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Budgement day 2

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Voiceofreasonfortheseason
51 minutes ago, busby1985 said:

The more I’ve thought about this the more I feel we need a total clear out of Levein. If Budge releases a statement today saying that Levein will go back to DoF and MacPhee or Daly will take temp charge, I don’t think that will change anything. We need a full new identity and direction. We have too many players and too many coaches not pulling their weight. Need a change of philosophy that will only come with a new management team. 

 

I don't think we will get a statement today but I reckon tomorrow we will. 

I agree with you, bet you any money though there will be idiots on here saying Austin should be the job due his "connections"

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1874robbo

Levein upstairs again?then the inevitable note passing would start again and rumours of Levein bursting in to dressing rooms at half time etc.

not for me!! It needs to be emptying him from the whole club.

a fresh start in our coaching.

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Austin MacGlee

I am so fed up I can barely bring myself to care anymore. Haven't even had the urge to post on here until now. The games have sucked the life out of me.

I want him gone but I have big concerns about Budge's capability in appointing someone else...she has leaned on and relied on Craig for her entire tenure so far. Who else at the club will be able to support her in the recruitment process?

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busby1985
51 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

Apart from doing the club a favour and leaving he would do himself a lot of good considering his health issues he has had to deal with.

Agree. 

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GorgieFifeLife

He will be sacked today. I think Budge knows things have turned and the poison towards him will only get worse. Gone by lunchtime.

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The Old Tolbooth
32 minutes ago, eyes open said:

For those who are advocating Robbie Nielsen for the job ,You would do well to remember his record is not quite startling after we were promoted , 5 wins in 25 Games , knocked out of europe by a bunch of taxi drivers (nothing against taxi drivers ) and the hibs game when we managed to draw from a winning position , He is not the answer , Did well to get promotion granted but we need to think big .

We are the 3rd biggest club in Scotland , With a great support and potential , we need to head hunt a top manager and pay whatever it takes to turn this round .. 

 

Completely agree with that, if we're going to go for a new manager, then let's go for a bigger name than the likes of Neilson, Daly, McPhee, or a whole host of other irrelevant managers who do the merry go round in Scotland, there's plenty high profile managers out of a job just now and we'll never know unless we make enquires. 

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Maroon Sailor

Says he can fix it

 

It's been broken since October last year

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neilnunb

Not sure why giving him to the quarterfinal will change things. Even if we were to win against Motherwell, Hibs and Aberdeen it would only stop the discontent until the next couple of defeats.

 

Once you've lost the support there is no coming back. It was one of the reasons Cathro had to go.  It is only people's sentiment for Levein that is dragging this out.

 

We need change.

 

 

 

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Tynecastlesmychurch
2 hours ago, copa-mundial said:

If he isn't gone either today, or tomorrow. He will be in the dug out for the Motherwell game. 

My opinion of course. 

I think your spot on. My guess is that he ain't going anywhere. Not for a couple of months anyway.

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Maroon Sailor

Ann is not ruthless enough to sack someone she has a good working relationship with and who was her main man to help her get the football side sorted out. Kind of you don't shit on your oppo type of thing.

 

Levein could make things easier for everybody in that boardroom though instead of this constant I can fix it rhetoric.

 

The team is rudderless and toothless

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Tynecastlesmychurch
12 minutes ago, GorgieFifeLife said:

He will be sacked today. I think Budge knows things have turned and the poison towards him will only get worse. Gone by lunchtime.

Source? Or just a hunch? 

Because as much as I hope your right. I fear he's still got a good bit more time  left in the job.

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We_are_the_Hearts
3 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said:

Ann is not ruthless enough to sack someone she has a good working relationship with and who was her main man to help her get the football side sorted out. Kind of you don't shit on your oppo type of thing.

 

Levein could make things easier for everybody in that boardroom though instead of this constant I can fix it rhetoric.

 

The team is rudderless and toothless

Where's he going to get his money for the GGs though?

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Brian Fantana
1 hour ago, Elshin said:

Budgement day should have been renamed a while ago.  Clearly that day was all levein.

 

Budge has to act now though, fans have been as patient as possible but its looks like of we dont beat well fans will be gathered outside.

 

Leta hope she does the right thing and then fans can start appreciating and getting behind  her for all the good things happening at our club.  

 

This, 100%. I was making the same point to someone in twitter yesterday. It wasn't Budgement Day. It was Rise of the Leveins 

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Jambof3tornado
36 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

Levein upstairs again?then the inevitable note passing would start again and rumours of Levein bursting in to dressing rooms at half time etc.

not for me!! It needs to be emptying him from the whole club.

a fresh start in our coaching.

Would you not accept Levein in a role as director of academy? 

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GorgieFifeLife
12 minutes ago, Tynecastlesmychurch said:

Source? Or just a hunch? 

Because as much as I hope your right. I fear he's still got a good bit more time  left in the job.

It's a hunch.  Budge is a shrewd businesswoman and she knows when you lose your customers confidence theres no way back.  It would be staggering if he wasnt removed from his post.  It would also destroy the confidence the fans have in her and lead to her coming under as much pressure as Levein.

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1874robbo
1 minute ago, Jambof3tornado said:

Would you not accept Levein in a role as director of academy? 

With no input whatsoever in to first team affairs yes I would but tbh the present man in charge is doing a decent enough job so why punt him?

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Jambof3tornado
15 minutes ago, Tynecastlesmychurch said:

Source? Or just a hunch? 

Because as much as I hope your right. I fear he's still got a good bit more time  left in the job.

Think its going to take a proper protest on the plaza for Ann to open her eyes.

 

The grumblings in the ground will get worse but will reflect the game on the day. If he pulls out a perfornance against motherwell he'll get some dafties back onside!

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Jambof3tornado
Just now, 1874robbo said:

With no input whatsoever in to first team affairs yes I would but tbh the present man in charge is doing a decent enough job so why punt him?

Good point well presented. I think CL is doing good work away from the 1st team to still have a role to play but the more he digs his heels in the more I want to severe all ties with him.

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GorgieRules22

I think we all know that nothing will happen. If you’ve ever worked with family or a mate your not going to sack them, your hoping they hold their hands up and go on their on will........not a chance of that happening.

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1874robbo
Just now, Jambof3tornado said:

Good point well presented. I think CL is doing good work away from the 1st team to still have a role to play but the more he digs his heels in the more I want to severe all ties with him.

I always liked him as a player and as a manager previously but his time in the hot seat since cathro has been imo very poor with the odd decent result chucked in.

I don’t enjoy going to the football anymore!

i was adamant I wasn’t buying a season ticket this year but went against my better judgement and renewed!! Really wish I’d listened to myself.

 

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It should have been ten
3 hours ago, i8hibsh said:

 

Wont be difficult. She produces more statements than RBS.

 

Pot and kettle coming from you 🤤

 

2 hours ago, Jambo_Gaz said:

Time to :bolt: Mr Levein. 

 

Thanks for everything but go before you're hated by the fans. 

 

Chronic, clearly weren’t around when he spent his playing career with us.

 

 “Hated” wow...just wow 🤦🏻‍♂️

 

 

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It should have been ten
2 hours ago, Gashauskis9 said:

I’m feeling it a lot, but I will never ever use the word hate and Craig Levein in the same breath.  I’m bewildered by him, but could never hate a man who devoted his career to us as a player (often playing through the pain barrier) and has been instrumental in securing the long term future of this club (look at the quality coming through the various age groups and the quality of player we can sign now).  I just wish he managed the first team in the same way he played.

 

I’ve calmed down over the weekend and decided I’ll give him the Motherwell game.  Amazing what watching old Hearts clips can do to the soul.  Also increased my FOH subs to counter at least one eejit who cancelled theirs.

 

Nice one, good post. 

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Iamborg

Budge bought into the long term project from Levein . In the latter stages of last season he was offered a 2 year extension ,

With the player recruitment recently she will be giving him a lot longer than a few games into  this season .

 

I wanted him gone with the Cathro fiasco as he's treating us as Craig Leiven FC .

 

 

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eyes open
2 minutes ago, Iamborg said:

Budge bought into the long term project from Levein . In the latter stages of last season he was offered a 2 year extension ,

With the player recruitment recently she will be giving him a lot longer than a few games into  this season .

 

I wanted him gone with the Cathro fiasco as he's treating us as Craig Leiven FC .

 

 

 

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suds66
57 minutes ago, GorgieFifeLife said:

He will be sacked today. I think Budge knows things have turned and the poison towards him will only get worse. Gone by lunchtime.

Can you categorically guarantee this will happen today!!

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Whatever
1 hour ago, GorgieFifeLife said:

He will be sacked today. I think Budge knows things have turned and the poison towards him will only get worse. Gone by lunchtime.

 

Nah.

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OmiyaHearts

I think Levein is here for the season, no matter what happens.

 

If he wasn't punted after that run of form last season, why would this season be any different?

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Rudy T
58 minutes ago, We_are_the_Hearts said:

Where's he going to get his money for the GGs though?

 

His 100k a year director salary would be my guess!

Edited by Rudy T

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Coco
41 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

With no input whatsoever in to first team affairs yes I would but tbh the present man in charge is doing a decent enough job so why punt him?

The Academy Director is just one of many people given jobs by Levein with no track record of performance in their job.  He looks to have spent most of his career as a Council sports coordinator and coaching children at Hearts.  Is this the person to bring through elite footballers?

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Rudy T
3 minutes ago, OmiyaHearts said:

I think Levein is here for the season, no matter what happens.

 

If he wasn't punted after that run of form last season, why would this season be any different?

 

The cup runs saved him last season, given we played butchers and bakers until the final he’s not getting that luck this season.

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Rudy T
1 minute ago, Coco said:

The Academy Director is just one of many people given jobs by Levein with no track record of performance in their job.  He looks to have spent most of his career as a Council sports coordinator and coaching children at Hearts.  Is this the person to bring through elite footballers?

 

I think that depends on what his actual role is? Does he has much to do with the actual players or is it more an ops role??

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i8hibsh

The term 'Budgement day' is a cringe likes.

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eyes open

The likelihood is that it's just another day at Tynecastle , it's been a mess for 3 seasons nothing's changed , 

Maybe the Captain will get his knuckles rapped for having the audacity to tell the truth. 

But Levein will just roll on .. 

I think that's the sad truth . 

Now over in the west the ugly sisters would have been outraged and rioting in the street if their lot had anything like the record we have. They don't accept failure or second best. I don't want us to be like them but it,s high time we raised the bar as well.

I think our clubs mentality is that it will all work out in the end ,Reality is it's broken and needs ripped up and a news strategy implemented.

Top manager in and I mean top drawer, Levein removed entirely as his presence would be toxic to any new manager. 

Will it happen ,we can but wish ...

Edited by eyes open
spell

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Bauld

Great managers have came from stranger places.

 

If Daly or another currently at the club have the ability to motivate the players, get them playing for the badge, the fans and the manager, then they are probably as right for the job as anybody.

 

You certainly can't use a managers playing career as gauge because that has been proven largely irrelevant to how they are as a manager.

 

If we are going to act it has to be now. The deeper into the season we get the harder the transition is going to be. 

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DarioHMFC

There will be no managerial changes today when it’s transfer deadline day, the next fees days could be a different story. 

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The Frenchman Returns

I believe Ann will wait until after the Aberdeen game. I think she will be wrong if she does but that’s my gut feel.

 

If he goes then he has to 100% go

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A_A wehatethehibs
1 hour ago, sadj said:

People wanting Neilson are for the most part people who rely on stats in arguments 😉 naaa in all seriousness if you do look at the stats Robbie without the Championship Season is only a couple of percentage points above CL. RN’s football the last few months was not great to watch. Its boom or bust with it. Maybe he has learned a bit since then but I think its a backward step. 

 

47% (prem only) to 33% wins is a "couple of percentage points" ? That is a chasm. 

 

Say what you want about Neilson, go brexiteer style and ignore the stats (ie the results/facts) if you want,  his Hearts team were professional, super fit, and they won the bread and butter games (eg. Ross County, Hamilton). That's something we've not been anywhere close to since he left.

 

Irrespective of that, I don't think there's fans clamouring for a Neilson return. Just a suggestion based on the fact that we already know Ann Budge trusts him and thinks highly of him, so therefore Neilson back in & Levein back upstairs is definitely a realistic shout. More realistic than joke shouts of Neil McCann or Paulo Sergio, appointments which have absolutely no chance of happening in the current circumstance. I've even heard Jim Jeffries name thrown out there :lol: 

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theshed
8 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

I believe Ann will wait until after the Aberdeen game. I think she will be wrong if she does but that’s my gut feel.

 

If he goes then he has to 100% go

 

You could be right but if we get beat from Motherwell then the worst Hibs team in a long time then no way can he be in charge against Aberdeen

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sadj
1 minute ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

47% (prem only) to 33% wins is a "couple of percentage points" ? That is a chasm. 

 

Say what you want about Neilson, go brexiteer style and ignore the stats (ie the results/facts) if you want,  his Hearts team were professional, super fit, and they won the bread and butter games (eg. Ross County, Hamilton). That's something we've not been anywhere close to since he left.

 

Irrespective of that, I don't think there's fans clamouring for a Neilson return. Just a suggestion based on the fact that we already know Ann Budge trusts him and thinks highly of him, so therefore Neilson back in & Levein back upstairs is definitely a realistic shout. More realistic than joke shouts of Neil McCann or Paulo Sergio, appointments which have absolutely no chance of happening in the current circumstance. I've even heard Jim Jeffries name thrown out there :lol: 

 

I only took out championship games. Stats are useable any way you choose that was my point. Indeed get JJ in from the same posters who say get Levein out he’s yesterdays man hes not managed in x years. McCann i don’t know. Part of me thinks he could do ok with the better players but Dundee’s budget was comfortably 6th and his signings were on the whole awful. I don’t think it should be anyone with club links outside of giving AM a shot. Kirk and Rankin will hopefully work their way up Fox and Daly cab gtf

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Sir Gio
1 hour ago, neilnunb said:

Not sure why giving him to the quarterfinal will change things. Even if we were to win against Motherwell, Hibs and Aberdeen it would only stop the discontent until the next couple of defeats.

 

Once you've lost the support there is no coming back. It was one of the reasons Cathro had to go.  It is only people's sentiment for Levein that is dragging this out.

 

We need change.

 

 

 

It was Sir Alex, he had lost the support, but he definitely won them back.

 

In any case he doesn't need the support, if he has the players. If we are winning and you cut your nose off to spite your face because we are winning with Levein, well I don't know, not rational.

 

Desperate to see us win these next matches, hopefully the players are too, if they aren't he will fall.

 

My personal belief, he puts far too much faith in the backroom and the promote from within theory. I believe its been noted by his senior pro's.

 

If I was him I would be getting in a room, Naismith, Berra and Whelan, with a view to rousing the lot of them into action. I would not be off that training pitch for 2 weeks, unfortunately for him, Whelan and Naismith wont be back until a week tomorrow.

 

We need change. Easy words, but change is not always good and it should be noted that the majority of teams who do change through a season are no better off than they were before.

 

Stoke City and Nottingham Forest actually declined last season, so there are no guarantees here.

 

I am absolutely concerned, if I was Ann Budge today, I wouldn't be firing him, but I would be making it perfectly clear, I have to think of an emergency strategy in the event things do not pick up dramatically.

 

I would be asking him what would he do in my position, flip it. Levein of course did not want Cathro fired, it was Budge who over ruled.

 

Motherwell was very good and the vast majority of the first hour on Saturday was very good, but then I am unhappy we have gone through July and August and drawn now with 4 teams who should have been defeated, 3 of which at home.

 

I have a strong view, October 5 is the date, that gives this side ample time to have gelled, it also gives the board ample time to materialise a Plan B as to how we move forwards.

 

Upon Cathros sacking there wasn't one, hence why we now have a DoF who manages the team, which was always trouble as soon as results fell off a cliff.

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Rudy T
6 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said:

 

47% (prem only) to 33% wins is a "couple of percentage points" ? That is a chasm. 

 

Say what you want about Neilson, go brexiteer style and ignore the stats (ie the results/facts) if you want,  his Hearts team were professional, super fit, and they won the bread and butter games (eg. Ross County, Hamilton). That's something we've not been anywhere close to since he left.

 

Irrespective of that, I don't think there's fans clamouring for a Neilson return. Just a suggestion based on the fact that we already know Ann Budge trusts him and thinks highly of him, so therefore Neilson back in & Levein back upstairs is definitely a realistic shout. More realistic than joke shouts of Neil McCann or Paulo Sergio, appointments which have absolutely no chance of happening in the current circumstance. I've even heard Jim Jeffries name thrown out there :lol: 

 

I would take Neilson in a heart beat! Look at the squad now to what he had when he had us 2nd in the league... he’d have that team flying. His Utd team are hardly boring!

 

Problem is we have far too many who still get upset about losing to Hibs, well I’m sure he’s learned that lesson! Again we also have fans who’ll say he’s just Leveins man and roll out the boring football mantra.

 

We need someone to come in and united the fans get Tynecastle buzzing again... I’ve no idea who that is mind you!

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Smith's right boot
3 hours ago, Jambo_Gaz said:

Time to :bolt: Mr Levein. 

 

Thanks for everything but go before you're hated by the fans. 

 

 

If you hate Levein you're a *****. 

 

 

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Last Laff

Levein won’t be going anywhere any time soon.  Crazy talk to think he’s going to get sacked or ask to stand down as manager after all the summer recruitment. 

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Smith's right boot
5 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

It was Sir Alex, he had lost the support, but he definitely won them back.

 

In any case he doesn't need the support, if he has the players. If we are winning and you cut your nose off to spite your face because we are winning with Levein, well I don't know, not rational.

 

Desperate to see us win these next matches, hopefully the players are too, if they aren't he will fall.

 

My personal belief, he puts far too much faith in the backroom and the promote from within theory. I believe its been noted by his senior pro's.

 

If I was him I would be getting in a room, Naismith, Berra and Whelan, with a view to rousing the lot of them into action. I would not be off that training pitch for 2 weeks, unfortunately for him, Whelan and Naismith wont be back until a week tomorrow.

 

We need change. Easy words, but change is not always good and it should be noted that the majority of teams who do change through a season are no better off than they were before.

 

Stoke City and Nottingham Forest actually declined last season, so there are no guarantees here.

 

I am absolutely concerned, if I was Ann Budge today, I wouldn't be firing him, but I would be making it perfectly clear, I have to think of an emergency strategy in the event things do not pick up dramatically.

 

I would be asking him what would he do in my position, flip it. Levein of course did not want Cathro fired, it was Budge who over ruled.

 

Motherwell was very good and the vast majority of the first hour on Saturday was very good, but then I am unhappy we have gone through July and August and drawn now with 4 teams who should have been defeated, 3 of which at home.

 

I have a strong view, October 5 is the date, that gives this side ample time to have gelled, it also gives the board ample time to materialise a Plan B as to how we move forwards.

 

Upon Cathros sacking there wasn't one, hence why we now have a DoF who manages the team, which was always trouble as soon as results fell off a cliff.

 

 

Good Post and I agree. 

 

Reference the last part I don't think anyone thought Peterhead would beat us, failing in the lc stage forced the move that they thought wouldn't be needed until at least the first quarter of games. 

 

This change, if any like you say has to be planned. 

 

Many folk don't care what happens next, just want to see an action, understandable but very short sighted and unlikely to move us forward. 

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mitch41
4 hours ago, sandylejambo said:

I'm Hoping for a temp manager from the lists that have did the rounds on here to see the season till Christmas to gauge how things are, because we need a motivator now and it has to be someone who knows the place.

your talking about Jon Daly            no thanks.

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Boab

I think a lot of fans gave Saturday as the day that things had to turn. It was a game we just had to win to steady the ship going into the break.

We failed. Again.

How many more must win days does there have to be ?

The game’s up, frankly, and Saturday should have been the last straw. 

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martoon

There's bound to have been dialogue since Saturday but not about what's good for HMFC. More likely they'll be desperately inventing a way for Levein to remain in control. 

 

Preference 1: No change and hope that the international break, therefore no damaging game, does the trick.

 

Pref 2: Levein back upstairs with one of his boot room Peps as head coach.

 

Pref 3: Levein remains head coach but with a crowd pleasing 2nd in command appointed from out with.

 

None of the above is acceptable to me but Levein's reach within the club is so widespread that anything else is unlikely, imo. 

 

Very depressing. 

 

 

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Locky

If Hibs lose at Killie, Heckingbottom will be punted and caretaker/new manager will rally the troops and gub us.

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shaun.lawson
2 hours ago, sadj said:

People wanting Neilson are for the most part people who rely on stats in arguments 😉

 

You called?

 

Quote

naaa in all seriousness if you do look at the stats Robbie without the Championship Season is only a couple of percentage points above CL. 

 

:vrface:

 

Robbie Neilson (Prem only) P 53 W 25 D 16 L 12 F 88 A 57 Pts 91 Win% 47 Pts/game 1.72

 

Craig Levein P 76 W 26 D 20 L 30 F 83 A 91 Pts 98 Win% 34 Pts/game 1.29

 

It's all very well you considering yourself the voice of reason all the time. But not when it's the voice of complete unreason, as is the case here.

Edited by shaun.lawson

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Robbo-Jambo
46 minutes ago, eyes open said:

The likelihood is that it's just another day at Tynecastle , it's been a mess for 3 seasons nothing's changed , 

Maybe the Captain will get his knuckles rapped for having the audacity to tell the truth. 

But Levein will just roll on .. 

I think that's the sad truth . 

Now over in the west the ugly sisters would have been outraged and rioting in the street if their lot had anything like the record we have. They don't accept failure or second best. I don't want us to be like them but it,s high time we raised the bar as well.

I think our clubs mentality is that it will all work out in the end ,Reality is it's broken and needs ripped up and a news strategy implemented.

Top manager in and I mean top drawer, Levein removed entirely as his presence would be toxic to any new manager. 

Will it happen ,we can but wish ...

What did Berra say? 

 

Must have missed that. 

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