Tziolis

[Sharky999]

Djoum is being hounded on here tonight though, and he did far far more today than Tziolis despite spending over a third of the game out of position. Why aren't excuses for Djoum being rolled out like they are on a weekly basis for Tziolis?

im certainly not criticising Djoum, and never have, he's one of those players that gives his all in every game imo, sadly he's trying to pick up the slack and drive us forward from all ares of the pitch and not where he can ultimately make a difference.

Lets be honest how many players over the past 4-5?years(or longer) have we played out of position and been regularly slaughtered on here for being crap

[Captain America]

It may be his playing style but he seems lazy and can't be bothered. 

 

Needs too much time on the ball.

 

Football is a game of opinions but I am not seeing how people can think he was our best player today.

 

Nicholson who only played 50mins was the best player in White.

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

Djoum is being hounded on here tonight though, and he did far far more today than Tziolis despite spending over a third of the game out of position. Why aren't excuses for Djoum being rolled out like they are on a weekly basis for Tziolis?

Exactly. Some special cases on here. If you don't think he's just here for a holiday then you either don't see him play or you watch Hearts with your eyes closed.

[hibshater]

If you want to make the most of someone like him you need good movement ahead of him, we have no movement or anyone wanting the ball

this

[hibshater]

I don't think Tziolis played badly. The big problem is we have no width and he has no one looking to receive a pass.

this, imho the guy is quality.

[Funtime Jambo]

Currie was better today.

Lads definitely one for the future!

[joondalupjambo]

Can I just clarify something, are we now basing how good people played based on how dirty their shirt is after a game? 

 

Jeez if my Mum thought like that she must of thought that I was world class.   I used to come back home after all my Sunday afternoon matches with the dirtiest shirt ever, week in week out.  Mind you truth be told it was because either I kept slipping on my erky most of the time or it was hissing cats an dogs and the pitches were muddy    

 

I suspect that many very good players don't throw themselves around, some will not even break sweat but they can still control a game and make an impact.

 

From what I have seen of Tziolis he is good and unless he starts to see some improvement around him he will be off of his own accord.   He will not need to be pushed. 

[Finlay James]

He's miles ahead of everyone in the team but the movement up front is chronic.

 

Anyone who thinks this guy is mince needs their head read.

[Samuel Camazzola]

He's miles ahead of everyone in the team but the movement up front is chronic.

 

Anyone who thinks this guy is mince needs their head read.

Someone who has a grasp of things and can recognise we have a good player on our hands.

[Drewjambobusby]

Someone who has a grasp of things and can recognise we have a good player on our hands.

Absolutely.

 

Guy is class. His style is not charging about getting in peoples faces ? He needs Cowie etc to do that, and he will pick passes !!

At Easter Road he wasn`t strolling about he was having to go all over the park looking for the ball ?? Never see the best of him when that happens.

 

Class act, and I just hope we get to see best of him before he goes.

[Zibi]

I thought Tziolis started well yesterday but in the 2nd half tired. Looks a bit off the pace to me.

[richiehmfc]

He is clearly a quality player but is hamstrung by the way we are playing and lack of movement.

 

Playing another non creative defensive midfielder beside him is not needed. Kitchen Wednesday, Nowak today, added pretty much nothing.

 

We should be playing to this boys strength. Two forwards, one coming short, one going in behind. 2 wingers stretching the game and a strong runner beside him (Cowie, Djoum)

 

Unfortunately his current options involve popping it off to our full backs who refuse to take on a man or have wide options ahead of them so come back inside and the ball rotates round our defence before getting humped up to no one.

 

That's has been the way we played for the last 3 games.

[Diadora Van Basten]

Our Busquet but unfortunately he doesn't have Iniesta or other Barca players to do the attacking stuff.

[gashauskis9]

I reckon with Tziolis, we're sometimes blinded by the player we wanted him to be as opposed to what we've observed. We're routinely bad for this when we sign a player of even a remote pedigree. It happened with Watt earlier in the season, untouchable and excuses made for him. Meanwhile, guys like Sowah, Rherras, Sammon et al get it tight game after game.

[Darlo_Jambo]

He is clearly a quality player but is hamstrung by the way we are playing and lack of movement.

Playing another non creative defensive midfielder beside him is not needed. Kitchen Wednesday, Nowak today, added pretty much nothing.

We should be playing to this boys strength. Two forwards, one coming short, one going in behind. 2 wingers stretching the game and a strong runner beside him (Cowie, Djoum)

Unfortunately his current options involve popping it off to our full backs who refuse to take on a man or have wide options ahead of them so come back inside and the ball rotates round our defence before getting humped up to no one.

That's has been the way we played for the last 3 games.

Bang on...

[viva hate]

Djoum hardly got back today when we lost possession and just stood there or trotted back slowly. Tzoulis sprinted back everytime.

 

Tzoulis was looking for forward passes when he had the ball then had to resort to sideways and backward passes when nobody made a move.

[soonbe110]

If you want to make the most of someone like him you need good movement ahead of him, we have no movement or anyone wanting the ball

Spot on. Lost count of the number of times he won the ball yesterday looked up to make a pass and every white jersey in front of him was hiding. No option but to go backwards.

[soonbe110]

Currie was better today.

Currie was exactly what he is today. A young laddie with great potential but nowhere near ready to start games. He was anonymous today.

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

He's a Rolls-Royce that can't drive up a hill, alright to bring on if you're 3 nil up

[Mr Kipling]

Tziolis was one of Hearts' better players yesterday (although I don'y particularly think that anyone played very well tbh).

 

This is just my opinion but the thing about Tziolis is that before he gets the ball is already thinking ahead and looking to connect the ball with runners. I think he is an intelligent player, and no-one is on the same wavelength; If no one is running, or trying to get away from their man, his only option is sideways or backwards, which is immensely frustrating. If you watch him he is constantly trying to encourage teammates to move. The lack of movement yesterday was horrific. This was also an issue for Rherras, who was becoming increasingly annoyed by the lack of movement.

 

It also doesn't help playing people out of position. Why was Djoum playing right wing? did Walker have a free role in midfield? Sowah was dire at centre back, Nowak is gash and Isma just wanted a wrestle! 

 

 

[buzzbomb]

You're in danger of living up to your name.

 

So basically Tziolis is class but there are excuses every week for why this doesn't show.

 

The pitch is crap.

The game is too fast.

There is no movement.

Etc

Etc

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Started well but clearly not influential enough on results. Think again, I'm afraid

[Diadora Van Basten]

I think our problem is that nobody is linking Tziolus to Goncalves.

[karipidis]

Every single time he had the ball yesterday he looked up and there was no movement, so had to retain the ball. He clearly is a class player but I think there are a number of factors that makes it clear the move isn't working out for either party.

[Jimw44]

He did ok yesterday. Composed and won his share of tackles. However there was no movement in front of him. He was far from the worse

[JamboAl]

He's a Rolls-Royce that can't drive up a hill, alright to bring on if you're 3 nil up

Agreed.

However I will say he might be more effective if there was more movement in the team as others are equally guilty of his "sin".  When moves start from the back they go (slowly) from FB to CD to MF to FB, all receiving the ball standing still, then looking round, then turning back and then a suicide back pass to JH who gets hounded because he's not a sweeper keeper.

We need to be less ponderous/predictable and at least alternate between slow and quick build-up to keep the opposition guessing more.  A lot more practice with pace is required on the training ground with a view to varying our play.  At the moment we have one style and do not seem to be able to change (except in panic) when something untoward happens. 

[CollyWolly]

I dont think he's a lazy player by any means. He clearly has a bit of class and he's played at a much higher level than this. He's just one of those guys who's been playing a style of football they play just about everywhere else in Europe. Some can adapt when they come here. Some can't. He's a can't.

[Alva-Jambo]

Is all this due to not being tough Scottish players ? has  Mr Levein,  brought in silky people who didnt realise what football was like up here? 

 

We bring guys to show around lovely Edinburgh, and forget to mention some of the hard nuts they will be expected to play against? 

 

This guy is certainly class,  But I largely agree with the last post above. 

[Jamdub]

The guy is class and if we are fortunate enough for him to sign a contract we will be very lucky moving forward. 

[KirkiJambo]

If you watch the Easter road game back you can see that he is constantly looking for the ball and looking to progress it forward. Watch everyone else when he has the ball, hiding behind hibs players not looking for the pass. Only option that then gives him is sideways. Like others have said he needs movement in front of him.

[Drewjambobusby]

If you watch the Easter road game back you can see that he is constantly looking for the ball and looking to progress it forward. Watch everyone else when he has the ball, hiding behind hibs players not looking for the pass. Only option that then gives him is sideways. Like others have said he needs movement in front of him.

Pretty much where I am at.

 

Looked much better when we had work horses like Cowie on park.

 

Kind of player you build teams round !!!

[alanthejambo]

Partick passed the ball round our midfield very easily. My 12 year old kid who plays midfield for his team couldn't believe that "that number never uses his left foot". Forget comparisons with mercurial wingers like Cooper. That clearly he is not. Tried one dribble in the first half and lost the ball. Didn't even bother trying to get it back.

[Spencer]

Tziolis is a proper player. It's the pish around him you've got to be worried about.

 

Another tragic desperate thread looking for a miracle

[JamboAl]

Tziolis is a proper player. It's the pish around him you've got to be worried about.

 

Another tragic desperate thread looking for a miracle

It's the pish some people talk that ignores reality!

He is a proper player, and few of his critics have said otherwise, but are you suggesting we get a whole new MF/team for him to flourish?  He has to fit into what we have, not what we would love to have.

[Rudi5kaceldream1ng]

Zidane he certainly is not but he's a clever player. The Greek fans liken him to pirlo & I can kind of understand why. A very poor mans pirlo. Pirlo has awesome players around him though. Tziolis clearly isn't so good as to drag us by the scruff of the neck though.

 

Greek fans say his legs are gone and I would have to agree but if we had any players who could make intelligent runs this guy would be properly effective. Johnsen is good at finding players who make clever runs also..,,

 

Anyway it is what it is he's a talented player that hasn't been influential enough so far. His signing is boredering on failure though if this slide of bad results isn't arrested.

[Spencer]

It's the pish some people talk that ignores reality!

He is a proper player, and few of his critics have said otherwise, but are you suggesting we get a whole new MF/team for him to flourish? He has to fit into what we have, not what we would love to have.

No I'm not saying that. I'm saying if Cathro used him competently he'd be effective.

 

The lack of pace in our side and fascination of our Head Coach to play pedestrian narrow football is the wider problem imo

[JamboAl]

No I'm not saying that. I'm saying if Cathro used him competently he'd be effective.

 

The lack of pace in our side and fascination of our Head Coach to play pedestrian narrow football is the wider problem imo

So why don't you say it without calling other people's posts pish

Now please tell us, given the players we have. how you think he may be effective.  Give Cathro the benefit of your wisdom.

 

 

PS maybe even Sammon (or Muirhead or Watt etc) might have been effective if our Head Coach had used them competently.  Eh?

[Spencer]

So why don't you say it without calling other people's posts pish

Now please tell us, given the players we have. how you think he may be effective. Give Cathro the benefit of your wisdom.

 

 

PS maybe even Sammon (or Muirhead or Watt etc) might have been effective if our Head Coach had used them competently. Eh?

Cathro is doing a great job.

[JamboAl]

Cathro is doing a great job.

Aye - neat sidestep.

[DETTY29]

Can I just clarify something, are we now basing how good people played based on how dirty their shirt is after a game? 

 

Jeez if my Mum thought like that she must of thought that I was world class.   I used to come back home after all my Sunday afternoon matches with the dirtiest shirt ever, week in week out.  Mind you truth be told it was because either I kept slipping on my erky most of the time or it was hissing cats an dogs and the pitches were muddy    

 

I suspect that many very good players don't throw themselves around, some will not even break sweat but they can still control a game and make an impact.

 

From what I have seen of Tziolis he is good and unless he starts to see some improvement around him he will be off of his own accord.   He will not need to be pushed. 

I was at one of the talks Lazlo did with the fans along with Robbie Neilson who was captain at the time.

 

Lazlo was more than happy to tell the audience he had told Neilson to stop going to ground in tackle unless it was last gasp and he was sure of winning the ball.  'You're no good to me sitting on your backside' or along those lines.

 

I've been disappointed in Tziolis after a promising start but we knew the type of player we were getting.  He isn't going to change his style just because he has moved to Scotland.  That's up to Cathro and MacPhee to get the best out of him and identify any minor adjustments needed to support the team.  Otherwise we should never have brought him in.

 

As a PS yesterday is the second time now after Wednesday I've heard folk lose their crap with him for not trying to take on players when he as ended up in a wide position.  It's not going to happen.

[PTBCAL]

Currie was better today

 

Currie was totally anonymous yesterday. Hopelessly lost out wide tbh.

[maroonlegions]

Djoum hardly got back today when we lost possession and just stood there or trotted back slowly. Tzoulis sprinted back everytime.

 

Tzoulis was looking for forward passes when he had the ball then had to resort to sideways and backward passes when nobody made a move.

 

No movement= zero options, this is rampant in our team just now.  Hence our keeper blootering the ball up to Isma who is isolated. Do they do this in training, if they do then we know who to blame.

[JamboJen]

The big problem is we have no width and he has no one looking to receive a pass.

100% this. A Tziolis/Cowie central two would work really well imo.

[Bring Back Paulo Sergio]

No I'm not saying that. I'm saying if Cathro used him competently he'd be effective.

 

The lack of pace in our side and fascination of our Head Coach to play pedestrian narrow football is the wider problem imo

You could be on to something. So far Cathro has done him best to make good players look shite. Due to tactics or lack of.