police application

[Sten Guns]

Please note however I do not condone in any way shape or form the sort of veiled racism Sten Guns is posting up (see his other thread about a dating site for Black people)

 

Incredible!

 

Please keep your incoherent, nonsensical and absolutely outrageous statements to yourself if you are not intelligent enough to understand someones postings.

 

Thanks.

[Sten Guns]

In England, Scotland and Wales employers are permitted to encourage applicants for jobs from "minority" or "under-represented" backgrounds. However, it is against the law to discriminate in favour of such applicants when giving jobs.

 

Very true Ulysses. I'm all for this.

 

However, sadly the Police are DEFINITELY favouring under represented minorities. My GF has told me all about it from what she saw and experienced at Tulliallan. All in aid of meeting quotas. It's so wrong it's incredible.

 

But it's happening. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

[scuj1]

3 pages, max

[Ulysses]

Very true Ulysses. I'm all for this.

 

However, sadly the Police are DEFINITELY favouring under represented minorities. My GF has told me all about it from what she saw and experienced at Tulliallan. All in aid of meeting quotas. It's so wrong it's incredible.

 

But it's happening. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

 

But if they are doing something which is clearly illegal, two obvious questions arise:

 

* Why aren't the media kicking up a fuss about it?

 

* Why aren't you doing something practical about it instead of just mumping your gums on JKB?

[Sten Guns]

But if they are doing something which is clearly illegal, two obvious questions arise:

 

* Why aren't the media kicking up a fuss about it?

 

* Why aren't you doing something practical about it instead of just mumping your gums on JKB?

 

1. It would be covered up. Denied. Defended. Sugar coated. Lied about.

 

2. Ok, I will say no more on here.

[Sharpie]

1. It would be covered up. Denied. Defended. Sugar coated. Lied about.

 

2. Ok, I will say no more on here.

 

In all fairness to you you have taken a bit of stick on this thread. You should however stop posting on the matter now because your emotions are causing you to write in a manner that would surely result in rejection by most police departments. I say this not to knock just to make a point to you.

[Ulysses]

1. It would be covered up. Denied. Defended. Sugar coated. Lied about.

 

Ah, I see.

[this_is_my_story]

I 100% agree with that, so long as those taken on meet the criteria.

 

But this is not happening. Stardards are lowered, when they shouldn't. Rules are bent, when they shouldn't.

 

This is NOT acceptable.

 

Example, you have a family member in a burning building, the Fire Fighter isn't strong enough to save them. They die. Why? Rules were bent. Not everyone was treated fairly. They passed entrance test when they shouldn't have.

 

Oh, but it's ok, our staff reflect society.

 

BS. Staff should only reflect society if the BEST are taken on, regardless of race, religion, gender, age etc.

 

I believe everyone should be treated equally, and I don't agree with rule bending to meet quotas.

 

They sure are - and arguably, nowhere is this more perfectly illustrated than in the Polis Force!

 

Sten, I'm sure you're big, old and ugly enough to realise that the old saying "If your face fits" is widely applicable. Nuff said, really!

[Only a Game]

Incredible!

 

Please keep your incoherent, nonsensical and absolutely outrageous statements to yourself if you are not intelligent enough to understand someones postings.

 

Thanks.

 

Did L&B possibly pick up, somewhere in your application process that perhaps you were lacking in tact, diplomacy and calm considered responses to difficult situations ?

 

Does it occur to you that raising the possibility that a British Police force now positively discriminates in favour of ethnic minorities would actually be viewed as a very positive change of tac by most people.

 

L&B Police to my certain knowledge, do not have "Quotas" of ethnic minorities that they MUST recruit. They, like every other police force in the UK are "targetted" to recruit from their own community with a view to reflecting their own communities ethnicity. Im not aware of any force in the UK who has ever come close to achieving their "target" nor one who has turned away excellent candidates in favour of less able candidates from ethnic minorities. I'm sure they would not admit it but the recruitment rate amongst ethnic minorities is so far off target for most forces and has been since they tried to increase it that the project is barely paid lip service to these days.

 

Just one final thing. Anyone with a conviction for shoplifting that became known during the recruitment process would immediatly be disqualified and I dont believe your assertion that one such person had a blind eye turned to a conviction for dishonesty.

 

As far as police recruitment in general is concerned, and this has been going on for many years, you have to either be an outstanding candidate with no blemishes, no little hidden skeletons, no little personality defects that might hamper your ability do the job, or you have to have a university degree in which case they make certain small concessions that a non graduate applicant might not get. They like academics and fast trackers and most of that type of recruit barely see an angry man on the street after their initial two years.

 

I think in your case they found something they didnt like much. I'm pretty sure that either you directly and officially, or one of your family/friends in the police unofficially could find out, for your piece of mind, what that something was

[bighusref]

Very true Ulysses. I'm all for this.

 

However, sadly the Police are DEFINITELY favouring under represented minorities. My GF has told me all about it from what she saw and experienced at Tulliallan. All in aid of meeting quotas. It's so wrong it's incredible.

 

But it's happening. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

 

I'm sorry Sten Guns, but I disagree.

 

I do not think that the Police actively break the law in their recruitment drives. I do not think that in this society they would get away with that. Big companies, like the Police, will actually go the other way and be, excuse the pun, whiter than white to avoid any suggestion of wrongdoing.

 

It's a shame for you, you applied for a job and didn't get it. However I don't think the Police gave "your" job to somebody else because of their skin colour. What I would say, is that your lack of trust in the system and beliefs about their quotas and targets could have came through in their vetting process and that could have been enough to rule you out.

[Sten Guns]

I'm sorry Sten Guns, but I disagree.

 

I do not think that the Police actively break the law in their recruitment drives. I do not think that in this society they would get away with that. Big companies, like the Police, will actually go the other way and be, excuse the pun, whiter than white to avoid any suggestion of wrongdoing.

 

It's a shame for you, you applied for a job and didn't get it. However I don't think the Police gave "your" job to somebody else because of their skin colour. What I would say, is that your lack of trust in the system and beliefs about their quotas and targets could have came through in their vetting process and that could have been enough to rule you out.

 

I'm afraid your wrong. It's a FACT that rules are bent and certain fitness failings ignored, in order to get certain people through all the hoops.

 

My partner is in the job and has not long spent her time at Tulliallan, and it is most definitely occuring.

 

You have officers telling probationers to 'lie' and keep a diary saying that they are hitting the gym everyday, at least trying to make the targets that they keep failing. It's pathetic. But it meets quotas.

 

Right, said all I have to say on the issue now. Whether you like it or not, this is happening.

[Sten Guns]

Did L&B possibly pick up, somewhere in your application process that perhaps you were lacking in tact, diplomacy and calm considered responses to difficult situations ?

 

Does it occur to you that raising the possibility that a British Police force now positively discriminates in favour of ethnic minorities would actually be viewed as a very positive change of tac by most people.

 

L&B Police to my certain knowledge, do not have "Quotas" of ethnic minorities that they MUST recruit. They, like every other police force in the UK are "targetted" to recruit from their own community with a view to reflecting their own communities ethnicity. Im not aware of any force in the UK who has ever come close to achieving their "target" nor one who has turned away excellent candidates in favour of less able candidates from ethnic minorities. I'm sure they would not admit it but the recruitment rate amongst ethnic minorities is so far off target for most forces and has been since they tried to increase it that the project is barely paid lip service to these days.

 

Just one final thing. Anyone with a conviction for shoplifting that became known during the recruitment process would immediatly be disqualified and I dont believe your assertion that one such person had a blind eye turned to a conviction for dishonesty.

 

As far as police recruitment in general is concerned, and this has been going on for many years, you have to either be an outstanding candidate with no blemishes, no little hidden skeletons, no little personality defects that might hamper your ability do the job, or you have to have a university degree in which case they make certain small concessions that a non graduate applicant might not get. They like academics and fast trackers and most of that type of recruit barely see an angry man on the street after their initial two years.

 

I think in your case they found something they didnt like much. I'm pretty sure that either you directly and officially, or one of your family/friends in the police unofficially could find out, for your piece of mind, what that something was

 

Nonsense. Inspector Colin Kenny who was head of recruitment made it very clear at the familiarisation evening that he did not care if anyone had university degrees and that it would have no bearing.

 

Again, your wrong, I know the girl who got in. Shop lifting was brought up at her home interview, but they let it slide as it happened when she was 16.

 

I also think you will find Positive Disrimination is illegal.

 

Mean time, thanks for giving away your occupation. But you need to do some more recruitment research, or at least not lie about it.

[Only a Game]

Nonsense. Inspector Colin Kenny who was head of recruitment made it very clear at the familiarisation evening that he did not care if anyone had university degrees and that it would have no bearing.

 

Again, your wrong, I know the girl who got in. Shop lifting was brought up at her home interview, but they let it slide as it happened when she was 16.

 

I also think you will find Positive Disrimination is illegal.

 

Mean time, thanks for giving away your occupation. But you need to do some more recruitment research, or at least not lie about it.

 

The evidence as to why you were rejected is certainly mounting up now isnt it ?

 

Maybe you should go for a self awareness course, maybe a bit of anger management.........and try again

 

Youve made a wrong assumption about my occupation (they wouldnt like that trait at the recruitment office either)

However I do know the gentleman you have mentioned above personally and I'd be more than happy to approach him on your behalf to find out the real reason for your rejection. Let me know.

[Andy.C]

I actually find myself agreeing with a lot of what Sten Guns is saying regarding quotas...my old man was in the fire brigade (retired a while ago now), but the quota thing was just coming into play back then. Some of the stories he had about the 'recruitment drive' were worrying.

[Boaby Ewing]

Ha, Kickback is brilliant sometimes.

[davemclaren]

I think some use the 'quotas' idea to justify their own failings. Let's face it, not everyone is going to be what they want to be.

[Deek]

So now, yep, i fecking hate the police, with a passion.

 

Have you told your girlfriend this.

 

Perhaps you should. She may then handcuff you to the bed and assault you with her truncheon.

[Ulysses]

Have you told your girlfriend this.

 

Has he told his girlfriend about this thread?

[Uberjambo]

You should have tried the funny handshake at your first interview.

[Only a Game]

Has he told his girlfriend about this thread?

 

We probably shouldnt even touch on the extraordinarily high incidence of girls who join the police who dump their "outsider" partners for "insiders" (especially high where the outsider has a bee in his bonnet about the police I'd imagine)

[Only a Game]

You should have tried the funny handshake at your first interview.

 

Doesnt work anymore. Most of the ones who had any influence or power in that regard have long since retired

[scott_jambo]

Sounds like your girlfriend is feeding you the "dont worry babe, there are quota's to fill, thats why you didnt get in. One girl was even a shoplifter!" line.

 

If you use your objective head and ignore your girlfriend's softly softly approach you will realise you got rejected for the simple reason that something you did made them unsure of you to a point where they had to reject you even after passing the fitness test etc..

 

I for one am glad we have one less racist in the police force.

[Only a Game]

 

I for one am glad we have one less racist in the police force.

 

But but but..........They work on quotas based on the profile of the community at large. Surely they are duty bound to have a quota of racists..........No ?

 

They seem to allow for a quota of shoplifters these days as well. How refreshingly enlightened

[Sharpie]

As it has all been forgotten due to a somewhat bitter rejected applicant, I will just say to the young guy who is the OP don,t let any of this crap spoil your pleasure, its only a wee taste of what the job brings. And as a small point of interest, after about the thirties the hand shake done nothing. The secret was play rugby, fitba', or be a piper. There was a wee window in the late fifties when joining the boxing team was a help.

[Only a Game]

As it has all been forgotten due to a somewhat bitter rejected applicant, I will just say to the young guy who is the OP don,t let any of this crap spoil your pleasure, its only a wee taste of what the job brings. And as a small point of interest, after about the thirties the hand shake done nothing. The secret was play rugby, fitba', or be a piper. There was a wee window in the late fifties when joining the boxing team was a help.

 

Boxing was certainly a help in the 70's when the late Bob Crozier was around as well.

 

I think the masonry thing didnt really die a death until around the end of the 70's Up till then there was a high incidence of suspicious promotions amongst craft members as well as non members being passed over.

[Deek]

Boxing was certainly a help in the 70's when the late Bob Crozier was around as well.

 

I think the masonry thing didnt really die a death until around the end of the 70's Up till then there was a high incidence of suspicious promotions amongst craft members as well as non members being passed over.

 

I had a friend who worked in West Lothian in the late 80's. He said he was one of three on the Masonic promotion list.

 

They all surprisingly did manage promotion.

[Miller Jambo 60]

How on earth does that make me racist?!

 

Are u having a laugh?

 

So now, if u think ur being victimised (which I don't) your racist? Get a grip!

 

I'm saying I KNOW the police have quotas.

 

After going thru what I did, you would maybe believe that is the reason I was rejected.

 

That is NOT racist. Unbelievable.

 

KB at its best, bringing the stupid racist issue in for the most minimal reason.

Maybe he said white because he is from a prominant white country.

Cant believe im typing this.

[Sharpie]

Boxing was certainly a help in the 70's when the late Bob Crozier was around as well.

 

I think the masonry thing didnt really die a death until around the end of the 70's Up till then there was a high incidence of suspicious promotions amongst craft members as well as non members being passed over.

 

I can honestly say between 55 and 67 when I left I never saw anything to indicate the masonic thing. Certainly knew lots of masons but as I say most of the fast movers were football or rugby they may have been masons as well of course, pipers generally settled for straight day shift. Me I was definitely stupid, I enjoyed the old beat work and had little or no ambition. I did do some A/Ps in my latter years.

 

I knew Bob Crozier very well. He was a well known and respected amateur referee. He was one of the coaches when Pat Tierney resurrected the boxing club, Willie Cunningham was the other I was in it at the start, and was single at the time. I was matched up with a student who was training for the British Championships. He was a one punch winner in most of his fights, and he whipped me for two rounds. Bob Crozier got over to me after the second round and told me it was embarrassing watching me get whipped. I got mad and done pretty well after that. When I got home my new wife flipped out at the sight of me, that was the boxing career finished. I was plagued for quite a while after by Pat Tierney who offered me a spot in CID if I would come back to the club.

 

In terestingly enough Pat Tierney had the reputation of being the first catholic hired by ECP in the thirties, and it was because of his boxing prowess.

[bighusref]

I'm afraid your wrong. It's a FACT that rules are bent and certain fitness failings ignored, in order to get certain people through all the hoops.

 

My partner is in the job and has not long spent her time at Tulliallan, and it is most definitely occuring.

 

You have officers telling probationers to 'lie' and keep a diary saying that they are hitting the gym everyday, at least trying to make the targets that they keep failing. It's pathetic. But it meets quotas.

 

Right, said all I have to say on the issue now. Whether you like it or not, this is happening.

 

It's not a FACT, it's an opinion. However, your demeanor all thread has been about aggressive defence of even the most simple of questions, (tbh, I wouldn't hire someone who could not field simple questions without going ridiculously defensive) so it would not surprise me if you still dispute this.

[Mac Elliott]

Lol, kickback at its finest.

 

For the OP you just have to watch everything you say, and how you act from this point forward be the most politically correct you can, nod and smile say the right thing its all just a big game. Getting through the application form is 1 of the biggest hurdles so you have done well to get this far. good luck

 

Ignore all the rubbish about quotas it just doesnt happen. The familiarisation evening i was on had 70 people there, not 1 so called ethnic minority there.

 

 

I know they have hammered the recruitment of late, so maybe they ran out of spaces for 25 year old, hard working, fit white males. WOULDNT SURPRISE ME. And before anyone doesnt like me saying that, try going through what i went through, and see how it makes you feel!

 

Probably wasn't the best choice of words, let my mate a serving officer see this and the first thing he thought was racist. Surely when you read it back you can understand what people where getting at? If you got all the way to the final interview surely you remember the good old 6 strands of diversity they bang on about.

[Andyeyespy]

Well done. Getting your application accepted is a massive hurdle due to the way they want it done

 

As previously said. If you need any help there's plenty serving and ex cops on here.

 

Whats the next stage ?

 

The next stage is a standard entrance test/initial fitness test. No dates yet.

[Andyeyespy]

Congratulations young man, I remember the thrill I got with the letter from Edinburgh City Police, still remember the day and its fifty five years ago now. You no doubt in your career will meet some total anuses, but you will meet some sterling life time friends. I have been out of my original Force for nearly forty three years and have on occasion still had contact, and in the past had many visitors here in Canada from ECP.

 

I may be a bit premature in talking about your career knowing the systems now, compared to my time, selection is a lot more comprehensive. However you have got the first stage, and I am not a praying person but I will think positive thoughts for you. Semper Vigilo.

 

Early days yet but fingers crossed, Thank you for the great reply:thumb:

[Mac Elliott]

The next stage is a standard entrance test/initial fitness test. No dates yet.

 

It's actually quite an easy day, the biggest thing for me was the nerves at the start.

 

Maths,English and Information Handling are all reasonably easy, download sample tests and try them.

 

1 1/2 mile run round inverleith park is a dawdle and they expect around 10 mins to do it you get 12!!! Push pull test is where a few failed they want a reading of 67kg for both if you can bench press 50kg you should pass it easy

 

Critical Thinking Test i'm sure they said no one had ever failed it!!! its so ridiculously easy multiple choice. example: you see a man standing outside a house with ladders at 3 in the morning do you a, approach him b, watch him c, ignore him.

[Andyeyespy]

Lol, kickback at its finest.

 

For the OP you just have to watch everything you say, and how you act from this point forward be the most politically correct you can, nod and smile say the right thing its all just a big game. Getting through the application form is 1 of the biggest hurdles so you have done well to get this far. good luck

 

Ignore all the rubbish about quotas it just doesnt happen. The familiarisation evening i was on had 70 people there, not 1 so called ethnic minority there.

 

 

 

Probably wasn't the best choice of words, let my mate a serving officer see this and the first thing he thought was racist. Surely when you read it back you can understand what people where getting at? If you got all the way to the final interview surely you remember the good old 6 strands of diversity they bang on about.

 

Thank you:thumb:

[Andyeyespy]

I have wanted to join the police for years but i dont have the guts as i dont know what the application process involves so any helpful tips id be grateful. cheers

 

Hi, My grades are not the best but have got alot of experience working with the public. My application was successful so u just dont know unless you try. Whats the worst that can happen? GO FOR IT....

[Only a Game]

The next stage is a standard entrance test/initial fitness test. No dates yet.

 

The fitness test is as someone posted above. Basic fitness or above will get you through. If your unfit or overweight be honest with yourself and get something done about it now.

 

They went through a period where the English/Maths etc was ridiculously hard but I think theyve eased it off a bit now. You cant really study for that although I think you can download sample tests. You either gets maths and English or you dont. One thing they used to do (dont know if the still do) is include quite a bit of current affairs. So read newspapers and keep up to date with the big issues and if you get questions like that, try not to be anything more than factual (e.g. dont say that you think the US and UK should withdraw from Afghanistan but find out why they say they are there and leave it at that) Dont give political opinions in any questions because sure as hell someone will come up with an opposite one

[Andyeyespy]

The fitness test is as someone posted above. Basic fitness or above will get you through. If your unfit or overweight be honest with yourself and get something done about it now.

 

They went through a period where the English/Maths etc was ridiculously hard but I think theyve eased it off a bit now. You cant really study for that although I think you can download sample tests. You either gets maths and English or you dont. One thing they used to do (dont know if the still do) is include quite a bit of current affairs. So read newspapers and keep up to date with the big issues and if you get questions like that, try not to be anything more than factual (e.g. dont say that you think the US and UK should withdraw from Afghanistan but find out why they say they are there and leave it at that) Dont give political opinions in any questions because sure as hell someone will come up with an opposite one

 

This is a fantastic post, Thank you for going out you`re way to give me some great advice:thumb:

[JamboAl]

A very big thank you to all who gave great advice on the application form, Just found out my application has been accepted. So now that ive got through, over, under the first hurdle ive got a few more to go.

 

thanks again.

 

Congrats - hope you do well.

[Mac Elliott]

The fitness test is as someone posted above. Basic fitness or above will get you through. If your unfit or overweight be honest with yourself and get something done about it now.

 

They went through a period where the English/Maths etc was ridiculously hard but I think theyve eased it off a bit now. You cant really study for that although I think you can download sample tests. You either gets maths and English or you dont. One thing they used to do (dont know if the still do) is include quite a bit of current affairs. So read newspapers and keep up to date with the big issues and if you get questions like that, try not to be anything more than factual (e.g. dont say that you think the US and UK should withdraw from Afghanistan but find out why they say they are there and leave it at that) Dont give political opinions in any questions because sure as hell someone will come up with an opposite one

 

It really is basic stuff: spelling, re-arranging sentences, a paragraph with about 15 words missing and you have the choice of 20 to put in but some can go in a few different places.

 

Oh and at any interviews whatever your opinion of something is they will try to get you to change your mind whether they believe it is right or wrong. Do not change it and be prepared to back up any answer you give

[Jamhammer]

Critical Thinking Test i'm sure they said no one had ever failed it!!! its so ridiculously easy multiple choice. example: you see a man standing outside a house with ladders at 3 in the morning do you a, approach him b, watch him c, ignore him.

 

Am I cover shift or night shift?

[Sharpie]

Am I cover shift or night shift?

 

how even the mighty can fail I would say if you were working 1800 to 0200 you would be cover shift, if you were working 2200 to 0600 you would be night shift. Can hear the buzzer going, and the thank you sir you are wrong, thanks for your time.