More Tory lies

[manaliveits105]

27 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

You first, comrade. 

Conservatives 

[The Mighty Thor]

2 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

Conservatives 

I think the nomenclature ascribed to you on here is perhaps too kind. 

 

 

 

 

[manaliveits105]

[Victorian]

10 hours ago, Cade said:

 

No more 2nd home allowance bollocks. 

Portcullis House is where all MPs have their London office space, situated right next to Parliament itself.
As part of the Westminster upgrade, convert every office into a bedsit so they have somewhere to stay when on Westminster duty.

No more free food, free bars or any other expenses.
Feel free to bump their base wage up to 100k, but that's it.
They'll pay their own way.

 

I'd even go so far as to make 7 new assemblies in England (London, south-east, south-west, east midlands, west midlands, north-east, north-west) each with powers equal to that of the Scottish, NI and Welsh assemblies with all 10 parts of the UK having full control over local matters.
Westminster is then the Federal assembly, 30 MPs from each of the 10 regions to total 300 Federal MPs. Westminster handles foreign policy, defence, regional disputes and anything else which requires national action.
This would include the newly Nationalised industries, which would be anything deemed to be a national strategic asset.
Education, the health service, prison service, steelmaking, arms manufacturing, water, energy, maybe telecoms, roads, rail, air, the lot. Maybe even farming, forestry, fishing and mining. 

 

From time to time,  one of these reptiles suggests that MP remuneration should be greatly increased.  Industry rate,  ken?  Must attract the best people,  innit?

 

The opposite is true.  Making the MP rewards package more and more lucrative attracts the wrong people.  

[Victorian]

.

Edited March 29 by Victorian

[manaliveits105]

Junta bingo a bit slow lately 

[Gundermann]

Cunning plans.

 

 

 

[Ulysses]

6 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

Conservatives 

 

To be fair, I wasn't expecting that. I thought you'd be voting Reform.

 

I won't be voting for any of them.  I'm not eligible. 

[ehcaley]

42 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

To be fair, I wasn't expecting that. I thought you'd be voting Reform.

 

I won't be voting for any of them.  I'm not eligible. 

But who will you vote for where you are eligible?SF?

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, ehcaley said:

But who will you vote for where you are eligible?SF?

 

SF? Ewwwww.

[ehcaley]

11 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

SF? Ewwwww.

😃

[I P Knightley]

9 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

 

I've had him down as a lame duck more than a big chicken.

[periodictabledancer]

Peston confirms what the country has known for over ten eyars : the Tories are being infiltrated by a bunch of loony right wing lunatics.

 

 

[periodictabledancer]

13 hours ago, Cade said:

 

No more 2nd home allowance bollocks. 

Portcullis House is where all MPs have their London office space, situated right next to Parliament itself.
As part of the Westminster upgrade, convert every office into a bedsit so they have somewhere to stay when on Westminster duty.

No more free food, free bars or any other expenses.
Feel free to bump their base wage up to 100k, but that's it.
They'll pay their own way.

 

I'd even go so far as to make 7 new assemblies in England (London, south-east, south-west, east midlands, west midlands, north-east, north-west) each with powers equal to that of the Scottish, NI and Welsh assemblies with all 10 parts of the UK having full control over local matters.
Westminster is then the Federal assembly, 30 MPs from each of the 10 regions to total 300 Federal MPs. Westminster handles foreign policy, defence, regional disputes and anything else which requires national action.
This would include the newly Nationalised industries, which would be anything deemed to be a national strategic asset.
Education, the health service, prison service, steelmaking, arms manufacturing, water, energy, maybe telecoms, roads, rail, air, the lot. Maybe even farming, forestry, fishing and mining. 

Build some tower blocks and put hostel type accommodation in them. Anyone who lives within 60 minutes travel of Charing Cross can take public transport.

No more subsidised meals or bars ( bars, FFS) . No cushy allowances for overpaid spouses (eg Jonny  Mercer pays his missus twice the going rate for secretarial services), slash the ridiculous amount of holidays they get, mandatory minimum attendance for all MPs/ Lords members with serious consequences for failure to turn up for work. 

Independent body to be set up to maintain & enforce standards of  behaviour in Parliament - basically, Parliament needs to function like a 21st century employer and  not a Victorian era mens club. 

Role of the speaker to be reviewed, given real powers on control over  behaviour & lying. 

[milky_26]

5 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

Build some tower blocks and put hostel type accommodation in them. Anyone who lives within 60 minutes travel of Charing Cross can take public transport.

No more subsidised meals or bars ( bars, FFS) . No cushy allowances for overpaid spouses (eg Jonny  Mercer pays his missus twice the going rate for secretarial services), slash the ridiculous amount of holidays they get, mandatory minimum attendance for all MPs/ Lords members with serious consequences for failure to turn up for work. 

Independent body to be set up to maintain & enforce standards of  behaviour in Parliament - basically, Parliament needs to function like a 21st century employer and  not a Victorian era mens club. 

Role of the speaker to be reviewed, given real powers on control over  behaviour & lying. 

you're first point is what i would suggest. They are there to work, the company i work for is govt funded and if i need to travel for work i have limits on what i can spend on a hotel, evening meal etc. i would love for them to say no on you go you travel a lot for work to X location we will fund you buying a second home and you can also have lots of expenses to go with that.

 

edit: re the attendance one, during covid they had MPs working remotely and joining PMQs from their constituency i would re introduce that so there was less of a need to travel to take part in things such as PMQs. Obviously some things are easier in person but not everything needs done that way

Edited March 29 by milky_26

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 minute ago, milky_26 said:

you're first point is what i would suggest. They are there to work, the company i work for is govt funded and if i need to travel for work i have limits on what i can spend on a hotel, evening meal etc. i would love for them to say no on you go you travel a lot for work to X location we will fund you buying a second home and you can also have lots of expenses to go with that.

You would probably be  classed as a scrounger.

[Victorian]

44 minutes ago, periodictabledancer said:

Peston confirms what the country has known for over ten eyars : the Tories are being infiltrated by a bunch of loony right wing lunatics.

 

 

 

They have always been adept at coexisting as one electoral vehicle for mutual self interest.  People with directly opposing political and societal ideologies.  It has even been portrayed as a virtue.  Broad church of views,  ken?  But they know that for re-election purposes,  it has been critical to fall back into position under the non-existent principle of a one-nation,  socially just,  economically prudent party.

 

It's difficult to believe that they will sacrifice the self interest vehicle that has provided for them,  but a tipping point could conceivably be reached when it is perceived that all of the chaos,  in-fighting,  corruption,  culture wars is likely to make them unelectable for a longer period of time.  A point may be reached when a lot of them realise that their self interest is best served by forming new electoral parties or joining existing ones.  Your typical Tory MP will not think twice about jumping ship to Reform,  Lib Dem or Labour if it means a chance at election.  But they'll also eventually reamalgamate into something that looks and smells like the current Tory party when the electoral cycle comes around to a change away from Labour.

 

I have always maintained that the first major party to openly advocate a referendum to rejoin the EU will be the Tories.  Perhaps in 7 or 8 years that will become the USP of any genuine or bogus moderate version of the Tory party.

[I P Knightley]

1 hour ago, periodictabledancer said:

Build some tower blocks and put hostel type accommodation in them. Anyone who lives within 60 minutes travel of Charing Cross can take public transport.

No more subsidised meals or bars ( bars, FFS) . No cushy allowances for overpaid spouses (eg Jonny  Mercer pays his missus twice the going rate for secretarial services), slash the ridiculous amount of holidays they get, mandatory minimum attendance for all MPs/ Lords members with serious consequences for failure to turn up for work. 

Independent body to be set up to maintain & enforce standards of  behaviour in Parliament - basically, Parliament needs to function like a 21st century employer and  not a Victorian era mens club. 

Role of the speaker to be reviewed, given real powers on control over  behaviour & lying. 

All remarkably sensible stuff. I've no real objection to the subsidy on coffees and toasties in the staff canteen but I agree on the bars.

 

No need to build tower blocks, there's a ton of accommodation within a stone's throw of HP (Victoria or Pimlico) which would serve the purpose as something like an 'apart-hotel' for them to carry out their sordid liaisons while in town and away from the prying eyes of the spouse.

 

I also agree on the Speaker. I don't understand why it has to be a sitting MP. That means that there's one constituency that votes in an MP, hoping to be represented in parliament but that MP effectively has to keep his or her trap shut and, if anything, steer clear of party lines in an effort to be seen to be neutral. Everything else is managed by the clerks office - why not the speakership?

[Mikey1874]

Still reading about Angela Rayner's house sale.

 

 

[Gundermann]

Mass exodus of the sweetcorn bits?

 

[Gizmo]

8 hours ago, I P Knightley said:

I've had him down as a lame duck more than a big chicken.

He has such a see-through veneer, he literally oozes "second place" vibes like a total Gil Gunderson. 

[Lone Striker]

22 hours ago, SectionDJambo said:

Agreed.

The Honours system has had almost all of its legitimacy destroyed in recent years. There were always some awards that raised eyebrows back in the day, but now it’s become a reward for cronies and a return for favours given to government.

Sadly, it devalues the awards given to those who have earned them through their devoted and selfless service to the nation and it’s people.

Yes.    Totally.  The "peerages for cash" and "peerages for supporting my bid to become PM" are an insult to the concept of democracy.  As you say it devalues the folk who are in the HoL as a result of their knowledge and experience being appreciated, and who can use that to give expert scrutiny to Bills.     The current scrutiny of the ridiculous Rwanda Bill shows that a knowledgeable & non-partisan 2nd chamber is necessary to prevent  the excesses of  extremist government.

[Roxy Hearts]

5 hours ago, Gundermann said:

Mass exodus of the sweetcorn bits?

 

🤣🤣🤣

[Mikey1874]

Curious if Reform catch them.

 

 

[Mikey1874]

More on this

 

 

[Ulysses]

22 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

More on this

 

 

 

98 seats.  What a disappointingly large total.

 

On a separate note, the deputy political editor of The Mirror needs to learn how to use a calculator. He managed to persuade himself that Labour would win a bigger landslide than Blair in 1997, but would have a smaller majority.  The oul' pol corrs of the 80s and 90s would never have made booboos like that.

[Mikey1874]

10 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

98 seats.  What a disappointingly large total.

 

On a separate note, the deputy political editor of The Mirror needs to learn how to use a calculator. He managed to persuade himself that Labour would win a bigger landslide than Blair in 1997, but would have a smaller majority.  The oul' pol corrs of the 80s and 90s would never have made booboos like that.

 

There are pictures too

 

 

[Ulysses]

4 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

There are pictures too

 

 

 

If Sunak is gonna lose his seat, it's just as well for him that he's just got all those honours shovelled out to his potential employers.

[Gundermann]

Tories wiped out in Scotland and Wales with SNP on 41 seats. Not too bad.

 

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/conservatives-wiped-scotland-wales-poll-195042559.html

[i wish jj was my dad]

17 minutes ago, Gundermann said:

Tories wiped out in Scotland and Wales with SNP on 41 seats. Not too bad.

 

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/conservatives-wiped-scotland-wales-poll-195042559.html

What about these Reform, Reclaim, 'honest we are not the BNP' chaps? Does that mean that the divisive, outraged froth we see on here isn't actually prevalent across the UK? 

[Gundermann]

3 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

What about these Reform, Reclaim, 'honest we are not the BNP' chaps? Does that mean that the divisive, outraged froth we see on here isn't actually prevalent across the UK? 

😄

 

The Lozza Fox Militia, Gorgie Chapter?

[i wish jj was my dad]

1 minute ago, Gundermann said:

😄

 

The Lozza Fox Militia, Gorgie Chapter?

I've no more idea than the next man about what the rest of the country thinks but I was relatively confident that Andrew Neil quoting bigots desperate to stoke up culture wars are just a noisy but tiny minority living in their sad wee social media bubble

It's encouraging to see that the polls are indicating that's true and the rest of the UK are rejecting such angry, divisive nonsense 👌. 

[Gundermann]

17 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

I've no more idea than the next man about what the rest of the country thinks but I was relatively confident that Andrew Neil quoting bigots desperate to stoke up culture wars are just a noisy but tiny minority living in their sad wee social media bubble

It's encouraging to see that the polls are indicating that's true and the rest of the UK are rejecting such angry, divisive nonsense 👌. 

 

Yeah, incredible that anyone is still quoting Andrew Neil.

 

[i wish jj was my dad]

1 minute ago, Gundermann said:

 

Yeah, incredible that anyone is still quoting Andrew Neil.

 

Not just anyone. You need to be a hard bitten, Daily Mail type nasty bigot to quote that 21st century Goebbels wannabe. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

JJ your obsessive trolling of me is wearing thin . Maybe seek some therapy . 😂 

 
however , 

 

 

it’s a glorious day in the Christian calendar so as the big man said 

 

“ father forgive them , they do not know what they do “ 

 

 

[Des Lynam]

12 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

JJ your obsessive trolling of me is wearing thin . Maybe seek some therapy . 😂 

 
however , 

 

 

it’s a glorious day in the Christian calendar so as the big man said 

 

“ father forgive them , they do not know what they do “ 

 

 

I’ve just been reading the last couple of pages and he makes no mention of you. I was a bit disappointed as different opinions are good to read but so are the arguments.  😂 

[Cade]

The right wing have made a fatal error.

They keep pushing the extremes in an attempt for attention.

But that only leads to factionalism and splits within their own ranks.

Hence the various parties within a party like the ERG and various other bampot splinters.

Then there was UKIP which gave the Tories a scare and so the Tories accelerated their headlong charge to the far right, absorbing most of UKIP into their own ranks.

But of course with extremism, you can never go extreme enough for some people so they split off then pose a threat to the main party.

UKIP has morphed into Reform, which is even more far right than UKIP was.

The end result is that the right wing vote gets diluted between the various factions, and in a FPTP system this means electoral wipeout.

The only way to win elections in a FPTP system is to occupy the middle ground.

 

[JudyJudyJudy]

14 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

I’ve just been reading the last couple of pages and he makes no mention of you. I was a bit disappointed as different opinions are good to read but so are the arguments.  😂 

He’s making a crossover comment from the Indy thread about a posting I made about Andrew Neil , he hasn’t actually got the balls to name me, but insists I’m a “ bigot “ etc . 

[Roxy Hearts]

10 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

He’s making a crossover comment from the Indy thread about a posting I made about Andrew Neil , he hasn’t actually got the balls to name me, but insists I’m a “ bigot “ etc . 

When you start to quote the likes of Andrew Neil then your barrel's bottom has fell out! That odious creature should just enjoy his life in the South of France. 

[XB52]

33 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

I’ve just been reading the last couple of pages and he makes no mention of you. I was a bit disappointed as different opinions are good to read but so are the arguments.  😂 

I think you'll find that all posts are about him in his mind

[Mikey1874]

2 hours ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

What about these Reform, Reclaim, 'honest we are not the BNP' chaps? Does that mean that the divisive, outraged froth we see on here isn't actually prevalent across the UK? 

 

First past the post.

 

They can get 30% of vote in some red wall seats, they still won't win any.

[Victorian]

I don't think Sunak would be too upset about losing his own seat.  

[Cade]

Just now, Victorian said:

I don't think Sunak would be too upset about losing his own seat.  

 

He'd be relieved.

Just say "oh well that's that, I tried" then feck off to the USA on a gold plated jet with his wife and their stolen billions.

[Mikey1874]

25 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

First past the post.

 

They can get 30% of vote in some red wall seats, they still won't win any.

 

 

[Ulysses]

4 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

 

 

I know it's only a small thing in the grand scheme if things, but I've seen a few forecasts that say the Greens will win two seats. Which two? I'm aware that they fancy their chances in Brighton Pavilion and one of the Bristol seats. But if there's a swing to Labour and even a small amount of tactical voting for the Liberal Democrats the Greens will probably end up with no seats.

[Mikey1874]

22 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

I know it's only a small thing in the grand scheme if things, but I've seen a few forecasts that say the Greens will win two seats. Which two? I'm aware that they fancy their chances in Brighton Pavilion and one of the Bristol seats. But if there's a swing to Labour and even a small amount of tactical voting for the Liberal Democrats the Greens will probably end up with no seats.

 

Brighton MP stepping down and Labour won the council off the Geeens last year. 

 

The next top target is Bristol West. 

 

[I P Knightley]

15 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

98 seats.  What a disappointingly large total.

 

On a separate note, the deputy political editor of The Mirror needs to learn how to use a calculator. He managed to persuade himself that Labour would win a bigger landslide than Blair in 1997, but would have a smaller majority.  The oul' pol corrs of the 80s and 90s would never have made booboos like that.

I'm generally alright with numbers but I've never stopped to work out how they calculate, say, a 28% swing or what constitutes a landslide. 

 

I assume that a landslide is a significant shift from one party to another in terms of seats won. Whether a bigger landslide gives you a bigger majority would depend on how far behind you're coming.

 

Given that I can't remember how far behind Blair came from and that Tories have been giving up seats one by one for a while, I've no idea where this discussion is going. 

[Mikey1874]

7 minutes ago, I P Knightley said:

I'm generally alright with numbers but I've never stopped to work out how they calculate, say, a 28% swing or what constitutes a landslide. 

 

I assume that a landslide is a significant shift from one party to another in terms of seats won. Whether a bigger landslide gives you a bigger majority would depend on how far behind you're coming.

 

Given that I can't remember how far behind Blair came from and that Tories have been giving up seats one by one for a while, I've no idea where this discussion is going. 

 

They now have detailed analysis of every seat.

[Cade]

55 minutes ago, I P Knightley said:

I'm generally alright with numbers but I've never stopped to work out how they calculate, say, a 28% swing or what constitutes a landslide. 

 

I assume that a landslide is a significant shift from one party to another in terms of seats won. Whether a bigger landslide gives you a bigger majority would depend on how far behind you're coming.

 

Given that I can't remember how far behind Blair came from and that Tories have been giving up seats one by one for a while, I've no idea where this discussion is going. 

 

1992 saw a Tory majority of 21.
1997 saw a Labour majority of 179.

2001 Lab 167
2005 Lab 66
2010 Hung Parliament (Tory/Lib coalition)
2015 Tory 10
2017 Hung Parliament (Tory/DUP supply/confidence)
2019 Tory 80

 

Edited March 31 by Cade

[Threedoorsdown]

Can’t really see the country improving much under labour, but at least they aren’t outwardly Tory.