Homme Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 Has no-one got any debate other than posting wee silly pictures that may or may not be factual? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Zola Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 2 hours ago, Homme said: Has no-one got any debate other than posting wee silly pictures that may or may not be factual? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 4 hours ago, Homme said: Has no-one got any debate other than posting wee silly pictures that may or may not be factual? No. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 12 hours ago, Homme said: Has no-one got any debate other than posting wee silly pictures that may or may not be factual? What, did you think you'd logged into the archives of the Oxford Debating Society? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) I like a wee conspiracy debate now and then, let's face it some are very close to the truth. I always tune out when the Rothschilds are mentioned. Put it to bed.They are not worth trillions, they do not control the worlds economy and they do not start wars. Now, back to the memes... Edited June 19, 2019 by Bridge of Djoum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 13 hours ago, Gordon Zola said: You should really research the history of Central Banks and their roles in the present. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 11 hours ago, Gordon Zola said: That'll be a no then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WorldChampions1902 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 On 16/06/2019 at 13:31, jb102 said: If it had sunk and gone down with all hands we would be in a war by now. This has all the hallmarks of the Gulf of Tonkin. I wonder if the False Flag department at the Pentagon just pulled out the USS Maddox file and said "this'll do". "Gulf of Tonkin" indeed! You beat me to it. I'm not suggesting the US is responsible for these tanker incidents, but if you know your history, you sure as hell know that the US have previous for this sort of incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab87 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 US military drone shot down this morning by Iranian forces. Iran claims it was in Iranian airspace, while the US maintain it was in international airspace... How much more provocation can the US take? I know Trump wants to avoid war at all costs, but he won't want to be seen as soft. I wonder when the tipping point will come. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_bolton Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, Rab87 said: US military drone shot down this morning by Iranian forces. Iran claims it was in Iranian airspace, while the US maintain it was in international airspace... How much more provocation can the US take? I know Trump wants to avoid war at all costs, but he won't want to be seen as soft. I wonder when the tipping point will come. What's the alternative? He can't invade Iran. So he'll do nothing. Maybe some sanctions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab87 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, michael_bolton said: What's the alternative? He can't invade Iran. So he'll do nothing. Maybe some sanctions. I agree, and It's pretty obvious the Iranians know this too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 7 minutes ago, michael_bolton said: What's the alternative? He can't invade Iran. So he'll do nothing. Maybe some sanctions. Maybe like the sanctions that were imposed on Iraq for a number of years before 9-11 happened? Medicines etc so they hope the populace rebel as they can’t take anymore poverty and huge amounts of infant mortality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michael_bolton Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 4 minutes ago, Tazio said: Maybe like the sanctions that were imposed on Iraq for a number of years before 9-11 happened? Medicines etc so they hope the populace rebel as they can’t take anymore poverty and huge amounts of infant mortality? I've got Iranian pals who view the sanctions the other way. The Iranian state is not popular, but America's actions make the Iranian people prepared to put up with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 49 minutes ago, Rab87 said: US military drone shot down this morning by Iranian forces. Iran claims it was in Iranian airspace, while the US maintain it was in international airspace... How much more provocation can the US take? I know Trump wants to avoid war at all costs, but he won't want to be seen as soft. I wonder when the tipping point will come. You think US drones flying inside Iranian airspace or even close is Iranian provocation. What a twisted view the west have, unbelievable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibrahim Tall Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 47 minutes ago, ri Alban said: You think US drones flying inside Iranian airspace or even close is Iranian provocation. What a twisted view the west have, unbelievable. So, it’s ok to start shooting down the Russians then? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-47799660 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 54 minutes ago, Ibrahim Tall said: So, it’s ok to start shooting down the Russians then? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-47799660 Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 5 hours ago, Rab87 said: US military drone shot down this morning by Iranian forces. Iran claims it was in Iranian airspace, while the US maintain it was in international airspace... How much more provocation can the US take? I know Trump wants to avoid war at all costs, but he won't want to be seen as soft. I wonder when the tipping point will come. You know Trump wants to avoid war at all costs. Where did you hear this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibrahim Tall Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 1 hour ago, The Real Maroonblood said: You know Trump wants to avoid war at all costs. Where did you hear this? If Trump ‘wanted’ a war they’d already be at war. Whole thing is an act, the same as N Korea 2 years ago and Venezuela a few months ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Zola Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 It seems highly probable a few people on here are forming their world views from information they are getting from 'independent' western 'news' outlets Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab87 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 3 hours ago, Gordon Zola said: It seems highly probable a few people on here are forming their world views from information they are getting from 'independent' western 'news' outlets And where do you form your world views from, oh wise one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trapper John McIntyre Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 From 5 minutes ago, Rab87 said: And where do you form your world views from, oh wise one? From RT, like these two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab87 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 So strikes were authorised at some point last night, and then Trump pulled back. Interesting. Not sure that provides much of a detterent to Iran to cease their destabilising behaviour... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 48 minutes ago, Rab87 said: So strikes were authorised at some point last night, and then Trump pulled back. Interesting. Not sure that provides much of a detterent to Iran to cease their destabilising behaviour... Pretty worrying development all the same. America has now backed itself into a corner though and the slightest hint of Iran doing something they'll be forced to act or look weak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab87 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 minute ago, AlphonseCapone said: Pretty worrying development all the same. America has now backed itself into a corner though and the slightest hint of Iran doing something they'll be forced to act or look weak. Trump appears to really really want to avoid any sort of conflict. I would suspect that he would have given the order to strike thinking it would be a quick in and out surgical strike like they have performed in Syria in the past. However, with so much US and allied forces in the area, I am sure he would have been warned that there was a chance of reprisal attacks. Trump is all about image, and the last thing he would want is any US casualties, so I am sure this was behind the decision to pull back. As you say, he is in a corner now, and I am sure the Iranians will know it. Unless both sides come to the table soon, I can't imagine further Iranian provocation either directly or by proxy, will be far off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cade Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 Trump would love a wee war. Do a Maggie/Falklands and boost his rapidly plummeting popularity figures by having a wee scrap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab87 Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Cade said: Trump would love a wee war. Do a Maggie/Falklands and boost his rapidly plummeting popularity figures by having a wee scrap. I honestly do not believe he does. Wars are very very expensive. He does not like to spend money. It would be a very very risky move, and I believe he will do all he can to avoid it. Where is the evidence that he wants war, he has tried to avoid armed conflict at almost every turn since he took his presidency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King prawn Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 7 minutes ago, Rab87 said: I honestly do not believe he does. Wars are very very expensive. He does not like to spend money. It would be a very very risky move, and I believe he will do all he can to avoid it. Where is the evidence that he wants war, he has tried to avoid armed conflict at almost every turn since he took his presidency. Doesn’t the US usually profit from wars? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 9 minutes ago, King prawn said: Doesn’t the US usually profit from wars? Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maple Leaf Posted June 21, 2019 Share Posted June 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Rab87 said: I honestly do not believe he does. Wars are very very expensive. He does not like to spend money. It would be a very very risky move, and I believe he will do all he can to avoid it. Where is the evidence that he wants war, he has tried to avoid armed conflict at almost every turn since he took his presidency. I'm inclined to agree with you. I dislike Trump, as I've made abundantly clear on the 'Donald Trump' thread, but I think he's reluctant to start a war. Yon Bolton guy, on the other hand ... To me, the USA going to war with Iran over some damaged oil tankers (none of which are American-owned), and a destroyed drone which may have been in Iranian airspace, would be ludicrous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Zola Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 Glad the americans didn't retaliate and start world war 3 after they were provoked into shooting down an iranian passenger jet in iranian air space Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamborg Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Gordon Zola said: Glad the americans didn't retaliate and start world war 3 after they were provoked into shooting down an iranian passenger jet in iranian air space are you related to legions ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Zola Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 59 minutes ago, Iamborg said: are you related to legions ? killed 66 kids and didnt even apologise? what do you think would have happened if the iranians were off the coast of new york or california and shot down an american passenger plane. do you think the americans would have seen it as an act of war? do you think the media would have supported the iranians? why is it one rule for them another for other countries? wake up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 14 minutes ago, Gordon Zola said: killed 66 kids and didnt even apologise? what do you think would have happened if the iranians were off the coast of new york or california and shot down an american passenger plane. do you think the americans would have seen it as an act of war? do you think the media would have supported the iranians? why is it one rule for them another for other countries? wake up Unfortunately the USA act as the Worlds Police Force. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Zola Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said: Unfortunately the USA act as the Worlds Police Force. disguised as police by the media but actually the criminals Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maple Leaf Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 16 minutes ago, Gordon Zola said: killed 66 kids and didnt even apologise? what do you think would have happened if the iranians were off the coast of new york or california and shot down an american passenger plane. do you think the americans would have seen it as an act of war? do you think the media would have supported the iranians? why is it one rule for them another for other countries? wake up Eight years after the shoot down, the USA and Iran reached an agreement and issued the following statement: "...the United States recognized the aerial incident of 3 July 1988 as a terrible human tragedy and expressed deep regret over the loss of lives caused by the incident..." In addition, the Americans paid $62 million in compensation to the victims' families. It should also be noted that five months after the shoot down, Pan Am 103 was blown out of the sky over Lockerbie. Although a Libyan was convicted of that crime, many people suspected that the Iranians were behind it, and that it was payback for the earlier incident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Zola Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 5 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said: Eight years after the shoot down, the USA and Iran reached an agreement and issued the following statement: "...the United States recognized the aerial incident of 3 July 1988 as a terrible human tragedy and expressed deep regret over the loss of lives caused by the incident..." In addition, the Americans paid $62 million in compensation to the victims' families. It should also be noted that five months after the shoot down, Pan Am 103 was blown out of the sky over Lockerbie. Although a Libyan was convicted of that crime, many people suspected that the Iranians were behind it, and that it was payback for the earlier incident. do you think the iranians would have got 8 years or do you think their country would have getting obliterated within the next day? everyone would have said they deserved it, so why not the other way round. And you think paying dollars will get back all the lives wiped out? i think the families wouldve preferred their loved ones back. it should also be noted that you should not believe a word that the western media/propaganda machine spouts. if in doubt blame the iranians, gives the west an excuse to go to war with them even though they are the victims and all the brainwashed western civilians will back them because they heard it on the 'news' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maple Leaf Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 3 hours ago, Gordon Zola said: do you think the iranians would have got 8 years or do you think their country would have getting obliterated within the next day? everyone would have said they deserved it, so why not the other way round. And you think paying dollars will get back all the lives wiped out? i think the families wouldve preferred their loved ones back. it should also be noted that you should not believe a word that the western media/propaganda machine spouts. if in doubt blame the iranians, gives the west an excuse to go to war with them even though they are the victims and all the brainwashed western civilians will back them because they heard it on the 'news' Most of what you wrote about payments in your first paragraph is self-evident. Money changes hands and incidents are swept under the table. It's despicable, but that's what happened with both plane tragedies. I don't agree with you on your "western media/propaganda machine' comment. Yes, they were all suckered by the Bush Administration on Iraq, but that was then and things have changed. People are smarter now, and most people understand that the Trumpites are spoiling for a fight and looking for regime change in Iran. No Western government is with America on that. The only countries that will be with America in any attack on Iran will be Saudi Arabia and Israel. There will be no Western coalition this time. And that will be enough to ensure another American defeat. I only hope that saner heads prevail in Washington. By the way, no-one is going to obliterate Iran. They're perfectly capable of defending themselves and making any attacker pay in blood. And they will have Russia and China standing behind them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 3 hours ago, Maple Leaf said: Most of what you wrote about payments in your first paragraph is self-evident. Money changes hands and incidents are swept under the table. It's despicable, but that's what happened with both plane tragedies. I don't agree with you on your "western media/propaganda machine' comment. Yes, they were all suckered by the Bush Administration on Iraq, but that was then and things have changed. People are smarter now, and most people understand that the Trumpites are spoiling for a fight and looking for regime change in Iran. No Western government is with America on that. The only countries that will be with America in any attack on Iran will be Saudi Arabia and Israel. There will be no Western coalition this time. And that will be enough to ensure another American defeat. I only hope that saner heads prevail in Washington. By the way, no-one is going to obliterate Iran. They're perfectly capable of defending themselves and making any attacker pay in blood. And they will have Russia and China standing behind them. The US are exposing themselves by the day. They've just hit Iran with a cyber attack. I thought that was the Russians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Governor Tarkin Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 7 hours ago, Maple Leaf said: I don't agree with you on your "western media/propaganda machine' comment. Yes, they were all suckered by the Bush Administration on Iraq, but that was then and things have changed. People are smarter now, and most people understand that the Trumpites are spoiling for a fight and looking for regime change in Iran. No Western government is with America on that. The only countries that will be with America in any attack on Iran will be Saudi Arabia and Israel. There will be no Western coalition this time. I hardly know anybody outside of a few Americans who were suckered by the Bush administration tbh. I reckon we all knew him and Blair were absolute shysters, and no amount of western media support could disguise that hard fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said: I hardly know anybody outside of a few Americans who were suckered by the Bush administration tbh. I reckon we all knew him and Blair were absolute shysters, and no amount of western media support could disguise that hard fact. Haven't spoken to a single American who didn't see through Bush, Cheney and their game. Also, their anger at Colin Powell and that shameful display at the UN wasn't missed either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Governor Tarkin said: I hardly know anybody outside of a few Americans who were suckered by the Bush administration tbh. I reckon we all knew him and Blair were absolute shysters, and no amount of western media support could disguise that hard fact. 1 minute ago, Bridge of Djoum said: Haven't spoken to a single American who didn't see through Bush, Cheney and their game. Also, their anger at Colin Powell and that shameful display at the UN wasn't missed either. And yet ....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 5 minutes ago, jake said: And yet ....... Guilty! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 22 minutes ago, jake said: And yet ....... And yet what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 4 minutes ago, Bridge of Djoum said: And yet what? We voted them in again. Pretty obvious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 1 minute ago, ri Alban said: We voted them in again. Pretty obvious. ''We''? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibrahim Tall Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 17 hours ago, Gordon Zola said: Glad the americans didn't retaliate and start world war 3 after they were provoked into shooting down an iranian passenger jet in iranian air space Few things, that isn’t a genuine quote, it’s a *******ised version of multiple quote some of which pre-date Iran Air 655. Second, the incident was ****ed up but to add context it happened during the Iran/Iraq war, in an actual war zone where ‘neutral’ ships were being bombed on a regular basis. It wasn’t just simply a case of blowing a plane out the sky in ‘peace time’ for the hell of it. Its ****ed up and they should have apologised but false quotes and context help no one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 7 minutes ago, Ibrahim Tall said: Few things, that isn’t a genuine quote, it’s a *******ised version of multiple quote some of which pre-date Iran Air 655. Second, the incident was ****ed up but to add context it happened during the Iran/Iraq war, in an actual war zone where ‘neutral’ ships were being bombed on a regular basis. It wasn’t just simply a case of blowing a plane out the sky in ‘peace time’ for the hell of it. Its ****ed up and they should have apologised but false quotes and context help no one. I dunno, mate. I saw a meme quoting G HW the day after that one surfaced which read ''FTH''. Seems legit, likesay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jake Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 30 minutes ago, Bridge of Djoum said: ''We''? And yet despite everyone knowing Bush and Blair were at it. We still went to war. As a democracy we are responsible . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibrahim Tall Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 18 minutes ago, Bridge of Djoum said: I dunno, mate. I saw a meme quoting G HW the day after that one surfaced which read ''FTH''. Seems legit, likesay. That seems more legit tbh, have Russia Today quoted it yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bridge of Djoum Posted June 23, 2019 Share Posted June 23, 2019 2 minutes ago, Ibrahim Tall said: That seems more legit tbh, have Russia Today quoted it yet? Niet. Give it time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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