The Old Tolbooth Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Stumbled across this on the pie and bovril forum http://www.kilmarnockstandard.co.uk/ayrshi...81430-22348515/ Which basically states that a Rangers fan has been charged with breach of the peace for singing the famine song at Rugby Park. I couldn't help but laugh at the name of the Rangers supporter though, he's called William Walls, now is it just me or does anyone else think that he changed his name by deed poll? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel Kurtz Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Stumbled across this on the pie and bovril forum http://www.kilmarnockstandard.co.uk/ayrshi...81430-22348515/ Which basically states that a Rangers fan has been charged with breach of the peace for singing the famine song at Rugby Park. I couldn't help but laugh at the name of the Rangers supporter though, he's called William Walls, now is it just me or does anyone else think that he changed his name by deed poll? Is his middlename Derry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Tolbooth Posted November 27, 2008 Author Share Posted November 27, 2008 Is his middlename Derry Heh heh, that thought crossed my mind too mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The article seems to say although the judge said it was racial, he was only found guilty of BOP, rather than racially aggravated BOP. If this is the case then it hasnt been deemed racist by a court in a precedent or legal way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slashishere Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Does it matter, its not a hearts song, couldnt give a flying! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel Kurtz Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Sheriifs in Ayrshire would acquit pastor jack Glass,a well known one ruled that The Sash was a folk song a few years ago Thin his name was Hall,they named a roundabout after him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The article seems to say although the judge said it was racial, he was only found guilty of BOP, rather than racially aggravated BOP. If this is the case then it hasnt been deemed racist by a court in a precedent or legal way Not that a precedent from Kilmarnock Sheriff Court would be worth all that much anyway. I thought the more interesting thing was that Nicola Tait, 24, said that one of her tasks was to monitor the Rangers support for sectarian behaviour, including the singing of the "Famine Song". "The ?Famine Song? is one song that is not tolerated by Rangers," she told the court. Miss Tait ? a club steward for the last three years ? said that her instructions were to take the seat numbers of those guilty of sectarian behaviour and report them to Rangers for further action. etc.. It looks as if, for once, those in charge at Rangers are actually doing something rather than just talking about doing something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Kidd Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The famine is not over in your house Mitchell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Terraces Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The famine is not over in your house Mitchell. OOF!! That's a low blow Kidd... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Kidd Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Stumbled across this on the pie and bovril forum http://www.kilmarnockstandard.co.uk/ayrshi...81430-22348515/ Which basically states that a Rangers fan has been charged with breach of the peace for singing the famine song at Rugby Park. I couldn't help but laugh at the name of the Rangers supporter though, he's called William Walls, now is it just me or does anyone else think that he changed his name by deed poll? Oops double post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Not that a precedent from Kilmarnock Sheriff Court would be worth all that much anyway. I thought the more interesting thing was that Nicola Tait, 24, said that one of her tasks was to monitor the Rangers support for sectarian behaviour, including the singing of the "Famine Song". "The ?Famine Song? is one song that is not tolerated by Rangers," she told the court. Miss Tait ? a club steward for the last three years ? said that her instructions were to take the seat numbers of those guilty of sectarian behaviour and report them to Rangers for further action. etc.. It looks as if, for once, those in charge at Rangers are actually doing something rather than just talking about doing something. Not really If they were that bothered, they would appoint someone, with lots of legal experience who knew what too do and what would be binding rather than some minimum wage girl barely out of her teens. Its a token gesture so they can say there doing something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Tolbooth Posted November 27, 2008 Author Share Posted November 27, 2008 Oops double post. ****** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cow Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Not really If they were that bothered, they would appoint someone, with lots of legal experience who knew what too do and what would be binding rather than some minimum wage girl barely out of her teens. Its a token gesture so they can say there doing something That was my first thoughts also but i suppose we should judge her on results ie. fans being banned from ibrox , i think they (rfc)need to show they are actively enforcing this so any banning should be made public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Tolbooth Posted November 27, 2008 Author Share Posted November 27, 2008 OOF!! That's a low blow Kidd... I'll whisper it mate, but he's probably right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Bill Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The famine is not over in your house Mitchell. People in glass houses.... Buffalo Bill . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Kidd Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 People in glass houses.... Buffalo Bill . Who asked for your opinion Mr Double Barrell Baldy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Terraces Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I'll whisper it mate, but he's probably right Fair do's chief. I've never met you, but I have heard that you could quite possibly physically be described as being a tad 'rotund'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Not really If they were that bothered, they would appoint someone, with lots of legal experience who knew what too do and what would be binding rather than some minimum wage girl barely out of her teens. Its a token gesture so they can say there doing something I should point out that i said "doing something" as opposed to "doing enough" Given that Rangers are charging an extra 5% on away ticket sales I can see that they could almost afford to send a couple of Queens Counsel to each away game but Ms.Tait seems to have done her job effectively enough despite being female and under 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JyTees Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I should point out that i said "doing something" as opposed to "doing enough" Given that Rangers are charging an extra 5% on away ticket sales I can see that they could almost afford to send a couple of Queens Counsel to each away game but Ms.Tait seems to have done her job effectively enough despite being female and under 40. Doing something is a lot more than their other half is doing. They horrible mhanks fall into the "doing absolutely nothing" category! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LAIRDY14 Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Stumbled across this on the pie and bovril forum http://www.kilmarnockstandard.co.uk/ayrshi...81430-22348515/ Which basically states that a Rangers fan has been charged with breach of the peace for singing the famine song at Rugby Park. I couldn't help but laugh at the name of the Rangers supporter though, he's called William Walls, now is it just me or does anyone else think that he changed his name by deed poll? I signed up for Follow Follow (as I have done with other forums to see what the chat is!) and received this e-mail from them today:- This morning at 9am an MEP from the Irish Republic will be on Radio Scotland to discuss the Famine Chant/Song issue. There are several points we need to make. 1/ The Famine Chant came first - around October last year. It clearly mocks the faux Irishness of a section of Celtic fans. Normal football rivalry. 2/ The Famine Song has NEVER been suing at Ibrox or away from home. It?s first appearance was on Youtube on 8th April. So Celtic fans are complaining about Rangers fans Note bias of BBC Scotland who ignored two lengthy statements by Jimmy Spratt MP about Celtic fans singing the praises of the IRA - Jimmy is the ex-Chairman of the Northern Ireland Police Federation as well as an elected representative. 0500-929500 is the phone-in number Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest S.U.S.S. Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The article seems to say although the judge said it was racial, he was only found guilty of BOP, rather than racially aggravated BOP. If this is the case then it hasnt been deemed racist by a court in a precedent or legal way Ah good, a green light then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DETTY29 Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I signed up for Follow Follow (as I have done with other forums to see what the chat is!) and received this e-mail from them today:- This morning at 9am an MEP from the Irish Republic will be on Radio Scotland to discuss the Famine Chant/Song issue. There are several points we need to make. 1/ The Famine Chant came first - around October last year. It clearly mocks the faux Irishness of a section of Celtic fans. Normal football rivalry. 2/ The Famine Song has NEVER been suing at Ibrox or away from home. It?s first appearance was on Youtube on 8th April. So Celtic fans are complaining about Rangers fans Note bias of BBC Scotland who ignored two lengthy statements by Jimmy Spratt MP about Celtic fans singing the praises of the IRA - Jimmy is the ex-Chairman of the Northern Ireland Police Federation as well as an elected representative. 0500-929500 is the phone-in number Some may find this interesting or not but I took my Irish girlfriend to her first ever football game v. Celtic a few weeks back. In the build up I was explaining a few things about the rivalry between the 2 clubs, the perception Hearts fans follow (follow) everything the Rangers fans do, en masse. Now her comments:- - The famine song is not offensive, quite funny if you think about it. - Pro terrosists chanting is offensive At the game she found 2 things offensive - The Soldier Song should never be sung in English, only irish gaelic. - That I spend as much money on all the football as I do - especially Hearts as they were awful that day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stupid Sexy Flanders Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The Sellik fans offence at that particular song is a classic piece of point-missing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderstruck Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The cretins who prolong the sectarian bile - on both sides of the equation -need to wake up to the fact that Ireland has moved on and left them behind. A moving example of this was shown on the BBC news this lunchtime in the funeral of a young lad from Co Mayo who was killed serving with the Royal Marines. That his colleagues could parade, in uniform, through his home town as part of the cort?ge is a sad if informative look at modern-day Irish attitudes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N User Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I don't want the famine song sung by Hearts fans because it's a Rangers song and it's deemed to be sectarian/racist BUT What is so sectarian/racist about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bickfest Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The cretins who prolong the sectarian bile - on both sides of the equation -need to wake up to the fact that Ireland has moved on and left them behind. A moving example of this was shown on the BBC news this lunchtime in the funeral of a young lad from Co Mayo who was killed serving with the Royal Marines. That his colleagues could parade, in uniform, through his home town as part of the cort?ge is a sad if informative look at modern-day Irish attitudes. Along with the news that Irish volunteer numbers for the British forces have quadrupled in the last 3 years. In addition, the Irish President attended the re-dedication/re-opening of an Orange Lodge in Co Cavan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamaz Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Some may find this interesting or not but I took my Irish girlfriend to her first ever football game v. Celtic a few weeks back. In the build up I was explaining a few things about the rivalry between the 2 clubs, the perception Hearts fans follow (follow) everything the Rangers fans do, en masse. Now her comments:- - The famine song is not offensive, quite funny if you think about it. - Pro terrosists chanting is offensive At the game she found 2 things offensive - The Soldier Song should never be sung in English, only irish gaelic. - That I spend as much money on all the football as I do - especially Hearts as they were awful that day I'm Irish and a role reversal of your situation, My Girlfriend is a season ticket holder at Tynecastle and when i moved over here i started to go to games, (not my 1st love i have to say). i find the Famine song offensive, i find the singing of Amhr?n_na_bhFiann in Enghlish offensive, but then i find Celtic Repulsive so..... + Mr Romanovs costs arent that bad, try going to croke park to watch GAA But i think the famine song is shocking, should i go home too, i go to Tynecastle most weeks i'm not working and would hate for that to be sung around me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I don't want the famine song sung by Hearts fans because it's a Rangers song and it's deemed to be sectarian/racist BUT What is so sectarian/racist about it? You mean What is so sectarian/racist about asking the decendants of immigrants to 'go home' to the country of their ancestors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I'm Irish and a role reversal of your situation, My Girlfriend is a season ticket holder at Tynecastle and when i moved over here i started to go to games, (not my 1st love i have to say). i find the Famine song offensive, i find the singing of Amhr?n_na_bhFiann in Enghlish offensive, but then i find Celtic Repulsive so..... + Mr Romanovs costs arent that bad, try going to croke park to watch GAA But i think the famine song is shocking, should i go home too, i go to Tynecastle most weeks i'm not working and would hate for that to be sung around me Hopefully certain posters on here will read this and re-evaluate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambojim52 Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Stumbled across this on the pie and bovril forum http://www.kilmarnockstandard.co.uk/ayrshi...81430-22348515/ Which basically states that a Rangers fan has been charged with breach of the peace for singing the famine song at Rugby Park. I couldn't help but laugh at the name of the Rangers supporter though, he's called William Walls, now is it just me or does anyone else think that he changed his name by deed poll? Just what is wrong with his name? William Walls? I do beleive they make really good icecream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Tolbooth Posted November 27, 2008 Author Share Posted November 27, 2008 Fair do's chief. I've never met you, but I have heard that you could quite possibly physically be described as being a tad 'rotund'... If you remove the "t" from rotund, then your closer to the mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N User Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 You mean What is so sectarian/racist about asking the decendants of immigrants to 'go home' to the country of their ancestors? Look I'm not defending the song, so don't tar me as a Rangers apologist. I heard all the fuss/controversy before I heard the song, so when I heard the song- I didn't really get all the fuss. It seems to me the song is more a pop at the extent to which Celtic fans will go to with regards to their Irishness. Maybe i'm just being naive. Either way I don't want to get into an argument/debate about it because i don't particularly care about a pointless song that has nothing to do with Hearts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I don't want the famine song sung by Hearts fans because it's a Rangers song and it's deemed to be sectarian/racist BUT What is so sectarian/racist about it? Emmmmmmm, nothing at all. The few words are I believe, "The famine is over, why don't you go home". Try though I have I can find no mention of any race within any of the above quoted words. Part of it is a factual statement, the famine is over (although it doesn't actually make it clear which one), the other part is a simple request. As far as I can determine from the above the song is not directed at any one race/nationality of people presently living within the UK, it is directed at a section of the support of a Glasgow football club, and you only have to do minor searches on the internet to realise what that section of said support thinks of this country, and living within it. To give them factual information and ask them why they do not relocate based on that factual information seems like a reasonable request to make. If Celtic fans are looking for things to complain about they should be writing en masse (no pun intended) to the Board of Directors of their club with regards to some of the persons I saw wearing their strips during a match versus Aalborg the other evening. Some of them are apparently referred to in the media as football players, the names Samaras, Caldwell and Loovens spring to mind, which if I were a Celtic fan I would find highly offensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest S.U.S.S. Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Hopefully certain posters on here will read this and re-evaluate. And if like magic.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johanes de Silentio Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The song itself is obviously not helpful in solving this horrible sectarian issue. However, just once...I'd like to hear a Celtic fan answer the question: If Ireland is as great as you're always saying it is...why don't you move there? And precisely when will a judge make a ruling on the public singing of songs in praise of terrorists? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makween Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 This decision was reached as the prosecutor successfully (sp?) argued that although the line "The famine is over, why don't you go home?" isn't racist and is only a dig at Dhims' plastic paddy attitude, by singing those words the singer was associating himself with the verses of the song, which are basically a rant against Ireland. Fair enough, I suppose, but I've never heard anyone actually singing the verses. It could be argued that those are more of an add on. Certainly, when just singing the chorus, the song isn't sectarian or racist in the slightest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Emmmmmmm, nothing at all. The few words are I believe, "The famine is over, why don't you go home". Try though I have I can find no mention of any race within any of the above quoted words. Part of it is a factual statement, the famine is over (although it doesn't actually make it clear which one), the other part is a simple request. As far as I can determine from the above the song is not directed at any one race/nationality of people presently living within the UK, it is directed at a section of the support of a Glasgow football club, and you only have to do minor searches on the internet to realise what that section of said support thinks of this country, and living within it. To give them factual information and ask them why they do not relocate based on that factual information seems like a reasonable request to make. If Celtic fans are looking for things to complain about they should be writing en masse (no pun intended) to the Board of Directors of their club with regards to some of the persons I saw wearing their strips during a match versus Aalborg the other evening. Some of them are apparently referred to in the media as football players, the names Samaras, Caldwell and Loovens spring to mind, which if I were a Celtic fan I would find highly offensive. Yes. A song about the Irish potato famine is not aimed at one particular race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 And if like magic.... I doubt you're the type to worry about offending other Hearts fans. Looking forward to Saturday? Sure you'll be falling over yourself to tell the witty thinkers in the Rangers end how funny you think their jokes are. Might even keep you as a pet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makween Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Yes. A song about the Irish potato famine is not aimed at one particular race. Whether you're being deliberately obtuse is hard to tell, so I'll humour you. The song (the chorus, at least) is about Celtic fans' Plastic Paddy mentality, it's poking fun at the fact that they claim to love Ireland so much but stay in Scotland when there's nothing to stop them going to Ireland - hence the mention of the famine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 The song itself is obviously not helpful in solving this horrible sectarian issue. However, just once...I'd like to hear a Celtic fan answer the question: If Ireland is as great as you're always saying it is...why don't you move there? Why do you care? Should people only love the country they reside in? If you'd like to hear an answer go ask one. I'm sure they'll tell you quite rightly that it's none of your business where they live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 . The song (the chorus, at least) is about Celtic fans' Plastic Paddy mentality, In your opinion. I think you are giving the Rangers fans who invented this song too much credit. In my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H.A.N.S Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Why do you care? Should people only love the country they reside in? If you'd like to hear an answer go ask one. I'm sure they'll tell you quite rightly that it's none of your business where they live. I'd like to ask them why they sing songs glorifying a murderous terrorist organisation. But suppose I shouldn't - it's their business Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldar Hadzimehmedovic Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Couldn't care less. Sung by bellends, aimed at bellends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H.A.N.S Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Couldn't care less. Sung by bellends, aimed at bellends. Sung by bellends, aimed at the dirtiest ****iest barstewards in existence :mad: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 I'd like to ask them why they sing songs glorifying a murderous terrorist organisation. But suppose I shouldn't - it's their business Yes. I definitely see what your post had to do with my post. Thanks for sharing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxteth O'Grady Posted November 27, 2008 Share Posted November 27, 2008 Whether you're being deliberately obtuse is hard to tell, so I'll humour you. The song (the chorus, at least) is about Celtic fans' Plastic Paddy mentality, it's poking fun at the fact that they claim to love Ireland so much but stay in Scotland when there's nothing to stop them going to Ireland - hence the mention of the famine. That is exactly how I see it, - Weedgies with their Cheeky Oirish flags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted November 28, 2008 Share Posted November 28, 2008 I'm Irish and a role reversal of your situation, My Girlfriend is a season ticket holder at Tynecastle and when i moved over here i started to go to games, (not my 1st love i have to say). i find the Famine song offensive, i find the singing of Amhr?n_na_bhFiann in Enghlish offensive, but then i find Celtic Repulsive so..... + Mr Romanovs costs arent that bad, try going to croke park to watch GAA But i think the famine song is shocking, should i go home too, i go to Tynecastle most weeks i'm not working and would hate for that to be sung around me Fully appreciate your take on this but my understanding of it is that the Huns are not saying "we don't like or want Irish people in Scotland/Glasgow." They're targeting just the Celtic fans who have spent decades singing Irish and pro-IRA songs at them in their nasty, weegie accents (the majority). It feels peculiar for me to be attributing higher thought processes to either side of the OF fanbase but I really don't see that the song is racist at all. True, it may be judged offensive by those who carry the hurt of the famine(s) and all the nastiness around that but there are far more offensive things chanted at football matches as a matter of course. Ask Victoria Beckham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted November 28, 2008 Share Posted November 28, 2008 Fully appreciate your take on this but my understanding of it is that the Huns are not saying "we don't like or want Irish people in Scotland/Glasgow." They're targeting just the Celtic fans who have spent decades singing Irish and pro-IRA songs at them in their nasty, weegie accents (the majority). That may or may not be true but I've little sympathy for anybody who ends up in trouble because they're stupid enough to believe that subtle distinction will be obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamaz Posted November 28, 2008 Share Posted November 28, 2008 Fully appreciate your take on this but my understanding of it is that the Huns are not saying "we don't like or want Irish people in Scotland/Glasgow." They're targeting just the Celtic fans who have spent decades singing Irish and pro-IRA songs at them in their nasty, weegie accents (the majority). It feels peculiar for me to be attributing higher thought processes to either side of the OF fanbase but I really don't see that the song is racist at all. True, it may be judged offensive by those who carry the hurt of the famine(s) and all the nastiness around that but there are far more offensive things chanted at football matches as a matter of course. Ask Victoria Beckham. I dont want to carry on the debate really, I can appreciate that it's just football and that some songs are sung in this country that people get a bit of a laugh from. After all it is only a joke really isn't it......perhaps it is political correctness gone mad. Maybe the famine never even happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fulham Jambo Posted November 28, 2008 Share Posted November 28, 2008 you know without condoning the singing of this ditty for one moment.... there is nothing more absurd than the British public on a moral crusade. The best way not to take offence to something is to completely ignore it. Those quick to anger are as much to blame for the escalating of tension as those who provoke them and for Murray and Reid to have added their hapworth is not helpful - they should have set an example by displaying unity. This debate has no end - it will result in upset, violence and maybe worse and is a sad indicment of the divisions that exist in our so called civilised society. and quite what place it has in football is way beyond me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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