What a rollercoaster following HMFC

[TheBigO]

18 minutes ago, spirt of 98 said:

I agree we have third best points over the history of the top league. However we are talking about recent history.

 

Ive attended Hearts games for 36 years and we are the best of the rest however this is not guaranteed due to having third biggest budget as the difference in budgets is minute and does not allow us to buy finished articles. 
 

No sure thing by folk are having ago. It appears that there are loads of new entitled Hearts fans who believe the hype that we should be third every year. It would be nice but the facts for not support this. 
 

Please prove me wrong with facts and refrain from suggesting I am a Hobo just because my common sense facts based argument does not agree with your simpleton warped vision of Hearts superiority cause you are talking Colin Nish. 

I never mentioned you were a hobo.  Didn't even cross my mind.

 

The facts are we've underachieved outwith brief spells of our entire history.  We didn't have bogotry to build a foundation on, unfortunately (ask yourself why Rangers and Celtic became the dominant teams even within Glasgow never mind Scotland).  So we've always had that to contend with.

 

We get a good team, it gets picked apart.  We have an owner who ha too much ego and he makes a tit of it, we have a season with injuries to our best players, we put too much trust in a bloke who sold a dream to a naive board.  So it's up and down, it always is, kind of always has been.

 

If you want recent history like you seem to want, then 3rd then 4th (after an arse collapse and competing in Euro groups in a season we were literally missing our 7 or 8 best players at points) isn't mid-table.  Not in Scottish football it's not.  It's almost as high as you can get.  Not sure if that's evidence enough.

 

As it happens, I agree with your general thrust - I do think our fans, or large sections are over-priveleged babies with delusions of grandeur.  Guys who think Cam Devlin isn't good enough for us, guys who think a quarter final wind in a monsoon at Killie wan't pretty or controlled enough. But every club will have them.  Christ, Hibs have a large section who genuinely believe they're the "third force", and we all know only ourselves and Aberdeen can make any claim for that.

[Baxfee]

4 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I never mentioned you were a hobo.  Didn't even cross my mind.

 

The facts are we've underachieved outwith brief spells of our entire history.  We didn't have bogotry to build a foundation on, unfortunately (ask yourself why Rangers and Celtic became the dominant teams even within Glasgow never mind Scotland).  So we've always had that to contend with.

 

We get a good team, it gets picked apart.  We have an owner who ha too much ego and he makes a tit of it, we have a season with injuries to our best players, we put too much trust in a bloke who sold a dream to a naive board.  So it's up and down, it always is, kind of always has been.

 

If you want recent history like you seem to want, then 3rd then 4th (after an arse collapse and competing in Euro groups in a season we were literally missing our 7 or 8 best players at points) isn't mid-table.  Not in Scottish football it's not.  It's almost as high as you can get.  Not sure if that's evidence enough.

 

As it happens, I agree with your general thrust - I do think our fans, or large sections are over-priveleged babies with delusions of grandeur.  Guys who think Cam Devlin isn't good enough for us, guys who think a quarter final wind in a monsoon at Killie wan't pretty or controlled enough. But every club will have them.  Christ, Hibs have a large section who genuinely believe they're the "third force", and we all know only ourselves and Aberdeen can make any claim for that.

Brilliant post 👏

[karipidis]

15 minutes ago, Lone Striker said:

You would think so - but as Vlads Magic has said, the likes of Aberdeen and Hibs budgets are only 20%(ish) less than ours.  The effect of that gap is easily mitigated if they employ a better manager/coach  than us, or sign  a couple of  class players.  

 

 

No way there budget is as much as 20% less than ours. They both spent a fortune in the last window. 

[Lone Striker]

3 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I never mentioned you were a hobo.  Didn't even cross my mind.

 

The facts are we've underachieved outwith brief spells of our entire history.  We didn't have bogotry to build a foundation on, unfortunately (ask yourself why Rangers and Celtic became the dominant teams even within Glasgow never mind Scotland).  So we've always had that to contend with.

 

We get a good team, it gets picked apart.  We have an owner who ha too much ego and he makes a tit of it, we have a season with injuries to our best players, we put too much trust in a bloke who sold a dream to a naive board.  So it's up and down, it always is, kind of always has been.

 

If you want recent history like you seem to want, then 3rd then 4th (after an arse collapse and competing in Euro groups in a season we were literally missing our 7 or 8 best players at points) isn't mid-table.  Not in Scottish football it's not.  It's almost as high as you can get.  Not sure if that's evidence enough.

 

As it happens, I agree with your general thrust - I do think our fans, or large sections are over-priveleged babies with delusions of grandeur.  Guys who think Cam Devlin isn't good enough for us, guys who think a quarter final wind in a monsoon at Killie wan't pretty or controlled enough. But every club will have them.  Christ, Hibs have a large section who genuinely believe they're the "third force", and we all know only ourselves and Aberdeen can make any claim for that.

Great post. 👍  As for the posters with delusions of grandeur, its noticeable how few of their opinions  ever acknowledge the fact that some teams who we fail to beat actually have a few good/well-coached/high-energy players that make a difference.

 

 

[TheBigO]

1 minute ago, Lone Striker said:

Great post. 👍  As for the posters with delusions of grandeur, its noticeable how few of their opinions  ever acknowledge the fact that some teams who we fail to beat actually have a few good/well-coached/high-energy players that make a difference.

 

 

Yep that Killie team have beat both Celtic and Rangers this season and St Mirren are unbeaten and undoubtedly a good team

 

I want us sticking these teams away, but it's not as easy as it sounds.  Last night a good step.

[leipzig76]

1 hour ago, spirt of 98 said:

Childish pish patter. 

A reply filled with irony !

[BlueRiver]

4 hours ago, Vlad Magic said:

People really need to put this “3rd biggest budget” argument to one side.

 

Yes technically we have the 3rd biggest budget. This is factually correct. However it’s not significantly big enough to those with lower budgets to guarantee us 3rd. This is the reality.

 

We are still shopping at the very bottom end of the market like everyone else. We are still taking gambles on players from unfancied leagues like everyone else.

 

Our slight financial advantage means we can look at a slightly larger pool of players. The risks attached and the rewards of uncovering a gem apply the same to us as they do to others.

 

To say we should be 3rd because our budget is 3rd biggest is ill advised and leads to over the top and unrealistic expectations.

 

 

We're still scrapping the barrell for recruitment compared to the others but maybe we can sign 3 duffers to their one. 

[DalryJambo]

4 hours ago, Vlad Magic said:

People really need to put this “3rd biggest budget” argument to one side.

 

Yes technically we have the 3rd biggest budget. This is factually correct. However it’s not significantly big enough to those with lower budgets to guarantee us 3rd. This is the reality.

 

We are still shopping at the very bottom end of the market like everyone else. We are still taking gambles on players from unfancied leagues like everyone else.

 

Our slight financial advantage means we can look at a slightly larger pool of players. The risks attached and the rewards of uncovering a gem apply the same to us as they do to others.

 

To say we should be 3rd because our budget is 3rd biggest is ill advised and leads to over the top and unrealistic expectations.

 

I think one thing to consider is in the last 5 or so years we've recovered from Admin, demotion, a complete clear out of the squad, started the much needed refurbishment of 3 out of 4 stands including flood lighting, replacement of the pitchside surface, massive tvs etc, built an entirely new main stand (along with the associated hospitality, bars,  restaurants and kitchens etc. We're well on the way to completing the fit out of the hotel, updated the administration elements of the club and invested massively on a new pitch.

 

This has come at a cost, but with the support of fans buying season tickets, fan contributions, benefactor contributions, increased commercial income etc etc we have achieved the above without adding to our debt.

 

Aberdeen have a crap stadium that needs replaced, hibs need less investment but the fans constantly don't back the club financially, putting them at a disadvantage.

 

In the next few years we will start to reep the benefits of greater income streams, whilst not needing to invest in these capital expenditure type projects.

 

It's been a painful few years (relative to our expectations) but moving forward we should benift from the hard work that's been undertaken and kick on.

 

I can't argue recruitment and the team management aspects need to improve, but if this is our new baseline (vs 5 years ago) we're in a strong place.

[Bull's-eye]

3 hours ago, EIEIO said:

The difference between now and the previous regimes in the boardroom is that we have financial stability and strength due to Ann Budge and co. Great.

Unfortunately, when it comes to the football side we are tinpot and just appoint someone "we" know who's already at the club (eg Levein and Naismith) or connected to someone at the club (eg Cathro). Liam Fox would probably be there next choice if/when Naismith fails.

The frustration/ "pant wetting" is ramped up by repeatedly not appointing an experienced manager.

Great result last night and 2 good goals to brighten a rainy night in Ayrshire (even though we lost the same soft headed goal we've been conceding every other game for 2 years now).

 

Plenty Hampden appearances, 3rd 4th, European nights. All tinpot stuff right enough.

 

 

[Vlad Magic]

12 minutes ago, DalryJambo said:

 

I think one thing to consider is in the last 5 or so years we've recovered from Admin, demotion, a complete clear out of the squad, started the much needed refurbishment of 3 out of 4 stands including flood lighting, replacement of the pitchside surface, massive tvs etc, built an entirely new main stand (along with the associated hospitality, bars,  restaurants and kitchens etc. We're well on the way to completing the fit out of the hotel, updated the administration elements of the club and invested massively on a new pitch.

 

This has come at a cost, but with the support of fans buying season tickets, fan contributions, benefactor contributions, increased commercial income etc etc we have achieved the above without adding to our debt.

 

Aberdeen have a crap stadium that needs replaced, hibs need less investment but the fans constantly don't back the club financially, putting them at a disadvantage.

 

In the next few years we will start to reep the benefits of greater income streams, whilst not needing to invest in these capital expenditure type projects.

 

It's been a painful few years (relative to our expectations) but moving forward we should benift from the hard work that's been undertaken and kick on.

 

I can't argue recruitment and the team management aspects need to improve, but if this is our new baseline (vs 5 years ago) we're in a strong place.

 

Balanced and constructive.

 

Sometimes we forget just how much has gone on behind the scenes.

 

The first team is the priority and always should be however club infrastructure constantly needs remedial work or upgrading. Sometimes replacing completely as per your examples above.

 

This is a football business not just a football team. A fact some people appear to forget from time to time.
 

 

[EIEIO]

50 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

Plenty Hampden appearances, 3rd 4th, European nights. All tinpot stuff right enough.

 

 

Savage and McKinlay want us to get closer to the Old Firm we barely lay a glove on them when we play them never mind coming close to matching their record against the lesser lights from Livingston  Dundee, Paisley and Motherwell on the road. It's always "a difficult place to go" and we seem to accept this.

I'm delighted by last night's result and hope it's some kind of turning point with a more attacking style of play (although we are still losing soft headed goals every other game which is worrying) can we carry it on in Dingwall and start to move up the league? Let's hope so.

Edited September 27, 2023 by EIEIO
Spelling

[Fejka]

9 hours ago, Selkirkhmfc1874 said:

Saturday was a long journey home from Paisley feeling let down , woke up Sunday morning still feeling gutted ! Last night was amazing feeling when Lowry scored and woke up this morning still buzzing 

First time in a while that I’ve celebrated a goal with a bit of buzz. Goals this season have been few and far between but the few we have done apart from Lowrys last night have felt flat.

[Hmfc1965]

6 hours ago, DalryJambo said:

 

I think one thing to consider is in the last 5 or so years we've recovered from Admin, demotion, a complete clear out of the squad, started the much needed refurbishment of 3 out of 4 stands including flood lighting, replacement of the pitchside surface, massive tvs etc, built an entirely new main stand (along with the associated hospitality, bars,  restaurants and kitchens etc. We're well on the way to completing the fit out of the hotel, updated the administration elements of the club and invested massively on a new pitch.

 

This has come at a cost, but with the support of fans buying season tickets, fan contributions, benefactor contributions, increased commercial income etc etc we have achieved the above without adding to our debt.

 

Aberdeen have a crap stadium that needs replaced, hibs need less investment but the fans constantly don't back the club financially, putting them at a disadvantage.

 

In the next few years we will start to reep the benefits of greater income streams, whilst not needing to invest in these capital expenditure type projects.

 

It's been a painful few years (relative to our expectations) but moving forward we should benift from the hard work that's been undertaken and kick on.

 

I can't argue recruitment and the team management aspects need to improve, but if this is our new baseline (vs 5 years ago) we're in a strong place.

Some people talk about 'demotion "as if our absolutely rank performances for the vast majority of the season played no part in the outcome.

That season was a travesty in more ways than one.

[DalryJambo]

28 minutes ago, Hmfc1965 said:

Some people talk about 'demotion "as if our absolutely rank performances for the vast majority of the season played no part in the outcome.

That season was a travesty in more ways than one.

Yea, if we'd been playing better it wouldn't have impacted us the way it did, but given the uncertainty around covid etc I think everyone sticking together would have been the best approach. 

[Hmfc1965]

18 minutes ago, DalryJambo said:

Yea, if we'd been playing better it wouldn't have impacted us the way it did, but given the uncertainty around covid etc I think everyone sticking together would have been the best approach. 

I agree but I still can't quite fathom how we ended up in that position.