dreamydays Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 I honestly think that is what Vlad is trying to do at Hearts and that he's giving it a pretty good shot (despite some early over investment). Would be interested in hearing what people make of this statement in relation to Alan Sugars comments here... Can you apply the business philosophy to running a football club, like you did with Spurs, as any other business? AS- No because of the very weird nature of the football industry. It is an industry which is unique in the sense of the amounts of money that fly around in massive transactions that happen sometimes minutes of the sale of players. Pressure's put to bear upon the owners of the clubs to perform, which make them do irresponsible and silly things because they're frightened of having their heads beaten in by a few yobs. Maybe it's more having their heads beaten in by the back pages of the newspapers. It's a weird business. If you try and apply normal business principles in a football club, you end up getting criticised. Although that's what I did for 10 years in Spurs and that's why the club is still there, as far as a corporate entity is concerned. But here's the point. Do the fans care whether it is financially stable? Not really. And why is that? It's because clubs have been allowed to go bust and then start again the next day. To the actual fan that turns up every Saturday, what does all this balance sheet nonsense mean? Nothing. http://news.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/hi/entertainment/newsid_7737000/7737098.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the voice from above Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 He might be trying to apply a business model to Hearts BUT, the model is ****ed! As an example, his model says reject 400K for Ibby Tall, pay him ten grand a week for a season then watch him walk away for **** all. For a man trying to run a business he tends to make some stupid ****ing business decisions... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Bill Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 To the actual fan that turns up every Saturday, what does all this balance sheet nonsense mean? Nothing. Now you can't level that accusation at Hibernian fans, can you? Buffalo Bill . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 He might be trying to apply a business model to Hearts BUT, the model is ****ed! As an example, his model says reject 400K for Ibby Tall, pay him ten grand a week for a season then watch him walk away for **** all. For a man trying to run a business he tends to make some stupid ****ing business decisions... It depends how it all balances out (e.g. CG we gambled and got 9M, Tall we gambled and lost about 1M). As for applying a business model, if you show me a business model that ****es off a large % of customers to the point where they think you are a madman and don't believe a word that comes out of your mouth, I'll show you a failed business model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 It depends how it all balances out (e.g. CG we gambled and got 9M, Tall we gambled and lost about 1M). As for applying a business model, if you show me a business model that ****es off a large % of customers to the point where they think you are a madman and don't believe a word that comes out of your mouth, I'll show you a failed business model. How about Ryanair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 How about Ryanair? Has their owner ****ed off a large % of their customers to the point where they think the owner is a madman and don't believe a word he says? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The People's Chimp Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Can you apply the business philosophy to ruining a football club? VR- Yes. No surprises there then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Has their owner ****ed off a large % of their customers to the point where they think the owner is a madman and don't believe a word he says? Absolutely - Michael O'Leary doesn't give a **** about his customers or what they think of his hidden charges. For instance, try getting a 'Free Flight' as advertised on their website - impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreamydays Posted November 19, 2008 Author Share Posted November 19, 2008 No surprises there then. I see what you've done there- very good. All that this club is is what we make it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Absolutely - Michael O'Leary doesn't give a **** about his customers or what they think of his hidden charges. For instance, try getting a 'Free Flight' as advertised on their website - impossible. Which is all well and good, but is not evidence that he's ****ed off a large % of his customers. If you want proof that Vlad has done so, just look at ST sales and attendences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo66 Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Which is all well and good, but is not evidence that he's ****ed off a large % of his customers. If you want proof that Vlad has done so, just look at ST sales and attendences. Are our current season ticket sales/attendances more, less or about the same as they were under Chris Robinson? The reason I ask is that I don't think football fans give a **** how much the owner p***es them off. What they care about is success (relative or otherwise). If what you say is true, then I would expect our season ticket sales and attendances to be lower than they were under CR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Which is all well and good, but is not evidence that he's ****ed off a large % of his customers. If you want proof that Vlad has done so, just look at ST sales and attendences. Just Google 'Ryanair Sucks' and see how many hits you get, not to mention their frequent appearances on BBC Watchdog - they really don't give a toss about their customers and I know that from personal experiences. "You paid nothing for your ticket, so you get nothing. That's the company philosophy. You paid nothing, we take you there, but hey, you paid nothing. so if we don't take you there, tough ****, you've only lost five euros." - RyanAir Pilot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Are our current season ticket sales/attendances more, less or about the same as they were under Chris Robinson? Pretty much yes. The reason I ask is that I don't think football fans give a **** how much the owner p***es them off. What they care about is success (relative or otherwise). If what you say is true, then I would expect our season ticket sales and attendances to be lower than they were under CR. A fair point and I'd tend to agree, results = people through the gate in football. But then again, the results are what happen as a result of the business model for the club. And also, it could be easily argued - who is the least popular of the two? CR or Romanov? Probably CR overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Just Google 'Ryanair Sucks' and see how many hits you get, not to mention their frequent appearances on BBC Watchdog - they really don't give a toss about their customers and I know that from personal experiences. I wouldn't disagree mate - I heard some stories too. So how long till Ryanair get relegated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 I wouldn't disagree mate - I heard some stories too. So how long till Ryanair get relegated? Who knows but I would never fly with them again, even if they paid me - but I'm still going to Tynecastle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Who knows but I would never fly with them again, even if they paid me - but I'm still going to Tynecastle. which, perhaps without meaning to, illustrates the difference between a customer, and a football supporter. I too would change my airline if I wasn't happy, but no matter how much Vlad ****es me off, I could never go and support another team. Which makes it all the more frustrating when he acts like a total numpty and there is nothing I can do about it!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 which, perhaps without meaning to, illustrates the difference between a customer, and a football supporter. I too would change my airline if I wasn't happy, but no matter how much Vlad ****es me off, I could never go and support another team. Which makes it all the more frustrating when he acts like a total numpty and there is nothing I can do about it!!! Agreed, why is why SAS is right! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 Agreed, why is why SAS is right! and Vlad is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 I am not sure about football management, but it seems traditional management systems are not doing to well either. Ford, GM, Chrysler. They have without doubt if not peed off their customers have failed to compete with their foreign competition, Will they be relegated without a doubt to a lower level of business, having to go cap in hand to the Government for bailouts. They have even been Mercerised where it has been suggested Chrysler go out of business and the other two become the 1st Division team Auto Munufacturers United. There is a common thread in all business difficulties, arrogance, failure to provide customer satisfaction, and failure to learn from previous errors. Romanov is not alone in these errors, hopefully he is one of the first to learn from them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted November 19, 2008 Share Posted November 19, 2008 I am not sure about football management, but it seems traditional management systems are not doing to well either. Ford, GM, Chrysler. They have without doubt if not peed off their customers have failed to compete with their foreign competition, Will they be relegated without a doubt to a lower level of business, having to go cap in hand to the Government for bailouts. They have even been Mercerised where it has been suggested Chrysler go out of business and the other two become the 1st Division team Auto Munufacturers United. There is a common thread in all business difficulties, arrogance, failure to provide customer satisfaction, and failure to learn from previous errors. Romanov is not alone in these errors, hopefully he is one of the first to learn from them. At last some common-sense. There is no doubt a sound business plan is more likely to be successful especially if one can find a compromise between being over cautious and being ill-prepared for the unexpected. It is even better if you have the right people in the right places at the right price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toboggan Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Is football a business? I'd argue not. More a labour of love. Even the G8 clubs operate at a loss. Show me a profitable AND successful club? And i'm not talking about football manager! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyclojambo Posted November 21, 2008 Share Posted November 21, 2008 Has to be a business to some extent otherwise Hearts wouldn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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