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Players Attitude & Application


Rudy T

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Absolutely delighted with the result and performance last night. For me it sums up this current Hearts squad, we know what they're capable of we've seen it in a number of games recently; Rangers, Hibs x2, Celtic x2, Dundee and then last night again. Last night IMO was a result of the embarrassment of Saturday which on the surface is a good thing shows pride and determination, however when it's put in context with Dunfermline and Dundee games for example it suggests to me this squad aren't giving it their all in every game and there's a massive attitude problem.

 

We should win the league by a distance, we took Dundee and Raith apart in games where we turned up and with the same approach on Saturday we'll do the same to Dunfermline. However if this inconsistency in how the players want to apply themselves continues we'll not cruise this, and we'll most certainly get a shock next season.

 

We need a real culture change at Tynecastle, we need to see players who fight for the jersey and do the hard work early in games and not accept defeat.

 

I'm old enough to know Hearts won't win every game, even ones we should, but I get more angry and frustrated when I see players disrespect the opposition, our club, staff and fans by not trying to be the best they can be.

 

That last night was the bench mark for the rest of the season, performances need to remain at that level or we'll keep seeing this inconsistency in results and encourage every team to come and have a go at us without any fear.

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This 💯, if the all players could have even half the enthusiasm and determination of the fans we’d be in the top 3 of the Premier.

 

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It is strange that only after a real embarrassment do we play like we care. I'm not sure if the manager knows how to make them try in all games, well, not sure is wrong,  more certain, because I've seen it first hand. Maybe Neilson can keep this mindset going, let's hope so and if not he'll just have to go, same as Levein, in two years.

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Captain Sausage

We struggle against teams that sit in. It’s the same as last season. 
 

When teams attack and leave space, we play lot better. Last night was much better in terms of pressing and closing down. We had enough chances to win 10-0. 
 

That needs to be the minimum standard. 

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 No surprise that we got to grips with the game playing a high press and the problems at the heart of our defence were sorted out.  Unlike Saturday Rzith were just not given the time or space to play.  Far more hunger and application last night. More of the same please on Saturday.

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50 minutes ago, Rudy T said:

Absolutely delighted with the result and performance last night. For me it sums up this current Hearts squad, we know what they're capable of we've seen it in a number of games recently; Rangers, Hibs x2, Celtic x2, Dundee and then last night again. Last night IMO was a result of the embarrassment of Saturday which on the surface is a good thing shows pride and determination, however when it's put in context with Dunfermline and Dundee games for example it suggests to me this squad aren't giving it their all in every game and there's a massive attitude problem.

 

We should win the league by a distance, we took Dundee and Raith apart in games where we turned up and with the same approach on Saturday we'll do the same to Dunfermline. However if this inconsistency in how the players want to apply themselves continues we'll not cruise this, and we'll most certainly get a shock next season.

 

We need a real culture change at Tynecastle, we need to see players who fight for the jersey and do the hard work early in games and not accept defeat.

 

I'm old enough to know Hearts won't win every game, even ones we should, but I get more angry and frustrated when I see players disrespect the opposition, our club, staff and fans by not trying to be the best they can be.

 

That last night was the bench mark for the rest of the season, performances need to remain at that level or we'll keep seeing this inconsistency in results and encourage every team to come and have a go at us without any fear.

A brilliant summation of the players and coaches. 

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Weakened Offender

The current coaching team inherited a squad of players that showed in the previous season or two that when they could be arsed, they were a match for most sides. They just couldn't be arsed much and ended up bottom of the league. 

 

It's still a problem but it'll be addressed by the time we're promoted. 

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Gimme an H...
19 minutes ago, Captain Sausage said:

We struggle against teams that sit in. It’s the same as last season. 
 

When teams attack and leave space, we play lot better. Last night was much better in terms of pressing and closing down. We had enough chances to win 10-0. 
 

That needs to be the minimum standard. 

Raith sat in for 90mins last night. They were abysmal and managed not a single shot at goal. Pumped then 4-0.

 

OP is correct. It's a mentality thing. We need then up and at it from the very first minute regardless of us playing Hibs/Celtic/Rangers or Arbroath/Dunfermline/Inverurie Locos. 

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Gordon Ramsay

We need to press teams. 

 

We done it last night and forced them into mistakes. Start off higher up the pitch in every game should be the way to go. Especially when we have a better squad than everyone else. 

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Whether we like it or not the comforts of these well paid players have been taken away from them.

it could just be that training and playing football with no release is taking its toll

i never suffered in the first lockdown but the second has been depressing and some of the hearts performances were opportunities to lift me then I watched as we were 3-0 down to Raith 😌

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28 minutes ago, sandylejambo said:

It is strange that only after a real embarrassment do we play like we care. I'm not sure if the manager knows how to make them try in all games, well, not sure is wrong,  more certain, because I've seen it first hand. Maybe Neilson can keep this mindset going, let's hope so and if not he'll just have to go, same as Levein, in two years.

 

To be fair this seems to have been a problem at Hearts for several years now. We can raise our games for big games, but struggle for intensity in other games. Look at last season when we had a run of drawing with Ross County, beat Rangers, drew with St Johnstone, lost to Killie, beat Falkirk in the cup, lost to Celtic, drew with Hamilton, beat Rangers in the cup, beat Hibs, drew with Motherwell and lost to St Mirren. If we could have kept up our intensity from the Rangers and Hibs games in our other games we would have avoided relegation.

 

But is it also a problem most teams have? They raise their game against bigger teams but can't perform at that level consistently against teams they should be beating. For example this season Dunfermline, Dundee and Raith have all raised their intensity and effort against us, but dropped points in the majority of other games. I do also wonder if manager's are finding it harder than normal to get players to fully apply themselves in games given they are behind closed doors. Mentally it will be more difficult to raise their game in what feels like a bounce game.

 

But I do agree this is the challenge for Neilson this season. We clearly have much better players than anyone else in the league.

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We could basically win the league on Saturday, put a massive Psychological gap between us and the rest...lets hope the team turn up like last night.

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RustyRightPeg

Was night and day compared to the weekend.

 

Genuinely can’t believe how much we got away with it on Saturday, results going our way within the league. 
 

We need to continue to play like we played last night week in week out. A clean sheet always helps, don’t care if it was against 10 men or not for the majority of the game, we’ve conceded against 10 men before. 

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I think our biggest issue remains at CB, but also we need more youth in the team. I think youngsters are a lot more eager to impress generally speaking. Players like Walker and Halliday play important roles but if they decide not to turn up. Having Cochrane or someone else to be able to sub on or even rotate with might bring that better level of enthusiasm/energy. 

 

Although, I thought Walker played really well last night. He was driving forward with the ball and trying to make things happen which I think should be acknowledged given when he has a bad game folk (myself included) are quick to point it out. 

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Ex member of the SaS

Been saying all along my problem with them was application and commitment. We know they can play ( Celtic ) so why do they struggle and lose stupid goals to teams like RR? Always said we will win the league, but some of the play this season would struggle in the top flight. We need to be up and running after promotion.

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47 minutes ago, Gordon Ramsay said:

We need to press teams. 

 

We done it last night and forced them into mistakes. Start off higher up the pitch in every game should be the way to go. Especially when we have a better squad than everyone else. 

 

IMO that's how Neilson wants them to play in every game, the problem seems to be with the players willingness to do so. You can't have 3 or 4 passengers when you press or the whole thing becomes disjointed and gaps appear all over the park. 

 

That said working hard off the ball is one thing, but once you have it back the players need to work equally as hard in both running and passing. Far to often we see lazy/sloppy passing or static players not taking responsibility to get into good positions and all the work we've done to get it back is pointless.

 

Look at Livi or even St Johnstone at the weekend, ability wise they're not a patch on a lot of their opposition, but the sum of their parts is greater than their talent and they win games. If this Hearts team played Livi it would give me the fear right now, yet there's very few Livi players I'd want us to sign.

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Bazzas right boot
3 minutes ago, Rudy T said:

 

IMO that's how Neilson wants them to play in every game, the problem seems to be with the players willingness to do so. You can't have 3 or 4 passengers when you press or the whole thing becomes disjointed and gaps appear all over the park. 

 

That said working hard off the ball is one thing, but once you have it back the players need to work equally as hard in both running and passing. Far to often we see lazy/sloppy passing or static players not taking responsibility to get into good positions and all the work we've done to get it back is pointless.

 

Look at Livi or even St Johnstone at the weekend, ability wise they're not a patch on a lot of their opposition, but the sum of their parts is greater than their talent and they win games. If this Hearts team played Livi it would give me the fear right now, yet there's very few Livi players I'd want us to sign.

 

 

Unsure if I'd have the fear v livi, but I get your point. 

I'd rather player Aberdeen or hibs over livi or St Johnstone tho in general. 

 

Livi might crash again or continue thier form, who knows. Many managers can have a good run or a good season, then it goes wrong. 

 

Robbie last time built a team over 2. 5 seasons, although far from perfect it  was an  improving team, despite some average players. Some posters should remember that it's a team game, especially as many players in that side that had the team  about 2nd/ 3rd were ripped to bits on here. Some still are. In fact the manager is by some. 😭

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
27 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

It seems we turn up for big games but in other games we just turn up.

 

If you get my jist.

 

We've won 10/13  league games, scored almost 40 goals. 

 

We have defensive problems and other teams will sometimes play well. 

 

We need to sort out the defensive lapses, it is clear we'll score goals. 

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1 hour ago, kila said:

Are we saying the Rangers quarter final was ‘recently’ ?

 

Was less than a year ago. Pretty recent in terms of the age of the universe i suppose 🤷‍♂️

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1 hour ago, kila said:

Are we saying the Rangers quarter final was ‘recently’ ?

 

 

In terms of personnel, yes, 8 players from last nights squad were in the squad v Rangers.

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1 hour ago, Saint Jambo said:

..... I do also wonder if manager's are finding it harder than normal to get players to fully apply themselves in games given they are behind closed doors. Mentally it will be more difficult to raise their game in what feels like a bounce game.

 

But I do agree this is the challenge for Neilson this season. We clearly have much better players than anyone else in the league.

 

Yeah, I think this is a very good point. Playing with no crowd must be tricky to get that extra spark of enthusiasm or even momentum. I know it's the same for every team, but I suppose the odd lapse in performance is to be expected. We've won 10/13 after all and scored plenty.

As you say, that's where the manager has to come in and get them properly 'up for it.'

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No surprise nobody has mentioned the part Raith played in the game last night. 

In true jkb style on that performance they need 11 new players and a manager.

 

You can only play what's in front of you and because we've got better players we're going to win more than we lose, I really don't blame players for not being currently motivated to go the extra yard, Im 100% sure the odd few who actually have a job on here aren't. 

 

It's a Shit time to be alive and everybody's struggling, why the **** should semi fit football players be any different, cut them some slack and accept they're going to have off days. 

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1 hour ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

We've won 10/13  league games, scored almost 40 goals. 

 

We have defensive problems and other teams will sometimes play well. 

 

We need to sort out the defensive lapses, it is clear we'll score goals. 

Yes,

 

But we have been all over the shop at times in games we have won, or placid as hell such as in the LC game against Alloa.

 

Fine for now, but this is another 3 - 5 year plan.  And we won't be winning this level of games when we step up.

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Bazzas right boot
4 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

Yes,

 

But we have been all over the shop at times in games we have won, or placid as hell such as in the LC game against Alloa.

 

Fine for now, but this is another 3 - 5 year plan.  And we won't be winning this level of games when we step up.

 

 

Robbie managed more than fine last time on promotion, we've also beat hibs and drew with celtic over 120 minutes. 

 

With a few more additions I have no concerns about us next season. 

 

 

 

 

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Just now, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Robbie managed more than fine last time on promotion, we've also beat hibs and drew with celtic over 120 minutes. 

 

With a few more additions I have no concerns about us next season. 

 

 

 

 

Turning up being man far man a bit better players than Livingston, St. Mirren, Hamilton, St. Johnstone but not the same work ethic or focus has disaster written all over it.

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
5 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

Turning up being man far man a bit better players than Livingston, St. Mirren, Hamilton, St. Johnstone but not the same work ethic or focus has disaster written all over it.

 

 

 

Unsure why that's a thing atm. 

 

As I said, Robbie done fine on promotion last time so I'm confident we'll go forward. 

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Clark Griswold

Maybe the loss to Raith at the weekend was a wake up call for the players, I certainly hope it was and this performance last night isnt just a one off. We can't keep going 2 or 3 down before we react, we need to impose ourselves on the game from the off. We have lacked a ruthlessness recently in the last few seasons generally.

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25 minutes ago, DETTY29 said:

Turning up being man far man a bit better players than Livingston, St. Mirren, Hamilton, St. Johnstone but not the same work ethic or focus has disaster written all over it.

 

 

 

Unfortunately the arrogance of us fans has seeped into the dressing room where we seem to drop it down a level when playing these clubs. We are not good enough to do that and need to fight Livvy etc in the same way we do against hibs.

 

Had a wee check on London Hearts and our record against those 4 clubs over the last 6 league and cup games is: P 24, W 7, D 10, L 7

 

Also lost 5 of last 6 v Killie and won just 2 in 6 v Motherwell. Add those in and its P36 W10 D11 L15 Pts we are getting Bottom 6 points when playing supposedly weaker teams.

 

That's why we are where we are.

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45 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

Robbie managed more than fine last time on promotion, we've also beat hibs and drew with celtic over 120 minutes. 

 

With a few more additions I have no concerns about us next season. 

 

 

 

 

 

I've no doubt on paper we will have a top 4 team, however as we've seen that means nothing if the team plays within itself. 

 

 

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I posted on the highlights thread already, but I'll say it again here. Our boys don't do themselves justice because they only play like that when they've got a point to prove to people. Unfortunately, they don't feel like they've got to prove enough though.

 

The team look in good spirits together, and bond well, but I think a few bad apples in terms of attitude might just be enough to disrupt the whole squad at times. Walker being a prime example. Doesn't go out and play like he's got anything to prove. 

 

We are one of the most disliked clubs in Scotland, we've been absolutely shafted in the past year or so and in normal times, you'd have 20,000 people every week watching and wishing they were in your shoes. You should have a point to prove every ****ing week when you play for this club.

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4 minutes ago, Locky said:

I posted on the highlights thread already, but I'll say it again here. Our boys don't do themselves justice because they only play like that when they've got a point to prove to people. Unfortunately, they don't feel like they've got to prove enough though.

 

The team look in good spirits together, and bond well, but I think a few bad apples in terms of attitude might just be enough to disrupt the whole squad at times. Walker being a prime example. Doesn't go out and play like he's got anything to prove. 

 

We are one of the most disliked clubs in Scotland, we've been absolutely shafted in the past year or so and in normal times, you'd have 20,000 people every week watching and wishing they were in your shoes. You should have a point to prove every ****ing week when you play for this club.

 

Which is the mentality celtic manage to instil in their players (unbelievably, considering the advantages they have)

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1 minute ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Which is the mentality celtic manage to instil in their players (unbelievably, considering the advantages they have)

Fair play to them because it mostly works. That's what we need. We've totally lost our way over the past decade or so in terms of what we are as a club.

 

I look at Hibs and their fans after last weekend and think about the difference in them, and us. They seem happy to live in La La Land and act as if they're some sort of symbol of playing football the right way. They care more about looking good, than winning. They care more about a silky, long haired foreign winger who can do tricks, than a big, strong centre half who takes no shite.

 

Watching Hearts in my time, we're the opposite. We don't care about looking good. Besides, what have those ****s achieved by trying to look good? I don't care about shitebag ponces with a few tricks up their sleeve. Give me a big, shithouse ******* who wants to go out and ram the nut into anything to win.

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quockerwodgerjambo

The biggest issue is settling players in, getting them up to speed on fitness. Was always going to be difficult during covid restrictions, players dropping in and out of the side will be common over the next weeks. Shuffling the pack will have to do until everyone is up to a level of commitment that can be sustained during games. We still have a bulk of fixtures to play, these will be the games we see our team progress, February will be an indication of where we are as a unit. So many underlying issues regarding the long lay off last year, getting the right balance and a tune out of players takes a bit of time. Hearts are not one of the most hated clubs, most people i speak to feel we were hard done by. Playing in front of 50 fans is not a way to bring out the best in players, some of them need the atmosphere to play at top form. Making out they don't care etc is bullshit from the CL era, as far as i am aware we have players who feel proud to represent the club, they have to beat teams who play cup finals against us week in and out. You should go up to Riccarton and tell the players your thoughts, if you have the bottle.

 

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I get the impression that rather than work hard in the first hour like we did last time in the Championship when we would get an early lead then steamroller teams from 60-90, this time round we know that we are fitter so we are almost waiting for the goals to come in the last 30, but just fannying around, coasting for the first 60, and sometimes it is costing us...

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4 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

I get the impression that rather than work hard in the first hour like we did last time in the Championship when we would get an early lead then steamroller teams from 60-90, this time round we know that we are fitter so we are almost waiting for the goals to come in the last 30, but just fannying around, coasting for the first 60, and sometimes it is costing us...


Which I think comes from a philosophy based on possession and expecting the opposition to get tired chasing the ball and lose focus, allowing the gaps to open up. 
 

But our best results have come when we hit the opposition from the start like we are in a hurry. 

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4 hours ago, Captain Sausage said:

We struggle against teams that sit in. It’s the same as last season. 
 

When teams attack and leave space, we play lot better. Last night was much better in terms of pressing and closing down. We had enough chances to win 10-0. 
 

That needs to be the minimum standard. 

We may have just signed the solution to teams sitting in that you can’t break down. Just find Armand in the box and get to his second balls first. His making space and the jump for the 4th goal last night was a thing of beauty that defenders will find very hard to deal with if that’s what he does all the time.

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10 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:


Which I think comes from a philosophy based on possession and expecting the opposition to get tired chasing the ball and lose focus, allowing the gaps to open up. 
 

But our best results have come when we hit the opposition from the start like we are in a hurry. 

Yep, and trying to force mistakes from the opposition like last night is far better for the fans than simply making the opposition run around getting tired for an hour...

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41 minutes ago, Locky said:

I posted on the highlights thread already, but I'll say it again here. Our boys don't do themselves justice because they only play like that when they've got a point to prove to people. Unfortunately, they don't feel like they've got to prove enough though.

 

The team look in good spirits together, and bond well, but I think a few bad apples in terms of attitude might just be enough to disrupt the whole squad at times. Walker being a prime example. Doesn't go out and play like he's got anything to prove. 

 

We are one of the most disliked clubs in Scotland, we've been absolutely shafted in the past year or so and in normal times, you'd have 20,000 people every week watching and wishing they were in your shoes. You should have a point to prove every ****ing week when you play for this club.

Maybe the changes helped too. 

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quockerwodgerjambo

Jamie Walker is being mentioned, he could of had a couple last night if it wasn't for a certain cup winning goal keeper. As in a lot of games , goalies have been getting a finger tip to his shots.

Jamie has had this lazy tag around his neck since day one, not sure what else he can do but direct shots at the target. Sure he isn't great at being a helping hand, got a bad injury last season due to his lack of commitment though ( sarcasm ). That injury put him back, had to work on fitness all over again and get back into some type of form. We all know what happened next. I believe he will score a lot of goals this year for us, then all the other chat will die down.

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4 hours ago, Weakened Offender said:

The current coaching team inherited a squad of players that showed in the previous season or two that when they could be arsed, they were a match for most sides. They just couldn't be arsed much and ended up bottom of the league. 

 

It's still a problem but it'll be addressed by the time we're promoted. 

FFS give it a rest.  You need to try and move on.

The current coaching team have signed several players including a reliable goalie, a decent LB and 3 wingers, 2 of whom are not good enough to play and the other spends more time in the treament room than some of the physios.  The current coaching team are responsib;e for what happened against Alloa, Dundee, Dunfermline and Raith (last Saturday): no one else.  We have the players so why can't they be motivated to just go and do it.  Don't look to lay the blame elsewhere!

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19 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

FFS give it a rest.  You need to try and move on.

The current coaching team have signed several players including a reliable goalie, a decent LB and 3 wingers, 2 of whom are not good enough to play and the other spends more time in the treament room than some of the physios.  The current coaching team are responsib;e for what happened against Alloa, Dundee, Dunfermline and Raith (last Saturday): no one else.  We have the players so why can't they be motivated to just go and do it.  Don't look to lay the blame elsewhere!

 

You cannot continually lay all the blame at the coaches door. At some point the players must show some professionalism and pride and beat teams at this level by putting the hard work in. Last night they ran about like their next pay cheque depended on it, against Celtic the same, Hibs same so why not every game. Do you think Neilson et al tell them to swan about in games?

 

Its time to see some of these players for what they are. They have bags of talent yet most of them won't play at a higher level than Hearts because they don't have the baws to do it. Others who have played at a higher level are happy strolling about picking up their last decent wage. Unless of course it's a big game or they're a wee bit embarrassed by their last showing.

 

There is of course exceptions who must at times look at some these players and wonder why they're bothering bursting their arse.

 

We've had a number of managers, caretakers and coaches try to get a tune out of some of this lot and failed. Last night I watched Heart of Midlothian fc as I know it, **** knows what I've been watching the last few years. These players have had an easy ride recently while fans have focused on the managers but there's a common denominator through out this slump and they get away with it by turning up every so often.

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2 hours ago, quockerwodgerjambo said:

Jamie Walker is being mentioned, he could of had a couple last night if it wasn't for a certain cup winning goal keeper. As in a lot of games , goalies have been getting a finger tip to his shots.

Jamie has had this lazy tag around his neck since day one, not sure what else he can do but direct shots at the target. Sure he isn't great at being a helping hand, got a bad injury last season due to his lack of commitment though ( sarcasm ). That injury put him back, had to work on fitness all over again and get back into some type of form. We all know what happened next. I believe he will score a lot of goals this year for us, then all the other chat will die down.

Walker's problem is that his body language doesn't stand him well for when his form hits the skids. If he plays a 7 or 8 every week and scores 15 goals a season, no one cares. He comes across as casual.

 

If he plays shite most weeks, then he comes off as lazy and demotivated. Sadly, that's up to Jamie really. He needs to learn to look like he cares when the shit hits the fan.

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quockerwodgerjambo
13 minutes ago, Locky said:

Walker's problem is that his body language doesn't stand him well for when his form hits the skids. If he plays a 7 or 8 every week and scores 15 goals a season, no one cares. He comes across as casual.

 

If he plays shite most weeks, then he comes off as lazy and demotivated. Sadly, that's up to Jamie really. He needs to learn to look like he cares when the shit hits the fan.

Any idea how hard it was for him to get over his last injury mate ? Round and round in circles, he isn't the only player that is looking to find top form.

It i all down to the long lay off and the lack of fans atmosphere all that type background, i see a player who has had pot shots chances facing goalies who are having worldies game after game.

Any of them go in, then it will be two a game ratio. His attitude may look casual, i doubt it though. Always easier to watch someone apply themself than do it yourself.

So many factors effect all players right now, one of the main ones is the long lay off last year.

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Weakened Offender
2 hours ago, JamboAl said:

FFS give it a rest.  You need to try and move on.

The current coaching team have signed several players including a reliable goalie, a decent LB and 3 wingers, 2 of whom are not good enough to play and the other spends more time in the treament room than some of the physios.  The current coaching team are responsib;e for what happened against Alloa, Dundee, Dunfermline and Raith (last Saturday): no one else.  We have the players so why can't they be motivated to just go and do it.  Don't look to lay the blame elsewhere!

 

You give it a rest, you slavering pap. 

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4 hours ago, Locky said:

Fair play to them because it mostly works. That's what we need. We've totally lost our way over the past decade or so in terms of what we are as a club.

 

I look at Hibs and their fans after last weekend and think about the difference in them, and us. They seem happy to live in La La Land and act as if they're some sort of symbol of playing football the right way. They care more about looking good, than winning. They care more about a silky, long haired foreign winger who can do tricks, than a big, strong centre half who takes no shite.

 

Watching Hearts in my time, we're the opposite. We don't care about looking good. Besides, what have those ****s achieved by trying to look good? I don't care about shitebag ponces with a few tricks up their sleeve. Give me a big, shithouse ******* who wants to go out and ram the nut into anything to win.

Great post. 
It’s only players want to do everything on that park to win that we want at Hearts. Sometimes I look at the players and think they are not trying 100%. That should never even cross our minds when we watch them. 
Robbie said himself after last nights game it’s the first in a long time where we were at it from the start. Why the **** is that being allowed to happen!!!! 
Hopefully the penny has finally dropped and we see the same attitude on Saturday as last night. 

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