2NaFish Posted February 22, 2014 Share Posted February 22, 2014 Thread title "what is the rule on celebrations" Post#85 covers it Most of the thread is Petty Thumb hate. Was his celebraration excessive? Yes. Did it justify Hearts fans being arrested? Hardly Are referees inconsistent? Yes Are we over-reacting? Big time There are 5 posts which mention how griffiths is struggling to get over 5-1 out of 100 or so that i counted, none of them vitriolic to my eyes. I stopped counting the number of posts bemoaning inconsistency from referees when i hit 40. I didnt pay much attention when it became apparent how wrong you are, but if you can show me how most of this thread is just thumb hate, please let me know. It's a thread about poor referees. You said we were being precious and that's just not the case. edit. In the spirit of fairness, i also counted 2 posts effectively saying they don't particularly blame thumb as it's largely banter with him and he seems decent and how it's refs/the rules in general they are hacked off with. 3 if you include where i said it. So the thumb bashing is cancelled out to a fair degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Ok. So why were Stevo and Robinson booked when griffiths and brown were not? That is the whole point. Not that griffiths did not get booked for the isolated incident today - my personal opinion is that, as sore as it was to witness, a guy that has taken the stick that he has off the hearts fans in his career should be perfectly entitled to react in the, principally good-natured ribbing way that he did today - if you can dish it out as fans, you have to be able to take it back imo. But instead, my gripe is that the rule is very clearly not equally applied and I, for one, would like to see the powers that be squirm as they try to explain that away rather than accept it as the gross incompetence/inconsistency that it is. Quite a lot of folk on this thread seem to miss the distinction between this opinion and the opinion that players shouldn't be allowed to celebrate, which baffles me. It is perfectly simple (nb: comment not aimed at wavydavy who I believe was just doing his best to explain the inexplicable).... The problem is clearly for me in the rules by allowing the following quote "in the opinion of the referee". If they made it a booking if a player left the field of play (intentionally) or deliberately celebrates on or off the pitch towards the opposition fans then we would all know what should happen and in Griffith's case it should have been a yellow card. So long as it is down to "opinion" then there will always be controversy, just look at this board!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 There are 5 posts which mention how griffiths is struggling to get over 5-1 out of 100 or so that i counted, none of them vitriolic to my eyes. I stopped counting the number of posts bemoaning inconsistency from referees when i hit 40. I didnt pay much attention when it became apparent how wrong you are, but if you can show me how most of this thread is just thumb hate, please let me know. It's a thread about poor referees. You said we were being precious and that's just not the case. edit. In the spirit of fairness, i also counted 2 posts effectively saying they don't particularly blame thumb as it's largely banter with him and he seems decent and how it's refs/the rules in general they are hacked off with. 3 if you include where i said it. So the thumb bashing is cancelled out to a fair degree. I have posted before that I hate most celebrations. Mostly contrived pish and my pet hate of cuddling the fans, ******* hate it all. The Locozade thief didn't deserve to be booked Imo. I prefer to take it on the chin, I smirked rather than got irate. I do agree that we have been on the wrong end of shite bookings, but the same, we have seen Stokes getting a soft yellow against us. Referees will always be inconsistent unless they all in unison apply letter of the law, then we will complain of no common sense., but that's another argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2NaFish Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 lucozade thief? no need to turn this thread about refereeing into a thumb bashing. in this case Griffiths went out of his way to celebrate in front of opposition fans when it would be easier to celebrate with his own and then taunted the opposition fans and then ran 70 yards in order to leave the pitch and taunt the fans some more. its a booking by modern standards. you're welcome to think it shouldn't be a booking, but you'd be as wrong about that as you were when you claimed this thread was mostly petty posts about Griffiths rather than bemoaning poor refereeing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 lucozade thief? no need to turn this thread about refereeing into a thumb bashing. in this case Griffiths went out of his way to celebrate in front of opposition fans when it would be easier to celebrate with his own and then taunted the opposition fans and then ran 70 yards in order to leave the pitch and taunt the fans some more. its a booking by modern standards. you're welcome to think it shouldn't be a booking, but you'd be as wrong about that as you were when you claimed this thread was mostly petty posts about Griffiths rather than bemoaning poor refereeing. Hands up mate, you've got me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Well I guess i might be a part owner too......but I suspect your influence on the competition is equal to mine = 0. My influence on the SPFL is indeed non-existent. It's also irrelevant to my point. All I want is fair competition. I don't watch Hearts for entertainment. Some people do...fair enough... you are right I have no idea ..... I'm not sure he actually did leave the pitch, but if he did it was hardly by much, and under such interpretation you might have to book every player who leaves the pitch for what ever reason, going beyond the line to run around to win a ball, to take a corner or throw in, or what about if they decide to leave the ball after picking it up, or going to recover the ball, the goalie going into net after a goal to get the ball....and more,but there is only judge. Ref's have a tough job, today if he's gone "strict" we'd have been the losers. He left the pitch to embrace Lennon. And by letter of the "law", the referee has to book him. But that's not really my point - it was just to counter your pedantry ("law" versus "rule") by being pedantic and pointing out that he should have been booked for leaving the pitch. My point is about his celebration in general. I've stated elsewhere on this thread, I think that players should basically be able to celebrate however they like - if they are inciting crowd trouble, then the ******* police should be getting involved for public order offences (not that I am suggesting he should have been arrested). But...if people are going to get booked for "excessive" celebration, then it needs to be consistent. I certainly don't think people should be booked for showing emotion (in fact, quite the opposite) but...if some are, then everyone needs to be. It's pretty simple really. **** all to do with entertainment, all about fairness in the application of the laws/rules of the sport my team competes in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 The problem is clearly for me in the rules by allowing the following quote "in the opinion of the referee". If they made it a booking if a player left the field of play (intentionally)... It already is - if the player leaves the pitch without referee's permission, it is a yellow card offence. It's that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snake Plissken Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I don't think players should be booked for celebrating. But the one that sticks out most in my mind is New Year's Day 2006. I think it was already mentioned by another poster, in the previous game that season Skacel was booked for a pretty bloody muted celebration. McManus scored a last-minute equaliser and jumped into the crowd. Quite literally left the pitch and jumped into the supporters, by any interpretation of the rules of the game, that was a bookable offence. He was already on a yellow and the ref did nothing, this was the same ref who sent Fyssas off earlier in the game, a decision which was rescinded. I'm not one for the conspiracy chat but there could be absolutely no doubt which side the referee wanted to win that game. I know it's eight ******* years ago but I'll never forget that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighusref Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Any Hearts fan upset at that is a wet blanket. However, I don't get Griffiths thought process. If I'd scored my first goal for my club I'd not be running to the opposition support. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Does not bother me one bit if an opposition player runs and celebrates in front of the Hearts fans. What is a bit up in the air though is fro week to week the referee's seem to have different interpretations on what is a booking offence for doing this. I loved it when McCann cupped his ears to the Hibs support when scoring at Easter Road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottish_chicP Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I think the celebration bookings are ridiculous however, had that been a Hearts player a yellow would have been shown before he even had a chance to stand up. Absolute joke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Internet Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Any Hearts fan upset at that is a wet blanket. However, I don't get Griffiths thought process. If I'd scored my first goal for my club I'd not be running to the opposition support. Depends really. I think he gets a lot more joy out of winding us up than he does making Celtic fans happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDonald Jardine Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Any Hearts fan upset at that is a wet blanket. However, I don't get Griffiths thought process. If I'd scored my first goal for my club I'd not be running to the opposition support. If I was a Celtic fan I'd be a bit annoyed about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowmans_Boot Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Any Hearts fan upset at that is a wet blanket. However, I don't get Griffiths thought process. If I'd scored my first goal for my club I'd not be running to the opposition support. Most of celtics songs are to wind us up rather than support their own team so they can probably relate to his thought process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest C00l K1d Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Any Hearts fan upset at that is a wet blanket. However, I don't get Griffiths thought process. If I'd scored my first goal for my club I'd not be running to the opposition support. He probably hates celtic fans as much as us tbf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bebeto Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 The thumb was getting abuse from the Wheatfield, he scored ran to the Wheatfield and showed his thumbs. Quality banter if you ask me. He has participated in banter before and I applaud him for it. Banter like this is missing in the game today. Still hate the wee d*** though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy Goss Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Thought the ref and linesman had a shocker yesterday and the bias towards Celtic plain to see. No gripes with what Griffiths did. He was getting stick before he scored and naturally went to wind us up. We dish it out and should be able to take it back. Its all banter. Like other folk have stated, it is the inconsistency that does my head in, Hearts players have done far less and been booked. One rule for us and one for the tims was evident. Van Dijk steamrollered MacCullum in the first half = no booking, moments later Robinson fouls to stop Celtic breaking after he lost possession = booked. Stokes fouls a Hearts player to stop us breaking after above Pum foul = no booking. Hamill has a strop at the linesman for a decision = booked. Scott Brown in the refs ear all game = no booking. Once again against the mhanks the officials are biased and this happens to all other teams that play them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HMFC 86 Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Thought the ref and linesman had a shocker yesterday and the bias towards Celtic plain to see. No gripes with what Griffiths did. He was getting stick before he scored and naturally went to wind us up. We dish it out and should be able to take it back. Its all banter. Like other folk have stated, it is the inconsistency that does my head in, Hearts players have done far less and been booked. One rule for us and one for the tims was evident. Van Dijk steamrollered MacCullum in the first half = no booking, moments later Robinson fouls to stop Celtic breaking after he lost possession = booked. Stokes fouls a Hearts player to stop us breaking after above Pum foul = no booking. Hamill has a strop at the linesman for a decision = booked. Scott Brown in the refs ear all game = no booking. Once again against the mhanks the officials are biased and this happens to all other teams that play them. Yep that's how I saw it. There also seemed to be so many free kicks to the mhanks. In the second half in particular, the ref was giving free kicks any time a sellik player flopped over. This generated pressure on us. On the other hand, we seemed to never get a free kick in their half. Only when the ref couldn't avoid it, ie when Paterson nutmegged mulgrew and then mulgrew thugged him, did we get anything. Sellik have a team of giants, so how come they get all the free kicks as well? We all know that sellik are the best team in the league, why oh why do refs give them every decision as well, it's not as if they need it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 It already is - if the player leaves the pitch without referee's permission, it is a yellow card offence. It's that simple. You are wrong about the rule leaving the pitch.I posted the rules on an earlier post and this is a quote from it. Leaving the field of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence in itself but it is essential that players return to the field of play as soon as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 You are wrong about the rule leaving the pitch.I posted the rules on an earlier post and this is a quote from it. Leaving the field of play to celebrate a goal is not a cautionable offence in itself but it is essential that players return to the field of play as soon as possible. I'm just going by the SFA's Law Twelve. Looks pretty clear cut to me, in terms of cautionable offences in games under SFA rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amadjambo Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I don't remember Rudi being booked for giving the Hibs fans the Loser sign on more than one occasion at ER. I was more upset by our defending than the celebration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wavydavy Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I'm just going by the SFA's Law Twelve. Looks pretty clear cut to me, in terms of cautionable offences in games under SFA rules. I am going by the rules set by FIFa which is what I believe we all have to comply with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I am going by the rules set by FIFa which is what I believe we all have to comply with. And there is one source of confusion, and possibly a cause of the inconsistency that is so ******* annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Marsh Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 Pretty sure Stokes was booked in the 3-1 defeat for over celebrating. Just no consistency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambo85 Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Who cares. He is still one of the ugliest players I have ever seen at Tynecastle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Chimp Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 I prefer that they don't book players for celebrating tbh, but it needs to be consistent. /close thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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