Planning application submitted at last !!!!

[Jamboelite]

It appears reading thru this thread that we don't need any Hobo's on this board as there are plenty of PRETEND Hearts fans to do their job.

 

If you can't be positive about this then flock off down to Easter Road and support them.

 

I think that most people are delighted with the news but have concerns, and so they should there are alot of questions to be asked before blind faith can be restored like in the initial days of Vlad.

 

I think its positive but i have questions however today is not the day to ask them just to enjoy the moment.

[Ray Winstone]

It appears reading thru this thread that we don't need any Hobo's on this board as there are plenty of PRETEND Hearts fans to do their job.

 

If you can't be positive about this then flock off down to Easter Road and support them.

 

What are you on about? People are "pretend hearts fans" because they are sceptical?

 

People are well within their rights to be sceptical after all that has gone on in the past 2 seasons.

 

So why dont you grow up and stop being so pathetic.

[Sherlock]

Hawaii this is more debt . It looks unsustainable on top of the mounting debt we have.

 

Surely its proper to look at this with not just a fan head on but with a sensible economic head on.

 

Lopez says in the interview that he can see the club being self sustainable and the development being wiped out in time .

 

How on Earth is this possible if the debt goes to 70 odd million ??? Is this going to be the worlds greatest office and leisure land ?

 

Why not build a small stand and live within the means for a while ?

 

This just looks a huge gamble and there are more questions than answers at the moment.

 

In order to know what the debt will rise to, you have to know how much the increase is (which we know) and what the debt was before the work starts.

 

How much is the debt level at just now and how do you know this?

[FERRYABROAD]

In-line with true Hobonomics, don't forget to ignore the value of the asset created.

[Horse]

At the end of the day on average you will spend 2hrs in the ground once every fortnight....does it really what what it looks like?

 

Unless we have a decent team with a Manager will hardly ever get near 23,000 fans. 23,000 still will be too small for European games as well for Vlad so still be going to M'field for these games.

 

Fail to see why all the excitement IMHO.

[hawaii]

Hawaii this is more debt . It looks unsustainable on top of the mounting debt we have.

 

Surely its proper to look at this with not just a fan head on but with a sensible economic head on.

 

Lopez says in the interview that he can see the club being self sustainable and the development being wiped out in time .

 

How on Earth is this possible if the debt goes to 70 odd million ??? Is this going to be the worlds greatest office and leisure land ?

 

Why not build a small stand and live within the means for a while ?

 

This just looks a huge gamble and there are more questions than answers at the moment.

 

Agree that it's more debt, but building a new stand would tend to suggest that I would think? Still, it's a lot less than the ?700m to rebuild Ibrox though.

 

I would assume that the people in charge have worked out their figures and that it would not have gone ahead had they been concerned it would not reduce the debt. Vlad is a self made man which would suggest to me that he knows how to make a profit and I believe from the two BBC investigations that he has a long history in the hotel business.

 

Personally looking at this I can see a hotel chain paying us to run the hotel so I'd guess we will get money from this. The increased revenue from corporate boxes will be a huge step up from what we have now. The gym and offices will be further revenue streams - not to mention the flats as we all know how expensive Edinburgh property is.

 

Let us enjoy the news as this site has been infested by negativity for far too long, and mostly from Hearts fans (I won't call them supporters) who IMHO as WORSE than Hibs fans for putting the club down. Support the club instead of constantly knocking it - you never know you might enjoy it.

[redm]

I thought the idea was that Vlad's investment vehicle would pay for the stand etc. and then it would also take a % of the profit from the commercial side of the operation for a set period thereafter? Leaving Hearts in a position where they can also then use profits from the commercial operations to sustain the footballing side of the business? If that's the case, none of it ever directly becomes our debt anyway.

 

Argh. Damn these flippin pesky hobonomics. WHY are we even trying to work this stuff out when we haven't a scooby what the P&L looks like?

 

[Brad]

It appears reading thru this thread that we don't need any Hobo's on this board as there are plenty of PRETEND Hearts fans to do their job.

 

If you can't be positive about this then flock off down to Easter Road and support them.

 

 

i have every right to question Vlad in regards to where the money is going to come from for this new development, i have my own mind and i will continue to say what i think, it doesn't make me a hobo to think for myself

[Jammy T]

It appears reading thru this thread that we don't need any Hobo's on this board as there are plenty of PRETEND Hearts fans to do their job.

 

If you can't be positive about this then flock off down to Easter Road and support them.

 

I dont see any negativity on this thread.

[i8hibsh]

It's exciting stuff but I just

 

a.don't belive it

 

b.wish we would concentrate on getting consistantly great results on the pitch!

[Boris]

This is one step back towards getting things back on track. I feel like its all interrelated from here on:

 

If the stand finally goes up we'll need to get fans in it, ergo, we'll need a decent team on the pitch, ergo, we'll start playing well, ergo, revenue stream finally start to open up to the sort of extent VR needs them at in order to make HMFC a worthwhile venture.

 

Tiny, but reassuring step today. I'm happy, and expectant.

 

When are you due? Tell me it wasn't that fat troll K Jackson at the office Xmas party???

 

hehehe

 

Hope your doing well Borthers. Hopefully see you soon.

[Boris]

Boris, Boris....I'm more of a Herald-type temporary writer these days!

 

You know where to find me after the derby amigo. Hopefully there'll be a derby pumping to drink to.

 

Based in the Weege still? My mate writes for the Sunday Herald....

 

Yes, I may well see you for a few celebratories on Saturday!

[Craig_]

How on Earth is this possible if the debt goes to 70 odd million ??? Is this going to be the worlds greatest office and leisure land ?

 

To be fair, it must be pretty damn special, as ?51m's a hell of a lot for a stand and hotel complex! I'm sure the other three existing stands cost about a quarter of that!

[Guest casper]

Agree that it's more debt, but building a new stand would tend to suggest that I would think? Still, it's a lot less than the ?700m to rebuild Ibrox though.

 

I would assume that the people in charge have worked out their figures and that it would not have gone ahead had they been concerned it would not reduce the debt. Vlad is a self made man which would suggest to me that he knows how to make a profit and I believe from the two BBC investigations that he has a long history in the hotel business.

 

Personally looking at this I can see a hotel chain paying us to run the hotel so I'd guess we will get money from this. The increased revenue from corporate boxes will be a huge step up from what we have now. The gym and offices will be further revenue streams - not to mention the flats as we all know how expensive Edinburgh property is.

 

Let us enjoy the news as this site has been infested by negativity for far too long, and mostly from Hearts fans (I won't call them supporters) who IMHO as WORSE than Hibs fans for putting the club down. Support the club instead of constantly knocking it - you never know you might enjoy it.

 

Have you any idea how all these ex Soviot Union mulitmillionaires got their money?

[Pistol1874]

How is the debt ?70m now? The limit was ?40m.

 

Also, if this ?40m leaves us with a stand, a hotel and commercial space, does it not also leave us with the means to clear our debt?

 

I'm sure a substantial hotel in the Capital would change hands for a significant sum, I know that flats, even in today's market, will sell for a lot of money and that commercial space is at a premium too.

 

If Vlads builds and sells all of that and we are left (comparatively) debt free, whilst he swans off with a tidy profit, everyone wins.

 

Finally I would like to congratulate all the hobos who had the 'flat countdown clocks'. For the sake of accuracy though, can you now call them 'Flat, Hotel, Commericial Space, Superstore, Retail Space and Shiny New Stand to dwarf anything of interest to a caravan dweller countdown clocks'? Much obliged.

[IMA MAROON]

My Hero, Vladimir Romanov, does it again. He is the Greatest.

[topcat]

Have you any idea how all these ex Soviot Union mulitmillionaires got their money?

 

Was it that they'd all been reading an early version of reptiles.net and so had gained such a brilliant understanding of capitalist economics that when Communism fell the superior business knowledge that they'd gained from the emerald clad warrior-poet-accountants of Leith enabled them to become the plutocrats of the new post communist eastern europe?

[redm]

i have every right to question Vlad in regards to where the money is going to come from for this new development, i have my own mind and i will continue to say what i think, it doesn't make me a hobo to think for myself

 

Indeed it does not.

 

[Francis Albert]

I love all the "at last" stuff. The main stand was built not all that long after Hibs won the Scottish Cup and has been overdue for replacement for 20 or 30 years. How long has Vladimir Romanov had control?

[john brownlee]

Great news, still on the happy train, cant wait for the scramble for STs next season, with only 10000+ being available I can't see too many waiting until the last minute. Will book mine nice and early.

 

Manager next week, but no real hurry. SF is easeing in, may not need one and most of the team, for most of the game seem to be getting it right, Just a wee tweek here and there and future is bright.

 

 

 

Come on the mighty JTs.

 

:5643::5643:

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I love all the "at last" stuff. The main stand was built not all that long after Hibs won the Scottish Cup and has been overdue for replacement for 20 or 30 years. How long has Vladimir Romanov had control?

 

When people are told something is 2 or 3 months away repeatedly over an 18 month period, I think "at last" is a fair comment when it actually happens.

[dumbojambo]

Why would Ukio not allow us to bank with them without the re-development?

 

Frankly, I don't see why they should want the debt without an investment potential. Bank of Scotland didn't. I'm just assuming banks behave the same. Maybe not.

 

 

 

What stadium have they finished?

 

Siemens Arena in Vilnius (sports, entertainment, business complex). Owned by The Rubicon Group, a US construction firm. May be that they will sell it on.

 

On the stocks are the Minsk Leisure Centre, $350m investment agreement signed with the Minsk city authority, footall stadium; and the Vilnius Baltic Centre (sports, leisure, cultural city arena).

 

Couple of links:

 

 

http://news.belta.by/en/news/econom/?id=178951

 

http://www.automation.siemens.com/_en/portal/news/press_releases_detail.htm?rssItemURL=/detail_rss.php3?template_id=75&id=7025

 

UBIG are in the business of developing among other things "city arenas" that are multi-purpose. They obviously see this as the future. I tend to agree - I think we'll see fewer clubs owning their own grounds in future years. Too late for the Hibbies though - one city, one city arena.

[chester copperpot]

Believe it when I see it.

 

I started a thread on this approx 18 months ago, still seems to be the same information as I had then.

 

Hope I'm wrong though.

[Cliffundo]

Right , the debt was raised to ?40 million VR ok'd this.

 

soo...Am I right in saying Ubig will fund this new stand, hotel and the other residential buildings, on their own or with outside investemt if an investor is interested. Meaning hearts are not liable for any additional debt?

 

Hearts are only buying the land that will be home to the new development.

 

So talk of being ?90 million in debt is balls?

 

Hearts will generate income from leasing/selling the land that the hotel and the residential properties are to be built on?

 

or..... although Hearts have increased borrowing to buy the land...will UBIG still own the land due to hearts being owned by UBIG?

[Thig Ar Latha]

Great news,

 

Just hope that Edinburgh Council deals with it better than Aberdeenshire Council managed with the Trumph Golf proposal!

[dumbojambo]

Right , the debt was raised to ?40 million VR ok'd this.

 

soo...Am I right in saying Ubig will fund this new stand, hotel and the other residential buildings, on their own or with outside investemt if an investor is interested. Meaning hearts are not liable for any additional debt?

 

Hearts are only buying the land that will be home to the new development.

 

So talk of being ?90 million in debt is balls?

 

Hearts will generate income from leasing/selling the land that the hotel and the residential properties are to be built on?

or..... although Hearts have increased borrowing to buy the land...will UBIG still own the land due to hearts being owned by UBIG?

 

 

Hearts will generate income from leasing/selling the land that the hotel and the residential properties are to be built on?

 

Could be. Or Hearts could be set up as a separate company with no interest in Tynecastle or its operations except as tenants paying rent to the owners of the new stadium complex. Hearts would trade purely on the proceeds of football - admission money, merchandising, sponsorship, transfers with minimal overheads. However it would be done, I would see the original ?20m (pieman) debt disappearing as part of that process - all the debt created by UBIG would be retained by them as part of the investment cost.

[IMA MAROON]

I love all the "at last" stuff. The main stand was built not all that long after Hibs won the Scottish Cup and has been overdue for replacement for 20 or 30 years. How long has Vladimir Romanov had control?

 

Yes, some have to remember that Romanov owes us nothing. That said, we can now all enjoy rubbing it in the noses of the hobo's.

[FERRYABROAD]

I love all the "at last" stuff. The main stand was built not all that long after Hibs won the Scottish Cup and has been overdue for replacement for 20 or 30 years. How long has Vladimir Romanov had control?

 

The thread title was NOT intended as a dig at King Vlad.

[McJambo]

Believe it when I see it.

 

I started a thread on this approx 18 months ago, still seems to be the same information as I had then.

 

Hope I'm wrong though.

 

You posted a thread saying that we had applied for planning permission?

 

Must have missed that

 

You mean you posted a thread saying we were in talks with the council? 18 months is the time it has taken, for some reason, to iron out any major concerns they had. I think.

[Guest casper]

Was it that they'd all been reading an early version of reptiles.net and so had gained such a brilliant understanding of capitalist economics that when Communism fell the superior business knowledge that they'd gained from the emerald clad warrior-poet-accountants of Leith enabled them to become the plutocrats of the new post communist eastern europe?

 

No, they all did it by selling Beetles records for the boot of their Ladas.

[Oxford City]

How this all makes me feel...

a bit sceptical, a bit concerned... but mostly really, really excited. And I'm sure I'm not the only one.

[Hagar the Horrible]

Be positive? we only need to sell six players as good as Gordon and its paid for?

[mda]

Its great news and what we've been waiting for, so let's just enjoy it for once and see what happens.

 

Of course, I'd still like to see a manager in place....

[troonjambo]

Believe it when I see it.

 

I started a thread on this approx 18 months ago, still seems to be the same information as I had then.

 

Hope I'm wrong though.

 

cheer up andy its nearly derby day and you know what that means hibs are getting a spanking:)

[wright1989]

Delighted But in the EEN it states that hearts will have one final look at it before submiting the application. Come on Vlad prove me wrong mate;)

[Tynie b]

The Stand applicacation is a Smoke Screen because Hearts Supporters are asking were the **** the New Manager is, and the Players, to help get us out of the ***** we're in.

 

Puppet.. "Vlad, They ferkin supporters are going mental asking aboot the Manager you Promised"

 

MadVlad.. "Tell them we've submitted the planning application for the new Stand, That'll keep the Muppets happy for a few weeks...Oh, and Make sure the Cooncil knock it back,FFS..."

[lost in leith]

Right , the debt was raised to ?40 million VR ok'd this.

 

soo...Am I right in saying Ubig will fund this new stand, hotel and the other residential buildings, on their own or with outside investemt if an investor is interested. Meaning hearts are not liable for any additional debt?

 

Hearts are only buying the land that will be home to the new development.

 

So talk of being ?90 million in debt is balls?

 

Hearts will generate income from leasing/selling the land that the hotel and the residential properties are to be built on?

 

or..... although Hearts have increased borrowing to buy the land...will UBIG still own the land due to hearts being owned by UBIG?

 

At the last AGM the Directors were given the power to borrow up to ?40m (previous limit was ?20m). The explanation was "The increased borrowings limit will provide the Company with sufficient headroom to fund the initial phases of the proposed redevelopment of Tynecastle Stadium and the Company's immediate working capital requirements." I suspect rumours of the debt being ?40m already are mince. We'll know when the accounts come out.

 

AFAIK there's no detail yet about how the redevelopment will be funded, who will own what, where the income from the various business will go etc.

 

Today is good news, and I suspect we will get planning permission for the proposal as it stands. However, that doesn't necessarily mean it will happen. I'm pretty sure Hibs have planning permission to build a new East Stand but no firm date for development.

 

Let's just wait and see what happens next........

[Father Tiresias]

The Stand applicacation is a Smoke Screen because Hearts Supporters are asking were the **** the New Manager is, and the Players, to help get us out of the ***** we're in.

 

The cynic in me tends to agree with you. This regime has always drowned the bad news with what they think is good news.

 

So, Stevie Frail to be announced as the new manager tomorrow anyone??

[Father Tiresias]

That said, we can now all enjoy rubbing it in the noses of the hobo's.

 

Why, because we're second bottom of the league and have applied for planning permision for a new stand.

 

Aye, that'll work it right up the Hobo's!!

[The Real Maroonblood]

Why, because we're second bottom of the league and have applied for planning permision for a new stand.

 

Aye, that'll work it right up the Hobo's!!

 

You would think by some of the reactions to this announcement that we had just brought in a quality manager.

A new main stand that will probably not happen.

[Vlad_Knows_Best]

I was assured the planning application was submitted weeks ago.

 

Someone is telling porkies.

[Commander Harris]

I was assured the planning application was submitted weeks ago.

 

Someone is telling porkies.

 

assured by whom?

[Vlad_Knows_Best]

assured by whom?

 

A supporter who works for the council's planning department.

[Commander Harris]

A supporter who works for the council's planning department.

 

someone had posted on here that they had been consulting with the council and had unofficially submitted it for a provisional look of some sort. perhaps that's what your friend meant?

[Julio]

Great news, still on the happy train, cant wait for the scramble for STs next season, with only 10000+ being available I can't see too many waiting until the last minute. Will book mine nice and early.

 

Manager next week, but no real hurry. SF is easeing in, may not need one and most of the team, for most of the game seem to be getting it right, Just a wee tweek here and there and future is bright.

 

 

 

Come on the mighty JTs.

 

:5643::5643:

 

Yep the waiting list is filling up already. Last count 10,000.

[Julio]

You would think by some of the reactions to this announcement that we had just brought in a quality manager.

A new main stand that will probably not happen.

 

TRM the response says it all.

[Vlad_Knows_Best]

someone had posted on here that they had been consulting with the council and had unofficially submitted it for a provisional look of some sort. perhaps that's what your friend meant?

 

 

Could well be the case mate?

[redm]

A supporter who works for the council's planning department.

 

What is he? The tea lady? He might want to review his career path, I doubt that anyone who works in the council planning department would think that was a story.

 

 

There are different types of planning applications...It's quite standard for developers to submit an outline planning application which only gives basic details of what they intend to build. This is normally done to ascertain whether or not their ideas are viable before they go and spend vast fortunes on preparing the full or detailed planning application (which incidentally, is what Hearts submitted today btw). Even then, you're not guaranteed to get your plans approved...there may be reserved matters which are basically a list of things they didn't like and want you to change. Ironing out the creases can take a frustratingly long time. And even THEN they might just grant permission but with further conditions anyway...or worse, reject the proposal entirely. Put simply, there's an awful lot of to'ing and fro'ing.

 

Developments of this size go through roughly the same process but with LOTS of add-ons like consultation etc. It's a complicated and very slow process, and considering that pretty much every local authority has a huge backlog of applications to get through it's probably safe to assume that Edinburgh does too. But they're getting there...and that's enough for me.

[Vlad_Knows_Best]

What is he? The tea lady? He might want to review his career path, I doubt that anyone who works in the council planning department would think that was a story.

 

 

There are different types of planning applications...It's quite standard for developers to submit an outline planning application which only gives basic details of what they intend to build. This is normally done to ascertain whether or not their ideas are viable before they go and spend vast fortunes on preparing the full or detailed planning application (which incidentally, is what Hearts submitted today btw). Even then, you're not guaranteed to get your plans approved...there may be reserved matters which are basically a list of things they didn't like and want you to change. Ironing out the creases can take a frustratingly long time. And even THEN they might just grant permission but with further conditions anyway...or worse, reject the proposal entirely. Put simply, there's an awful lot of to'ing and fro'ing.

 

Developments of this size go through roughly the same process but with LOTS of add-ons like consultation etc. It's a complicated and very slow process, and considering that pretty much every local authority has a huge backlog of applications to get through it's probably safe to assume that Edinburgh does too. But they're getting there...and that's enough for me.

 

Calm yourself mate........make a innocent reply to Kenny D and you come out with all this..............no wonder KB is going downhill with people like you here, ready to jump down peoples throats at the first opportunity.

[Ryan Gosling]

PTBCAL posted that application had been submitted in December but handed back to fix a few things, and he posted that he expected it to be around the 14th of January.