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systemx

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Tranent Juniors,Haddington Athletic and Musselburgh Athletic have announced substantial funding from East Lothian Council which will cover the cost of floodlights at their respective grounds which hopefully will lead to SFA licenses being granted.

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15 minutes ago, systemx said:

Tranent Juniors,Haddington Athletic and Musselburgh Athletic have announced substantial funding from East Lothian Council which will cover the cost of floodlights at their respective grounds which hopefully will lead to SFA licenses being granted.

What will Tranent become....Tranent Seniors ?

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been here before
4 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Just waiting for Midlothian and Fife Councils to follow suit.

 

Might have to employ a few more leeries at time and a half on a Saturday.

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25 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Just waiting for Midlothian and Fife Councils to follow suit.

The proof is Bonnyrigg Rose who had to get floodlights installed last season to gain SFA licence and promotion to the Lowland League.  Now they are topping it with a chance of getting into League 2.

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Footballfirst
1 hour ago, Alec Eiffel said:

The proof is Bonnyrigg Rose who had to get floodlights installed last season to gain SFA licence and promotion to the Lowland League.  Now they are topping it with a chance of getting into League 2.

Bonnyrigg did get hold of lights cheaply from the council as they were second hand from the old Newbattle school. I'm sure that Whitehill, Dalkeith and Arniston wouldn't mind some financial or material help in their direction.

 

In Fife, St Andrews, Inverkeithing, Burntisland and Crossgates would also appreciate help to get them licensed.

 

All that relates to the "senior" clubs. There are several more junior clubs that wouldn't mind being helped out too.

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2 hours ago, Victorian said:

Sounds like these clubs are better run than Hearts then.

 

Nae bursd at the helm. 

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3 hours ago, systemx said:

Tranent Juniors,Haddington Athletic and Musselburgh Athletic have announced substantial funding from East Lothian Council which will cover the cost of floodlights at their respective grounds which hopefully will lead to SFA licenses being granted.


excellent¬†news. ūüĎć

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4 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Bonnyrigg did get hold of lights cheaply from the council as they were second hand from the old Newbattle school. I'm sure that Whitehill, Dalkeith and Arniston wouldn't mind some financial or material help in their direction.

 

In Fife, St Andrews, Inverkeithing, Burntisland and Crossgates would also appreciate help to get them licensed.

 

All that relates to the "senior" clubs. There are several more junior clubs that wouldn't mind being helped out too.

 

Was thinking most of the Midlothian clubs already have floodlights but guess ones you've pointed out don't.

 

No danger they'll do anything at Arnie, ground move still on the cards?

 

Only one I'm surprised it as dalkeith not having them?

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5 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Bonnyrigg did get hold of lights cheaply from the council as they were second hand from the old Newbattle school. I'm sure that Whitehill, Dalkeith and Arniston wouldn't mind some financial or material help in their direction.

 

In Fife, St Andrews, Inverkeithing, Burntisland and Crossgates would also appreciate help to get them licensed.

 

All that relates to the "senior" clubs. There are several more junior clubs that wouldn't mind being helped out too.

Agreed....as some of you may know Whitehill Welfare are in the process of some major fundraising to have floodlights fitted before 1 June 2020 to maintain their sfa license.

 

a big well done to East Lothian council for helping these clubs, personally I can’t see Midlothian council helping anyone out.

 

the costs for Whitehill will be in the region of 20-30k, we have raised over 10k so far, but obviously any assistance would be a massive bonus for the club

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11 hours ago, systemx said:

Tranent Juniors,Haddington Athletic and Musselburgh Athletic have announced substantial funding from East Lothian Council which will cover the cost of floodlights at their respective grounds which hopefully will lead to SFA licenses being granted.

 

This is tremendous news.

 

Looking forward to heading along to Olivebank on Saturday to see Musselburgh Athletic play Jeanfield Swifts.

 

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Footballfirst
5 hours ago, Alan_R said:

 

Was thinking most of the Midlothian clubs already have floodlights but guess ones you've pointed out don't.

 

No danger they'll do anything at Arnie, ground move still on the cards?

 

Only one I'm surprised it as dalkeith not having them?

Dalkeith has lights, but is struggling with other issues in order to meet the SFA's Licensing criteria. 

 

I was only making the point that if assistance is available for floodlights in the East Lothian council area, then there could be a case for other councils to provide financial support for other developments by community clubs, not just limited to floodlights. 

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Fxxx the SPFL
2 hours ago, Lambo85 said:

 

This is tremendous news.

 

Looking forward to heading along to Olivebank on Saturday to see Musselburgh Athletic play Jeanfield Swifts.

 

why not Livingston :whistling:

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Allowayjambo1874
13 hours ago, RobboM said:

The gap between the former Junior sides that have moved into the East of Scotland Leagues and the ones that stayed behind has grown very quickly.

 
I appreciate your talking about the east coast teams but have to say I’m very surprised at Auchinleck’s progress in the Scottish cup. Kelty bossing it it in the lowland league and top of the second division Cove both put out by them. Thought that the juniors might be on their last legs but they are making a strong case for continuing them on in the west. 

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13 hours ago, RobboM said:

The gap between the former Junior sides that have moved into the East of Scotland Leagues and the ones that stayed behind has grown very quickly.

 

I believe that the more forward thinking ex-Junior sides like Kelty and Bonnyrigg will take over the Lowland League with the old Senior teams like Dalbeattie, Gala & Vale of Leithen struggling.  Selkirk & Hawick have already gone.

 

I undertand that in the west, Junior clubs like Auchinleck are also looking to move into the Lowland League.  Making the Scottish league truly pyramidal.  

  

In the EoS Premier League ex-Junior clubs like Bo'ness, Camelon, Tranent, Hill O'Beath, Broxburn, Linlithgow, etc. have taken over. The old Senior clubs are now in the lower divisions.

  

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5 minutes ago, Allowayjambo1874 said:

 
I appreciate your talking about the east coast teams but have to say I’m very surprised at Auchinleck’s progress in the Scottish cup. Kelty bossing it it in the lowland league and top of the second division Cove both put out by them. Thought that the juniors might be on their last legs but they are making a strong case for continuing them on in the west. 


There's been a debate in Junior football over the past couple of years about integrating the Juniors into the SPFL pyramid. The debate has been accelerated becuase of Kelty's move followed by the exodus of the top East Junior sides last season. There was (serious) talk all through last season about integrating the remaining Junior sides but it is a far more complex issue than Brexit ūüėČ
You are certainly right though that the West Junior Superleague remains a very high standard but even if the top West teams get involved there will be a bottleneck in the whole process of moving through the pyramid as the Lowland League only has 1 relegation spot. In turn there is only 1 promotion spot from the Highland/Lowland league into the SPFL Div 2.

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5 minutes ago, Tasavallan said:

 

I believe that the more forward thinking ex-Junior sides like Kelty and Bonnyrigg will take over the Lowland League with the old Senior teams like Dalbeattie, Gala & Vale of Leithen struggling.  Selkirk & Hawick have already gone.

 

I undertand that in the west, Junior clubs like Auchinleck are also looking to move into the Lowland League.  Making the Scottish league truly pyramidal.  

  

In the EoS Premier League ex-Junior clubs like Bo'ness, Camelon, Tranent, Hill O'Beath, Broxburn, Linlithgow, etc. have taken over. The old Senior clubs are now in the lower divisions.

  


If Auchinleck took the lead (like Kelty did in the East) then I have no doubt plenty of other West Juniors would follow. However, I think they are content as the big fish in the wee pool hoovering up trophies whereas other West clubs like Clydebank, Pollok are keener on the Pyramid and the possiblity of SFA licensing and entering the Scottish Cup.

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6 minutes ago, RobboM said:


If Auchinleck took the lead (like Kelty did in the East) then I have no doubt plenty of other West Juniors would follow. However, I think they are content as the big fish in the wee pool hoovering up trophies whereas other West clubs like Clydebank, Pollok are keener on the Pyramid and the possiblity of SFA licensing and entering the Scottish Cup.

 

I doubt we would lose the West Region Juniors entirely, or the North and East Regions for that matter.  To be truly pyramidal, in line with what the SFA are striving for, I expect that the winners of the 5 premier leagues (West, North & East Juniors plus EOS and SOS Seniors) will have a play-off at the end of season to determine who will play the bottom team in League 2 for promotion/ relegation.  If the Junior leagues come into the pyramid then expect 2, or more, teams getting relegated from an expanded Lowland League each season.  Progress.    

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Allowayjambo1874
14 minutes ago, RobboM said:


There's been a debate in Junior football over the past couple of years about integrating the Juniors into the SPFL pyramid. The debate has been accelerated becuase of Kelty's move followed by the exodus of the top East Junior sides last season. There was (serious) talk all through last season about integrating the remaining Junior sides but it is a far more complex issue than Brexit ūüėČ
You are certainly right though that the West Junior Superleague remains a very high standard but even if the top West teams get involved there will be a bottleneck in the whole process of moving through the pyramid as the Lowland League only has 1 relegation spot. In turn there is only 1 promotion spot from the Highland/Lowland league into the SPFL Div 2.

Think that most of the west teams were not too bothered but were sitting up and taking notice as to how quickly Kelty and Bonnyrigg are progressing. 
 

unfortunately as someone has mentioned reckon the progressive clubs will rise and the older more traditional clubs may sink. Sad to say it but don’t think we’ll see East Stirling or Berwick Rangers back for a very long time if ever.

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5 minutes ago, Tasavallan said:

 

I doubt we would lose the West Region Juniors entirely, or the North and East Regions for that matter.  To be truly pyramidal, in line with what the SFA are striving for, I expect that the winners of the 5 premier leagues (West, North & East Juniors plus EOS and SOS Seniors) will have a play-off at the end of season to determine who will play the bottom team in League 2 for promotion/ relegation.  If the Junior leagues come into the pyramid then expect 2, or more, teams getting relegated from an expanded Lowland League each season.  Progress.    

The Lowland League and the Highland league already have that play off to determine who plays the bottom SPFL2 team. Problem with integration is geography. You have 2 regions in the SFA, Highland and Lowland and 3 regions in the Juniors, East West and North. The whole of the West Region Juniors could move en masse with no structural changes into the level feeding the Lowland League. The whole of the North Region could fit into place under the Highland League (there are no feeder leagues to the Highland League currently).

In the East though you have the equivalent of the Northern Ireland border problem for Brexit. There are teams in the East Region Juniors who, geographically for the SFA, fit under the Highland League. You have the remaining East Region Junior sides in Fife and West Lothian who already have the East of Scotland League that exists on the same geographical footprint.  What would be the point of 2 identical leagues covering the same area? If Junior Clubs are to move into the pyramid they need to play by the same SFA rules on registration, discipline, ground criteria etc. Once you accept that point there is no role for the Scottish Junior FA .... other than running the Scottish Junior Cup. The SJFA have no intention of negotiating themselves out of existence so have no incentive to move forward with integrating Junior Clubs into the SFA Pyramid.

More than 1 relegation spot from the Lowland League certainly would be progress though

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6 minutes ago, Allowayjambo1874 said:

Think that most of the west teams were not too bothered but were sitting up and taking notice as to how quickly Kelty and Bonnyrigg are progressing. 
 

unfortunately as someone has mentioned reckon the progressive clubs will rise and the older more traditional clubs may sink. Sad to say it but don’t think we’ll see East Stirling or Berwick Rangers back for a very long time if ever.

 

Auchinleck were featured on A View from the Terrace.  Their Chairman said (I parrot phrase) that while playing in the West Super League was financially profitable for the club they were under 'pressure' from the suits to enter into the pyramid.  It may be that the West Region Juniors keep its league structure and only the winner of the Super League would enter into play-offs for promotion to League 2.  I very much doubt that traditional teams in the lower leagues like Albion Rovers, Brechin City, Cowdenbeath, etc. would rise again if they are relegated from League 2.  

 

If the level below League 2 is the Highland, Lowland and South of Scotland Leagues then I suspect that the Lowland League will likely expand to 2, or more, divisions to accommodate the number of ex-Junior clubs wanting to join.  Linlithgow Rose must be the next ex-Junior club to rise, assuming they get the sponsors.

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Smith's right boot

They'll be asking for funding for the wumunz team soon. 

 

Council has far more important things to be spending money on, like off setting the massive central government funding shortfall through the austerity polices placed on them by wm. 

 

Nah, that's good news. 

Will allow them to go up a level as folk have said. 

 

Grass roots football is important. 

 

 

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Sexton Hardcastle
14 hours ago, Victorian said:

Sounds like these clubs are better run than Hearts then.

What because they got hand outs and went begging cap in hand to the local authority?

 

Aye hearts are shite for not doing the same. Absolute riddy 

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Just now, Sexton Hardcastle said:

What because they got hand outs and went begging cap in hand to the local authority?

 

Aye hearts are shite for not doing the same. Absolute riddy 

 

You thought I was making a serious point?    

 

Riddy indeed.

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16 minutes ago, RobboM said:

The Lowland League and the Highland league already have that play off to determine who plays the bottom SPFL2 team. Problem with integration is geography. You have 2 regions in the SFA, Highland and Lowland and 3 regions in the Juniors, East West and North. The whole of the West Region Juniors could move en masse with no structural changes into the level feeding the Lowland League. The whole of the North Region could fit into place under the Highland League (there are no feeder leagues to the Highland League currently).

In the East though you have the equivalent of the Northern Ireland border problem for Brexit. There are teams in the East Region Juniors who, geographically for the SFA, fit under the Highland League. You have the remaining East Region Junior sides in Fife and West Lothian who already have the East of Scotland League that exists on the same geographical footprint.  What would be the point of 2 identical leagues covering the same area? If Junior Clubs are to move into the pyramid they need to play by the same SFA rules on registration, discipline, ground criteria etc. Once you accept that point there is no role for the Scottish Junior FA .... other than running the Scottish Junior Cup. The SJFA have no intention of negotiating themselves out of existence so have no incentive to move forward with integrating Junior Clubs into the SFA Pyramid.

More than 1 relegation spot from the Lowland League certainly would be progress though

 

You forgot the South of Scotland League.  In the current play-offs the winners of the SOS League play the winners of the Lowland League to determine who plays the winners of the Highland League to play the bottom club in League 2.

 

Also the rules of the Lowland League allow for more than 1 team to be relegated to EOS or SOS leagues (to be determined by the League).  I suspect this depends on which team(s) is coming up and who has SFA licences/floodlights, etc. Like last season, Bonnyrigg were initially rejected due to not having floodlights but eventually replaced Whitehill after protest and getting a set of lights. 

 

The only issue for me is where will the West Juniors fit into the Pyramid structure (if at all).

Edited by Tasavallan
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Footballfirst

The success in the EOSFL in attracting significant numbers of former junior clubs into the senior ranks with the possibility of becoming SFA licensed has led to a long overdue upgrading of facilities among those clubs both old and new.

 

Floodlights are only part of the upgrading process, with more cover, seating, improved toilet and disabled facilities being planned or installed at most grounds.  

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2 minutes ago, Tasavallan said:

 

You forgot the South of Scotland League.  In the current play-offs the winners of the SOS League play the winners of the Lowland League to determine who plays the winners of the Highland League to play the bottom club in League 2.

 

Also the rules of the Lowland League allow for more than 1 team to be relegated to EOS or SOS leagues (to be determined by the League).  I suspect this depends on which team(s) is coming up and who has SFA licences/floodlights, etc. Like last season, Bonnyrigg were initially rejected due to not having floodlights but eventually replaced Whitehill after protest and getting a set of lights. 

 

The only issue for me is where will the West Juniors fit into the Pyramid structure.


You're mixing up some of the levels Tasavallan.

South of Scotland winners(if licenced) are Tier 6 and play off against East of Scotland winners (if licenced), who are also Tier 6, for a Lowland League spot Tier 5. West Juniors would fit in at this level too so the West of Scotland winners Tier 6 (if licenced) would be in a 3 way play off for the Lowland League spot Tier 5.

Last season the relegation from the Lowland League was complicated by the fact that Selkirk started the season then went into abeyance and also that Berwick Rangers were relegated into the Lowland League from SPFL2 Tier 4. 

It's long winded to write all that, sorry!ūüôā , but most folks think the West Juniors would fit in to the pyramid as the West Seniors with very little change required.

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Footballfirst
28 minutes ago, Tasavallan said:

You forgot the South of Scotland League.  In the current play-offs the winners of the SOS League play the winners of the Lowland League to determine who plays the winners of the Highland League to play the bottom club in League 2.

 

Also the rules of the Lowland League allow for more than 1 team to be relegated to EOS or SOS leagues (to be determined by the League).  I suspect this depends on which team(s) is coming up and who has SFA licences/floodlights, etc. Like last season, Bonnyrigg were initially rejected due to not having floodlights but eventually replaced Whitehill after protest and getting a set of lights. 

 

The only issue for me is where will the West Juniors fit into the Pyramid structure.

I think the challenge of accommodating the West Juniors into the Pyramid remains just as difficult now as it did when the SFA set up its Pyramid Working Group a few years ago.  It seems as if the Juniors wish to protect their structure, but bolted onto the existing pyramid structure, thus providing the benefits of being inside the pyramid, but retaining their independence. I don't think that is a sustainable position.

 

My solution wouldn't be a Lowland League 2, but for the Lowland League to split on a regional basis with East and West leagues at tier 5 on a par with the Highland league. That approach would have the benefits of better reflecting the population distribution being weighted towards the central belt. The playoffs for entry to the SPFL would need to be adapted accordingly.

 

A Lowland League West could accommodate existing LL members, East Kilbride, Cumbernauld, Caledonian Braves, BSC Glasgow etc., along with the best of the West Region Juniors like Auchinleck, Pollok, Beith, Rob Roy, Clydebank etc. Derogation for a year or two to obtain SFA Licences would be necessary for the new clubs. The remaining West Juniors would form a WOSFL equivalent to the EOSFL at tier 6 and below.

 

The vacancies in what would be the Lowland League East could see accelerated promotion for Linlithgow, Bo'ness, Penicuik, Broxburn etc, rather than the trickle feed entry to current LL setup. 

Edited by Footballfirst
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1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

I think the challenge of accommodating the West Juniors into the Pyramid remains just as difficult now as it did when the SFA set up its Pyramid Working Group a few years ago.  It seems as if the Juniors wish to protect their structure, but bolted onto the existing pyramid structure, thus providing the benefits of being inside the pyramid, but retaining their independence. I don't think that is a sustainable position.

 

My solution wouldn't be a Lowland League 2, but for the Lowland League to split on a regional basis with East and West leagues at tier 5 on a par with the Highland league. That approach would have the benefits of better reflecting the population distribution being weighted towards the central belt. The playoffs for entry to the SPFL would need to be adapted accordingly.

 

A Lowland League West could accommodate existing LL members, East Kilbride, Cumbernauld, Caledonian Braves, BSC Glasgow etc., along with the best of the West Region Juniors like Auchinleck, Pollok, Beith, Rob Roy, Clydebank etc. Derogation for a year or two to obtain SFA Licences would be necessary for the new clubs. The remaining West Juniors would form a WOSFL equivalent to the EOSFL at tier 6 and below.

 

The vacancies in what would be the Lowland League East could see accelerated promotion for Linlithgow, Bo'ness, Penicuik, Broxburn etc, rather than the trickle feed entry to current LL setup. 

So Tranent are an etc.haha

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1 hour ago, Footballfirst said:

My solution wouldn't be a Lowland League 2, but for the Lowland League to split on a regional basis with East and West leagues at tier 5 on a par with the Highland league. That approach would have the benefits of better reflecting the population distribution being weighted towards the central belt. The playoffs for entry to the SPFL would need to be adapted accordingly.

 

I would agree FF.  The LL has to be of a manageable size: 2 divisions or East/West split.  Then the Highland League may also need to be modified to bring in the North Juniors.  All these leagues can be semi-autonomous until the Play-Offs to enter the SPFL. 

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Smith's right boot

So could teams like Tranent  Jand Musselburgh A  and such in theory--end up in league 3? 

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10 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

So could teams like Tranent  Jand Musselburgh A  and such in theory--end up in league 3? 

yes if they win respective leagues and playoffs etc and have an SFA License

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2 hours ago, RobboM said:


You're mixing up some of the levels Tasavallan.
 

 

Indeed I did.  I was a level out.

 

To quote Wiki:

Since 2014‚Äď15, the winners of the East of Scotland Football League and the South of Scotland Football League take part in an end of season play-off for a place in the Lowland Football League, subject to both clubs meeting the licensing criteria for promotion.

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3 hours ago, Tasavallan said:

If the level below League 2 is the Highland, Lowland and South of Scotland Leagues then I suspect that the Lowland League will likely expand to 2, or more, divisions to accommodate the number of ex-Junior clubs wanting to join.  Linlithgow Rose must be the next ex-Junior club to rise, assuming they get the sponsors.

Only if they win the East of Scotland League and also then the play off against the south of scotland league. Which looking at that league, the winners of the East League are pretty much stick ons to go up. At the moment the top team in the east league is Bo'ness, who have just had floodlights installed and are going for their SFA licence at the moment (i believe) 
 

image.png.eac84fda63b54a0b5d411790e31f0146.png

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Smith's right boot
55 minutes ago, systemx said:

yes if they win respective leagues and playoffs etc and have an SFA License

 

Thanks 

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4 hours ago, RobboM said:


There's been a debate in Junior football over the past couple of years about integrating the Juniors into the SPFL pyramid. The debate has been accelerated becuase of Kelty's move followed by the exodus of the top East Junior sides last season. There was (serious) talk all through last season about integrating the remaining Junior sides but it is a far more complex issue than Brexit ūüėČ
You are certainly right though that the West Junior Superleague remains a very high standard but even if the top West teams get involved there will be a bottleneck in the whole process of moving through the pyramid as the Lowland League only has 1 relegation spot. In turn there is only 1 promotion spot from the Highland/Lowland league into the SPFL Div 2.

Good idea would be to create and SPF League 3, top teams invited to join.. 

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6 minutes ago, jumpship said:

Good idea would be to create and SPF League 3, top teams invited to join.. 


Noooooooo! It really wouldn't ūüėč

Last thing we need is another Scotland wide division of part time teams.
Invited to join? There's already a pyramid in place that lets teams get promoted on merit like Edinburgh City and Cove Rangers.

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6 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

Dalkeith has lights, but is struggling with other issues in order to meet the SFA's Licensing criteria. 

 

I was only making the point that if assistance is available for floodlights in the East Lothian council area, then there could be a case for other councils to provide financial support for other developments by community clubs, not just limited to floodlights. 

What about the team that represents the capital of midlothian? If Easthouses got floodlights, does that mean they could climb the leagues with a view to promotion to league 2?  If I win the euro millions I'm going to fund their aim for world domination.  If they did have the resources,  could easthouses climb the league? 

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1 minute ago, FruitJuice said:

What about the team that represents the capital of midlothian? If Easthouses got floodlights, does that mean they could climb the leagues with a view to promotion to league 2?  If I win the euro millions I'm going to fund their aim for world domination.  If they did have the resources,  could easthouses climb the league? 

Easthouses Lily already has floodlights, is SFA licensed, played in this season's Scottish Cup and yes ........ they can climb the league pyramid.

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43 minutes ago, richiehmfc said:

Only if they win the East of Scotland League and also then the play off against the south of scotland league. Which looking at that league, the winners of the East League are pretty much stick ons to go up. At the moment the top team in the east league is Bo'ness, who have just had floodlights installed and are going for their SFA licence at the moment (i believe) 
 

image.png.eac84fda63b54a0b5d411790e31f0146.png

 

I agree with you about Bo'ness but my own local club, Broxburn were unlucky to lose out to Bonnyrigg in the EOS play-offs last season, are so far unbeaten and have games in hand this season.  Broxburn have a lovely little ground  at Albyn Park with lights and an SFA licence.  The good thing is that this season we do not have 3 conference winners going into the play-offs.   

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39 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

What about the team that represents the capital of midlothian? If Easthouses got floodlights, does that mean they could climb the leagues with a view to promotion to league 2?  If I win the euro millions I'm going to fund their aim for world domination.  If they did have the resources,  could easthouses climb the league? 

Easthouses. ūü§Įūüė≥

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52 minutes ago, Footballfirst said:

Easthouses Lily already has floodlights, is SFA licensed, played in this season's Scottish Cup and yes ........ they can climb the league pyramid.

Seriously? Yes!  Come ahead ya jambo swines...

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10 minutes ago, FruitJuice said:

What you saying Dave?  Don't diss the Hooses! 

My mum and other relatives on her side of the family came from the Hoose. I lived there for 6 months after I was born until we moved upmarket to Bonnyrigg. 

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