Sydney Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Everyone's attendances grew in the aftermath of the Second World War. Interestingly, only three teams since 1905 have had the biggest average crowds - Rangers 68 times, Celtic 28 times and Hearts 4 times (1924, 1925, 1926, 1936). If you want a similar chart for anyone else in Scotland, let me know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Better call Saul Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Everyone's attendances grew in the aftermath of the Second World War. Interestingly, only three teams since 1905 have had the biggest average crowds - Rangers 68 times, Celtic 28 times and Hearts 4 times (1924, 1925, 1926, 1936). If you want a similar chart for anyone else in Scotland, let me know. What about the wee team ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydney Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 What about the wee team ? Nearly always less than ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboinglasgow Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Nearly always less than ours. Do you have Rangers and Celtics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudeskaboyuk Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Very good. Will need to go on to London Hearts site to see what was going on again around 1961 when there is a huge downward spiral starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydney Posted November 21, 2011 Author Share Posted November 21, 2011 Very good. Will need to go on to London Hearts site to see what was going on again around 1961 when there is a huge downward spiral starting. The downward spiral happened to everyone. Some teams (like Partick Thistle and Queens Park) never recovered. The Old Firm eventually recovered, and now have bigger crowds than they've ever had. There's an economic theory about shoppers being sttracted to the biggest shopping centre in the region - seems to have happened in Glasgow. Fifty years ago, the OF had 50% of the "market share" of football watchers in Glasgow. Now they have 97% of the market share, and teams like Queens Park and Partick and Clyde have miniscule supports, and Third Lanark have died. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4marsbars Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Thanks for that. What about Hearts and Hibs on the same graph? I'm sure a lot of Hibs fans would like to see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Thanks for that. What about Hearts and Hibs on the same graph? I'm sure a lot of Hibs fans would like to see that. Hibs have had the highest average for a single season between the 2. Did this back a couple of years ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Since WWII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Raw data http://www.londonhearts.com/charts/avg_l_crowdsOF.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 I've been working with David Speed and a lot of Hearts home crowds are short of just under 1000. This is because complementary tickets were not included in the final returns. Also there was a period around 2007 when Hearts reported the numbers of tickets sold rather than the numbers through the turnstyles. A practice that the Old Firm were doing and Hibs appear to have adopted this season. Another thing there was a time when many Cup crowds across Scotland may have been deliberately reported short and the revenue difference split between the 2 clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Quite interesting to see how poor celtic's attendances were when they were winning 9-in-a-row and also to see the OF gates jumping so markedly in the last 20 years. All seems to start with Souness and then the other lot seemed to respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Quite interesting to see how poor celtic's attendances were when they were winning 9-in-a-row and also to see the OF gates jumping so markedly in the last 20 years. All seems to start with Souness and then the other lot seemed to respond. The 'Old Firm' (and all other clubs) got 'enormous' crowds when playing the 'big games' the extra capacity in their grounds meant their biggest was bigger than everyone elses. This also explains why Hibs had the big average after WWII Easter Road held at maximum about 15,000 to 20,000 more than Tynecastle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4marsbars Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Hibs have had the highest average for a single season between the 2. Did this back a couple of years ago. Thanks, it's just as we thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locky Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Nearly always less than ours. It's been nearly 40 years since Hibs averaged over 15000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Average crowd by team, by season since 2005-06 The Hibernian line refers hearts home then Hibs home season team hearts_crowd hibs_crowd diff 2005-06 Aberdeen 16787 14572 2215 2005-06 Celtic 17076 16317 759 2005-06 Dundee United 16617 14164 2453 2005-06 Dunfermline Athletic 16773 13163 3610 2005-06 Falkirk 16538 13092 3446 2005-06 Hibernian 16915 16917 -2 2005-06 Inverness Caledonian Thistle 16373 12214 4159 2005-06 Kilmarnock 16516 11079 5437 2005-06 Livingston 16583 11755 4828 2005-06 Motherwell 16594 11926 4668 2005-06 Rangers 17209 15865 1344 2006-07 Aberdeen 17241 15662 1579 2006-07 Celtic 16975 15316 1659 2006-07 Dundee United 17010 14032 2978 2006-07 Dunfermline Athletic 17031 14061 2970 2006-07 Falkirk 16687 13700 2987 2006-07 Hibernian 16901 16288 613 2006-07 Inverness Caledonian Thistle 16271 12868 3403 2006-07 Kilmarnock 16934 12092 4842 2006-07 Motherwell 16753 13777 2976 2006-07 Rangers 17040 15865 1175 2006-07 St Mirren 17009 13053 3956 2007-08 Aberdeen 17122 14552 2570 2007-08 Celtic 16454 15930 524 2007-08 Dundee United 16653 14440 2213 2007-08 Falkirk 16268 12391 3877 2007-08 Gretna 16273 12941 3332 2007-08 Hibernian 16783 17015 -232 2007-08 Inverness Caledonian Thistle 15812 12905 2907 2007-08 Kilmarnock 12429 13074 -645 2007-08 Motherwell 16633 11223 5410 2007-08 Rangers 16060 16544 -484 2007-08 St Mirren 15867 13522 2345 2008-09 Aberdeen 14657 11697 2960 2008-09 Celtic 15987 14181 1806 2008-09 Dundee United 16053 11990 4063 2008-09 Falkirk 13009 11563 1446 2008-09 Hamilton Academical 12030 10437 1593 2008-09 Hibernian 15979 16157 -178 2008-09 Inverness Caledonian Thistle 13057 11688 1369 2008-09 Kilmarnock 13424 12117 1307 2008-09 Motherwell 13762 11094 2668 2008-09 Rangers 15710 14357 1353 2008-09 St Mirren 13483 10317 3166 2009-10 Aberdeen 14219 12177 2042 2009-10 Celtic 15306 12372 2934 2009-10 Dundee United 13599 11120 2479 2009-10 Falkirk 14102 13305 797 2009-10 Hamilton Academical 13260 11481 1779 2009-10 Hibernian 16944 14113 2831 2009-10 Kilmarnock 13671 10640 3031 2009-10 Motherwell 13929 11240 2689 2009-10 Rangers 16558 13733 2825 2009-10 St Johnstone 13416 11495 1921 2009-10 St Mirren 12821 11894 927 2010-11 Aberdeen 13434 10941 2493 2010-11 Celtic 16156 13649 2507 2010-11 Dundee United 14185 10252 3933 2010-11 Hamilton Academical 12620 9733 2887 2010-11 Hibernian 17156 17780 -624 2010-11 Inverness Caledonian Thistle 12994 12099 895 2010-11 Kilmarnock 13446 11169 2277 2010-11 Motherwell 13529 11178 2351 2010-11 Rangers 16187 14420 1767 2010-11 St Johnstone 14406 8870 5536 2010-11 St Mirren 12386 8337 4049 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 Since 1983-84 there have been 8 occurences where Hibs have had a better average than Hearts per team of >1,000 season team hearts_crowd hibs_crowd diff 1988-89 Hibernian 22576 25489 -2913 1992-93 Hibernian 15541 18797 -3256 1993-94 Partick Thistle 7446 8808 -1362 2001-02 Kilmarnock 10027 11154 -1127 2001-02 St Johnstone 10703 12067 -1364 2004-05 Aberdeen 13066 14374 -1308 2004-05 Kilmarnock 10311 11796 -1485 2004-05 Rangers 14221 15639 -1418 Hearts have had 212 >1,000 better average occurences And 39 with a difference of over 5,000 season team hearts_crowd hibs_crowd diff 1983-84 Aberdeen 14996 7177 7819 1983-84 Dundee 9421 4080 5341 1984-85 Celtic 17500 10584 6916 1984-85 Rangers 16050 9684 6366 1984-85 St Mirren 9387 3150 6237 1985-86 Aberdeen 15956 9548 6408 1985-86 Celtic 21974 13439 8535 1985-86 Clydebank[4] 15232 5314 9918 1985-86 Dundee 11788 5475 6313 1985-86 Dundee United 13330 5325 8005 1985-86 Motherwell 11095 4983 6112 1985-86 Rangers 23911 12939 10972 1985-86 St Mirren 10952 4924 6028 1986-87 Aberdeen 14823 7576 7247 1986-87 Clydebank[4] 11090 5133 5957 1986-87 Dundee 9956 4263 5693 1986-87 Falkirk 12206 4756 7450 1986-87 Hamilton Academical 9713 4124 5589 1986-87 Rangers 28864 19656 9208 1986-87 St Mirren 11711 6400 5311 1987-88 Celtic 27068 21206 5862 1987-88 Dundee United 14129 8825 5304 1987-88 Falkirk 12446 6045 6401 1987-88 Rangers 28936 19414 9522 1987-88 St Mirren 12252 6326 5926 1989-90 Celtic 24595 14079 10516 1989-90 Dundee 11312 5209 6103 1989-90 Dundee United 13547 6624 6923 1989-90 Dunfermline Athletic 14202 9118 5084 1989-90 Hibernian 23977 18238 5739 1990-91 Rangers 21478 16310 5168 1990-91 St Mirren 11564 4211 7353 1991-92 Aberdeen 15930 7859 8071 1991-92 Rangers 23445 15110 8335 1997-98 Kilmarnock 15676 10017 5659 2000-01 Hibernian 17375 10919 6456 2005-06 Kilmarnock 16516 11079 5437 2007-08 Motherwell 16633 11223 5410 2010-11 St Johnstone 14406 8870 5536 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnybob72 Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 The graphs show what we all know and that is that ALL clubs have a significant number of glory hunters. While we've always had a laugh at Rangers about this due to their crowds in the pre Souness era it's not just them. So, if we are going to replace our big earners with youth players in January and results go downhill (if they can go any further down the hill) then we can safely assume the crowds will also see a drop. While a number of people will fall into the 'I'll go regardless' camp there will according to the stats be a large number who wont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henryheart Posted November 21, 2011 Share Posted November 21, 2011 The stat I'm interested in is the size of the away support. In England the size of the away support is frequently published, but not so in Scotland. This season I've heard our away support at Killie and St. Mirren being announced as 726 and 912 respectively. How many have we taken elsewhere? Hearts never announce the size of the away support and it would be interesting to use the figures to see how our support reacts to certain fixtures. I have this theory that our support can actually drop for games against the old firm as some simply don't like the hostility. Our recent home crowd against Celtic looked particularly sparse for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sydney Posted November 22, 2011 Author Share Posted November 22, 2011 The graphs show what we all know and that is that ALL clubs have a significant number of glory hunters. While we've always had a laugh at Rangers about this due to their crowds in the pre Souness era it's not just them. So, if we are going to replace our big earners with youth players in January and results go downhill (if they can go any further down the hill) then we can safely assume the crowds will also see a drop. While a number of people will fall into the 'I'll go regardless' camp there will according to the stats be a large number who wont. I think if we keep going the way we're going, we'll be back around the 10,000 mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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