duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Had a concerned mate of mine on the phone who got lifted at a game and charged with Sectarian Breach of the Peace, he pleaded Not Guilty but has 4 police officers giving evidence against him! Does anyway know what he'll get if found guilty? Feel sorry for him because the Police have seemingly romanced what was actually said at the time. EDIT - It was his first offence. Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gasman Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 This is very much "flavour of the month" right now, which is probably a bad thing for your mate. With four Police lined up to give evidence against him, I'd hope he has at least one witness for the defence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 He'll get a heavy fine and a football banning order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Had a concerned mate of mine on the phone who got lifted at a game and charged with Sectarian Breach of the Peace, he pleaded Not Guilty but has 4 police officers giving evidence against him! Does anyway know what he'll get if found guilty? Feel sorry for him because the Police have seemingly romanced what was actually said at the time.EDIT - It was his first offence. Cheers What game and what city, and why four police officers when two would do the same job ? The fact that there are 4 might actually help him because they'll all have to get the story right if they're making it up. Of course if they're not making it up its a hell of a lot easier to get it right. Being honest if he's done something perhaps a bit naughty he might be best to plead to a breach of the peace without the sectarian element. If he gets done for the sectarian part its a definite football banning order IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 He'll get a heavy fine and a football banning order. Have you got any idea how heavy it would be mate? Just because the lawyer told him if the judge was in the right mood he might get the jail! That struck the fear of death in him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 What game and what city, and why four police officers when two would do the same job ? The fact that there are 4 might actually help him because they'll all have to get the story right if they're making it up. Of course if they're not making it up its a hell of a lot easier to get it right. Glasgow, when we played Celtic in September mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
this_is_my_story Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Glasgow, when we played Celtic in September mate. Hmm... so it was in Glasgow, against Celtic, and four police officers (when, as rightly stated by OAG, two would be sufficient) are to give evidence? Call me cynical... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neave Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 What 'peace' is there at a football match? The fact they've had to add 'Sectarian' at the start of the charge would suggest to me that all shouting/abuse etc is breaching the 'peace' and the 'sectarian' makes a little bit more severe and focussed. If this is the case, everyone who shouts at a match should get lifted. TBH mate, it sounds like your pal's ****ed, especially if he doesn't have any witnesses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Thinly veiled, I got lifted after singing a naughty song at the Derby and my court date is soon and I'm bricking it, post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambojackbilly Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Had a concerned mate of mine on the phone who got lifted at a game and charged with Sectarian Breach of the Peace, he pleaded Not Guilty but has 4 police officers giving evidence against him! Does anyway know what he'll get if found guilty? Feel sorry for him because the Police have seemingly romanced what was actually said at the time.EDIT - It was his first offence. Cheers The Police dont lie, the truth will come out Pity to get a criminal record but it's certainly looking that way when you are against 4 plod in court, though any witnesses could arguably counter Still, if yer mates feels aggrieved then it has to be not guilty all the way Even if it doesn't go his way he might merit sympathy fae the Judge and receive the minimum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest King Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 **** The Police IMO, especially Strathclyde Police Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Have you got any idea how heavy it would be mate? Just because the lawyer told him if the judge was in the right mood he might get the jail! That struck the fear of death in him.Tell him to instruct his lawyer that he'll plead guilty to a normal breach or he'll go to trial. If they accept this he'll probably get a ?750 fine with it being a first offence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neave Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 **** The Police IMO, especially Strathclyde Police Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 Hmm... so it was in Glasgow, against Celtic, and four police officers (when, as rightly stated by OAG, two would be sufficient) are to give evidence? Call me cynical... What the charge says is that he was shouting fenian b's whilst gesticulating and giving the v signs. Now although he was gesticulating, wasn't shouting fenian b's. Find it strange that 4 are giving evidence against him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tynie b Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Have you got any idea how heavy it would be mate? Just because the lawyer told him if the judge was in the right mood he might get the jail! That struck the fear of death in him. Sectarian breach of the peace?? No Violence?? 1st Offence?? His Lawyer (Or your mate) is talkin S***...NO WAY he'll get time, A fine and maybe some community service at worse... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Glasgow, when we played Celtic in September mate. Presumably then, he hasnt been on his own when lifted and has some chums willing to dispute the police evidence ? He doesnt really want to be getting done for sectarian breach in Glasgow. They'll hammer him. As I said, if he's been a tad naughty he should consider pleading guilty to the breach of the peace without the sectarian element. Taking a big chance going to trial hoping for 4 police officers to get it wrong somewhere or have a sudden attack of conscience, especially if he doesnt have witnesses on his side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 Tell him to instruct his lawyer that he'll plead guilty to a normal breach or he'll go to trial. If they accept this he'll probably get a ?750 fine with it being a first offence. ?750!! **** me, thats pretty steep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 sair yin. the fine and the banning order will be bad enough but it's the criminal record and the near certainty that he'll be named in the media that will really sting the erse. does he have a employer that will be a tad ***ed off when they find oot? edit - not calling him an erse. i mean HIS erse will sting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambojackbilly Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Worst case scenario a fine and a criminal record No being casual at your mates concern but TBH it aint that big a deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P-Dizzle Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Thinly veiled, I got lifted after singing a naughty song at the Derby and my court date is soon and I'm bricking it, post. This. Has there ever been a "My mate did..." thread that wasn't the OP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigwull22 Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Get Donald Findlay to defend him, I wonder what School the Police Officers went to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWL Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 ?200 to ?300 fine at the most, would really have to admit to just breach though, for it to be the lower end of the scale and when he does go up to court the plod will make it seem 10 times worse than it actually was. If it turns out they won't accept just a breach admission then he has to play the daft wee first offender card and play the very very sorry card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 sair yin. the fine and the banning order will be bad enough but it's the criminal record and the near certainty that he'll be named in the media that will really sting the erse. does he have a employer that will be a tad ***ed off when they find oot? edit - not calling him an erse. i mean HIS erse will sting. You reckon it will be in the media yeah? That would be costly for him as he works in a massive financial institution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 Worst case scenario a fine and a criminal record No being casual at your mates concern but TBH it aint that big a deal Thats what I thought aswell but he was through for the dietary today and the way they're treating it makes it seem quite a big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 You reckon it will be in the media yeah? That would be costly for him as he works in a massive financial institution. if he gets done on a sectarian breach then he will be a lucky lad if it doesn't make the media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodmorningmrfisherman Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Why has he no witnesses in this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 if he gets done on a sectarian breach then he will be a lucky lad if it doesn't make the media. No meaning to be smart mate, but what sort of media? Are we talking about the Sun/Daily Record? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 Why has he no witnesses in this? He was through with one person who hes trying to get as a witness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 No meaning to be smart mate, but what sort of media? Are we talking about the Sun/Daily Record? could be papers and/or television. just depends on the luck. a mate of mine once got done (wrongly) for breach of the peace (not sectarian related) and even that was in the papers. one of the first to get a banning order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P-Dizzle Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 If its a slow news day you could be in trouble. The 4 guys that got done for singing about Sol Campbell all had their names on the TV and in every paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodmorningmrfisherman Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 He was through with one person who hes trying to get as a witness. Well whats the problem with the person being a witness? Make's it much easier for his defence and if his lawyer hasn't sorted that out I would advise a new lawyer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 He was through with one person who hes trying to get as a witness. Forgive me for bringing it up but "trying to get" sounds like the witness is a bit reluctant seeing as how this happened in September and the witness hasnt committed himself to the cause. If the witness isnt desperate to back him up then maybe he should be thinking about what he actually did and what he can get away with admitting to. Its a bit bum tweaky being a witness in court, especially if your being economical with the truth and especially if you dont have much experience of it (not a position that will bother 4 police officers one bit mind you) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duckandcover Posted November 17, 2009 Author Share Posted November 17, 2009 could be papers and/or television. just depends on the luck. a mate of mine once got done (wrongly) for breach of the peace (not sectarian related) and even that was in the papers. one of the first to get a banning order. Jesus christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Chimp Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 If it's glasgow, and as a scapegoat friendly supporter from out of town -hearts, hibs and aberdeen are the three favourites - he's in a very tricky situation should all the cops speak up. It's the famous glasgow district court 2 cop breach, except this time it's in the sheriff, with 4 cops, and his ability to go to football games in future is at stake. Jail is probably not an issue, but a football banning order certainly is. His lawyer should be looking at, and definitely will be looking at, what deal he can get, but your mate needs to assert to him the importance of not getting an FBO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Jesus christ. actually now that i come to think about it i think his conviction did have a sectarian element to it but the story i was told about it was that he was 'fitted up' as they say. the boy isn't sectarian at all. he might just get jammy and it wont be reported but i would doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Chimp Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 actually now that i come to think about it i think his conviction did have a sectarian element to it but the story i was told about it was that he was 'fitted up' as they say. the boy isn't sectarian at all. he might just get jammy and it wont be reported but i would doubt it. The daily rankger/sunday hail are hardly going to turn down the chance to pin sectarian blame on a hearts fan/draw it away from the disgusting orcs and blamefree plastic paddies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldar Hadzimehmedovic Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 What the charge says is that he was shouting fenian b's whilst gesticulating and giving the v signs. Now although he was gesticulating, wasn't shouting fenian b's. Find it strange that 4 are giving evidence against him. What was he shouting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 The daily rankger/sunday hail are hardly going to turn down the chance to pin sectarian blame on a hearts fan/draw it away from the disgusting orcs and blamefree plastic paddies. this seems likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 ?200 to ?300 fine at the mostI got more than that when I got lifted in 1987 at Parkhead Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
berrasbraw Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 The daily rankger/sunday hail are hardly going to turn down the chance to pin sectarian blame on a hearts fan/draw it away from the disgusting orcs and blamefree plastic paddies.sounds about right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Best give your ma a recipe, Ducks: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wibble Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Best give your ma a recipe, Ducks: I laughed. Sounds like you are toast mate. It sounds like you are probably guilty and now, because you started this thread every nosey reporter who reads this knows that your case is coming up and will be looking out for your conviction. Expect Reporting Scotland at your door 2 minutes after you get home from the court. Should there be 300 arrests of Rantic supporters every week for this offence? YES Should you have been lifted for this? Debatable in the circumstances, but very predictable The best advice you have had is to bargain a plea where the sectarian bit is dropped. Good luck. Let this act as a warning for every other poor unfortunate who visits the weedge for games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol1874 Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 I laughed. Sounds like you are toast mate. It sounds like you are probably guilty and now, because you started this thread every nosey reporter who reads this knows that your case is coming up and will be looking out for your conviction. Expect Reporting Scotland at your door 2 minutes after you get home from the court. Should there be 300 arrests of Rantic supporters every week for this offence? YES Should you have been lifted for this? Debatable in the circumstances, but very predictable The best advice you have had is to bargain a plea where the sectarian bit is dropped. Good luck. Let this act as a warning for every other poor unfortunate who visits the weedge for games. Can't believe the justice system in this country. A football banning order for a Hearts supporter at this time is hardly a punishment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 What's your name Duck and Covers? Just so I remember to read the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moonheid Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 I got lifted a few years back at ibrox, was drunk but not doing anything. Got a letter through stating I was getting charged with trying to incite a riot. Was up at the sherriffs with two coppers witnesses. Daft burgers had got their stories exactly the same, unfortunately for them the fuds had decided to go on the stand and claim that I had been shouting sectarian abuse, goading the rangers fans in my broad edinburgh accent. Being born and bred in Glasgow, I was asked two questions and the case was thrown out! ACAB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wibble Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Can't believe the justice system in this country. A football banning order for a Hearts supporter at this time is hardly a punishment... Very good point. OP should keep this line in mind if he is asked for a quote by the news or the papers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allanio Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Typical lawyer's answer coming - but it entirely depends on the person in question, e.g. their age and any previous convictions. Kickback doesn't exactly provide top-notch legal advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Typical lawyer's answer coming - but it entirely depends on the person in question, e.g. their age and any previous convictions. Kickback doesn't exactly provide top-notch legal advice. Where we're more than amply catered for with sound medical advice and expertise in 'matters of the heart', I'd tend to seek a second opinion on legal matters. Just to be on the safe side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Creepy Lurker Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 If there are four of them and one of him, he'd be better off pleading guilty unless he has a lot of witnesses. The sectarian element changes things. If it was just a breach, it would've needed to be something pretty severe to constitute "fear and alarm to any reasonable person" in the context of a football match (I know someone who got acquited of an incident which happened at Celtic Park on those grounds), but unless he can prove that he didn't behave in a sectarian fashion he might be better off pleading guilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
troonjambo Posted November 17, 2009 Share Posted November 17, 2009 Tell him to instruct his lawyer that he'll plead guilty to a normal breach or he'll go to trial. If they accept this he'll probably get a ?750 fine with it being a first offence. EXTREMELY SENSIBLE ADVICE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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