More Tory lies

[Gundermann]

2 hours ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

No opportunity for drama, outrage or faux offence with that though.  

[Mikey1874]

4 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

If you are a refugee and think that if you risk your life crossing the channel you may well just end up in Rawanda you willl either apply legally or even better stay in the EU 

Its a deterrent for sure - improving the processing time for legal applications will do feck all to stop illegal entry and people trafficking 

It's definitely a vote loser for Labour to over turn it though .

 

The risk for the Conservatives is flights to Rwanda actually becomes a vote loser for them.

 

That actually doing it makes them cruel and incompetent given there are other solutions. And timing it for good weather proving it makes no difference to Channel crossings. 

[i wish jj was my dad]

If dumping people in Rwanda is ever any form of vote winner the country is even more ****ed than I thought. 

You'd have to be a special type of **** to support a plan like that. 

[The Mighty Thor]

5 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

If you are a refugee and think that if you risk your life crossing the channel you may well just end up in Rawanda you willl either apply legally

tell us how an asylum seeker can apply legally plz?

[The Real Maroonblood]

10 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

If dumping people in Rwanda is ever any form of vote winner the country is even more ****ed than I thought. 

You'd have to be a special type of **** to support a plan like that. 

The resident Village Idiot proves your point about being a special type of ****.

[bairdy]

Surely there must be a better alternative to sending these people to Rwanda.

I'm quite sure the 'MI5', (or whoever in the UK ), Interpol, The French Police etc, know who some of the heads of these gangs are, Starmer is correct, these are the people the combined forces of the UK& France should be going after. I presume they are, but it doesn't look as if they're making a dent in the gangs orginisations.

[Mikey1874]

Happy St George's Day.

 

 

[i wish jj was my dad]

6 minutes ago, bairdy said:

Surely there must be a better alternative to sending these people to Rwanda.

I'm quite sure the 'MI5', (or whoever in the UK ), Interpol, The French Police etc, know who some of the heads of these gangs are, Starmer is correct, these are the people the combined forces of the UK& France should be going after. I presume they are, but it doesn't look as if they're making a dent in the gangs orginisations.

That's an actual solution though. These ****s are only interested in stirring up knuckle draggers. 

[Korky]

7 minutes ago, bairdy said:

Surely there must be a better alternative to sending these people to Rwanda.

I'm quite sure the 'MI5', (or whoever in the UK ), Interpol, The French Police etc, know who some of the heads of these gangs are, Starmer is correct, these are the people the combined forces of the UK& France should be going after. I presume they are, but it doesn't look as if they're making a dent in the gangs orginisations.

My guess is that it’s a lot more difficult than we know otherwise the UK and French authorities would have clamped down more effectively before now.

Starmer’s sound bite about going after the gangs is a bit like Rachel Reeves promise to raise billions by eliminating tax avoidance.

 

[manaliveits105]

1 minute ago, Korky said:

My guess is that it’s a lot more difficult than we know otherwise the UK and French authorities would have clamped down more effectively before now.

Starmer’s sound bite about going after the gangs is a bit like Rachel Reeves promise to raise billions by eliminating tax avoidance.

 

They will be a disaster 

[manaliveits105]

19 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

tell us how an asylum seeker can apply legally plz?

Are you saying there's no legal asylum seekers ?? 
just google it - the infos all there for you 

[Lone Striker]

3 hours ago, Footballfirst said:

I see that the passing of the Rwanda bill is having an immediate impact ........ not!

 

Five people - three men, a woman and a child - have died while attempting to cross the sea from France to Britain this morning.

The French coastguard said the small boat was overloaded and carrying 110 people when the incident happened at about 5am on Tuesday.

 

It’s turning out to be another busy day in the Channel.

We’ve watched the Border Force bring in a first group of migrants to Dover. We counted around 70 people - including women and children.

A second Border Force boat is also heading in, along with the Dover lifeboat, laden with people.

Conditions in the Channel are very calm - it’s what Border Force label a red day, meaning crossings are expected in large numbers. That forecast is certainly proving to be the case.

 

Its a bit ironic that one arm of the Govt (Home Office Border Force) are playing a humanitarian role by "stopping the boats" and taking the occupants to safe detention centres - while Sunak is focused on the unlawful law  to fly  300 of them to an unsafe country as a means of "stopping the boats".

 

One can only imagine the political pressure thats been put on Air Tanker to  be the carrier for these asylum seekers.  "Oh, we've just realised that your contract with the RAF is coming up for renewal soon ? How interesting...."

 

 

 

 

[i wish jj was my dad]

3 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Its a bit ironic that one arm of the Govt (Home Office Border Force) are playing a humanitarian role by "stopping the boats" and taking the occupants to safe detention centres - while Sunak is focused on the unlawful law  to fly  300 of them to an unsafe country as a means of "stopping the boats".

 

One can only imagine the political pressure thats been put on Air Tanker to  be the carrier for these asylum seekers.  "Oh, we've just realised that your contract with the RAF is coming up for renewal soon ? How interesting...."

 

 

 

 

I thought we'd seen the worst of it with Thatcher. This mob are on a completely different level. 

[The Mighty Thor]

12 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

Are you saying there's no legal asylum seekers ?? 
just google it - the infos all there for you 

I'm saying there is currently no legal route open to an asylum seeker to enter the UK.

 

Actually i'm not saying that, the Refugee Council are saying that.

 

So you post the legal routes for asylum seekers on here and i'll fire it round t'internet and the small boats will vanish overnight.

 

 

Edited April 23 by The Mighty Thor

[Lone Striker]

25 minutes ago, bairdy said:

Surely there must be a better alternative to sending these people to Rwanda.

I'm quite sure the 'MI5', (or whoever in the UK ), Interpol, The French Police etc, know who some of the heads of these gangs are, Starmer is correct, these are the people the combined forces of the UK& France should be going after. I presume they are, but it doesn't look as if they're making a dent in the gangs orginisations.

Its probably just like the drug gangs.  Make a bust to nab the bad guys at the top, and  usually  some other bad guys muscle in to take over the running of it.   

 

If there's a constant demand for something illegal, bad guys will always find a way to  provide it at  extortionate cost.

 

  

 

 

[manaliveits105]

Tell them or their representatives to try Claim Asylum in the UK on www.gov.uk 

or just hang on till Labour get in 

 

 

[Mikey1874]

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

3 hours ago, Gizmo said:

 

Not from a piss taking mildly sarcastic jocular what if on a football forum, but because of highly visible threats and ill-tempered and ill-judged intemperate comments from high profile politicians and journalists. 

 

Perhaps if you genuinely read that comment as a serious threat to Liz Truss you should refer it to the plod under the hate crime legislation. 

 

But you didn't, did ya. 

 

 

No mate I’m no a grass . I did the adult thing by challenging it on this forum . 
 

I’ll leave the reporting of comments like that to Humzas army ! However they may be informed by the over stretched police  that this type of comment is not covered in the recent hate crime legislation 

[Lone Striker]

9 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

Tell them or their representatives to try Claim Asylum in the UK on www.gov.uk 

or just hang on till Labour get in 

 

 

Surely you remember the "hostile environment" policy championed by Theresa May and then Braverman ?   Several Acts were passed to make it impossible to claim asylum in the UK when you're not yet in the UK, and to make it difficult for 3rd party organisations like the Refugee Council to make the claim on your behalf.

 

Part of the problem relating to the huge volume of over-loaded small boats is the lies being told by the people-smugglers to the poor souls they're fleecing before piling  dozens of them on to inflatables.  

 

 

[MR INCREDIBLE]

Should have saved all the money we give to the Frogs and Rwanda and bought a lot of extra boats to patrol the channel and basically turn them round !

Might be a few casualties but they’ll soon learn 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

[Lone Striker]

Dominic Casciani's legal commentaries are usually spot-on

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-68841417

[The Real Maroonblood]

10 minutes ago, MR INCREDIBLE said:

Should have saved all the money we give to the Frogs and Rwanda and bought a lot of extra boats to patrol the channel and basically turn them round !

Might be a few casualties but they’ll soon learn 🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

[Lone Striker]

Maybe I'm just thick, but can anyone explain how the Rwanda Bill stops asylum seekers from "jumping the queue " ?

 

And in what way were they "jumping the queue" previously ?  

 

Rwanda bill live - Sunak says plan will stop 'queue-jumping' asylum seekers

Human rights organisations have criticised the new legislation, which could see asylum seekers sent to Rwanda in 10-12 weeks.

 

Rishi Sunak has said the Rwanda Scheme will stop asylum seekers from "jumping the queue", following the deaths of five people, including one child, in an attempt to cross the English Channel.

Speaking in a press conference alongside NATO chief Jens Stoltenberg, Sunak was asked about his reaction to the five deaths hours after the controversial Rwanda bill to deport asylum seekers was passed by parliament.

Sunak said it was "incredibly sad to hear about the deaths in the Channel," adding that it underscores how important it is to stop these criminal gangs".

 

He said that it was "costing a fortune" to house asylum seekers, adding: "Of course it's unfair. And it undermines our British notion of fairness that people are jumping the queue."

 

 

[manaliveits105]

37 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Surely you remember the "hostile environment" policy championed by Theresa May and then Braverman ?   Several Acts were passed to make it impossible to claim asylum in the UK when you're not yet in the UK, and to make it difficult for 3rd party organisations like the Refugee Council to make the claim on your behalf.

 

Part of the problem relating to the huge volume of over-loaded small boats is the lies being told by the people-smugglers to the poor souls they're fleecing before piling  dozens of them on to inflatables.  

 

 

It's simple If you can't manage to apply to come to the UK legally then don't come - go elsewhere legally. 

 if they were to believe the jkb comrades on here they would soon  realise the UK is a really shit place to live anyway 

[Victorian]

5 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Maybe I'm just thick, but can anyone explain how the Rwanda Bill stops asylum seekers from "jumping the queue " ?

 

And in what way were they "jumping the queue" previously ?  

 

Rwanda bill live - Sunak says plan will stop 'queue-jumping' asylum seekers

Human rights organisations have criticised the new legislation, which could see asylum seekers sent to Rwanda in 10-12 weeks.

 

Rishi Sunak has said the Rwanda Scheme will stop asylum seekers from "jumping the queue", following the deaths of five people, including one child, in an attempt to cross the English Channel.

Speaking in a press conference alongside NATO chief Jens Stoltenberg, Sunak was asked about his reaction to the five deaths hours after the controversial Rwanda bill to deport asylum seekers was passed by parliament.

Sunak said it was "incredibly sad to hear about the deaths in the Channel," adding that it underscores how important it is to stop these criminal gangs".

 

He said that it was "costing a fortune" to house asylum seekers, adding: "Of course it's unfair. And it undermines our British notion of fairness that people are jumping the queue."

 

 

 

Nuance of language is critical and not an accident.  Your typical gammon understands the concept of a queue being jumped.  Something that is unfair,  underhand,  cheating,  mustn't be allowed,  etc.  Your gammon's sense of British fairness will be insulted and they will have sympathy with the proposed remedy.

[Lone Striker]

12 minutes ago, Victorian said:

 

Nuance of language is critical and not an accident.  Your typical gammon understands the concept of a queue being jumped.  Something that is unfair,  underhand,  cheating,  mustn't be allowed,  etc.  Your gammon's sense of British fairness will be insulted and they will have sympathy with the proposed remedy.

As I suspected then.  Create a crazy policy, wear down the Lords legal objections till they fall asleep & just give up, then justify it with a made-up nonsense  sound-bite.   

 

If  (and its a big IF) a journalist dares to ask him to explain what "queue jumping" has to do with it, it'll be a word salad b0ll0cks nonsense reply.     Much like Boris Johnson would have done.

 

 

[Victorian]

3 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

As I suspected then.  Create a crazy policy, wear down the Lords legal objections till they fall asleep & just give up, then justify it with a made-up nonsense  sound-bite.   

 

If  (and its a big IF) a journalist dares to ask him to explain what "queue jumping" has to do with it, it'll be a word salad b0ll0cks nonsense reply.     Much like Boris Johnson would have done.

 

 

 

Pretty much.  You wont see a question being answered directly.  Word salad,  bullshit,  stock phrases,  outright lies.

 

The problem to be solved has always been infinitely more valuable than finding a solution.  Portray yourself as the only one capable of getting it done.  The other guy hasn't got a plan,  etc.  

 

Gutter politics.

[Lone Striker]

28 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

It's simple If you can't manage to apply to come to the UK legally then don't come - go elsewhere legally. 

 if they were to believe the jkb comrades on here they would soon  realise the UK is a really shit place to live anyway 

... and yet thousands prefer to risk their lives and hand over their life savings to  criminals just to come here clinging on to the edge of an inflatable   instead of staying in France and seeking EU asylum there ?   So much for the "hostile environment".

 

Maybe if the UK Govt actually organised a proper process for asylum seekers to apply before they set foot in the UK, the small boat crossings might reduce.   The EU seems to have (or intending to have) such an arrangement in place throughout the 27.

 

Seems to me that the smugglers are probably  telling them that the UK is a soft touch, land of milk & honey,  and a benefits heaven.   Maybe even recruiting some of them to carry out phone scams.

 

  

[Tazio]

Luckily the patriots have been celebrating St George's Day by keeping London safe.

 

St George's Day central London rally turns violent as brawl with police erupts and four arrests (msn.com)

[Victorian]

One of the main reasons they come is the hopelessly broken asylum system.  People can come here and spend years while their cases eventually receive a decision.  Instead of pretending you're creating a meaningful deterrent of the possibility of being palmed off to Rwanda,  the actual solution is to remove or greatly diminish the attraction that encourages people to come.  Pour all of the money being wasted into a working processing system that provides decisions in weeks.  As well as that,  provide safe routes and enter into agreements on numbers,  quotas,  etc.  In tandem,  enter agreements that 'illegal' crossings (small boats) arrivals are returned to Europe on the same or next day.

 

No point crossing by small boat.  You go back instantly.  Come via a safe route.  No queues being jumped.  Case decided in weeks.  Most cases are approved anyway.

 

But solutions are not on the agenda.  Perpetuating the manufacted problem is the agenda.

[Lone Striker]

1 minute ago, Victorian said:

One of the main reasons they come is the hopelessly broken asylum system.  People can come here and spend years while their cases eventually receive a decision.  Instead of pretending you're creating a meaningful deterrent of the possibility of being palmed off to Rwanda,  the actual solution is to remove or greatly diminish the attraction that encourages people to come.  Pour all of the money being wasted into a working processing system that provides decisions in weeks.  As well as that,  provide safe routes and enter into agreements on numbers,  quotas,  etc.  In tandem,  enter agreements that 'illegal' crossings (small boats) arrivals are returned to Europe on the same or next day.

 

No point crossing by small boat.  You go back instantly.  Come via a safe route.  No queues being jumped.  Case decided in weeks.  Most cases are approved anyway.

 

But solutions are not on the agenda.  Perpetuating the manufacted problem is the agenda.

Seems that way.   A  "we're being swamped" reaction to a  problem can be quite beneficial when there's an election looming.

[Victorian]

Just now, Lone Striker said:

Seems that way.   A  "we're being swamped" reaction to a  problem can be quite beneficial when there's an election looming.

 

And long after that.  Labour already owns the blame.  The deterrent wont work and doesn't really exist.  Arrivals will continue.  Labour will scrap the scheme in whatever form that takes.   Scrapped,  wound down,  not used.  It'll take years to repair the system and build up it's purpose and strength.  Meanwhile the Tories scream about their fantastic idea being thwarted and tens of thousands of arrivals that would have been prevented if they had stayed in power.  

[i wish jj was my dad]

8 minutes ago, Tazio said:

Luckily the patriots have been celebrating St George's Day by keeping London safe.

 

St George's Day central London rally turns violent as brawl with police erupts and four arrests (msn.com)

'The Lads' out for a nice day out behaving like true patriots.  Just like Rememberance Sunday. And entertainment laid on courtesy of celebrity arseholes too.  Gawd bless 'em. 

[Cade]

Mind when this lot were foaming at the mouth because someone dared to change the colours of the England flag in the back of a football shirt??

Well here's a woke, gay, pink England flag for you.

 

Edited April 23 by Cade

[SectionDJambo]

Am I mistaken in the belief that I heard, some time ago, that the UK has to take people from Rwanda, that they don’t want there, as part of this agreement? It never seems to be mentioned anymore.

It seems a strange thing to replace unwanted migrants in the UK with unwanted people from Rwanda, so maybe I heard wrong.

The other thing that I find strange is that people from these countries, where the migrants start out from, are expected to be aware that they stand the risk of being sent to Rwanda. Are they thought to be well informed enough to know this is the policy of the UK government, since the traffic gangs won’t be telling them. They currently don’t seem to be aware that their trip across the Channel is to be taken in an overcrowded, flimsy dinghy that all too often capsizes.

[Mikey1874]

30 minutes ago, Victorian said:

One of the main reasons they come is the hopelessly broken asylum system.  People can come here and spend years while their cases eventually receive a decision.  Instead of pretending you're creating a meaningful deterrent of the possibility of being palmed off to Rwanda,  the actual solution is to remove or greatly diminish the attraction that encourages people to come.  Pour all of the money being wasted into a working processing system that provides decisions in weeks.  As well as that,  provide safe routes and enter into agreements on numbers,  quotas,  etc.  In tandem,  enter agreements that 'illegal' crossings (small boats) arrivals are returned to Europe on the same or next day.

 

No point crossing by small boat.  You go back instantly.  Come via a safe route.  No queues being jumped.  Case decided in weeks.  Most cases are approved anyway.

 

But solutions are not on the agenda.  Perpetuating the manufacted problem is the agenda.

 

Also UK Home Office hasn't been great at removing people refused asylum.

 

And also a lot of people refused are actually allowed to stay.

 

They really need tackle the family and other ties too that are the main attraction to people wanting to come to the UK. Deport anyone with any overseas extended family. Up to 20 million people which should help get a GPs appointment or a council house. 

[Psychedelicropcircle]

3 hours ago, bairdy said:

Surely there must be a better alternative to sending these people to Rwanda.

I'm quite sure the 'MI5', (or whoever in the UK ), Interpol, The French Police etc, know who some of the heads of these gangs are, Starmer is correct, these are the people the combined forces of the UK& France should be going after. I presume they are, but it doesn't look as if they're making a dent in the gangs orginisations.

Chances are they’ll know who they are & how to get at them, unfortunately it suites the narrative to keep them coming & in view on barges hotels etc to keep the knuckle draggers angry to vote  

[Mikey1874]

£661 million is the updated latest cost of the Rwanda scheme.

[Ked]

The Tories have got this wrong.

But migration to Europe and England isn't going away.

In fact it's only getting worse.

 

What if anything do we try to do?

Does anyone advocate a free for all?

 

How should we deal with it?

 

[ToadKiller Dog]

How is Rwanda a stronger deterrent than risking death in a dingy ?

It's a nasty and ridiculous policy ,that was created by Boris on the hoof to distract us from another of his failed plans .

 

 

The tories will now ramp up the anti ECHR rhetoric for the election ,will be the same play book as the anti EU lies .

 

[Psychedelicropcircle]

2 minutes ago, ToadKiller Dog said:

How is Rwanda a stronger deterrent than risking death in a dingy ?

It's a nasty and ridiculous policy ,that was created by Boris on the hoof to distract us from another of his failed plans .

 

 

The tories will now ramp up the anti ECHR rhetoric for the election ,will be the same play book as the anti EU lies .

 

Will not make a difference. The country has been gas lighten to death.

[Threedoorsdown]

The vast majority of these people are economic migrants. If I was in their situation I’d be in in France trying to jump into lorry’s too.

 

However, these people aren’t the real problem. It’s people like Dougie Smith 👍

[Benny Factor]

2 hours ago, Lone Striker said:

Maybe I'm just thick, but can anyone explain how the Rwanda Bill stops asylum seekers from "jumping the queue " ?

 

And in what way were they "jumping the queue" previously ?  

 

Rwanda bill live - Sunak says plan will stop 'queue-jumping' asylum seekers

Human rights organisations have criticised the new legislation, which could see asylum seekers sent to Rwanda in 10-12 weeks.

 

Rishi Sunak has said the Rwanda Scheme will stop asylum seekers from "jumping the queue", following the deaths of five people, including one child, in an attempt to cross the English Channel.

Speaking in a press conference alongside NATO chief Jens Stoltenberg, Sunak was asked about his reaction to the five deaths hours after the controversial Rwanda bill to deport asylum seekers was passed by parliament.

Sunak said it was "incredibly sad to hear about the deaths in the Channel," adding that it underscores how important it is to stop these criminal gangs".

 

He said that it was "costing a fortune" to house asylum seekers, adding: "Of course it's unfair. And it undermines our British notion of fairness that people are jumping the queue."

 

 

 

Is this the same Rishi Sunak that was chancellor at time of the PPE VIP Lane????

Not so much as jumping the queue, but having a queue that only people with Tory connections knew about!

[Lone Striker]

4 minutes ago, Threedoorsdown said:

The vast majority of these people are economic migrants. If I was in their situation I’d be in in France trying to jump into lorry’s too.

 

However, these people aren’t the real problem. It’s people like Dougie Smith 👍

Who he ?

[Threedoorsdown]

5 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

Who he ?

Exactly.

[Mikey1874]

18 minutes ago, Threedoorsdown said:

The vast majority of these people are economic migrants. If I was in their situation I’d be in in France trying to jump into lorry’s too.

 

However, these people aren’t the real problem. It’s people like Dougie Smith 👍

 

Not according the Home Office. Majority of boat people have been granted asylum as genuine refugees. So they had to change the law to make them all illegal.

[i wish jj was my dad]

56 minutes ago, Ked said:

The Tories have got this wrong.

But migration to Europe and England isn't going away.

In fact it's only getting worse.

 

What if anything do we try to do?

Does anyone advocate a free for all?

 

How should we deal with it?

 

Trying to process applications like other countries do might be a start but that wouldn't appeal to the Tommy Robinsons of this world.  Much better dumping people in Rwanda and breaching ECHR.  That'll show Johnny Foreigner.  

[il Duce McTarkin]

2 hours ago, Tazio said:

Luckily the patriots have been celebrating St George's Day by keeping London safe.

 

St George's Day central London rally turns violent as brawl with police erupts and four arrests (msn.com)

 

 

The nick of those ****s.

[Mikey1874]

Eventually you need more than culture wars.

Edited April 23 by Mikey1874

[i wish jj was my dad]

4 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Eventually you need more than culture wars.

It's all they've got.