*** Official Heart of Midlothian vs. The Rangers Match Thread ***

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, Nelly Terraces said:

We played pretty well & on another day could've maybe got a draw but the difference in the 2 sides for me was highlighted by 2 long diagonal balls, our one went to GMS & his 1st touch was poor as it came off his foot & the ball went about 5 yards in front of him, he tried getting round the full back but didn't manage it. Few minutes later they play that ball to Kent, the ball literally sticks to his foot whilst he's on the run & he skins Moore to get the cross in which ultimately led to them scoring.

 

They just have that bit more quality than we do I'm afraid. 

It was about the only one that found the man, another difference for me is theirs was over the CH not a fullback so Aribo was through on goal not wide. We need players making runs in behind CHs. 

[Mighty jam]

2 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Our GK has now faced the most shots of anyone in the league, is that midfields fault? Was their second goal where Souttar watches tue ball sail over his head without even noticing Aribo make a 30 yard run right past him the midfields fault (that Haring was playing in)? 
Gordon is the only player that would get in either of the uglies teams, none of the defenders would, which will be illustrated by the clubs they leave for in the next 6 months. 

over the course of half a season then yes it is down to the midfield causing Gordon to face so many shots! we should have control and domination of teams like Livingston, we absolutely do not! rarely do we completely dominate in games the way the old firm do to other teams.

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, jambopilms said:

I don't care if Halkett, Souter and Smith leave I would keep Kingsley if possible.

Halkett and Souter don't have the footballing intelligence to be great defenders. Souter's strength is with the ball at his feet but even then most games he gives it away in a dangerous area.

Our defence has been poor for years even in the championship we were giving away golden opportunity ever game. It can't get better if you keep it the same.

Definitely. I wouldn’t be gutted if Kingsley left either as he ruthlessly exposed for pace yesterday. 

[Pasquale for King]

1 minute ago, Mighty jam said:

over the course of half a season then yes it is down to the midfield causing Gordon to face so many shots! we should have control and domination of teams like Livingston, we absolutely do not! rarely do we completely dominate in games the way the old firm do to other teams.

I think you might be the only person blaming the midfield who have been really good this season even when they’re playing against 3 players in there without the manager noticing it. Basic mistakes like those we witnessed yesterday can in no way be blamed on the midfield. 

[Tiger]

45 minutes ago, PortyBeach said:

Sadly correct, Tazio. However their accumulated losses in overspending to prevent 10IAR have caught up with them.

Mike Ashley’s legal action is also a looming problem and it’s estimated it will cost TRFC around £10M.

They are currently surviving on soft loans from directors and share issues. Rescue in the form of Champions League monies is massively important for them. 
Of course, Scotland’s match officials know what’s expected of them in that regard. How Celtic react is the big question for me. Will they spend big in January to try to deny TRFC their CL bonanza? 

 

I personally hope they do, would love this tribute act to follow in the same footsteps as their predecessor.

[Mighty jam]

2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

I think you might be the only person blaming the midfield who have been really good this season even when they’re playing against 3 players in there without the manager noticing it. Basic mistakes like those we witnessed yesterday can in no way be blamed on the midfield. 

Don't think so mate! to improve the team you ought to look at the weak area's so seem intent on ditching our best players

[Pasquale for King]

14 minutes ago, Mighty jam said:

Don't think so mate! to improve the team you ought to look at the weak area's so seem intent on ditching our best players

What best players? Nobody that plays in defence are our best players. They are all likely to leave if they get a better offer, can’t wait to see who comes in for them tbh. 

[Mighty jam]

16 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

What best players? Nobody that plays in defence are our best players. They are all likely to leave if they get a better offer, can’t wait to see who comes in for them tbh. 

deary me mate! now why would they get better offers? is it perhaps because they are perhaps good players attracting interest from others clubs...."our best players" not hearing too much interest in our midfield players

 

[Pasquale for King]

55 minutes ago, Mighty jam said:

deary me mate! now why would they get better offers? is it perhaps because they are perhaps good players attracting interest from others clubs...."our best players" not hearing too much interest in our midfield players

 

Getting more money from some shitey club down south doesn’t make them great players, out of contract players will always attract interest, I would be fairly confident that none of them will play for Everton for instance. 
Any manager looking at this years performances might not be rushing in to sign them, I could be here all night listing their mistakes and limitations as players. 
We can but wait and see. 

[JimmyCant]

4 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Agreed.
I think we can play two up front but it would be Ginnelly to run the channels, Boyce had his best season with a nippy forward beside him. 
Unfortunately for us we aren’t in a position yet to challenge them for the league, both aren’t as good as they have been but by the time we get better players they might both have CL money behind them. 
My biggest moan about yesterday was the proof if any more was needed of how bad our defence is. 
I honestly couldn’t care less if they all leave by next summer. 

Thing is, although it didn’t stand up to scrutiny from a good team yesterday, it’s still statistically a good defence. If they all leave, we’ll be building an entire new defence and the quality will probably be similar, albeit we might get a leader in there and we might get a wee bit more pace in there and we might end up with a better balance. It’s a huge ask to get all that right in one go. If we do need to do that though, it strips away at the budget we’ve got for strikers and a creative midfielder and a RWB. 
 

Id keep Halkett and Kingsley and try and get a relatively experienced leader and organiser to play with them. A Mulgrew type (not him but someone of that ilk before someone tells me he’s finished)

[Pasquale for King]

6 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Thing is, although it didn’t stand up to scrutiny from a good team yesterday, it’s still statistically a good defence. If they all leave, we’ll be building an entire new defence and the quality will probably be similar, albeit we might get a leader in there and we might get a wee bit more pace in there and we might end up with a better balance. It’s a huge ask to get all that right in one go. If we do need to do that though, it strips away at the budget we’ve got for strikers and a creative midfielder and a RWB. 
 

Id keep Halkett and Kingsley and try and get a relatively experienced leader and organiser to play with them. A Mulgrew type (not him but someone of that ilk before someone tells me he’s finished)

Statically our GK has now faced more shots that any other, it’s only because of his quality that we are where we are and it’s masked how bad they are. 
We have to improve this area and hopefully we should have European football to boost the finances and our appeal to attract better players. 
We have creative players, whether this  manager can bring the best out of them remains to be seen. 
It might not be up to us if any of the players stay depending on if they want to. 

[JimmyCant]

7 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Statically our GK has now faced more shots that any other, it’s only because of his quality that we are where we are and it’s masked how bad they are. 
We have to improve this area and hopefully we should have European football to boost the finances and our appeal to attract better players. 
We have creative players, whether this  manager can bring the best out of them remains to be seen. 
It might not be up to us if any of the players stay depending on if they want to. 

I’m speaking in hindsight here because I didn’t have much argument with Neilson’s line up yesterday, but having seen the game and seen us exposed by diagonals and pace, I think it would have been better to stick with a back 3 and play Cochrane at LWB. With a 3 across midfield and 2 up front instead of 3, I honestly think we might have got a result, but he went for it as folk had been asking for so no real issue with that attitude. We were quite a bit better when Kingsley stepped in to the centre a bit more but we lost attacking width down the left because of it.

 

I’m not sure your Gordon stat necessarily tells the whole story or proves our defence is mince by the way

Edited December 13, 2021 by JimmyCant

[Pasquale for King]

Just now, JimmyCant said:

I’m speaking in hindsight here because I didn’t half much argument with Neilson’s line up yesterday, but having seen the game and seen us exposed by diagonals and pace, I think it would have been better to stick with a back 3 and play Cochrane at LWB. With a 3 across midfield and 2 up front instead of 3, I honestly think we might have got a result, but he went for it as folk had been asking for so no real issue with that attitude. We were quite a bit better when Kingsley stepped in to the centre a bit more but we lost attacking width down the left because of it

It was a strange feeling really as we created chances but still got beat, and I felt they could’ve picked up the pace if they needed to. After 15 minutes it looked like it could be a real doing. 
It’s interesting that he now feels a back four is better than his preferred three against the uglies. 

[PortyBeach]

1 hour ago, Tiger said:

 

I personally hope they do, would love this tribute act to follow in the same footsteps as their predecessor.

At the very least, January might see them have to offload a player or three. We can but hope.

As you say, if Celtic do decide to up the ante, it could get interesting.

I think much depends on the calculations within the Celtic boardroom. There’s a view they might be prepared to let it go because it would ensure TRFC’s survival - something commercially important to Celtic.

 

[JimmyCant]

1 minute ago, Pasquale for King said:

It was a strange feeling really as we created chances but still got beat, and I felt they could’ve picked up the pace if they needed to. After 15 minutes it looked like it could be a real doing. 
It’s interesting that he now feels a back four is better than his preferred three against the uglies. 

I think he is wrong to chop and change from a 4 to a 3/5. I also think playing 2 in centre mid is asking for trouble against certain teams. A big part of our problem is having one decent winger (McKay) and one other decent forward (Boyce) The rest of the forwards are pretty gash. We’re not posing enough threat up front to make teams think about how to stop that. Overload the midfield and that lets you press the central defence. That’s how you play Hearts. Been proved umpteen times this season.

[No Idle Talk]

Except for one five minute period I think we played well yesterday. Unfortunately we conceded two goals in that five minute period. The defending for their first goal was dreadful. Aribo took the second goal very well. 

 

Looking at the 90mins as a whole, I don't feel that we deserved to lose the game. Losing to that lot never sits well with me but on this occasion I think there are positives to take out of the game. 

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, JimmyCant said:

I think he is wrong to chop and change from a 4 to a 3/5. I also think playing 2 in centre mid is asking for trouble against certain teams. A big part of our problem is having one decent winger (McKay) and one other decent forward (Boyce) The rest of the forwards are pretty gash. We’re not posing enough threat up front to make teams think about how to stop that. Overload the midfield and that lets you press the central defence. That’s how you play Hearts. Been proved umpteen times this season.

Yeah we’ve been out numbered in midfield to many times, he then has to get the wingbacks to play inverted or the wingers, or worse Boyce,  to make up for it. 

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, No Idle Talk said:

Except for one five minute period I think we played well yesterday. Unfortunately we conceded two goals in that five minute period. The defending for their first goal was dreadful. Aribo took the second goal very well. 

 

Looking at the 90mins as a whole, I don't feel that we deserved to lose the game. Losing to that lot never sits well with me but on this occasion I think there are positives to take out of the game. 

The second goal was worse as he ambled past a typical ball watching CH who is nowhere near as good a defender as he’s made out to be. 

[gnasher75]

2 hours ago, No Idle Talk said:

Except for one five minute period I think we played well yesterday. Unfortunately we conceded two goals in that five minute period. The defending for their first goal was dreadful. Aribo took the second goal very well. 

 

Looking at the 90mins as a whole, I don't feel that we deserved to lose the game. Losing to that lot never sits well with me but on this occasion I think there are positives to take out of the game. 

 

Agreed. I just watched the whole game again. The overriding emotion is frustration that we didn't convert our chances. Kingsley's free kick, Ginnelly's cross that nearly led to an OG, Boyce's chance in the first couple of minutes and the one he put over after the handball.

 

What we desperately need is a poacher, a penalty box striker, the kind of player who always seems to be in the right place to finish. No idea who might be available in January but it's the missing piece of the jigsaw. A Robbo/McCoist/Boyd type.

 

Also, for what it's worth, I think Barisic could easily have been sent off for his aggression first towards Devlin and then to Ginnelly. VAR might not have saved Gino from a second yellow (although I still think it was harsh) but it might have given Barisic a straight red.

 

[Hearts1975]

There is still a lot to be positive about. Savage has already said we will be strengthening in January. If we get anything like the players that we got in the summer, then expect some more quality to come through the door 

 

Nothing can ever be perfect but in my mind we have most certainly closed the gulf in quality between us and the OF. Probably the only real benchmark u can take in this league.
 

For years and years we rocked up, home and away, and apart from the odd win here and there, took a doing most times 

 

That isn’t happening now. Still a work in progress, but progress is the key word here. I think we are most definitely getting better and there is much more ambition being shown now and from within 

 

All since AB handed over the reigns to AM (tbf). it feels like the acceptance of mediocrity years have gone, and we are now on a different path moving forward