Hagar the Horrible Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 You know, I know, theres not a cats chance in hell of them going into administration............................................... but there again we live in hope I think its quite shocking that you would want a fellow SPL team of the stature of Glasgow Rangers to go into Administration.......shocking I want Liquidation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Root Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I hope Whyte does buy it, since nobody has a real clue about him its a stick on he's dodgy and will just ruin the club anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Comedian Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Radio Clyde's Connie McLaughlin has tweeted: "Source close to the Craig Whyte camp has told me #Rangers takeover will only go through if the board resign." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterion Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Laughable... All these board members will proclaim themselves as "proper Rangers supporters who put the club first" They would have agreed to resign at the first chance if this was true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radge21 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 The takeover will be back on again,and all over the papers just before they play celtic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gasman Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 The takeover will be back on again,and all over the papers just before they play celtic. ......or us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Rangers board have just released a statement http://www.rangers.co.uk/articles/20110419/club-statement_2254024_2342295 Buying themselves more time in the takeover/fakeover .................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwaysthereinspirit Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Rangers board have just released a statement http://www.rangers.c...2254024_2342295 Buying themselves more time in the takeover/fakeover .................. Reads like Whyte didn't exactly tell them the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.......... Great news. The Scottish media will be all over this............or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Reads like Whyte didn't exactly tell them the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.......... Great news. The Scottish media will be all over this............or not. Or that Murray hasn't told the Board the whole truth about how desperate Rangers possition is? The Record will probably pick up on the bit about the Board looking at alternative options - "Money Men Battle for Big Rangers Prize" sort of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chester™ Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Reads like Whyte didn't exactly tell them the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.......... Great news. The Scottish media will be all over this............or not. Or the Board are stalling for as long as possible as Whyte wants to get rid of them all... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Scarcely anybody in the media even mentioning that Andrew Thornhill QC is currently in tribunal on Rangers behalf trying to fend off the threat of the massive tax bill & penalties from HMRC becoming reality and threatening the clubs future existence. I think only the Evening Times has reported this - why anybody would buy Rangers FC or invest ?25M or buy a ST until that case is resolved one way or the other is beyond me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Root Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Scarcely anybody in the media even mentioning that Andrew Thornhill QC is currently in tribunal on Rangers behalf trying to fend off the threat of the massive tax bill & penalties from HMRC becoming reality and threatening the clubs future existence. I think only the Evening Times has reported this - why anybody would buy Rangers FC or invest ?25M or buy a ST until that case is resolved one way or the other is beyond me? Hopefully no orcs renew and they head into the summer cashless. It's all good news really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Rangers board have just released a statement http://www.rangers.co.uk/articles/20110419/club-statement_2254024_2342295 Buying themselves more time in the takeover/fakeover .................. I would expect Lloyds Bank to be on the phone to the Rangers board as we speak with a"Deal or No Deal" type ultimatum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I thought Murray already tried the "fresh issue of new capital" route a couple of years ago and such was the lack of interest he ended up putting another ?50m or so in himself. Hard to believe it will work any better now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterion Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 To this end the Board has had an approach from one of its directors who wishes the Board to consider an alternative funding option. This would involve a fresh issue of new capital to raise ?25m to be invested directly into the Club. The Board believes that it has a responsibility to examine this proposal whilst continuing its review of the Craig Whyte transaction. After six months of limited engagement in the process, the Board believes that is not in the best interests of its stakeholders for it to be pressed into an unrealistic timescale. WTF ? The last time there was a shares offer Rangers fans could only come up with about ?1mill and SDM had to fork out millions himself. Where is ?25mill going to come from... thin air ? Has to be said - this sort of financial wishful thinking makes Vlad look like a business angel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I would expect Lloyds Bank to be on the phone to the Rangers board as we speak with a"Deal or No Deal" type ultimatum. Quite. At least CPR realised the game was up when HBOS called in the debt. If there are shareholders who approve of the Whyte deal (and I'd guess there are) the board may also be getting some alternative advice on what exactly their "fiduciary duty" is. It looks like a delightful mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I would expect Lloyds Bank to be on the phone to the Rangers board as we speak with a"Deal or No Deal" type ultimatum. Lloyds Bank have security over Ibrox and Rangers assets so whether the take-over/fake-over goes ahead or if Rangers end up plunged into administration the Bank would be preferential creditors and are almost certain to get all their money back even if they have to liquidate RFC if no new buyer will stump up enough cash to clear their loans. Obviously a quick sale would get their money back quicker and with less adverse publicity but the Huge Tax Bill hangs like a sword over RFC with still no clarity of who if anybody has the money to pay off HMRC should Rangers lose the tribunal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Lloyds Bank have security over Ibrox and Rangers assets so whether the take-over/fake-over goes ahead or if Rangers end up plunged into administration the Bank would be preferential creditors and are almost certain to get all their money back even if they have to liquidate RFC if no new buyer will stump up enough cash to clear their loans. Obviously a quick sale would get their money back quicker and with less adverse publicity but the Huge Tax Bill hangs like a sword over RFC with still no clarity of who if anybody has the money to pay off HMRC should Rangers lose the tribunal? If Rangers lose, which of HMRC and Lloyds is first in the queue as creditors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 If Rangers lose, which of HMRC and Lloyds is first in the queue as creditors? Lloyds as they are secured creditors whilst everybody else (except the administrator) are ordinary creditors including HMRC. However if rangers got whacked for the full tax, interest and fines (ie between ?30M and ?50M) then HMRC would dwarf all the other creditors and so no deal could be agreed without their say so. Both them and Lloyds would have to agree to selling off Rangers FC or their assets in such a way that they both maximised their repayment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Das Root Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 CB, I do hope that happens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bilel Mohsni Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I want what CB said to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wright1989 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I hope you're right CB. I really do. Hope your right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 In previous administrations the tax-man was able to be out-voted by the other creditors in terms of agreeing to receive x pence in the pound for their debts. In Rangers case if HMRC win the tribunal and appeals and Rangers are hit for the full amount of unpaid tax, compound interest and fines then at approx ?54M they would be the majority creditor and couldn't be outvoted and shafted as they have withother clubs. Both HMRC and Lloyds would have to agree on how to divvy up RFC, pay off Lloyds secured loans and maximise repayment to HMRC (& other creditors) as they are legally obliged to do so. In cases like Dundee FC the local companies might have been minded to accept a small repayment to ensure that whilst they got something Dundee FC continued - HMRC however have a legal duty to reclaim as much of the tax payers money as possible even if that means liquidation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 even a confirmed member of the more blinkered brigade of rangers supporters today appeared to be less than confident about the future well being of his football club. his theory - well, one of them - was that david murray himself may be having second thoughts about ending his rangers involvement because.... maybe he sees the mooted cross-border cup competition as the beginning of a brighter and more lucrative era and that now isn't the right time to sell. :omg!: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bilel Mohsni Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Who would foot the bill for any failed appeals from Rangers if they lost and tried to appeal the decision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Lloyds as they are secured creditors whilst everybody else (except the administrator) are ordinary creditors including HMRC. However if rangers got whacked for the full tax, interest and fines (ie between ?30M and ?50M) then HMRC would dwarf all the other creditors and so no deal could be agreed without their say so. Both them and Lloyds would have to agree to selling off Rangers FC or their assets in such a way that they both maximised their repayment. If Rangers FC the company goes into voluntary administration ( and there isnt another kind) they are legally declaring and accepting that they cant service debt and other liabilities from either income or assets or a combination on both. An administrator, KPMG for example, is appointed who is independent from everyone, including Lloyds. The administrator's first function,if possible, is to preserve the business as a going concern, clearing as much debt as possible from the proceeds of sales of assets. First of all they would try and sell the club as a whole going concern. Thats likely to be easy but at a rock bottom price. The next alternative would be that they dissolve the company and sell it in bits. I dont know how much Rangers owe Lloyds or the HMRC or both combined, but I'd be willing to speculate that they owe far far more than the club is even worth on the open market, far less as a bargain basement sale to get it off the administrators hands and earn them their fee. Lloyds or HMRC would have no say or influence whatsoever over the disposal of the club by the administrators. I'm not sure what order creditors get paid or if there is in fact a pecking order. My only experience of administration was with a previous employer and when that business was sold as a going concern, the creditors got something like 45p in the pound that they were owed. Although some creditors did eventually get paid in full as we needed to continue working with them, although those payments were entirely a gesture of goodwill on behalf of the new owners. If Rangers are risking administration or contemplating it as a solution this will IMO impact on Lloyds who wont get the full amount they are owed, therefore they will be very keen, but powerless, to see that the Whyte deal goes ahead because in that deal there is provision, it seems , for Lloyds to be paid in full. The upside of going into administration for a prospective new owner of Rangers FC is that the HMRC bill and the Lloyds bank bill, dont exist anymore when they take over, because the administrator will have paid them 45p in the pound or whatever from the proceeds of the sale. Of course the current owners of Rangers FC get NOTHING in that scenario but walking away with NOTHING and ensuring the club remains intact at the same time might actually be a very attractive position compared to what could happen. . I'd go as far as to say that a new owner stepping in now must be completely off his head if there is any possibility that Rangers will go into administration. The only reason, I suspect, that they are not currently in administration is because of the impact on their points total Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Sexington Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 even a confirmed member of the more blinkered brigade of rangers supporters today appeared to be less than confident about the future well being of his football club. his theory - well, one of them - was that david murray himself may be having second thoughts about ending his rangers involvement because.... maybe he sees the mooted cross-border cup competition as the beginning of a brighter and more lucrative era and that now isn't the right time to sell. :omg!: Hahaha Deary me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Broo Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Why would anyone invest in share capital with Rangers in the state they are in? Therefore surely this idea to have a new issue of shares to raise ?25 million is pie in the sky, or a smokescreen...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottm2011 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 It seems like someone has came in at the last minute (or has been in the background the whole time) and the board are stalling for him/them. Alistair Johnstone's statement this afternoon seems to point in that direction anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wright1989 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 In previous administrations the tax-man was able to be out-voted by the other creditors in terms of agreeing to receive x pence in the pound for their debts. In Rangers case if HMRC win the tribunal and appeals and Rangers are hit for the full amount of unpaid tax, compound interest and fines then at approx ?54M they would be the majority creditor and couldn't be outvoted and shafted as they have withother clubs. Both HMRC and Lloyds would have to agree on how to divvy up RFC, pay off Lloyds secured loans and maximise repayment to HMRC (& other creditors) as they are legally obliged to do so. In cases like Dundee FC the local companies might have been minded to accept a small repayment to ensure that whilst they got something Dundee FC continued - HMRC however have a legal duty to reclaim as much of the tax payers money as possible even if that means liquidation. Stop it. Just stop it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Hahaha Deary me. a very precise analogy. he's an otherwise intelligent guy who simply appears to be completely blinded by something. panic maybe. yak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 If Rangers FC the company goes into voluntary administration ( and there isnt another kind) they are legally declaring and accepting that they cant service debt and other liabilities from either income or assets or a combination on both. An administrator, KPMG for example, is appointed who is independent from everyone, including Lloyds. The administrator's first function,if possible, is to preserve the business as a going concern, clearing as much debt as possible from the proceeds of sales of assets. First of all they would try and sell the club as a whole going concern. Thats likely to be easy but at a rock bottom price. The next alternative would be that they dissolve the company and sell it in bits. I dont know how much Rangers owe Lloyds or the HMRC or both combined, but I'd be willing to speculate that they owe far far more than the club is even worth on the open market, far less as a bargain basement sale to get it off the administrators hands and earn them their fee. I'm not sure what order creditors get paid or if there is in fact a pecking order. My only experience of administration was with a previous employer and when that business was sold as a going concern, the creditors got something like 45p in the pound that they were owed. Although some creditors did eventually get paid in full as we needed to continue working with them, although those payments were entirely a gesture of goodwill on behalf of the hew owners If Rangers are risking administration or contemplating it as a solution this will IMO impact on Lloyds who wont get the full amount they are owed, therefore they will be very keen, but powerless, to see that the Whyte deal goes ahead because in that deal there is provision, it seems , for Lloyds to be paid in full. The upside of going into administration for a prospective new owner of Rangers FC is that the HMRC bill and the Lloyds bank bill, dont exist anymore when they take over, because the administrator will have paid them 45p in the pound or whatever from the proceeds of the sale. Of course the current owners of Rangers FC get NOTHING in that scenario but walking away with NOTHING and ensuring the club remains intact at the same time might actually be a very attractive position compared to what could happen. . I'd go as far as to say that a new owner stepping in now must be completely off his head if there is any possibility that Rangers will go into administration. All of what you said is true however the administrator has 2 duties 1) to try to sell the club as a going concern 2) to maximise creditors repayment - he can only achieve 1) IF the creditors agree to that - as HMRC and Lloyds have a legal duty to the tax-payer / their shareholders then legally their primary concern is to recoup as much of what they are owed as possible. Rangers FC as a football club will continue to exist of that i have no doubt as somebody will buy them and they still have over fifty thousand fans but the current Rangers FC ie the company as we know it could well be obliterated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwaysthereinspirit Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Mad Vlad should offer 100,000 pounds for Bougherra right now just to get it on the back page of the Daily Record. Tomorrow we bid 100,000 pounds for Naismith for the back page of Thursdays Record Thursday we bid 50,000 for MacGregor and on and on and on........ The OF had done it for years with cheeky wee bids, why cant we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bilel Mohsni Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 What is the absolute worst case scenario then as things stand? That's what I want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 What is the absolute worst case scenario then as things stand? That's what I want. rangers somehow survive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wright1989 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 rangers somehow survive. Good one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Why would anyone invest in share capital with Rangers in the state they are in? Therefore surely this idea to have a new issue of shares to raise ?25 million is pie in the sky, or a smokescreen...... Fergus McCann did appear at Celtic. He funded a rescue deal - and then went to the fans with a capital issue. Rangers have a lot of fans. Presumably if it were styled as a share deal to save the club then people would step up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 What is the absolute worst case scenario then as things stand? That's what I want. HMRC and Lloyds cannot agree on the sale of RFC as a going concern and the administrator is forced to liquidate the club. This would leave any new would be owners of Rangers Football Club 2011-2012 Ltd having to start from scratch, buy the stadium, the rights to the club name, badge, colours etc as happened at Fiorentina and persuade the fans that the new company was a continuation of the team that first played on fleshers haugh in 1873. Italian football teaches us that it took Fiorentina only a few seasons to regain their former status but if such a thing happened in Scotland it would rock our football to the very core! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 In previous administrations the tax-man was able to be out-voted by the other creditors in terms of agreeing to receive x pence in the pound for their debts. In Rangers case if HMRC win the tribunal and appeals and Rangers are hit for the full amount of unpaid tax, compound interest and fines then at approx ?54M they would be the majority creditor and couldn't be outvoted and shafted as they have withother clubs. Both HMRC and Lloyds would have to agree on how to divvy up RFC, pay off Lloyds secured loans and maximise repayment to HMRC (& other creditors) as they are legally obliged to do so. In cases like Dundee FC the local companies might have been minded to accept a small repayment to ensure that whilst they got something Dundee FC continued - HMRC however have a legal duty to reclaim as much of the tax payers money as possible even if that means liquidation. Charlie. I dont think any of this applies if Rangers go into administration. Lloyds certainly appear to be a secure creditor so they may well be able to claim that security, be it the stadium or the "club"itself. That still leaves them short because the "club' they take still owes the taxman and others no doubt, millions upon millions of pounds and they would have to cover that from assets and wouldnt be able to. They will lose big time if they call in the security either wise they'd have done it months ago. The only way out of this for Rangers to survive as a club is administration, especially if they lose the HMRC tribunal. And in that case HMRC and Lloyds have no say as to how it is disposed of. They get a share depending on what the administrators sell it for. And that share wont be anything like what they are owed IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Fergus McCann did appear at Celtic. He funded a rescue deal - and then went to the fans with a capital issue. Rangers have a lot of fans. Presumably if it were styled as a share deal to save the club then people would step up. They would be better doing this after the tax mess was sorted out though Coco otherwise tens of millions that could be put into funding the club and team might have to go to repaying the taxman if Rangers lose the tax-case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bilel Mohsni Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Aye you know what I mean buddy! Best/worst case scenario! As it stands right now I want them to lose, appeal, lose again and have a humungous bill to pay at the end of it... Then I want Bain in the stocks in front of a massive Govan-Kathkin Park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Charlie. I dont think any of this applies if Rangers go into administration. Lloyds certainly appear to be a secure creditor so they may well be able to claim that security, be it the stadium or the "club"itself. That still leaves them short because the "club' they take still owes the taxman and others no doubt, millions upon millions of pounds and they would have to cover that from assets and wouldnt be able to. They will lose big time if they call in the security either wise they'd have done it months ago. The only way out of this for Rangers to survive as a club is administration, especially if they lose the HMRC tribunal. And in that case HMRC and Lloyds have no say as to how it is disposed of. They get a share depending on what the administrators sell it for. And that share wont be anything like what they are owed IMO You are incorrect here OaG - creditors have to vote through any settlement of their claim or disposal of assets. Some creditors (ie Rangers club-deck bond holders might settle for pennies in the pound) Lloyds and HMRC cannot do so as they have legal obligations to their share-holders and the tax-payer. The administrator must get the creditors to approve any proposals he puts forward or else he has no option but to liquidate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vlad-Stupid Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I'm just surprised Celtic haven't been linked with buying out rangers yet. One cheek couldn't survive without the other IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 ................. If Rangers are risking administration or contemplating it as a solution this will IMO impact on Lloyds who wont get the full amount they are owed, therefore they will be very keen, but powerless, to see that the Whyte deal goes ahead because in that deal there is provision, it seems , for Lloyds to be paid in full. The upside of going into administration for a prospective new owner of Rangers FC is that the HMRC bill and the Lloyds bank bill, dont exist anymore when they take over, because the administrator will have paid them 45p in the pound or whatever from the proceeds of the sale. Of course the current owners of Rangers FC get NOTHING in that scenario but walking away with NOTHING and ensuring the club remains intact at the same time might actually be a very attractive position compared to what could happen. ............... The only reason, I suspect, that they are not currently in administration is because of the impact on their points total Lloyds already own 25% of MIH, and through that holding around 25% of Rangers. They also hold the bulk of the enormous MIH debt. It would be in Lloyds interests to see Rangers sold off before the tax case is settled as the HMRC case is against Rangers. Only Rangers will be liable for that debt and not MIH or Lloyds. If Rangers were to go into administration before the end of the season, then they would not be able to play in Europe next season. Edit: I should add that if Lloyds, MIH or SDM were to agree to be guarantors the tax bill, then they would have to place anything up to ?60M in an escrow account before the sale goes through. I can't see any of those parties being able or willing to fund such a guarantee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Aye you know what I mean buddy! Best/worst case scenario! As it stands right now I want them to lose, appeal, lose again and have a humungous bill to pay at the end of it... Then I want Bain in the stocks in front of a massive Govan-Kathkin Park. nothing seems to be imminent anyway. this takeover... or should that be fakeover?... looks like running on for a while yet and the HMRC case isn't being being settled until at least august according to some reports. would that leave the main protagonists enough time to undergo extensive plastic surgery in order to hide themselves from the 'weearrapeepul' baying mob when the balloon goes POP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Rangers are already in de facto administration as they've admitted that Lloyds are controlling the club and not the Board of Directors. This is the only reason that they are not in de jure Administration as it would mean the main creditor handing over the reins to an accountancy firm appointed by the court. Murray has lost control of this part of his House of Cards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Lloyds already own 25% of MIH, and through that holding around 25% of Rangers. They also hold the bulk of the enormous MIH debt. It would be in Lloyds interests to see Rangers sold off before the tax case is settled as the HMRC case is against Rangers. Only Rangers will be liable for that debt and not MIH or Lloyds. If Rangers were to go into administration before the end of the season, then they would not be able to play in Europe next season. Depends what the guarantee arrangements are between Rangers and MIH. Chances are that MIH guarantee Rangers overdraft facility and it could be that this facility would have to be utilised to pay HMRC. If the overdraft cannot be extended to pay off HMRC then Rangers cease to be a going concern and liquidation proceeding must begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Rangers are already in de facto administration as they've admitted that Lloyds are controlling the club and not the Board of Directors. This is the only reason that they are not in de jure Administration as it would mean the main creditor handing over the reins to an accountancy firm appointed by the court. Murray has lost control of this part of his House of Cards. Agree with this Spellczech, but despite losing control his company, without a sale going through, will retain liability for payment of the tax bill I would imagine, and anything due to the bankers, unless he is considering putting the whole of The Murray International Holdings Group into administration. Rangers are tied to MIH, just as HMFC form part of the overall UBIG Group of Companies, and simply putting Rangers into administration shouldn't enable them to escape paying what they are due I'd imagine. One of the reasons I suspect Murray is desperate to sell the club, to get out of that liability, because I suspect he knows the HMRC case is going to be lost, big time. Not a lot of money to him I don't suppose, ?60 million, but when you take into account MIH has a debt of around ?990 million I believe (with all loans taken into account) he won't want them being held liable for this tax bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 The sensible course for any Rangers minded individual would be to keep their investment money or season ticket money back for now and use that to help rebuild the sticky buns if they lose the tax-case and are forced into administration or liquidation. Unless somebody is giving cast-iron guarantees and legal assurances to pay any tax bill and has the funds in place then puting money into the gers just now could see that money wiped out if they lose the tax-case and appeals. Why not hold back a few weeks or months to see which way the wind blows before commiting their money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Depends what the guarantee arrangements are between Rangers and MIH. Chances are that MIH guarantee Rangers overdraft facility and it could be that this facility would have to be utilised to pay HMRC. If the overdraft cannot be extended to pay off HMRC then Rangers cease to be a going concern and liquidation proceeding must begin. I can't see Lloyds permitting MIH to extend their borrowing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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