't usually work on high explosive basis but fragment to do as much damage over as wide an area as possible (they're designed to hit small fast planes after all). This is why pictures of downed aircraft are riddled with jagged holes. Hollywood lies to you. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuous-rod_warhead Edited January 10, 2020 by Cade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionDJambo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 I wonder if the Donald would be so calm if there had been some Americans on the flight? As for the Iranians, now allowing all the interested parties in after the crash site has been tampered with, big time. The western intelligence agencies will know exactly how that aircraft came down, just as they know what happened to the one that came down in Ukraine a few years ago. Satellites will have picked up and sent evidence which even Iran can't dispute. It looks like they are all drawing breath to see if some good can come of this catastrophe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said: Satellites will have picked up and sent evidence which even Iran can't dispute. You think that satellites constantly monitor every airstrip in the middle east in case of missile launches? Stop watching so many bad films. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 25 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said: I wonder if the Donald would be so calm if there had been some Americans on the flight? As for the Iranians, now allowing all the interested parties in after the crash site has been tampered with, big time. The western intelligence agencies will know exactly how that aircraft came down, just as they know what happened to the one that came down in Ukraine a few years ago. Satellites will have picked up and sent evidence which even Iran can't dispute. It looks like they are all drawing breath to see if some good can come of this catastrophe. That is why on the diplomatic front everyone is allowing the Iranians a way out of this disaster, but it is really up to Iran to grab the opportunity, whilst it is still open to them, and the clock is ticking. The good that could come from this, is if enough diplomatic pressure can be exerted upon the Iranians to force them back to the table and talk about a new nuclear deal, if and it is a big if, a deal could be agreed which prevents Iran from developing a nuclear bomb, then 176 poor souls wouldn't have died in vain, that has to be the big hope that everyone must work towards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionDJambo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 31 minutes ago, Cade said: You think that satellites constantly monitor every airstrip in the middle east in case of missile launches? Stop watching so many bad films. If you think that the US wouldn’t be blanket spying Iran, by satellite, especially when under threat of attack, you should start watching some bad films. There is no doubt the Americans know exactly what happened. It’s what they’re doing with the information that is intriguing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Swanny17 said: See that video footage, would it not be reasonable to expect a larger explosion in the sky if a missile hit a passenger aircraft? Daft laddie question I know. The footage I saw was basically because of distance all quite small, but the fireball that appeared after the strike looked like if it had been in full photograph exposure quite large. It was as is often described a fireball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 15 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said: If you think that the US wouldn’t be blanket spying Iran, by satellite, especially when under threat of attack, you should start watching some bad films. There is no doubt the Americans know exactly what happened. It’s what they’re doing with the information that is intriguing. Giving away information gives away what they can do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionDJambo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said: Giving away information gives away what they can do. Agreed. They have got something over the Iranians now, by the looks of it, and they’ll use it to their own best advantage. Donald might not even tell his mate, Boris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XB52 Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: That is why on the diplomatic front everyone is allowing the Iranians a way out of this disaster, but it is really up to Iran to grab the opportunity, whilst it is still open to them, and the clock is ticking. The good that could come from this, is if enough diplomatic pressure can be exerted upon the Iranians to force them back to the table and talk about a new nuclear deal, if and it is a big if, a deal could be agreed which prevents Iran from developing a nuclear bomb, then 176 poor souls wouldn't have died in vain, that has to be the big hope that everyone must work towards. You mean like the deal we had with them that prevented them developing a nuclear bomb? The one that trump kyboshed as his pals in Israel didn't like it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 13 minutes ago, XB52 said: You mean like the deal we had with them that prevented them developing a nuclear bomb? The one that trump kyboshed as his pals in Israel didn't like it The one and the same, and don't be shocked that it ends up like the NAFTA deal that Trump scrapped and then renegotiated, which looks awfully similar to the deal Trump scrapped in the first place, but Trump can then proclaim that his deal is the greatest deal in history, even if it's pretty much the same as the previous one. It's all about making the Donald look like the greatest deal maker in history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 CNN reporting that Trump told associates that he was under pressure from four Senators who were supporters of him in his Impeachment trial to take action against General Salemani. It is also being reported that in the briefings to Congress there was no mention of threats to Embassies as claimed by Trump, and there was no evidence of imminent threat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maroonlegions Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 7 hours ago, Cade said: Wee green men had feck all to do with it, not saying aliens are all wee green men but.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 I see the 'narrative' between Al Jazeera and Sky News is 180 degrees out of sink. Why's that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 And for anyone that missed it the first time around, here is the link to 'journalists' going on courses funded by Integrity Initiative. https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/foreign-office-funds-2m-infowars-13707574 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 The Fars News Agency has just announed that Iran will reveal how the plane crashed tomorrow. This is going to be interesting, either it'll be a pile of BS or could the Iranians be about to come clean and admit it was shot down by them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: The Fars News Agency has just announed that Iran will reveal how the plane crashed tomorrow. This is going to be interesting, either it'll be a pile of BS or could the Iranians be about to come clean and admit it was shot down by them. It might have been shot down by someone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redjambo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: The Fars News Agency has just announed that Iran will reveal how the plane crashed tomorrow. This is going to be interesting, either it'll be a pile of BS or could the Iranians be about to come clean and admit it was shot down by them. So they're involving time machines now. This gets curiouser and curiouser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Z Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, redjambo said: So they're involving time machines now. This gets curiouser and curiouser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 26 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: The Fars News Agency has just announed that Iran will reveal how the plane crashed tomorrow. This is going to be interesting, either it'll be a pile of BS or could the Iranians be about to come clean and admit it was shot down by them. Seriously? You haven't even given them a chance. Guilty! Tell me, where did the west get this video? Amazing isn't it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 22 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: It might have been shot down by someone else. We see a rocket light up in the sky. Don't know if I missed it, but I'd expect to see it light up from the ground, if it was from a fighter jet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 5 minutes ago, ri Alban said: We see a rocket light up in the sky. Don't know if I missed it, but I'd expect to see it light up from the ground, if it was from a fighter jet. The world is full of CIA, MI6, Mossad, FSB and whatever the Iranians call themselves agents, double agents and even triple agents. They both have multiple proxies in the area all having access to each other’s weapons, be it US, UK, French, Chinese and Russian manufacture. It could have been anybody or a mistake by Iran. One thing is, this exactly what the US wanted, get themselves back on the front foot again. That’s how these 3 dimensional chess games are played. Edited January 10, 2020 by Space Mackerel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: The world is full of CIA, MI6, Mossad, FSB and whatever the Iranians call themselves agents, double agents and even triple agents. They both have multiple proxies in the area all having access to each other’s weapons, be it US, UK, French, Chinese and Russian manufacture. It could have been anybody or a mistake by Iran. One thing is, this exactly what the US wanted, get themselves back on the front foot again. That’s how these 3 dimensional chess games are played. Iirc the American's have only ever said they suspect it was shot down by an Iranian missile rather than an Iranian...so you could be right. Edited January 10, 2020 by Taffin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: The world is full of CIA, MI6, Mossad, FSB and whatever the Iranians call themselves agents, double agents and even triple agents. They both have multiple proxies in the area all having access to each other’s weapons, be it US, UK, French, Chinese and Russian manufacture. It could have been anybody or a mistake by Iran. One thing is, this exactly what the US wanted, get themselves back on the front foot again. That’s how these 3 dimensional chess games are played. Did we find WMD in Iraq yet? Mind that. 11 minutes ago, ri Alban said: We see a rocket light up in the sky. Don't know if I missed it, but I'd expect to see it light up from the ground, if it wasn't* from a fighter jet. *Edit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 39 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: It might have been shot down by someone else. I wonder what the reaction would be , if Putin assassinated an American or UK General who was training groups he didn't like. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, ri Alban said: I wonder what the reaction would be , if Putin assassinated an American or UK General who was training groups he didn't like. The guy who founded the White Helmets who was found dead not so long ago in dodgy circumstances? Former MI6? What a weird world full of coincidences. James Le Mesurier: White Helmets co-founder died from fall, Turkey says https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-50808180 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 9 minutes ago, ri Alban said: Seriously? You haven't even given them a chance. Guilty! Tell me, where did the west get this video? Amazing isn't it. Wind your fecking neck in bud. Up until about an hour or two ago the Iranians were still insisting that it was too early to speculate on the cause of the crash and to wait until the investigations are complete, and now all of a sudden before any investigations have taken place on the ground and before the data from the black boxes is analysed they are now going to reveal the reason the plane crashed. The Iranians are doing the exact thing they are telling everybody else not to do. I can only see either one of two things, either they'll come out with some story of weather ballons et al or reveal that the plane was shot down, accidentally probably, because that door has been firmly wedged open for the Iranians to take. Even you have to admit that the bulldozing of the site before the Ukrainian investigators had arrived is highly irregular and extremely suspicious. As for the video it was sent to Bellingcat, they did not say where they got it from, only that it was sent to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 15 minutes ago, Taffin said: Iirc the American's have only ever said they suspect it was shot down by an Iranian missile rather than an Iranian...so you could be right. Im not saying I’m right, I’m just saying in these massive cat and mouse geo political games, dirty tricks and the media are one of the main weapons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: The guy who founded the White Helmets who was found dead not so long ago in dodgy circumstances? Former MI6? What a weird world full of coincidences. James Le Mesurier: White Helmets co-founder died from fall, Turkey says https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-50808180 I see ISIS are happy about the General who fecked them up on behalf of the US is dead. Well I never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Wind your fecking neck in bud. Up until about an hour or two ago the Iranians were still insisting that it was too early to speculate on the cause of the crash and to wait until the investigations are complete, and now all of a sudden before any investigations have taken place on the ground and before the data from the black boxes is analysed they are now going to reveal the reason the plane crashed. The Iranians are doing the exact thing they are telling everybody else not to do. I can only see either one of two things, either they'll come out with some story of weather ballons et al or reveal that the plane was shot down, accidentally probably, because that door has been firmly wedged open for the Iranians to take. Even you have to admit that the bulldozing of the site before the Ukrainian investigators had arrived is highly irregular and extremely suspicious. As for the video it was sent to Bellingcat, they did not say where they got it from, only that it was sent to them. Seriously? It was only an observation. Anyway, Iran are very much entitled to carry out the investigation and have all the evidence required to make a judgement. You or I may not like the answer, but, some will only believe their own prejudice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Space Mackerel Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 1 minute ago, ri Alban said: I see ISIS are happy about the General who fecked them up on behalf of the US is dead. Well I never. Yup. And the White Helmets were always embedded with Isis units, funnily enough, more than plenty photos of them waving their flags about. Make that of what you will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 Just now, Space Mackerel said: Yup. And the White Helmets were always embedded with Isis units, funnily enough, more than plenty photos of them waving their flags about. Make that of what you will. Mind Lockerbie? Did Iran or Libya have the chance to investigate or was it just Scotland/UK/America. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, ri Alban said: Seriously? It was only an observation. Anyway, Iran are very much entitled to carry out the investigation and have all the evidence required to make a judgement. You or I may not like the answer, but, some will only believe their own prejudice. No offence meant, I spoke out of turn, I'm usually much more measured than that, sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted January 10, 2020 Share Posted January 10, 2020 11 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said: Im not saying I’m right, I’m just saying in these massive cat and mouse geo political games, dirty tricks and the media are one of the main weapons. Being right can be dangerous to your health, better to live in ignorant bliss. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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