CJGJ Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 1 minute ago, EH11 said: No confirmation of nerve agent at this stage. The only details released by the investigators suggested that there were remnants of Betty Turpin's hotpot around the scene of where the two were found and under their fingernails. Police confirm same agent as used previously,,though whether from same batch open to question https://www.bbc.co.uk/news Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Dan Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 World Cup a big success, ideal time to strike again! No idea just a purely speculative guess on my part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambof3tornado Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 6 minutes ago, EH11 said: No confirmation of nerve agent at this stage. The only details released by the investigators suggested that there were remnants of Betty Turpin's hotpot around the scene of where the two were found and under their fingernails. Same nerve agent confirmed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 Pure speculation but perhaps they touched something or picked something up in the park in Salisbury, I can't recall the Queen Elizabeth Gardens in Salisbury being a scene of interest or cordoned off when the Skripal's were poisoned, maybe something was left there and the park wasn't searched as only the places the Skripal's were known to have been were cordoned off and searched. More will become known in due course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Izemore Posted July 4, 2018 Share Posted July 4, 2018 2 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Pure speculation but perhaps they touched something or picked something up in the park in Salisbury, I can't recall the Queen Elizabeth Gardens in Salisbury being a scene of interest or cordoned off when the Skripal's were poisoned, maybe something was left there and the park wasn't searched as only the places the Skripal's were known to have been were cordoned off and searched. More will become known in due course. I think you’re spot on here. The nerve agent used against the Skripal’s was previously stated to degrade extremely slowly and couldn’t be washed away with water/rain. I’m guessing they’ve found and handled the container used in the original attack whilst they picnicked in the park. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 3 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Pure speculation but perhaps they touched something or picked something up in the park in Salisbury, I can't recall the Queen Elizabeth Gardens in Salisbury being a scene of interest or cordoned off when the Skripal's were poisoned, maybe something was left there and the park wasn't searched as only the places the Skripal's were known to have been were cordoned off and searched. More will become known in due course. Yeah I'm on this horse. Cross contamination from the previous thing. The nerve agent was said to be highly persistent. Somehow something has been missed. Maybe it was inevitable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 MI6 agents/Perpetrators mishandling HMG goods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Public Health England now warning people not to touch or pickup any discarded items in the Salisbury area. By that it would seem that the new cases have probably been a case of cross contamination. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig_ Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Does seem a bit odd that it's happened twice within a short distance of Porton Down. What are the chances? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Craig_ said: Does seem a bit odd that it's happened twice within a short distance of Porton Down. What are the chances? Not really, if your eyes can land on what's right in front of them. It's obviously material that has been missed from the previous incident. It would only really be odd if two unlucky, innocent people had picked it up in maybe Stornaway or Belfast. Edited July 5, 2018 by Victorian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 Home Secretary having a go at Russia. We wont be a dumping ground, etc etc. Added to the statement that the two people ( seemingly drug users ) handled an 'item' which is said to be from an area not previously fully decontaminated. Erm... it's all very well raging at Russia again because Russia was certainly the cause of the previous poisoning, but surely this instance has to be blamed / explained with the clean up operation not being absolutely exhaustive and complete. Maybe it could never have been so. What seems likely here is that the authorities were and are aware of this possibility and had planned for it. If they're lucky, this will be the full extent of remaining discarded poison. We may never know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 41 minutes ago, Victorian said: Home Secretary having a go at Russia. We wont be a dumping ground, etc etc. Added to the statement that the two people ( seemingly drug users ) handled an 'item' which is said to be from an area not previously fully decontaminated. Erm... it's all very well raging at Russia again because Russia was certainly the cause of the previous poisoning, but surely this instance has to be blamed / explained with the clean up operation not being absolutely exhaustive and complete. Maybe it could never have been so. What seems likely here is that the authorities were and are aware of this possibility and had planned for it. If they're lucky, this will be the full extent of remaining discarded poison. We may never know. What do you want the authorities to do? Close, quarantine and decontaminate the whole of Salisbury? Queen Elizabeth Gardens was not one of the original places which was cleaned up after the Skripals and that was because there was no indications that the Skripals had been there, so there would be no reason to clean it, it would as the whole of Salisbury would have been, given a cursory look over for anything that had been discarded, but by it's very nature of being a wooded area with bushes & shrubs etc it would make finding something probably quite small extremely difficult, and add in the fact that the authorities didn't know the escape route the perpetrator/s took either, so another reason why the gardens were probably just given a once over. Personally I don't see what else the authorities could have done, Salisbury City is a huge area with a population of over 40,000, the authorities had to concentrate on the area's which they knew the Skripals had been to. Resources were stretched enough without spending time looking at places the authorities knew the Skripals hadn't been. Of course there was always the chance that something would turn up in an area previously unknown to be connected to the case, and that is what seems to have happened here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: What do you want the authorities to do? Close, quarantine and decontaminate the whole of Salisbury? Queen Elizabeth Gardens was not one of the original places which was cleaned up after the Skripals and that was because there was no indications that the Skripals had been there, so there would be no reason to clean it, it would as the whole of Salisbury would have been, given a cursory look over for anything that had been discarded, but by it's very nature of being a wooded area with bushes & shrubs etc it would make finding something probably quite small extremely difficult, and add in the fact that the authorities didn't know the escape route the perpetrator/s took either, so another reason why the gardens were probably just given a once over. Personally I don't see what else the authorities could have done, Salisbury City is a huge area with a population of over 40,000, the authorities had to concentrate on the area's which they knew the Skripals had been to. Resources were stretched enough without spending time looking at places the authorities knew the Skripals hadn't been. Of course there was always the chance that something would turn up in an area previously unknown to be connected to the case, and that is what seems to have happened here. You went to the trouble of highlighting a passage there but you seem to have missed out the next sentence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 17 minutes ago, Victorian said: You went to the trouble of highlighting a passage there but you seem to have missed out the next sentence. Indeed I did? Point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 9 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Indeed I did? Point? The point? Well the sentence quite clearly explains the paragraph you highlighted. The sentence that was missed in the mad scramble to argue with what someone said on the Internet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 23 minutes ago, Victorian said: The point? Well the sentence quite clearly explains the paragraph you highlighted. The sentence that was missed in the mad scramble to argue with what someone said on the Internet. To argue is the furthest thing which I want, therefore I'll leave this discussion there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 8, 2018 Share Posted July 8, 2018 Dawn Sturgess the woman infected with Novichok has died. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 9, 2018 Share Posted July 9, 2018 Will be interested to hear from Kickback's chemical weapons experts regarding how this fatality feeds unto the theory that the previous survivals were a clear indication that the agent material could not have originated from Russia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 They've found the suspected poison container A major development potentially Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Do people still believe this was Russia? See the last time. Why did they take away the bench but, left the front door. It's been bugging me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 5 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said: They've found the suspected poison container A major development potentially Indeed. But equally if not more importantly it might mean that no other member of the public is in danger now, maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, ri Alban said: Do people still believe this was Russia? See the last time. Why did they take away the bench but, left the front door. It's been bugging me. Front door was taken away, there was news helicopter footage of plywood covering up where the door once was. Don't know about now, whether it's been replaced or not or if that part of town is open to the public yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanks said no Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Presumably the bin rakers picked the container up on one of their expeditions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 1 minute ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Front door was taken away, there was news helicopter footage of plywood covering up where the door once was. Don't know about now, whether it's been replaced or not or if that part of town is open to the public yet. Cheers for that. Every time I watched the news the door was still there. Bugged my box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, ri Alban said: Cheers for that. Every time I watched the news the door was still there. Bugged my box. That could have been old footage being shown before they discovered that it was the door handle which was the site of the attack. You have to remember that once the police discovered that it was the door, the cordon around the house was widened and shutters were put up, so there was no new footage after that, except from the air and even that was only aired a few times, that I saw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, Jambo-Jimbo said: That could have been old footage being shown before they discovered that it was the door handle which was the site of the attack. You have to remember that once the police discovered that it was the door, the cordon around the house was widened and shutters were put up, so there was no new footage after that, except from the air and even that was only aired a few times, that I saw. This may have skewed my opinion, BTW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 1 minute ago, ri Alban said: This may have skewed my opinion, BTW. Just found this photo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 12 minutes ago, The Frenchman Returns said: Presumably the bin rakers picked the container up on one of their expeditions? With the guy being conscious he should be able to say Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, Jambo-Jimbo said: Just found this photo. Cheers for that. I saw none of this. Was it blacked out, or was I trying to confirm my bias. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 7 minutes ago, ri Alban said: Cheers for that. I saw none of this. Was it blacked out, or was I trying to confirm my bias. Been freely available on the internet and in the media (newspapers) since the moment the photos were taken, as far as I'm aware. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, Jambo-Jimbo said: Been freely available on the internet and in the media (newspapers) since the moment the photos were taken, as far as I'm aware. Don't rub it in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, Victorian said: Is that for me, vicky. Because I actually pulled that face about 10 minutes ago. Edited July 13, 2018 by ri Alban Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 (edited) Aye it was, aye. You're an unguided missile of a poster. Edited July 13, 2018 by Victorian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 13 minutes ago, ri Alban said: Don't rub it in. You asked if it was blacked out, I said no as far as I know the photos were freely available, how is that rubbing it in? A 10 second google search would have answered your question about the door. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, Jambo-Jimbo said: You asked if it was blacked out, I said no as far as I know the photos were freely available, how is that rubbing it in? A 10 second google search would have answered your question about the door. No, sorry. That was a dig at myself. Thanks for your info. Much appreciated, BTW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 13, 2018 Share Posted July 13, 2018 Just now, ri Alban said: No, sorry. That was a dig at myself. Thanks for your info. Much appreciated, BTW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Gentleman Posted July 14, 2018 Share Posted July 14, 2018 7 hours ago, Mikey1874 said: They've found the suspected poison container A major development potentially Yep, in the bloke's house (unsurprisingly). It'll be interesting to see how things go from here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 Big developments now. Russian suspects identified and seems the carrier was a perfume bottle. Lady who died may have sprayed it onto herself. Seems like media been briefed on the info not officially confirmed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armageddon Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 As above, the couple found a perfume bottle in a park, assuming while on a drug sesh, shes taken it home and sprayed it on herself. Unbelievably careless by the people responsible. Shows how they got it into the country though, they'll have the bag scans from the airport and no doubt it'll show this bottle at the time those responsible went through Security. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Armageddon said: As above, the couple found a perfume bottle in a park, assuming while on a drug sesh, shes taken it home and sprayed it on herself. Unbelievably careless by the people responsible. Shows how they got it into the country though, they'll have the bag scans from the airport and no doubt it'll show this bottle at the time those responsible went through Security. Yes, the Russians will have it on the bag scans from whatever Russian airport the perpretators left from, so unless the bags are scanned again upon entry to the UK, then the UK authorities have nothing, now we know why the bottle was dumped, apart from the obvious danger to themselves, it also means if the bottle was dumped then it can't be traced back to any particular bag or person if it wasn't scanned upon UK entry. As said unless bags are scanned again upon entry to the UK or the Russians had over their airport scans, then there is no definitive proof. However if they are scanned upon entry to the UK, then the authorities should be able to track that particular bag and who was carrying it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armageddon Posted July 19, 2018 Share Posted July 19, 2018 2 hours ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Yes, the Russians will have it on the bag scans from whatever Russian airport the perpretators left from, so unless the bags are scanned again upon entry to the UK, then the UK authorities have nothing, now we know why the bottle was dumped, apart from the obvious danger to themselves, it also means if the bottle was dumped then it can't be traced back to any particular bag or person if it wasn't scanned upon UK entry. As said unless bags are scanned again upon entry to the UK or the Russians had over their airport scans, then there is no definitive proof. However if they are scanned upon entry to the UK, then the authorities should be able to track that particular bag and who was carrying it. Haha oh aye - good point! Pesky wee buggers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 (edited) Good news Edited July 20, 2018 by Mikey1874 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 Let's have a wee reminder of all those insightful notions about it not being the Russians wot dun it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted July 20, 2018 Share Posted July 20, 2018 2 hours ago, Victorian said: Let's have a wee reminder of all those insightful notions about it not being the Russians wot dun it. Russian government? I don't think so, not a chance, as it would provoke tit for tat. Probably Russian mobsters that he's crossed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) Remember we were all reliably informed by some folks that it couldn't have been the Russians, well. Two Russian nationals have today been named as suspects in this case, indeed charges have been brought and an arrest warrant issued. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45421445 Edited September 5, 2018 by Jambo-Jimbo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphonseCapone Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Jambo-Jimbo said: Remember we were all reliably informed by some folks that it couldn't have been the Russians, well. Two Russian nationals have today been named as suspects in this case, indeed charges have been brought and an arrest warrant issued. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45421445 They weirdly look like the same guy with and without a beard! I suppose the UK will advocate some sanctions, the EU will water them down somewhat then agree. The Russians will mock the whole thing in their media playing to the local audience. And at some point in the near future we'll see the same thing happen all over again. Edited September 5, 2018 by AlphonseCapone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 No the Russians. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff the Mince Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 5 minutes ago, Victorian said: No the Russians. Na mate the Jews . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted September 5, 2018 Share Posted September 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Barack said: Russia says it's not them. How could you not trust this man? Why would he do this in the run up to a world cup. MI6 did this because the victims turned again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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