Franklin Delano Bluth Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 No, to encourage a 19 year old girl FFS and help her back - not put obstacles in her way after the WTA tour had failed in their duty of care completely and absolutely. She merited special treatment because the circumstances were so unique; Graf voted according to pure self-interest, and that's it. "Likeable character", my backside. If the other clubs had been given the chance to vote Hearts out of the SPL, would you have just shrugged and defended it as 'democracy' had they done so? It was a decent, even good contest: not as good as last year's though. Meanwhile, this "muscular female = bloke rather than a woman" is as misogynistic and patriarchal as it can possibly get. Women should be all gentle, should they? All nice, soft and sweet? And whaddayaknow: the same people slagging Serena Williams off for being in ferociously strong physical shape also slagged Marion Bartoli off for, in their view, not being in good enough shape. Damned if they do, damned if they don't. What are you even talking about? It's not about being gentle. It about making Nadal look like a wee weed* and having muscles bigger than most men on the tour, FFS. Look at her legs man! There is a lot of the 'Serena is a bloke' chat, but you take it very differently to how it's meant to be taken. We all know she doesn't have a penis, etc, etc. It's not even necessarily a dig at her - it could be taken as a dig at the Sharapova's and Lisicki's of the world who seem to care more about being 'attractive' rather than knuckling down and hitting the gym to increase their strength and fitness, so they could match Williams. Much has been made of how much work Djokovic and Murray had to do to get to where they are, days and days in the gym, and no off-season to speak off. Many have also passed comment about how much strength Nadal has. What do you have to do to reach the finals of the women's game? Be slightly fit and strong. Doesn't matter though, you'll still get absolutely destroyed by the only one who seems to take it seriously and put the hours in. And fact is - Bartoli is unfit. That's just true. She should have never won a premier sports tournament. What's wrong with more women aiming to increase their strength and fitness in the off-season, and trying to match Serena's power? That in turn would make the women's game more competitive and help it's reputation. People should just think the women's game is all great, whilst one person takes it seriously and hoovers up, whilst the others are quite happy to sit about with their millions and put in comparatively little effort? No thank you. Give me the Man's game, where you have to sacrifice your body and commit to the game, spend years in the gym working on strength and fitness, and then maybe get considered to be top 10, but you have to be incredibly gifted to even get close to that. *there are plenty female athletes bigger than Nadal, by the way, doesn't make them any less feminine. Same goes for Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 What are you even talking about? It's not about being gentle. It about making Nadal look like a wee weed* and having muscles bigger than most men on the tour, FFS. Look at her legs man! What's wrong with more women aiming to increase their strength and fitness in the off-season, and trying to match Serena's power? That in turn would make the women's game more competitive and help it's reputation. Can you make your mind up please? One minute you're referring to Serena as "that bloke", having already referred to Bartoli at Wimbledon as "the big felly"; the next, you're complaining bitterly about the failure of Serena's contemporaries to match her physique! Now, if you've settled on point 2, it's a fair one - and the example of how relentlessly hard Murray worked to close the gap on his extraordinary competitors is an excellent one. Albeit, I'm unpersuaded that any other current woman could match Serena physically: my sense is you're pretty much born with a physique like that, or you're not. They could certainly work harder to close the gap though. Give me the men's game and the women's game. Why does it have to be an either/or? One is great, so the other is shit? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franklin Delano Bluth Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Can you make your mind up please? One minute you're referring to Serena as "that bloke", having already referred to Bartoli at Wimbledon as "the big felly"; the next, you're complaining bitterly about the failure of Serena's contemporaries to match her physique! Now, if you've settled on point 2, it's a fair one - and the example of how relentlessly hard Murray worked to close the gap on his extraordinary competitors is an excellent one. Albeit, I'm unpersuaded that any other current woman could match Serena physically: my sense is you're pretty much born with a physique like that, or you're not. They could certainly work harder to close the gap though. Give me the men's game and the women's game. Why does it have to be an either/or? One is great, so the other is shit? Nope. Like I made clear, it's not a negative that Williams is muscular. It's just a fact. It's a positive for her and a negative for everyone else. Also, as I pointed out, I at least, was joking about Bartoli being the Big Felly, Serena being a bloke, etc. Still though - they are the ones who close resemble men more than the skinny, fragile wee women who are common in modern day tennis. We're talking about a straight shoot-off here, or at least I am. If I had to choose between the two, it's the men's all day, and the women's game is drastically worse than the men's, because of the respective competitiveness of the games, and commitment of the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 How had they failed in their duty of care? Not protecting players? Tennis players had been sitting with their backs to the crowd for nigh on 100 years at the time of the attack and it hadn't happened before. So yes in a way the circumstances were unique, but that also meant there was no precedent for how people should behave. Why are you singling out Graf? The players lower in the rankings would have had more to gain, or are you meaning that Seles had number 1 at the time (not a clue if she did) and Graf was so desperate to get it back she maliciously voted no so she could get it back? And why shouldn't she. And this has sod all to do with Hearts, though if there was a vote and Hearts were voted out by a massive majority there would be little I could do, apart from bitch about it for ever, despite it being a democratic process. Bizarrely though I've just tried google to find out about the statistics of the vote and couldn't find anything about it. Any sporting authority under whose watch a player is attacked and stabbed has failed in its duty of care: however unprecedented the circumstances. Seles wasn't playing that match that day because she thought "it's a nice sunny afternoon: let's have a spot of tennis". She was playing because she was a member of the WTA Tour, and it was her job. Seles was number 1 at the time, yes. She'd won 7 of the previous 8 Grand Slams she'd entered. Graf certainly gained more than anyone else from what happened; having been on a run of just 2 Slams won in her previous 12 attempts, she immediately hoovered up 10 of the next 15 after Seles was attacked: including the next four on the bounce. Seles' stabbing left a massive void at the top of the game which everyone noticed, and no-one could fill: to the point whereby an at least 10lbs (and arguably closer to 20lbs) overweight Seles immediately reached the US Open Final on her return in 1995, and almost won it too. You can find details of the vote I mentioned in part 3 of this article here: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=59458 The reason I'm singling out Graf in particular is this. It wasn't her fault, but Gunther Parche got what he wanted (the reason he attacked Seles was because she'd dislodged his idol!): to the point whereby very many still regard Graf as the greatest female player of all time. Nothing in what was happening in her or Seles' careers before Monica was stabbed suggests that would've been the case had it not occurred; and in that light, however much she of course couldn't predict the future, it makes how she voted look shabby and horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Sexington Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Kickback reacts to Billy Jean Lawson and the Panda entering into a long debate about women's tennis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 What a fascinating read this has been Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudi Skacel Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 10pm tonight the Djokovic - Nadal final will start, could be a late one tonight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I'm going for a wee kip just down in prep for staying up for the distance tonight. You know, incase it's one of those five set epics, that nobody likes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I'm going for a wee kip just down in prep for staying up for the distance tonight. You know, incase it's one of those five set epics, that nobody likes. I have seen this line mentioned a few times in this thread, whats it about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I have seen this line mentioned a few times in this thread, whats it about? Lawson tried to say that nobody likes five set men's matches. Can't quite remember when it was though. Wimbledon? Edit - something tells me it was just before Del Potro and Djokovic had that tremendous match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Lawson tried to say that nobody likes five set men's matches. Can't quite remember when it was though. Wimbledon? Edit - something tells me it was just before Del Potro and Djokovic had that tremendous match. Cheers for explaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franklin Delano Bluth Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Lawson tried to say that nobody likes five set men's matches. Can't quite remember when it was though. Wimbledon? Edit - something tells me it was just before Del Potro and Djokovic had that tremendous match. 6-0 6-0 victories for Serena Williams are where it's at Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Lawson tried to say that nobody likes five set men's matches. Can't quite remember when it was though. Wimbledon? Edit - something tells me it was just before Del Potro and Djokovic had that tremendous match. I would say that I never actually said that - and was merely pointing out that first, American TV companies are increasingly unamused at the marathons the men's tour has become known for in recent years; and second, that what this all takes out of the leading men's players cannot be sustainable, and is bound to result in serious injuries - but for once, I shall quit while I'm miles behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I would say that I never actually said that - and was merely pointing out that first, American TV companies are increasingly unamused at the marathons the men's tour has become known for in recent years; and second, that what this all takes out of the leading men's players cannot be sustainable, and is bound to result in serious injuries - but for once, I shall quit while I'm miles behind. You've got bigger things to worry about now man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
:shitwine: Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Lawson tried to say that nobody likes five set men's matches. Can't quite remember when it was though. Wimbledon? Edit - something tells me it was just before Del Potro and Djokovic had that tremendous match. Correct - nobody wants long matches As soon as both players are on the scoreboard, I just tune out, like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Got to fancy Rafa tonight and think he will do it in 4 sets but wouldn't mind it going to a 5 setter like previous matches between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Franklin Delano Bluth Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Got to fancy Rafa tonight and think he will do it in 4 sets but wouldn't mind it going to a 5 setter like previous matches between the two. Djokovic is no mug and will hang in there, doesn't know when he's beat. Still think Rafa will win though. Stupidly good right now. Just wait until his knee gives out half way through the first set. Wheel chair by 40, NAP. :'> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Wiseau Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Defo fancy Rafa in a big way. But enough about my personal feelings, on to the tennis. Nadal in 4. He has an air of invincibility about him at the moment. Actually hope he wins too - deserves it for fighting back from those injuries and reaching these kinds of exceptional standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Nadal in 5 for this cat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gershwin Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Link please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taffin Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Djokovic in 4 for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Going the distance I think. Would be good for Nadal to win it. Djoko will be out for blood after last year though. Looking forward to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudi Skacel Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 Here we go, I want Novak to win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossthejambo Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Nadal in 4 is my shout for this. He's in too good form just now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gershwin Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I'm flagging already. FFS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossthejambo Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I'm flagging already. FFS. I'm the same, not a hope in hell of me seeing this through to the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaka Demus & pliers Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 So, is Nadal back on the drugs then aye? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Break Nadal. Been pretty even so far though and would bet against Djok breaking back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Rafa turning it on big style, break to love with a huge out challenge. 5-2, serving for the set in 36 mins Edit - Rafa takes the first. Djok has some work to do here, although if I was to put money on anyone mounting a come back it would be him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Nadal is going to smash someone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 1-1 in the second set. Novak letting two break points slip to let Rafa get back to deuce and Rafa holds on deuce #2 Nadal's camp getting some boy chucked out for shouting during points Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 I wouldn't mess with Uncle Toni, the guy is some unit. Shouting out once is an accident but 3 times is just taking the mick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beats Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Doesn't matter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooperstar Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Jesus! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Exhausted watching that point! Ridiculous tennis, some break that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 That was absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Merse Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 The American tv companies are livid at the length of that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gershwin Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 ooft. What a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 If your going to break the guy who has only lost serve once in the whole tournament that is the way to do it. Absurdly high standard of tennis in that 54 shot rally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 And Rafa breaks straight back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Great Khali Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 By the way, perhaps a tad over dramatic but I genuinely feel lucky as **** watching this, watching the likes of Djoko, Nadal, Murray and Fed. Chuck in the like of Del Potro, we are smack bang in the middle of some sort of golden era in tennis. Love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Thats got to hurt Novak being broken straight back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Merse Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 By the way, perhaps a tad over dramatic but I genuinely feel lucky as **** watching this, watching the likes of Djoko, Nadal, Murray and Fed. Chuck in the like of Del Potro, we are smack bang in the middle of some sort of golden era in tennis. Love it. The semis and finals of the grand slams have been incredible now for about 8 years. They've had everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 The semis and finals of the grand slams have been incredible now for about 8 years. They've had everything. And every single one has given us something different. The speed of some of Novak's winner is incredible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JyTees Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Think we're in for another classic. Possibly a classic to end all classics! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Merse Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Djokovic upped it in that game. That was like watching him 2 years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergio Garcia Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Novak has came alive in last half hour, needs to hold here though. Back to the attacking Novak of 2011. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 No chance he'll let Rafa break straight back again is there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Jarman Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Great shot to win a well deserved set. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Merse Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Didn't see that coming. How can you go to bed when its this good!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.