Aitken article

[rdewar42]

It's been too long since I've seen the phrase, "so-called supporters" on KB.

 

Frail is pathetic. Factendof.

 

Glad to re-aquaint you with an apt sobriquet.

[Jambof3tornado]

Frail hasnt been dumped on,he knew his coat was an yon shoogly peg.Avram Grant,now there was a man who was shat on,coz given time he could have gotten chelsea somewhere,Shaggy meanwhile was getting us nowhere,anytime!!!

 

Happy with him as an U19's coach but no more than that.

[Baird, King and Michael]

Tommy Walker, Alfie Conn, Willie Bauld and Jim Cruickshank among others were all treated like ****.

 

Now Stevie Frail has been dumped like a old TV in the canal.

 

It's nothing to be proud of, but let's not pretend this is something new.

 

I conclude that Hearts have never had great ownership in the modern age.

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

It is true that we treated players badly in the past.

 

It is true that previous regimes took supporters for granted.

 

It's also true that previous owners took the club to the brink through financial mismanangement, first in the late 70's early 80's and then in the late 90's.

 

However, nothing in our history, or any other Scottish football clubs history can compare to what has gone on at Hearts under Romanov.

 

We went beyond a joke and a laughing stock a very long time ago.

 

This is a serious as it gets.

[lambojambo]

It's been too long since I've seen the phrase, "so-called supporters" on KB.

 

Frail is pathetic. Factendof.

 

 

How about "so called MORON"?

 

I think that fits the bill as far as your goodself is concerned.

[Bootboy100]

I am confused can someone explain how Frail has been treated badly??

 

From what I have read and understand he was told when the season ended he was not going to be around much longer as McGhee was bringing in his own backroom staff unless he went back to coaching the youths. He refused.

 

His contract ends this month supposedly.

 

He came to work on Wednesday and was summoned to a meeting and told he was on gardening leave and was also told why.

 

Now he is still being paid until his contract ends so what is exactly shabby about the treatment???

[Drylaw Hearts]

I am confused can someone explain how Frail has been treated badly??

 

From what I have read and understand he was told when the season ended he was not going to be around much longer as McGhee was bringing in his own backroom staff unless he went back to coaching the youths. He refused.

 

His contract ends this month supposedly.

 

He came to work on Wednesday and was summoned to a meeting and told he was on gardening leave and was also told why.

 

Now he is still being paid until his contract ends so what is exactly shabby about the treatment???

 

I was told the treatment of Frail was "disgraceful" - by someone who definately know.

 

I didn't even bother asking for details.

 

But......

 

Frail had been hanging about since the end of the Season and from what I hear he wasn't even spoke to with regards to his position once.

 

He was left in limbo for several weeks and that is a bit off.

 

 

I hope he get's himself a nice payday from a newspaper to 'tell all'.

 

He deserves it.

[Guest jambomickey]

the regime in control of our football club are paranoid rats! yet some hearts supporters just accept the fact they treat people like dung

[MacDonald Jardine]

Sorry, I wasn't avoiding the question, just went to bed! The answer is of course no, although for damaging and divisive the last two or three years of CPR's reign must surely run it close, (although perhaps CPR was less bizarre and more clear-minded).

 

Rereading Aitken's article (And I agree Aitken is just about the last real "journalist" in the Scottish media) in the cold light of dawn I still think it is basically arguing Vlad has broken with the club's past whereas when it comes to the treatment of players it would be more accurate to say he has carried on a tradition from which far far greater club servants suffered - Walker, Bauld and Mackay just to name three from one line of the club song., and throw in Cruickie as another example.

 

Robinson's time was less divisive in that the vast majority agreed he was at best incompetent and at worst corrupt.

I'm not defending what happened to SF but is there a pleaseant way of dealing with it?

[Bootboy100]

I was told the treatment of Frail was "disgraceful" - by someone who definately know.

 

I didn't even bother asking for details.

 

But......

 

Frail had been hanging about since the end of the Season and from what I hear he wasn't even spoke to with regards to his position once.

 

He was left in limbo for several weeks and that is a bit off.

 

 

I hope he get's himself a nice payday from a newspaper to 'tell all'.

 

He deserves it.

 

 

If that really is the case then fair enough however the vibes that were given was that Frail knew his time was nearly up.

 

If Frail does tell all and I hope he does then I will gladly change my opinion on this matter.

[Charlie-Brown]

Is this the same 'lying' 'spineless' 'muppet' that so many on here wanted to 'grow a pair' and to 'GTF' ?

 

Iam sure Stephen Frail will be comforted by their new found sympathy for him.

[Coco]

Is this the same 'lying' 'spineless' 'muppet' that so many on here wanted to 'grow a pair' and to 'GTF' ?

 

Iam sure Stephen Frail will be comforted by their new found sympathy for him.

 

It will soon be time to put the boot into the next puppet as proxy for Romanov ...

[Mat1874]

Good read I thought. As I posted on another thread it's not that Frail is losing his job, it's the way that the club have conducted their business which stinks.

[magicTs]

Is this the same 'lying' 'spineless' 'muppet' that so many on here wanted to 'grow a pair' and to 'GTF' ?

 

Iam sure Stephen Frail will be comforted by their new found sympathy for him.

 

How can you on one hand feel sympathy for Frail but on the other defend and condone Romanov's every action ??

[tolcross lad]

Mike Aitken is one of the best reporters but on this occasion he is being a bit misty eyed about previous Hearts regimes and their poor treatment of employees and players at every level-not just the legends.

He is also not putting Frails situation into the context of how ruthless football is generally.Frail should understand this more than most.If he had become manager he would have had to strengthen the team by showing players the door even employing time honoured tactics like "freezing players out"He would have hedged his bets regarding resigning of players waiting to see if he could sign others better.Meantime players are left in limbo.He would maybe get rid of a player who was undermining his authority .

Having signed a 2year contract with the club he might just leave after 1 year if a better job came along, leaving players who perhaps signed or resigned influenced by the fact he was the manager, in his wake.

Football is a business which is not for the faint hearted and I know of situations at other clubs which make Romanov look like a saint.

[Glamorgan Jambo]

Mike Aitken is one of the best reporters but on this occasion he is being a bit misty eyed about previous Hearts regimes and their poor treatment of employees and players at every level-not just the legends.

 

 

Not being chippy but could you highlight which part of Mike's article paints previous regimes in a 'shiny' light. I've read the article a few times and apart from the bit where he quotes Albert Mackie's book (more aspirational even at the time) I can't see one bit where he makes any comparison between the Romanov and previous regimes.

[Acey]

How about "so called MORON"?

 

I think that fits the bill as far as your goodself is concerned.

 

"So-called moron" in that context suggests that I am not, in fact, a moron. This is not news to me.

 

I fully support Mr Romanov in any step he may take in removing Fail from the club. Nobody cried about Rixy's mortgage; I'm fecked if I'm going to shed a tear for that ginger sad sack.

[tynie]

I also totally agree with the article.

 

I'm not that bothered he got moved on but the way it appears it happened after he was the face of the Romanov regime for so long was pretty gutless and insensitive.

 

I wonder if Campbell Ogilvie will do the decent thing after the manager with 'significant experience of British football' is not appointed.

 

The most gutless is Romanov himself. Appoints locals to do his dirty work because he doesnt have the guts to face the music himself . He makes all the snowballs and gets someone else to throw them.

[maroonedinoz]

"So-called moron" in that context suggests that I am not, in fact, a moron. This is not news to me.

 

I fully support Mr Romanov in any step he may take in removing Fail from the club. Nobody cried about Rixy's mortgage; I'm fecked if I'm going to shed a tear for that ginger sad sack.

 

Surely there is a difference in standards as to what is considered acceptable by punters on this board and what is considered acceptable in a professional sense.

 

By that I mean this...anyone here can basically type anything they want about anybody..eg above quote, and at the end of the day it means little...other than a punter letting of steam

 

But,,operating in a professional footballing environment, it severely damages the reputation of the club if it is percieved that staff, even when considered superflous, are treated in a humiliating manner.

 

I do not want Frail as manager and would prefer to see him released.

 

But the man, any man for that matter, should be treated with dignity, and not if the story published is correct, like an errant schoolboy who has been sent home until the headmaster has decided how he will be punished, when eh comes home from the pub.

 

I have had to sack several people in my career, but I treated each person with dignity and respect, even if the news I was given them was unpalatable to them.

 

I did not treat them like meaningless items, but people, and am still on good term swith soem I bump into.

 

It is much if the person bein greleased understands why, and doesnot walk away 'bittr and twisted' - nobody wins when that happens.

 

Steven Frail deserves to be treated with dignity and respect, but I don;t think he has been from what I read.

 

And Hearts as an employer/potential employer/club, will be viewed in professional circles, as all the poorer for it.

 

I am fast coming to the conclusionn that there is absolutely nothing we can do that does not go tits up under this current regime.

 

From hiring a new manager to getting rid of an old one....

 

The way Frail has been dumped may be seen as 'acceptable' in Lithuania..but it is not what I would like to think was now considered as 'acceptable' at Tynecstle.

[Charlie-Brown]

How can you on one hand feel sympathy for Frail but on the other defend and condone Romanov's every action ??

 

Maybe I should just have quoted loads of posters posts about Frail from before / after his being asked to stay away then we could compare & contrast the blatant hypocrisy of these born-again Frail sympathisers.

 

I felt sympathy for Sandy Clark and John Robertson when they were asked to step down as well as believing it was the correct thing to do.

[tolcross lad]

Not being chippy but could you highlight which part of Mike's article paints previous regimes in a 'shiny' light. I've read the article a few times and apart from the bit where he quotes Albert Mackie's book (more aspirational even at the time) I can't see one bit where he makes any comparison between the Romanov and previous regimes.

 

"If the way Frail was brushed aside by Romanov is any thing to go by,Heart of Midlothian no longer lives up to its proud and graceful name." Also his reference to Albert Mackies book invoked a sense of a moral highground in the past.

I can only relate to events that have happened in my time and there have been many situations situations when the club have behaved every bit as badly since Mackies book was written.

Mike Aitken must surely know this.

I dont like what happened to Frail but he is part of a system which is ruthless and naturally insensitive.

Unfortunately,Romanov fits very ably indeed into this system.

[Francis Albert]

... and we shouldn't run away with the idea that there is anything very special about Hearts history of callous and insensitive tretment of employees. Jock Stein, incomparably Celtic's and the Scottish game's greatest ever manager. was sacked and insultingly offfered the job of running Celtic's football pools operation. And David Murray's treatment of Rangers previous two managers is also up there. But of course "what's all right in Lithuania isn't how we do things in Scotland...".

[Glamorgan Jambo]

"If the way Frail was brushed aside by Romanov is any thing to go by,Heart of Midlothian no longer lives up to its proud and graceful name." Also his reference to Albert Mackies book invoked a sense of a moral highground in the past.

 

 

 

All very indirect and subject to interpretation. No where does he state that the actual behaviour of HMFC boards in the past lived up to Mackie's, his and ours interpretation of the romance of the name of our club.

 

Of course football's ruthless and as Frail was clearly not up to the job he should have been removed. It was done in a ruthless way which was annoying enough, but also done in a shambolic and disorganised way which is reflective of our current owners and their unfitness for their responsibilities.

[Glamorgan Jambo]

... and we shouldn't run away with the idea that there is anything very special about Hearts history of callous and insensitive tretment of employees. Jock Stein, incomparably Celtic's and the Scottish game's greatest ever manager. was sacked and insultingly offfered the job of running Celtic's football pools operation. And David Murray's treatment of Rangers previous two managers is also up there. But of course "what's all right in Lithuania isn't how we do things in Scotland...".

 

 

Again nowhere does this refer to honourable behaviour by past HMFC boards.

 

I could tell you a good story about UBIG/Romanov's purchase of the RBS building in St Andrew square that would make you not only doubt their behaviour but also make you lose all confidence in their competence/delivery skills but I'd lose someone their job. They are damaging the club every day they remain here to use their own words.

[tolcross lad]

... and we shouldn't run away with the idea that there is anything very special about Hearts history of callous and insensitive tretment of employees. Jock Stein, incomparably Celtic's and the Scottish game's greatest ever manager. was sacked and insultingly offfered the job of running Celtic's football pools operation. And David Murray's treatment of Rangers previous two managers is also up there. But of course "what's all right in Lithuania isn't how we do things in Scotland...".

Indeed.

And every time any manager states that his team needs strengthening it means some of you lot aint good enough,that he means to get rid of and get someone better.If you dont figure in his plans you will be encouraged to leave by fair means or foul.

"plumbed new depths of insensitivity"was the phrase used by Aitken.The bottom was reached a long long time ago.Its the nature of the game.

[Pilmuir]

It's not just the Steve Frail incident but the fact that it the latest in long line of actions that have damaged the reputation of our proud club. It should crystal clear to everyone now how Vlad works, and it is not good.

 

Regardless of Frail's performance in charge, he was prepared to be give it a go and gave the club some stability. In my opinion he can leave with his head held high. For sure, his next employers will be easier to work with.

[jambovambo]

Well written article by a life-long Jambo, who has reported on Hearts for many years.

 

Well done, Mike.

[magicTs]

Maybe I should just have quoted loads of posters posts about Frail from before / after his being asked to stay away then we could compare & contrast the blatant hypocrisy of these born-again Frail sympathisers.

 

I felt sympathy for Sandy Clark and John Robertson when they were asked to step down as well as believing it was the correct thing to do.

 

I'm not talking about other posters I'm talking about you NMH. How can you continue to defend and condone Romaknob ? He is a disgrace.

[redm]

In principle, I have absolutely no problem at all with Frail being removed from his position as caretaker manager but a little courtesy or decency wouldn't have gone amiss here. This should have been dealt with at Tynecastle or elsewhere, not in some office at Riccarton on the first day of pre-season training. He might not be the manager we need but he has done nothing but give his very best in a situation that would have driven a weaker man to the drink, if not an early grave.

 

Romanov's claims that he values loyalty from his employees must be empty words and not much else. Frail has demonstrated loyalty time and time again in recent months and this is how his efforts are repaid? Nobody expects him to be given a plum role in the new management set-up (assuming we do get one...) but he never ever did anything to deserve being treated like something Vlad stepped in.

 

If you happen to be reading this Stevie, thanks for all that you did...or tried to do...You slogged your guts out for this club and I hope you know that many of us are very grateful for that.

[Francis Albert]

Again nowhere does this refer to honourable behaviour by past HMFC boards.

 

I could tell you a good story about UBIG/Romanov's purchase of the RBS building in St Andrew square that would make you not only doubt their behaviour but also make you lose all confidence in their competence/delivery skills but I'd lose someone their job. They are damaging the club every day they remain here to use their own words.

 

Property deals? Now you are talking. I have only been involved in three, when moving house. Encountered more barefaced lies, cheating and incompetence from all involved than in the rest of my life put together.

[tolcross lad]

All very indirect and subject to interpretation. No where does he state that the actual behaviour of HMFC boards in the past lived up to Mackie's, his and ours interpretation of the romance of the name of our club.

 

Of course football's ruthless and as Frail was clearly not up to the job he should have been removed. It was done in a ruthless way which was annoying enough, but also done in a shambolic and disorganised way which is reflective of our current owners and their unfitness for their responsibilities.

The article itself is an opinion and it is open to interpretation and criticism.To support his opinion he has conjured up the image of a club of integrity and then quickly got stuck into Romanovs callousness and his plumbing the depths of insensitivity.Other posters have made the same interpretation as myself re the article.As much as I am disliking Romanovs tenure at Hearts his ruthlessness and lack of man management skills is run of the mill in football.Romanov seems to make it so obvious in the spotlight that he has created for himself.

Ruthlessness and callousness in football is endemic. I know one of our more recent managers Pre Romanov regularily employed the tactic of freezing players out of Hearts.Those who had contracts but he did not want on the playing staff and the wages budget.Experienced decent professional players were made to train with younger players.They were made to sit on the bench without ever getting a game.They got the cold shoulder treatment.Neither the manager or his assistant would speak to the player for weeks on end.How callous and humiliating is that?The depths of insensitivity were plumbed many times before Romanov.

I agree that this controversy is representative of the shambolic nature of aspects of our club.

[Glamorgan Jambo]

The article itself is an opinion and it is open to interpretation and criticism.

 

Nowhere does he state that Hearts were better run in the past. He does paint an aspirational picture of how he would like Hearts to behave but this has not been interpreted by quite a few on this thread as a reference to a gilded path.

 

I'm glad you agree that the club are being run shambolically.

 

Incidentally I'm just back from the Mets - Yankees baseball game as I'm in NYC over the weekend. My Yankees supporting friend had to endure a long rant about Romanov while we had a few beers during a rain delay. His comment was 'just like George Steinbrenner but without the success --- and probably without the money also'. It does show that dictators/micro managers can run very succesful sports teams although George differs from Vlad in that he's in and around the stadium most days...

 

Thanks for the discussion (also to the boy from Hoboken - Francis Albert)

[Feg9]

Totally agreed with Mike Aitkens Article.

 

There is a way of treating people...Staff and Customers.

 

Vlad has absolutely no regard for it and he does it in the name of the club I love.

 

It saddens and disgusts me.