Csaba on discipline - couldn't agree more

[jamboinglasgow]

On the hearts website he talks about discipline due to ?40,000 fine http://www.heartsfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/HeartsNewsDetail/0,,10289~1353753,00.html

 

The line I like best is this, "The referee never changes his decisions but when you talk all the time about what he is doing then you can lose concentration."

 

I have felt like shouting this so often at the players as sometimes they think (like most players these days) yelling at the ref and crowding him will make him change his mind and I have yet to see that happen, usually a yellow card is produced and a player has to tread carefully from there on. Think the captain has to help players realise that, pressely seemed to be good at keeping some players calm and talking to the ref to see what went wrong.. I was remember being told by a player in my rugby team at school that he liked me being the captain as I kept cool and stopped fellow players from going at the ref and that if there was a descision that seemed odd I would go over and ask the ref what the descision was about in a polite manner and allow him to explain. That is what I want Berra to do.

 

Also like him talking about the need to play with the brain rather than just the legs. Think we were lacking concentration and intelligence on the football field last season.

[Zali Cinnamon]

On the hearts website he talks about discipline due to ?40,000 fine http://www.heartsfc.premiumtv.co.uk/page/HeartsNewsDetail/0,,10289~1353753,00.html

 

The line I like best is this, "The referee never changes his decisions but when you talk all the time about what he is doing then you can lose concentration."

 

I have felt like shouting this so often at the players as sometimes they think (like most players these days) yelling at the ref and crowding him will make him change his mind and I have yet to see that happen,

 

Steven Gerrard managed it!

[Guest JamboRobbo]

Csaba talks so much sense it is unreal. And to think, there were some on here who wanted to blame it all on the refs and said our players were right to lose the plot all the time.

[JamboAl]

Csaba talks so much sense it is unreal. And to think, there were some on here who wanted to blame it all on the refs and said our players were right to lose the plot all the time.

 

I'd be surprised if anyone ever blamed it all on the refs or that the players were right to lose the plot. Understanding why they lost the plot and saying they were right to do so are two entirely different things.

 

There is absolutely no doubt discipline needs to be tightened but I find it difficult going to an OF game v Hearts and being presented with a ref from Paisley or Glasgow as that is neither neutral nor fair. That ref will conduct his business, family and social life in a weegie environment and a "wrong" decision will have an effect on that, including the possibilty of his windows going in. Don't just blame Hearts players/fans - look at the problem holistically.

[Gambo]

Csaba talks so much sense it is unreal. And to think, there were some on here who wanted to blame it all on the refs and said our players were right to lose the plot all the time.

 

Who was this? I remember there were plenty blaming the players but also having a go at the way we were being refereed differently to other teams.

 

There were those though who blamed it all on VR.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

Who was this?

 

Nobody Gambo.

 

I remember there were plenty blaming the players but also having a go at the way we were being refereed differently to other teams.

 

There were those though who blamed it all on VR.

 

And there were those like myself and Csaba, who blame it on OUR poor discipline. Poor discipline caused by not having a manager who instilled discipline in our players.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I'd be surprised if anyone ever blamed it all on the refs or that the players were right to lose the plot. Understanding why they lost the plot and saying they were right to do so are two entirely different things.

 

There is absolutely no doubt discipline needs to be tightened but I find it difficult going to an OF game v Hearts and being presented with a ref from Paisley or Glasgow as that is neither neutral nor fair. That ref will conduct his business, family and social life in a weegie environment and a "wrong" decision will have an effect on that, including the possibilty of his windows going in. Don't just blame Hearts players/fans - look at the problem holistically.

 

I don't even care WHO is "to blame". It's irrelevent.

 

As Csaba says, we need to sort out our discipline. OUR discipline. Not refs, not SFA, and not the media. OUR discipline. That is what we can control, and that is what we need to sort.

 

I'm delighted Csaba sees this, as it has been glaringly obvious for a couple of season.

[Gambo]

Nobody Gambo.

 

 

 

And there were those like myself and Csaba, who blame it on OUR poor discipline. Poor discipline caused by not having a manager who instilled discipline in our players.

 

I'm delighted Csaba wants to sort the discipline out, i am also sure though Csaba has just looked at the poor disciplinary figures and not actually witnessed what some of those booking/sendings off were for and what others in this country get away with.

 

No one on here is naive enough to think all the blame lies with the refs, what we do have though are some who think ALL the blame lies with the players(and their coaching) and that the referees are totally blameless*.

 

*Not even referees think this.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I'm delighted Csaba wants to sort the discipline out, i am also sure though Csaba has just looked at the poor disciplinary figures and not actually witnessed what some of those booking/sendings off were for and what others in this country get away with.

 

No one on here is naive enough to think all the blame lies with the refs, what we do have though are some who think ALL the blame lies with the players(and their coaching) and that the referees are totally blameless*.

 

*Not even referees think this.

 

Woosh. That'll be the sound of the whole point Csaba is making flying way above your head.

 

We can't control refs. We can't control decisions that WILL go against us. We can control OUR discipline.

[Gambo]

Woosh. That'll be the sound of the whole point Csaba is making flying way above your head.

 

We can't control refs. We can't control decisions that WILL go against us. We can control OUR discipline.

 

Not gone above my head.

 

You were the one who brought 'to think there were those who thought the refs were all to blame' into it. I replied to that, as well as acknowledging our discipline* does need sorted.

 

Unfortunatley our indiscipline record goes a lot further than what our players do, the poor refereeing against us also has an effect on that.

[i8hibsh]

Although I 100% agree that our discipline is deplorable and MUST be rectified

 

we get fined, but what happens to the corrupt weegie feckers through in the that sh*thole in the Weeg that continually give us bad treatment and always favour the dispicable brothers!

[Gambo]

Although I 100% agree that our discipline is deplorable and MUST be rectified

 

we get fined, but what happens to the corrupt weegie feckers through in the that sh*thole in the Weeg that continually give us bad treatment and always favour the dispicable brothers!

 

Nothing, just ignore it, it does not matter.

[JamboAl]

Not gone above my head.

 

You were the one who brought 'to think there were those who thought the refs were all to blame' into it. I replied to that, as well as acknowledging our discipline* does need sorted.

 

Unfortunatley our indiscipline record goes a lot further than what our players do, the poor refereeing against us also has an effect on that.

 

Correct Gambo. He was wrong! He said ALL the blame and then as usual tries to take the high moral ground. Of course Csaba is right. Of course we all agree with him but to pretend that players are so inhuman as to completely ignore the blatant weegie bias, sorry "mistakes", is ridiculous.

JR seems to be latching on to Csaba now but will he still be in his camp if we were to lose 2 or 3 winnable games. Oh of course that would be VR's fault.

[DETTY29]

Although I 100% agree that our discipline is deplorable and MUST be rectified

 

we get fined, but what happens to the corrupt weegie feckers through in the that sh*thole in the Weeg that continually give us bad treatment and always favour the dispicable brothers!

 

Irrespective of the rights or wrongs, that's they way it is.

 

But OUR players indiscipline and OUR (officials) rantings n the press just make things worse. The best course of action is for the players and management to publicly accept the decisions and we may go from getting nothing to get something, which is a hell of a lot better.

 

It's behind the scenes you make your move.

 

Every club gets an opportunity the rate refs performances. Might be worth while the manager sending in 2 reports - one as to how he feels immediately after the game and one after a VT of the game. Similarly we should be pushing for refs to do the same. Immediately the game is over, the refs should complete their reports. No contact is allowed between the ref and players, managers, linesman, 4th official and supervisor until the report is complete. Whether this is at SFA level or muted to Uefa/Fifa I don't know.

 

The removal of Donald MacVicar is vital. He has overseen an unheralded lack of standards, fast tracking of incompetents, seemingly bias towards appointing weak OF apologists; the continual early retirement of our 'better' refs....the list is endless*

 

Dundee United, Aberdeen and Motherwell were all criminally dealt with by refs at the end of last season to the benefit of the Old Firm. We have to get these people on side. Us crowing on about not getting support when Vlad went off on one is niave and short-sighted. Just look at the 'perceived' success that 4 clubs have already told Celtic/Rangers to do one in respect of their surcharge for selling tickets, with more to come on board.

 

Co-operation by 10 against the 2 can work.

 

* MacVicar is a viable small step towards a very public and humiliating removal of Gordon Smith.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

JR seems to be latching on to Csaba now but will he still be in his camp if we were to lose 2 or 3 winnable games. Oh of course that would be VR's fault.

 

Praise where due, criticism where due. Csaba is saying the right things, so I give him praise.

 

If a manager loses winnable games, and it's down to the decision HE makes, then he deserves criticism. If it's down to decisions THE OWNER makes, then the owner would deserve criticism.

 

Praise where due, criticism where due. You should try it some time.

[JamboAl]

Praise where due, criticism where due. Csaba is saying the right things, so I give him praise.

 

If a manager loses winnable games, and it's down to the decision HE makes, then he deserves criticism. If it's down to decisions THE OWNER makes, then the owner would deserve criticism.

 

Praise where due, criticism where due. You should try it some time.

 

Bollox; it tears you apart to praise VR who via an interpreter SUPPOSEDLY told you a lie like you did with your ST.

And how you'll know who makes the relevant decisions is anyone's guess. Ah yes, I remember. Bad decisions must be VR's fault, good ones anybody else's.

BTW I did praise you the other day when you got something right - it's just that I don't the chance very often.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

Bollox; it tears you apart to praise VR who via an interpreter SUPPOSEDLY told you a lie like you did with your ST.

And how you'll know who makes the relevant decisions is anyone's guess. Ah yes, I remember. Bad decisions must be VR's fault, good ones anybody else's.

BTW I did praise you the other day when you got something right - it's just that I don't the chance very often.

 

Excellent points as usual

[Guest Dipped Flake]

Praise where due, criticism where due. Csaba is saying the right things, so I give him praise.

 

If a manager loses winnable games, and it's down to the decision HE makes, then he deserves criticism. If it's down to decisions THE OWNER makes, then the owner would deserve criticism.

Praise where due, criticism where due. You should try it some time.

 

I try to keep away from commenting on your posts as any thread with you posting on it rapidly descends into playground taunting back and forth but I would be very interested to hear how you tell the difference in the highlighted bit above?? How can you know who made the decision that lost us the game???

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I try to keep away from commenting on your posts as any thread with you posting on it rapidly descends into playground taunting back and forth but I would be very interested to hear how you tell the difference in the highlighted bit above?? How can you know who made the decision that lost us the game???

 

I have psychic powers.

 

Oh, and I generally keep away from commenting on your posts too. Not because it rapidly descends into playground taunting back and forth, but just cause they're generally pretty rubbish.

[Guest Dipped Flake]

I have psychic powers.

 

Oh, and I generally keep away from commenting on your posts just cause there rubbish.

 

sort of proves my point...ah well I tried bye bye...

[Paws (FTH)]

Oh my handbags at dawn. Perhaps Csaba needs to come on and have a word

[Coco]

Pressley is a good example here.

 

Very rare that he ever gave any stick to referees. Preferred the quiet word with them. Hugh Dallas once said in an interview that Pressley was his favourite player to referee because he was so polite.

 

What advantage did Pressley get out of this? The benefit of the doubt. The fallover foul, the hands-on in the box, the last ditch tackle - he would tend to get the benefit of the doubt from the referees.

 

I have no problem with cards for well intentioned mis-timed tackles. We have many players who are too scared to tackle and that needs to be sorted out too.

 

But the backchat/diving/petulance etc is wholly unprofessional. Laszlo should tell the squad that we will never do these things - and if the players do they will be put on the transfer list - no matter who they are. That should be made public and we should stick to it. Corinthian football - but we would start to rebuild our shocking reputation. It goes further up too - the comments from the owner have been despicable in this area.

[JamboAl]

Excellent points as usual

 

Thank you very much. I feel humbled.

[magicTs]

Pressley is a good example here.

 

Very rare that he ever gave any stick to referees. Preferred the quiet word with them. Hugh Dallas once said in an interview that Pressley was his favourite player to referee because he was so polite.

 

What advantage did Pressley get out of this? The benefit of the doubt. The fallover foul, the hands-on in the box, the last ditch tackle - he would tend to get the benefit of the doubt from the referees.

 

I have no problem with cards for well intentioned mis-timed tackles. We have many players who are too scared to tackle and that needs to be sorted out too.

 

But the backchat/diving/petulance etc is wholly unprofessional. Laszlo should tell the squad that we will never do these things - and if the players do they will be put on the transfer list - no matter who they are. That should be made public and we should stick to it. Corinthian football - but we would start to rebuild our shocking reputation. It goes further up too - the comments from the owner have been despicable in this area.

 

Good post, sums things up nicely. If as Gambo suggests there is an agenda against Hearts (personally I think that's nonsense and we should put our own house in order) then we should be using it as a motivational thing (much easier with a manager VR). If the genuine feeling is the worlds against us then get the players fighting for each other in a positive sense and not like a bunch of girls blouses as has been the case letting down the club, the fans and themselves.