Gaffer on young guns

[Alex Kintner]

3 hours ago, King Joffrey said:

The Ajax model? Do people go to the pub before posting? Levein is the jam tomorrow guy on every front. 

 

Our reserves are 7th I think. Cochrane is 18 and guys like Turnbull and Hastie at Motherwell are first XI every week and million pound plus players performing at that level consistently. 

 

We brought in guys like Wighton and Burns and Mulraney and Shaugnessey because we have nothing coming through of any note. Even Keena can't get match time in a Hearts team that is the worst in the league for goals from open play. 

 

I sound beaten and negative because I am. Levein promises and promises and delivers nothing. Dragging it all out til retirement. I have as much faith in our youth system as I do our recruitment. But Budge fans talk of restructuring and investment in the academy. I deal in proof. Where is it?

 

I hope Cochrane makes it but remember he was the Gilmour understudy at Rangers and let go for not being good enough. 

 

I've been brought up on youngsters making the first team like McLaren or Naysmith. Where's that quality? Nowhere. Godinho and Brandon are 21 and 22 next month. By this stage they should be first team or off to Dunfermline. 

 

I honestly think if every player in Scotland was fit we'd be one of maybe two SPL first teams with no academy player in it. But Levein says hold on, give it 3 years, like the recruitment and new flair players, (like the stand for that matter but that's another thread), like everything. Jam tomorrow.

 

Ajax? Puh-lease.

 

Get shot and let's get new management in at all levels.

 

Utter nonsense and I know that for a fact ??

[Cambo]

The worry should be at any stage in the development of young players, if we can't bring through kids who are better than lower league English journeymen and nobodies from Australia etc, then we are singularly failing at academy level. The lads at Motherwell are a great example. In first team on merit, show their quality and stay there. We seem to have every excuse for NOT playing them.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

13 minutes ago, BOBTHEBRUCE said:

 

I've experienced it myself in the work place. 

If you're expected to do 5 different jobs, you're never going to be the best you can at any of them. 

I can relate to that 

[BOBTHEBRUCE]

1 minute ago, Sir Gio said:

I can relate to that 

 

Have you also got a clueless arse hole of a boss that know's nothing about man management or keeping his staff happy?

Ha. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 minute ago, BOBTHEBRUCE said:

 

Have you also got a clueless arse hole of a boss that know's nothing about man management or keeping his staff happy?

Ha. 

Probably the other way round  ?

[BOBTHEBRUCE]

1 minute ago, Sir Gio said:

Probably the other way round  ?

 

??

Are you the boss? 

[jake]

21 minutes ago, To Be Frank said:

 

Utter nonsense and I know that for a fact ??

Not nonsense mate.

Utter shite I think you meant to type

[Bazzas right boot]

At 19 if they haven't made it we should just give them jobs on the Saturday selling pies. 

 

 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

3 minutes ago, BOBTHEBRUCE said:

 

??

Are you the boss? 

It's only a rumour

 

Keep your friends close your enemies closer type relationship with my bosses 

 

Edited May 7, 2019 by Sir Gio

[BOBTHEBRUCE]

1 minute ago, Sir Gio said:

It's only a rumour

 

Yeah, My boss doesn't like to take responsibility either. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 minute ago, Olly Lee's left boot said:

At 19 if they haven't made it we should just give them jobs on the Saturday selling pies. 

 

 

Or tickets apparently 

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Sir Gio said:

Or tickets apparently 

 

Bit harsh selling them as tickets. 

 

 

[BOBTHEBRUCE]

4 minutes ago, Sir Gio said:

It's only a rumour

 

Keep your friends close your enemies closer type relationship with my bosses 

 

 

Yeah, I can relate to that. 

It's like selling your soul to the devil. 

I remember the days when i had self respect.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Just now, BOBTHEBRUCE said:

Yeah, My boss doesn't like to take responsibility either. 

Haha. I do take responsibility unfortunately. Sometimes you don't actually get the amount you want or require to help your teams as much as you would like. Level I'm at probably worst of both worlds. Treat everyone with the respect I expect myself. 

JKB has very much been my release from the real world 

 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Just now, BOBTHEBRUCE said:

 

Yeah, I can relate to that. 

It's like selling your soul to the devil. 

I remember the days when i had self respect.

Are you the boss?

[BOBTHEBRUCE]

Just now, Sir Gio said:

Are you the boss?

 

I may as well be. 

But without boss pay. 

[Coco]

http://www.deadlinenews.co.uk/2017/10/12/hearts-manager-craig-levein-insists-future-bright-scotland-despite-latest-qualifying-set-back/

 

2 years on who are the 18 to 20 year olds at Hearts who look like they are going to play 100 games or be internationals? 

 

Not a first choice player or player sale who has come through the youth system in 5 years.

[Mr Brightside]

1 hour ago, Coco said:

http://www.deadlinenews.co.uk/2017/10/12/hearts-manager-craig-levein-insists-future-bright-scotland-despite-latest-qualifying-set-back/

 

2 years on who are the 18 to 20 year olds at Hearts who look like they are going to play 100 games or be internationals? 

 

Not a first choice player or player sale who has come through the youth system in 5 years.

Harry Cochrane and Calum Morrison have both already played 30+ games for Hearts. Chris Hamilton and Anthony MacDonald should also make it at Hearts.  These 4 are all good enough to make 100 appearances for Hearts.

 

Euan Henderson, Dario Zanatta, Marcus Godinho and Aidan Keena also have a chance.

[rick witter]

If Levein is in charge it won’t be exciting to watch that is a certainty. 

[Fort Vallance]

Investing in the infrastructure of the academy is marvellous and it's the way to go. However its money down the drain if the scouts are crap and we dont get a decent share of the best kids. 

[Coco]

9 hours ago, Mr Brightside said:

Harry Cochrane and Calum Morrison have both already played 30+ games for Hearts. Chris Hamilton and Anthony MacDonald should also make it at Hearts.  These 4 are all good enough to make 100 appearances for Hearts.

 

Euan Henderson, Dario Zanatta, Marcus Godinho and Aidan Keena also have a chance.

 

Godinho has a cap but isn't a young player.  None of the rest are anywhere near to being internationals nor are they anywhere near to 100 games.  2 years ago Levein had at least one 18 year old who was going to get 100 games and be an international. Who was that?

 

The youth setup which was so bad Levein had to rebuild it with a Council active schools coordinator produced Walker who scored over 30 goals for Hearts and Paterson who got a move to a high level.  Levein's rebuilt academy has produced nothing like that calibre in 5 seasons.

Edited May 8, 2019 by Coco

[TheBigO]

Bauld saving me some typo g on this thread.

 

Our 17 year olds are the first crop from our academy is the only way it can be looked at. Cochrane and Mcdonald are the elder statesmen of Roger Arnotts system. Give it time.

 

That our 1st team should be better while these kids get there is a different argument entirely.

 

Wah Wah Wah Jake Hastie Wah Wah Wah Gary Naismith. Wah Wah Wah two young lads who've both had broken legs. Deary jings.

[Coco]

12 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Bauld saving me some typo g on this thread.

 

Our 17 year olds are the first crop from our academy is the only way it can be looked at. Cochrane and Mcdonald are the elder statesmen of Roger Arnotts system. Give it time.

 

That our 1st team should be better while these kids get there is a different argument entirely.

 

Wah Wah Wah Jake Hastie Wah Wah Wah Gary Naismith. Wah Wah Wah two young lads who've both had broken legs. Deary jings.

2 years ago Levein had 16 17 and 18 year olds who were going to the top.  2 years later they should be 18, 19 and 20 year olds who are well on the way to the top.  Who are these players?

 

Now you say we have to wait further for the players who were the 15 year olds when Levein had the 16 to 18 year olds going to the top?  When can we have the jam?  Maybe the next 'generation' will be the ones?

 

There is such hope that there is something special being done at Hearts.

[TexasAndy]

54 minutes ago, Coco said:

 

Godinho has a cap but isn't a young player.  None of the rest are anywhere near to being internationals nor are they anywhere near to 100 games.  2 years ago Levein had at least one 18 year old who was going to get 100 games and be an international. Who was that?

 

The youth setup which was so bad Levein had to rebuild it with a Council active schools coordinator produced Walker who scored over 30 goals for Hearts and Paterson who got a move to a high level.  Levein's rebuilt academy has produced nothing like that calibre in 5 seasons.

How long do you think it takes to see results of an academy rebuild?  FFS  

[TheBigO]

27 minutes ago, Coco said:

2 years ago Levein had 16 17 and 18 year olds who were going to the top.  2 years later they should be 18, 19 and 20 year olds who are well on the way to the top.  Who are these players?

 

Now you say we have to wait further for the players who were the 15 year olds when Levein had the 16 to 18 year olds going to the top?  When can we have the jam?  Maybe the next 'generation' will be the ones?

 

There is such hope that there is something special being done at Hearts.

Name 16-18 year olds from 2 years ago.

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

12 hours ago, Coco said:

http://www.deadlinenews.co.uk/2017/10/12/hearts-manager-craig-levein-insists-future-bright-scotland-despite-latest-qualifying-set-back/

 

2 years on who are the 18 to 20 year olds at Hearts who look like they are going to play 100 games or be internationals? 

 

Not a first choice player or player sale who has come through the youth system in 5 years.

 

It’s all just words. Levein never delivers on any of it.

[Coco]

10 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Name 16-18 year olds from 2 years ago.

 

Exactly.

[TheBigO]

21 minutes ago, Coco said:

 

Exactly.

Eh? There were no 18 year old products of this academy setup 2 years ago. Harry was 16 at the time and I'd say is about where he should be, injuries notwithstanding.

 

Anyone older than that was either already at the club and basically  ot been coached for years or brought in to plug gaps which is trickier.

 

Anyone the current management have had since 13/14yo or younger isn't yet at an age or stage to be making big impact. Not hard to understand but then understanding doesn't suit agendas where everything needs twisted to boot the club.

 

I bow out at this point.

[Mr Brightside]

6 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Eh? There were no 18 year old products of this academy setup 2 years ago. Harry was 16 at the time and I'd say is about where he should be, injuries notwithstanding.

 

Anyone older than that was either already at the club and basically  ot been coached for years or brought in to plug gaps which is trickier.

 

Anyone the current management have had since 13/14yo or younger isn't yet at an age or stage to be making big impact. Not hard to understand but then understanding doesn't suit agendas where everything needs twisted to boot the club.

 

I bow out at this point.

Good post. The crop from Cochrane’s age and below is what we can judge the academy revamp on.

It appears that this year a number of young players got sent out on loan to gain first team experience and maybe they will be ready for our first team next season.

[Sid]

2 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Eh? There were no 18 year old products of this academy setup 2 years ago. Harry was 16 at the time and I'd say is about where he should be, injuries notwithstanding.

 

Anyone older than that was either already at the club and basically  ot been coached for years or brought in to plug gaps which is trickier.

 

Anyone the current management have had since 13/14yo or younger isn't yet at an age or stage to be making big impact. Not hard to understand but then understanding doesn't suit agendas where everything needs twisted to boot the club.

 

I bow out at this point.

 

Totally agree.  From the low point the Academy had reached it will be some time before we see if it’s working. 

Similar to our getting core players on long term deals.  That’s about done and should mean a more stable team.  Less, but better quality transfer activity, improving the team.  It is what we have all called for but too soon to see if it will all succeed under Levein. Stand and general infrastructure all done means greater focus now on footballing side.  Mistakes been made but hearing in the right direction.  

Again, that doesn’t fit the “Blame Levein for everything” agenda.  

[Bridge of Djoum]

13 hours ago, BOBTHEBRUCE said:

Yeah, My boss doesn't like to take responsibility either. 

How is the wife?

[luckydug]

King Joffrey sounds awful familiar considering he only has 26 posts.

I never used to believe in reincarnation until JKB came along.?

[GarryJ-o-s]

1 hour ago, TheBigO said:

Name 16-18 year olds from 2 years ago.

 

I guess Keena, Morrison, Cochrane and McDonald were all in that age category at the time of the article. All have a pretty good chance of hitting 100 games with us.

[Bridge of Djoum]

32 minutes ago, luckydug said:

King Joffrey sounds awful familiar considering he only has 26 posts.

I never used to believe in reincarnation until JKB came along.?

They change names but not styles. Easy to spot.

[i8hibsh]

Calum Paterson is the only highlight of our academy.

[tolcross lad]

19 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

Calum Paterson is the only highlight of our academy.

I think he was signed as a 16 year old from Tynie.

[We_are_the_Hearts]

14 minutes ago, tolcross lad said:

I think he was signed as a 16 year old from Tynie.

Correct. Battle hardened from club football for when the going got tough.

[Coco]

1 hour ago, TheBigO said:

Eh? There were no 18 year old products of this academy setup 2 years ago. Harry was 16 at the time and I'd say is about where he should be, injuries notwithstanding.

 

Anyone older than that was either already at the club and basically  ot been coached for years or brought in to plug gaps which is trickier.

 

Anyone the current management have had since 13/14yo or younger isn't yet at an age or stage to be making big impact. Not hard to understand but then understanding doesn't suit agendas where everything needs twisted to boot the club.

 

I bow out at this point.

Levein said he had future internationals aged 16 17 and 18 at the club 2 years ago.

 

It is all just bluster and bluff.  Of course some good young players will come through.  As yet there is zero evidence that they will be better than those from the pre-rebuilt setup.  Nor does the guy running the academy have any track record in producing footballers.

[vlad on the tyne]

Marc Leonard decided to goto Brighton. He was highly regarded. 

[TheBigO]

22 minutes ago, Coco said:

Levein said he had future internationals aged 16 17 and 18 at the club 2 years ago.

 

It is all just bluster and bluff.  Of course some good young players will come through.  As yet there is zero evidence that they will be better than those from the pre-rebuilt setup.  Nor does the guy running the academy have any track record in producing footballers.

Brandon was 18 then I guess.  Looked great - broke his leg.  Godinho is an internationalist.  Morrison was prob 17 at that time and he's had a tough season but may well become a top player - certainly has talent.  And do you have to take it so literally - easier to beat someone with if you do I suppose.

 

Shall we reconvene in two years with regards the academy when it can be initially judged from a first team impact perspective, but for now agree that we need some ready made players to help these lads integrate in to a steady, good team, rather than have to carry us aged 16?

 

I'm no Levein fan, and he should have done a helluva lot better but there has been some perfect storm shit this year which hasn't helped either.  If we're sitting looking similar in October, no matter who is in charge, we worry, but for now we all need to calm our beans, realise that injuries have been unprecedented, plus the kids are a year or so off so not really fit to step in.  The season basically has gone tits up.  BUT we now have the spine of a team for the first time in years so next season there's hope.  I'll take hope for now.

 

 

[Alex Kintner]

There’s genuine sticks to beat Levein with. The academy is not one of them. The first group of youngsters impacted by his revamp are just now turning 18 and in Cochrane and McDonald we have a couple of crackers who will go on to have long successful careers.

[Jocam2325]

14 hours ago, Mr Brightside said:

Harry Cochrane and Calum Morrison have both already played 30+ games for Hearts. Chris Hamilton and Anthony MacDonald should also make it at Hearts.  These 4 are all good enough to make 100 appearances for Hearts.

 

Euan Henderson, Dario Zanatta, Marcus Godinho and Aidan Keena also have a chance.

Cochrane looks like he could be good. McDonald looked exciting when he played lasy season. Never seen Hamilton. Keena also looks a prospect but none of the others. Morrison is poor and Zanatta has been out on loan forever for a reason. Godinho won't make it neither will Henderson.   Just my opinion. 

[Alex Kintner]

1 hour ago, Jocam2325 said:

Cochrane looks like he could be good. McDonald looked exciting when he played lasy season. Never seen Hamilton. Keena also looks a prospect but none of the others. Morrison is poor and Zanatta has been out on loan forever for a reason. Godinho won't make it neither will Henderson.   Just my opinion. 

 

Zanatta very much in first team plans for next season ??

[Jocam2325]

35 minutes ago, To Be Frank said:

 

Zanatta very much in first team plans for next season ??

Well I hope he has improved. Albeit he hasn't looked great previously I concede that was some time ago and he must surely be worth a shot in front of Morrison. 

[kimosavi]

22 hours ago, King Joffrey said:

The Ajax model? Do people go to the pub before posting? Levein is the jam tomorrow guy on every front. 

 

Our reserves are 7th I think. Cochrane is 18 and guys like Turnbull and Hastie at Motherwell are first XI every week and million pound plus players performing at that level consistently. 

 

We brought in guys like Wighton and Burns and Mulraney and Shaugnessey because we have nothing coming through of any note. Even Keena can't get match time in a Hearts team that is the worst in the league for goals from open play. 

 

I sound beaten and negative because I am. Levein promises and promises and delivers nothing. Dragging it all out til retirement. I have as much faith in our youth system as I do our recruitment. But Budge fans talk of restructuring and investment in the academy. I deal in proof. Where is it?

 

I hope Cochrane makes it but remember he was the Gilmour understudy at Rangers and let go for not being good enough. 

 

I've been brought up on youngsters making the first team like McLaren or Naysmith. Where's that quality? Nowhere. Godinho and Brandon are 21 and 22 next month. By this stage they should be first team or off to Dunfermline. 

 

I honestly think if every player in Scotland was fit we'd be one of maybe two SPL first teams with no academy player in it. But Levein says hold on, give it 3 years, like the recruitment and new flair players, (like the stand for that matter but that's another thread), like everything. Jam tomorrow.

 

Ajax? Puh-lease.

 

Get shot and let's get new management in at all levels.

Fantastic post cant argue with any of that....the Levein brigade will no doubt 

[King Joffrey]

4 hours ago, kimosavi said:

Fantastic post cant argue with any of that....the Levein brigade will no doubt 

 

Cheers Kimosavi. Like arguing with Theresa May on here with the clap clap clap we nearly died brigade. 

[Mikey1874]

On 07/05/2019 at 20:06, Cambo said:

The worry should be at any stage in the development of young players, if we can't bring through kids who are better than lower league English journeymen and nobodies from Australia etc, then we are singularly failing at academy level. The lads at Motherwell are a great example. In first team on merit, show their quality and stay there. We seem to have every excuse for NOT playing them.

 

The lads at Motherwell were brought in out of desperation by the manager after a bad run of defeats and form. You'll have to ask him what he was thinking exactly though he had had his resignation rejected. But seems he had had enough of a lot of his players. Their run of form and wins was not guaranteed. 

Edited May 9, 2019 by Mikey1874

[DalryJambo]

On 07/05/2019 at 18:43, King Joffrey said:

 

Yeah admit I should have been clearer was more referring to fact he's also 20 and been nowhere near a likely first team member other than in dire needs. Young players should be coming through about 18 or 19 and established or moved on by 20 to 21. I do actually like Keena but he's going to be 21 before pushing for real consideration. Cosgrove is 22 and been Aberdeen starting centre forward for a year. 

 

I guess the problem we have is that many Hearts fans absolutely destroy our emerging talent if they have poor performances so it’s harder for an 18 year old to establish themselves here as opposed to  Motherwell or Kilmarnock for example.

 

[Nookie Bear]

7 minutes ago, DalryJambo said:

 

I guess the problem we have is that many Hearts fans absolutely destroy our emerging talent if they have poor performances so it’s harder for an 18 year old to establish themselves here as opposed to  Motherwell or Kilmarnock for example.

 

 

Do we? I’ve always seen Hearts fans as very patient with our young talent and give them a lot of leeway. 

 

Its Johnny Foreigner we have trouble with. 

 

 

[Jamhammer]

16 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:

 

Do we? I’ve always seen Hearts fans as very patient with our young talent and give them a lot of leeway. 

 

Its Johnny Foreigner we have trouble with. 

 

 

Afraid it's everyone nowadays. Young, old, Scots, "foreigner", you're lucky if you get a game before you're judged. Some get written off without actually playing.