Gullane Sand Dunes.....!

[Mikey1874]

Gullane is on

 

https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/article/boys-buzzing-to-be-back

[Mikey1874]

More from first day back

 

https://www.edinburghlive.co.uk/sport/football/ryan-edwards-embracing-punishing-hearts-16468027

[Naisysback]

On 16/06/2019 at 15:51, busby1985 said:

Footballs moved on, the sides you are talking about played 20 years ago, even longer with jock Wallace. The games quicker, the pitches harder, faster, the impact on the body greater than its ever been, even at SPFL level. I’d be shocked to see us return to the dunes after the injuries we had last season. 

100% agree. Get the balls out on day 1, do all the running with balls at your feet.

 

This thing with Jock Wallace was when players came back 2 stone overweight after eating\drinking for 6 weeks,  players now are athletes.

 

If you are going to run a mile, why not run the mile with a ball, doing drills, practicing with the ball. A piano player doesnt get better doing hand exercises, gets better by practice.

 

Use this time to try and find a style of play that involves the ball and the nice new pitch being in contact for long periods of time. Use the time to teach Uche to pass a ball. Academy producing footballers, not boys who play football but real talented footballers, give them a platform to play or they will walk. 

 

 

[Mikey1874]

Some people ignoring the need for fitness.

 

Is it latching on to any negativity ("Levein out") or actual analysis.

 

Certainly after Ian Cathro did what people are asking for players later said they weren't fit enough. 

 

Players including Michael Smith interviewed yesterday have already said this is really important time to build fitness. 

 

[BelgeJambo]

On 16/06/2019 at 01:15, Kiwidoug said:

Went to see Hearts there once when we were young and fit.  After they had finished we tried it.  Roasting hot day.  Utter torture.  Just couldn't do it.

Where the Germans dug in?

[portobellojambo1]

3 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Some people ignoring the need for fitness.

 

Is it latching on to any negativity ("Levein out") or actual analysis.

 

Certainly after Ian Cathro did what people are asking for players later said they weren't fit enough. 

 

Players including Michael Smith interviewed yesterday have already said this is really important time to build fitness. 

 

 

The part of the season we looked best in last season was strangely enough the first few weeks of the season, i.e. the period during which the players probably got most benefit from all the hard work done down at Gullane. For some to say the reason we were so poor last season was because we took the players to Gullane is fecking bonkers.

[Mikey1874]

6 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

 

The part of the season we looked best in last season was strangely enough the first few weeks of the season, i.e. the period during which the players probably got most benefit from all the hard work done down at Gullane. For some to say the reason we were so poor last season was because we took the players to Gullane is fecking bonkers.

 

The one thing I find interesting is they only seem to do around 10 days of really intense work which doesn't seem enough. Maybe for already fit sportsmen it is. 

 

But it's probably quite a tailored approach with all the sports science. 

[busby1985]

14 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Some people ignoring the need for fitness.

 

Is it latching on to any negativity ("Levein out") or actual analysis.

 

Certainly after Ian Cathro did what people are asking for players later said they weren't fit enough. 

 

Players including Michael Smith interviewed yesterday have already said this is really important time to build fitness. 

 

We can do fitness work that doesn’t require running up and down sand dunes. If that was the only way to get players fit, everyone would do it. My whole point was that I’d prefer us to avoid the sand, stay on grass and work on fitness a modern way. We looked ridiculously unfit last season and the injuries everyone all ready knows about. Something somewhere behind the scenes last year with fitness was severely lacking, that was my point. Robbie Neilson has the players doing triple sessions, we’ve never looked as fit as under Robbie. That is gone now. Back to the old fashioned Wednesday off, day after a match off etc etc. I hope we see a different approach this pre season. 

[Mikey1874]

1 minute ago, busby1985 said:

We can do fitness work that doesn’t require running up and down sand dunes. If that was the only way to get players fit, everyone would do it. My whole point was that I’d prefer us to avoid the sand, stay on grass and work on fitness a modern way. We looked ridiculously unfit last season and the injuries everyone all ready knows about. Something somewhere behind the scenes last year with fitness was severely lacking, that was my point. Robbie Neilson has the players doing triple sessions, we’ve never looked as fit as under Robbie. That is gone now. Back to the old fashioned Wednesday off, day after a match off etc etc. I hope we see a different approach this pre season. 

 

Don't agree we looked unfit

 

What makes you say that? 

[glynnlondon]

Maybe we should make our recruitment team do it.

We could sell tickets

 

[busby1985]

3 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Don't agree we looked unfit

 

What makes you say that? 

We ran out of legs in loads of matches, think the stats back that up with us barely scoring late on in games etc although that is also down to the fact that we barely scored any goals anyway. Unfit players usually pick up muscle injuries mainly, we’ve had loads. To balance, we’ve also had loads of impact injuries so that’s a hard one to prove either way. 

 

Id just prefer us to stay away from such a “gruelling” approach. Plenty facilities at Riccarton to utilise for fitness and plenty that can involve the ball. 

[jambo_No5]

Doesn't matter what the club do these days people on here will look to criticise them for any reason at all. You just have to look at every thread on this board, they all end up with the same tone and sounding the same 

Edited June 22, 2019 by jambo_No5

[Mikey1874]

1 minute ago, glynnlondon said:

Maybe we should make our recruitment team do it.

We could sell tickets

 

 

The fans would be better

 

The 'Levein out' crowd I'd pay to see 

[Mikey1874]

1 minute ago, busby1985 said:

We ran out of legs in loads of matches, think the stats back that up with us barely scoring late on in games etc although that is also down to the fact that we barely scored any goals anyway. Unfit players usually pick up muscle injuries mainly, we’ve had loads. To balance, we’ve also had loads of impact injuries so that’s a hard one to prove either way. 

 

Id just prefer us to stay away from such a “gruelling” approach. Plenty facilities at Riccarton to utilise for fitness and plenty that can involve the ball. 

 

Just going to Gullane for a day at most.

 

All the other stuff is getting done.

 

You'll cheer up with better results. 

[busby1985]

9 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Just going to Gullane for a day at most.

 

All the other stuff is getting done.

 

You'll cheer up with better results. 

Everyone will cheer up with better results. At the end of the day, although we all disagree and argue etc we all want the same thing, hearts to be successful. Footballs all about 90 minute football analysts, kickback is no different haha. 

[Notts1874]

People getting bent all out of shape to have a go.

 

Utterly bizarre behaviour.

[portobellojambo1]

28 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

The one thing I find interesting is they only seem to do around 10 days of really intense work which doesn't seem enough. Maybe for already fit sportsmen it is. 

 

But it's probably quite a tailored approach with all the sports science. 

 

I think your 2nd sentence possibly sums it up. I'm guessing that in years gone by players were possibly more inclined to change their lifestyles/habits during the close season and needed a really hard pre season to get them back into shape. I think most players these days (Vanecek possibly being an exception) understand more that they have to look after themselves much better and the pre season then becomes a little less intense.

[Brick Tamland]

Gullane sand dunes are not an archaic way to get fit. 

I played pro football in this country for 11 years and was extremely fit - I was the guy nobody wanted to do pre-season with ?. 

I loved the dunes as I could fly up and down them and the fitness levels achieved were excellent. I did however see many of my team mates throw up and look utterly destroyed after it. But the overwhelming opinion was that it was by far the best way to get your core fitness back. You cannot build core fitness by doing drills with the ball. To suggest Klopp and Guardiola don’t do the dunes is ridiculous as they will have their equivalents. Every pro player will take a beasting at preseason training without a ball, with no exceptions.  Be it the dunes or the beep test or other techniques.  

A player who hasn’t done preseason will not have the core fitness levels of those who have. 

I talk about core fitness level as it is that what gets you through the last 10/15 minutes of a game. If you have that high core level then the drills with the ball are slicker and your touch and confidence improves and it also gives you a certain element of mental edge - you look at the guy your up against and know that in those last 10/15 minutes you’ll win that personal battle with him. 

So in my opinion the dunes, or the equivalent beasting, at preseason is absolutely essential to build up core fitness and is not archaic. 

Working with the ball and drills with the ball will improve dramatically once that core fitness is built up. 

That article in the EEN has Michael Smith and Berra say how important it is, I’d like to think that the opinion of 2 international footballers is more relevant than some of the slavers that are on here.

[Ally Alexander]

1 hour ago, busby1985 said:

We ran out of legs in loads of matches, think the stats back that up with us barely scoring late on in games etc although that is also down to the fact that we barely scored any goals anyway. Unfit players usually pick up muscle injuries mainly, we’ve had loads. To balance, we’ve also had loads of impact injuries so that’s a hard one to prove either way. 

 

Id just prefer us to stay away from such a “gruelling” approach. Plenty facilities at Riccarton to utilise for fitness and plenty that can involve the ball. 

 

[Ally Alexander]

Actually over training is likely to cause more injuries.  Also tired muscles slows a player.  There's s a fine balance between optimum and too much training.

 

[Bazzas right boot]

2 hours ago, Naisysback said:

100% agree. Get the balls out on day 1, do all the running with balls at your feet.

 

This thing with Jock Wallace was when players came back 2 stone overweight after eating\drinking for 6 weeks,  players now are athletes.

 

If you are going to run a mile, why not run the mile with a ball, doing drills, practicing with the ball. A piano player doesnt get better doing hand exercises, gets better by practice.

 

Use this time to try and find a style of play that involves the ball and the nice new pitch being in contact for long periods of time. Use the time to teach Uche to pass a ball. Academy producing footballers, not boys who play football but real talented footballers, give them a platform to play or they will walk. 

 

 

 

 

Piano players will do exercises for thier hands separate from playing the piano. 

 

Fitness is a  massive part of any sport. 

 

Fitness in many sports from tennis to boxing, football and rugby requires a lot of work outwith the actual sport for stamina, pace, strength and fitness. 

 

It's normal to mix techniques. 

 

Also, in football most of the running is of the ball. 

 

 

[tokyowalnut]

2 hours ago, busby1985 said:

We ran out of legs in loads of matches, think the stats back that up with us barely scoring late on in games etc although that is also down to the fact that we barely scored any goals anyway. Unfit players usually pick up muscle injuries mainly, we’ve had loads. To balance, we’ve also had loads of impact injuries so that’s a hard one to prove either way. 

 

Id just prefer us to stay away from such a “gruelling” approach. Plenty facilities at Riccarton to utilise for fitness and plenty that can involve the ball. 

Pre season is all about 'grueling' sessions though. This is when players have to be pushed to the absolute limit for their fitness. You can't do that during the season between games. Very much doubt a ball will be touched in first couple of weeks.

 

The injuries have been scrutinised on here, they can't all be lumped together and blamed on fitness.

[Notts1874]

21 minutes ago, jonnothejambo said:

 

End the thread. Nailed it !

Not quite. I want to know who he played for. Then we can end the thread.

[i wish jj was my dad]

3 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Just going to Gullane for a day at most.

 

All the other stuff is getting done.

 

You'll cheer up with better results. 

I very much doubt the last sentence.

[TyphoonJambo]

29 minutes ago, Notts1874 said:

Not quite. I want to know who he played for. Then we can end the thread.

Agreed 100%. Good post but now im hanging on a thread, who do we have on our site, a mystery ex Pro? C'mom Mr Tamland, spill the beans.

[Brick Tamland]

1 hour ago, Notts1874 said:

Not quite. I want to know who he played for. Then we can end the thread.

Was due to sign for the famous in June ‘81 by Bobby Moncur who had previously signed Mackay, Bowman and Robbo all of whom I played with at various teams but he got sacked 2 days before I was due to sign and it never materialised so I was as you can imagine a bit gutted.

Dundee Utd wanted to sign me the year before after the maximum 3 “trialist”  games you could play at that time and Walter Smith was keen but I didn’t like Jim McLean and didn’t fancy the travelling either.  

Jimmy McManus, the hobo scout at the time, talked me into the 3 ‘trialist’ games (it felt wrong just wearing the top never mind being in the home changing room?) and Bertie Auld wanted me to sign for the shite, but that was never going to happen. 

Outwith those above, I went on to play first team games for 9 clubs in Scotland, 6 of which I signed for. 

Hopefully that’s enough info and I can remain as Brick Tamland ??

[Mr Elwood P]

Actually read everything there is to read now. We were unfit and everybody was injured from late October, because we had a day of training on the Gullane Dunes in June? We were unstoppable from July - October but that wasn’t anything to do with the core fitness establishments in pre-season. One day of old school fitness means the entire Hearts set up is archaic. Folk need to log off and go for a beer or speak to somebody face to face. 

[jambonian]

Alex MacDonald always took the players there pre-season and they (mostly) stayed fit throughout the season, and a lot were in their early and mid 30s. Todays wimps...oops, I mean footballers, can't cope with it in their early-mid 20s.

[Jammy T]

8 hours ago, Naisysback said:

100% agree. Get the balls out on day 1, do all the running with balls at your feet.

 

This thing with Jock Wallace was when players came back 2 stone overweight after eating\drinking for 6 weeks,  players now are athletes.

 

If you are going to run a mile, why not run the mile with a ball, doing drills, practicing with the ball. A piano player doesnt get better doing hand exercises, gets better by practice.

 

Use this time to try and find a style of play that involves the ball and the nice new pitch being in contact for long periods of time. Use the time to teach Uche to pass a ball. Academy producing footballers, not boys who play football but real talented footballers, give them a platform to play or they will walk. 

 

 

 

Like Cathro did, aye?

[Jammy T]

The thing about this is - it’s pointless doing it for one day. There won’t be any fitness benefit unless you do it at least 3 times IMO.

 

One day might be good for team building I guess.

[TyphoonJambo]

2 hours ago, Brick Tamland said:

Was due to sign for the famous in June ‘81 by Bobby Moncur who had previously signed Mackay, Bowman and Robbo all of whom I played with at various teams but he got sacked 2 days before I was due to sign and it never materialised so I was as you can imagine a bit gutted.

Dundee Utd wanted to sign me the year before after the maximum 3 “trialist”  games you could play at that time and Walter Smith was keen but I didn’t like Jim McLean and didn’t fancy the travelling either.  

Jimmy McManus, the hobo scout at the time, talked me into the 3 ‘trialist’ games (it felt wrong just wearing the top never mind being in the home changing room?) and Bertie Auld wanted me to sign for the shite, but that was never going to happen. 

Outwith those above, I went on to play first team games for 9 clubs in Scotland, 6 of which I signed for. 

Hopefully that’s enough info and I can remain as Brick Tamland ??

So close and yet so far, nearly lived the dream. Hope you had a damm good shower after wearing that shit as well. Cheers for the info.

[joondalupjambo]

Save the dunes they are an important part of the landscape.  Just walked from Gullane beach to North Berwick within the last few days and quite a few if the dunes have been planted up with what looks like sea grass type plants. Protecting them from eroding further seems to be the tactic now. Letting big Uche run up and down them a few times will put environmental efforts back decades ?

 

[i wish jj was my dad]

I  really don't get the negativity. A day of hard training in a different environment. It's no as if the ogre is making the  play 5s on concrete

[Five to One]

Are Hibs waiting to see if we visit the dunes? Copying us in every other way ?‍♂️ 

[i wish jj was my dad]

1 hour ago, Jammy T said:

The thing about this is - it’s pointless doing it for one day. There won’t be any fitness benefit unless you do it at least 3 times IMO.

 

One day might be good for team building I guess.

Which is probably what it is about. I've done it and I've taken a team to do it too. It's different and probably more about building character and team building. Nobody needs to be made to throw up to be fit but it might help build up confidence and team spirit.

[LogicalEric]

Laughable that people still see this kind of training as something from the past. Have a look at what Man City and Liverpool do, first week

of pre season is heavy running/Gacon tests/Yo-yo tests. It has massive benefits for the season ahead.

[TommiGronlund]

On 15/06/2019 at 21:19, jonnothejambo said:

I have 'done' the Gullane sand dunes when I was a young man. 

 

Murder Hill to be exact. From the bottom it actually looked pretty innocuous. 

 

Then when you actually run up it you know where it got it's name. We used to do it a number of times in one session. 

 

Haven't been on the beach there for years. I wonder if it has changed over the years.

 

Anyone else on here done it ? 

Mind my team done it one pre season... Coach made us run up it backwards too several times... Was bedridden rest of the day ?

[henry]

5 hours ago, Brick Tamland said:

Was due to sign for the famous in June ‘81 by Bobby Moncur who had previously signed Mackay, Bowman and Robbo all of whom I played with at various teams but he got sacked 2 days before I was due to sign and it never materialised so I was as you can imagine a bit gutted.

Dundee Utd wanted to sign me the year before after the maximum 3 “trialist”  games you could play at that time and Walter Smith was keen but I didn’t like Jim McLean and didn’t fancy the travelling either.  

Jimmy McManus, the hobo scout at the time, talked me into the 3 ‘trialist’ games (it felt wrong just wearing the top never mind being in the home changing room?) and Bertie Auld wanted me to sign for the shite, but that was never going to happen. 

Outwith those above, I went on to play first team games for 9 clubs in Scotland, 6 of which I signed for. 

Hopefully that’s enough info and I can remain as Brick Tamland ??

 

I played semi pro football in the Jnr &. EOS league and you are 100% correct. We often done pre season at Gullane and it was hardest training I’ve ever done. There was the inevitable carry on with someone if not all of the squad ending up in The Forth at the end of the session. The team building is something you didn’t mention but it does wonders for that as well. Funnily enough I also pulled on a hibs strip at Easter Rd in a trial match ?

[jambocub]

4 hours ago, Jammy T said:

 

Like Cathro did, aye?

Did you watch any of cathros Training sessions?

More importantly his pre season ones

[Doc Rob]

20 hours ago, Ally Alexander said:

Actually over training is likely to cause more injuries.  Also tired muscles slows a player.  There's s a fine balance between optimum and too much training.

 

 

Yes, but that’s why this sort of thing is only done during pre-season.

[Jammy T]

12 hours ago, jambocub said:

Did you watch any of cathros Training sessions?

More importantly his pre season ones

 

It’s universally acknowledged and confirmed by Levein that our fitness under Cathro dipped dramatically.

[UcheGang]

Dinosaur stuff.

 

But it is Levein we are talking about.

[tokyowalnut]

Just now, UcheGang said:

Dinosaur stuff.

 

But it is Levein we are talking about.

What is? Doing fitness work?

 

Try again. 

[Unknown user]

If Levein gave a million to Oxfam there would be some on here calling him a **** for not giving 2 million to Save the Children.

 

Edited June 23, 2019 by Smithee

[Maroonblood22]

Heard that if you don't go up the dunes with your right foot first then you'll get an injury in November. FACT!

[UcheGang]

21 minutes ago, tokyowalnut said:

What is? Doing fitness work?

 

Try again. 

Getting professional footballers to run up and down dunes ffs. 

 

A million more suitable training methods than that.

 

Fitness really helped us last season didn't it? 

 

[Maroonblood22]

3 minutes ago, UcheGang said:

Getting professional footballers to run up and down dunes ffs. 

 

A million more suitable training methods than that.

 

Fitness really helped us last season didn't it? 

 

 

Dyu think Naisy's knees, big Peter's Hernia and Uche's broken foot were due to running up sand dunes months before?

 

We had many issues last season to grumble about, the Gullane dunes weren't one of them.

[Blackshades]

30 minutes ago, UcheGang said:

Dinosaur stuff.

 

But it is Levein we are talking about.

 

30 minutes ago, UcheGang said:

Dinosaur stuff.

 

But it is Levein we are talking about.

I'm interested to know what your modern day fitness plan  is seeing your a guru in professional sports fitness

Edited June 23, 2019 by Blackshades

[Notts1874]

Amazing that all our resident fitness experts also hate Levein. Some coincidence that.

 

[Skacelsid]

Could not care less about Gullane,  but if the coming season is anything like lasts, serious injury wise our whole fitness science and conditioning people's competence need to be seriously questioned. It should not just be put down to bad luck. I thought our championship winning season we won a lot of points because we were fitter than our opponents, has anything changed. It really is not that difficult for young men to get fit enough to play a game of football.