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Stephane Grappelli

SNP MP Natalie McGarry

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Dusk_Till_Dawn

286F6DB100000578-3463994-Suspended_McGar

 

Wouldn't. Would.

 

God, what???

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coconut doug

As i explained it doesn't apply because we have a not proven verdict.

I cannot understand this point. If it does not apply why did Lord Bracadale say it?

 

 

post 28 "McGarry's position is untenable as an MP. "

 

post 40  "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police."

 

Traditional Labour supporters constantly trying to argue both sides at the same time. thank goodness for Corbyn and the principled clarity he brings.

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Seymour M Hersh

It's Coyote actually, hence the 'Coyote Ugly' film and bars.  As regards the OP, can't make my mind up whether she should stick to the 'innocent until proved guilty' line or do the proper thing and resign her seat to protect the party.    

 

Actually it's Hyena and that was in the 70's long before Coyote Ugly was a twinkle in the writers eye.

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Yoda

This.

 

Also a big test for the SNP, but I saw a poll that showed SNP on 50% and Labour in 3rd with 16% for the Westminster elections? 

She could have burnt down a children's home, SNP supporters will still vote SNP, no matter what.  Labour will be a distant 2nd.

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JamboX2

I cannot understand this point. If it does not apply why did Lord Bracadale say it?

 

Let me read the quote. My understanding, is that a Sheriff cannot say what you have noted. I know from English colleagues that it is used by Magistrates in their courts. Personally, never experienced it. But happy to read into it.

 

post 28 "McGarry's position is untenable as an MP. "

 

post 40 "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police."

 

Traditional Labour supporters constantly trying to argue both sides at the same time. thank goodness for Corbyn and the principled clarity he brings.

It's not untenable in a legal sense. It's untenable in a political one. She's a lame duck.

 

Hopefully in a by-election Corbyn's straight talking can win us a seat.

Edited by JamboX2

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Australis......

Was it not her fellow women for Indy campaigners that grassed her up to the police and the papers?

I don't think the her fellow SNP colleagues will be sorry to see the back of her if she is found guilty.

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XB52

She could have burnt down a children's home, SNP supporters will still vote SNP, no matter what.  Labour will be a distant 2nd.

Labour will be a distant 3rd I would suspect

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Deodato

FS

 

That's like a ferret standing next to a chipmunk

I just pissed myself laughing. 

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Sraman

Let me read the quote. My understanding, is that a Sheriff cannot say what you have noted. I know from English colleagues that it is used by Magistrates in their courts. Personally, never experienced it. But happy to read into it.

 

 

It's not untenable in a legal sense. It's untenable in a political one. She's a lame duck.

 

Hopefully in a by-election Corbyn's straight talking can win us a seat.

 

Given Scottish Labours new found autonomy Corbyn will have nothing to do with any by-election. Labours only chance is to go after the Unionist vote. I wonder how that will work out when Scottish Labour throw their kitchen sink at it, their kitchen sink consisting of Dugdale and Murphy??

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HaymarketJambo

She could have burnt down a children's home, SNP supporters will still vote SNP, no matter what.  Labour will be a distant 2nd.

 

Ah, but she didn't.

 

Speaking of burning what's Labour's Lord Watson up-to these day's?

Edited by HaymarketJambo

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Adam Murray

I'd imagine JK Rowling is having a little chuckle to herself 

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Gorgiewave

I'd imagine JK Rowling is having a little chuckle to herself 

 

She's probably earned the allegedly embezzled sum in royalties since yesterday.

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Victorian

It's hyena. Not coyote. Well.. I suppose it's both but hyena is an old analogy that's been on the go here for decades. McGarry is not hyena imo. Sturgeon is a pack of the bassas.

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Irufushi

Me too!

You would tackle anything.

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coconut doug

Let me read the quote. My understanding, is that a Sheriff cannot say what you have noted. I know from English colleagues that it is used by Magistrates in their courts. Personally, never experienced it. But happy to read into it.

 

 

It's not untenable in a legal sense. It's untenable in a political one. She's a lame duck.

 

Hopefully in a by-election Corbyn's straight talking can win us a seat.

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/152596/nursery-manager-cleared-of-embezzlement/

 

Here's an alleged embezzler told she can go free without a stain on her character and there are others. You seem to be suggesting that those found not guilty still carry some sort of stigma simply for being charged in the first place. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that and I'm pretty sure the sheriffs and Lords agree in these cases and that is why they used the phrases attributed to them. I think you are getting "not proven" and "not guilty" mixed up.

 

You never alluded to or pointed out in any way the notion of being untenable politically or legally. I don't understand the distinction and don't really think it exists.

 

It can't be good for a politician to have these allegations hanging over them but if they are not guilty why should they capitulate on the basis of allegations. Their position is in no way untenable until they have been found guilty. They are allowed to protest their innocence are they not?

 

I don't understand your statement "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police." The "not untenable" you speak of relates to her legal position you say but claim this is made worse by "being charged with embezzlement". There is no legal position other than being charged with embezzlement as far as I can tell. Can you tell me what being charged with embezzlement makes worse or "harder"?

 

It seems to me that once again you are just making things up and when challenged you are squirming around trying to justify your smears. McGarry has been found guilty of nothing, yet.

 

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Yoda

Ah, but she didn't.

 

Speaking of burning what's Labour's Lord Watson up-to these day's?

Unfortunately, living it up in House of Lords, when he should still be in jail for attempted murder.

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jambos are go!

Over the period of the next Parliament we will

consult with others to produce a fairer system based on ability to pay to

replace the Council Tax and we will put this to the people at the next

election,

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JamboX2

Given Scottish Labours new found autonomy Corbyn will have nothing to do with any by-election. Labours only chance is to go after the Unionist vote. I wonder how that will work out when Scottish Labour throw their kitchen sink at it, their kitchen sink consisting of Dugdale and Murphy??

It's a UK Parliament seat. The party is autonomous within the UK party. So Corbyn will be out. Whether that's good or bad who knows?

 

It'll be getting a lot of finance and members at it imo. A lot more of both now being the biggest party in Western Europe.

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JamboX2

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/152596/nursery-manager-cleared-of-embezzlement/

 

Here's an alleged embezzler told she can go free without a stain on her character and there are others. You seem to be suggesting that those found not guilty still carry some sort of stigma simply for being charged in the first place. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that and I'm pretty sure the sheriffs and Lords agree in these cases and that is why they used the phrases attributed to them. I think you are getting "not proven" and "not guilty" mixed up.

 

You never alluded to or pointed out in any way the notion of being untenable politically or legally. I don't understand the distinction and don't really think it exists.

 

It can't be good for a politician to have these allegations hanging over them but if they are not guilty why should they capitulate on the basis of allegations. Their position is in no way untenable until they have been found guilty. They are allowed to protest their innocence are they not?

 

I don't understand your statement "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police." The "not untenable" you speak of relates to her legal position you say but claim this is made worse by "being charged with embezzlement". There is no legal position other than being charged with embezzlement as far as I can tell. Can you tell me what being charged with embezzlement makes worse or "harder"?

 

It seems to me that once again you are just making things up and when challenged you are squirming around trying to justify your smears. McGarry has been found guilty of nothing, yet.

 

Untenable in a legal sense would mean legally unable to continue in her role. Which if charged she is pretty much done

 

Untenable politically would mean impossible to discharge her duties fully with integrity with what has happened. Eg, Eric Joyce after his multiple problems or Keith Vaz and his select committee post.

 

As for your last paragraph, gies peace mate. You make a good point and ruin it with that nonsense.

 

As for not proven v not guilty;

 

Guilty - evidence beyond reasonable doubt imparting guilt.

Not guilty - evidence not beyond a reasonable doubt.

Not proven - not enough evidenceto convict but enough to allow for not being not guilty.

 

That is why I do not think your wording as quoted can, and from my work have not heard the, use of "no stain".

 

However, I've been working all day and have enjoyed the footy tonight with a beer and intend to sleep away the night rather than debate this further for now.

Edited by JamboX2

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Big D

Was it not her fellow women for Indy campaigners that grassed her up to the police and the papers?

I don't think the her fellow SNP colleagues will be sorry to see the back of her if she is found guilty.

Someone asked who a by election candidate might be. Go figure. And a word of caution, some of these comments may be actionable now that charges have been brought, so the misogynists might want to swallow their pish. 

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Mister T

286F6DB100000578-3463994-Suspended_McGar

 

Wouldn't. Would.

No nay never ever.

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Dagger Is Back

FS

 

That's like a ferret standing next to a chipmunk

Wonderful!

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Dagger Is Back

286F6DB100000578-3463994-Suspended_McGar

 

Wouldn't. Would.

Could stash yer pieces in that belly button area. Maybe that's where the money's gone? Edited by Dagger Is Back

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Dawnrazor

I'd shag her.

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The Frenchman Returns

Ms McGarry, fourth from right, with her fellow SNP Glasgow MPs on election night in 2015

Would, Could, N/A, Absolutely would, Would, N/A, N/A, Even I wouldn't (unless of course alcohol was consumed)

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TheBigO
4 hours ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

Ms McGarry, fourth from right, with her fellow SNP Glasgow MPs on election night in 2015

Would, Could, N/A, Absolutely would, Would, N/A, N/A, Even I wouldn't (unless of course alcohol was consumed)

Why n/a? Fussy!

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gjcc
10 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Why n/a? Fussy!

 

Already had a shot of those ones perhaps? :lol: 

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JackLadd

The missing £25k has already been swept under the SNP carpet. 

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JackLadd
On 29/09/2016 at 15:17, Dawnrazor said:

I'd shag her.

 

You'd shag a barman's drying cloth.

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Boris
7 hours ago, JackLadd said:

The missing £25k has already been swept under the SNP carpet. 

 

Really?  In what way?

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JackLadd
2 hours ago, Boris said:

 

Really?  In what way?

 

Factually, spiritually, metaphorically... . To quote Steve Jones on the Bill Grundy show,  "Fackin spent it".

 

 

 

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Boris
4 minutes ago, JackLadd said:

 

Factually, spiritually, metaphorically... . To quote Steve Jones on the Bill Grundy show,  "Fackin spent it".

 

 

 

 

The money wasn't in the hands of the SNP though...and even if it was, she would have taken it from them, so not sure what your point is?  Are you saying that the SNP benefited from this embezzlement?

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John Gentleman
18 hours ago, The Frenchman Returns said:

Ms McGarry, fourth from right, with her fellow SNP Glasgow MPs on election night in 2015

Would, Could, N/A, Absolutely would, Would, N/A, N/A, Even I wouldn't (unless of course alcohol was consumed)

 

What's the collective noun for a bunch very odd-looking people? They look as though they'd score an average of 2 on the Glasgow Coma Scale.

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Boris
4 minutes ago, John Gentleman said:

 

What's the collective noun for a bunch very odd-looking people? They look as though they'd score an average of 2 on the Glasgow Coma Scale.

 

A cabinet?  It seems politicians in general are a bit odd...

 

Related image

 

 

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XB52
56 minutes ago, Boris said:

 

The money wasn't in the hands of the SNP though...and even if it was, she would have taken it from them, so not sure what your point is?  Are you saying that the SNP benefited from this embezzlement?

SNP bad is his answer; well every previous answer has been 

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SwindonJambo

Another Politician found guilty of financial impropriety. I'm not a supporter of her party but not would I use it as a stick to beat said party with. There are rogues in every party and walk of life in general unfortunately, abusing their position for personal gain. I just wish more of them were caught and appropriately punished.

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Craig_

The ravages of time appear to have been particularly ravaging in her case:

 

Image result for natalie mcgarry

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Gorgiewave
14 minutes ago, Craig_ said:

The ravages of time appear to have been particularly ravaging in her case:

 

Image result for natalie mcgarry

 

Really? Still would.

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The Frenchman Returns
3 hours ago, Craig_ said:

The ravages of time appear to have been particularly ravaging in her case:

 

Image result for natalie mcgarry

I have to confess I zoomed in to see if that was a bit of fluff just right of her bag strap.

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Super T
11 hours ago, John Gentleman said:

 

What's the collective noun for a bunch very odd-looking people? They look as though they'd score an average of 2 on the Glasgow Coma Scale.

A Crash

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manaliveits105

Latest survation poll 21% in favour of Indyref2 poll

bye Jimmy don’t let the door hit your shoulder pads on the way oot 

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Boris
11 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

Latest survation poll 21% in favour of Indyref2 poll

bye Jimmy don’t let the door hit your shoulder pads on the way oot 

 

The same poll that has the SNP winning 51 out of 59 seats at the next general election.

 

The schizophrenic nature of the Scottish electorate, eh?

 

"Jimmy" doesn't seem to be going anywhere with figures like that.

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Gorgiewave
4 minutes ago, Boris said:

 

The same poll that has the SNP winning 51 out of 59 seats at the next general election.

 

The schizophrenic nature of the Scottish electorate, eh?

 

"Jimmy" doesn't seem to be going anywhere with figures like that.

 

But she only has one policy and her party only has one purpose.

 

Independence is not happening.

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Boris
4 minutes ago, Gorgiewave said:

 

But she only has one policy and her party only has one purpose.

 

Independence is not happening.

 

Not true regards one policy, otherwise why would they be returned so massively at a GE?  The electorate obviously like the other policies.

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Gorgiewave
Just now, Boris said:

 

Not true regards one policy, otherwise why would they be returned so massively at a GE?  The electorate obviously like the other policies.

 

They'll certainly be loving the education policies: they're really, truly working.

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Boris
Just now, Gorgiewave said:

 

They'll certainly be loving the education policies: they're really, truly working.

 

Well, polls for Holyrood show the SNP doing very well again, so the electorate seem to think so.

 

I'm not really sure what your point is, I mean the SNP could shit gold doubloons and give them to the people making everyone super rich, but you'd still find fault with that, just because it's the SNP.

 

I get you don't like the concept or idea of independence, that's cool, your choice.  Most people in Scotland, it would seem, don't want independence yet either.  But, and perhaps it's because they actually live here and so are affected first hand by government, both Holyrood and Westminster, policies, that they elect those to represent them based on a number of issues.  As such, the SNP remains most popular political party in Scotland.

 

As I said, the schizophrenic nature of Scottish politics.

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gjcc
11 hours ago, manaliveits105 said:

Latest survation poll 21% in favour of Indyref2 poll

bye Jimmy don’t let the door hit your shoulder pads on the way oot 

 

Very selective of your figures there if it’s the same (“Scotland in Union” run) poll. 

 

34% said there should NOT be another referendum. 

8% were undecided. 

 

The 21% you quote was for there to be a referendum “within 2 years” as Nicola had suggested. The remainder was for 2-5 years, 5-10, years and over 10 years. 

 

So 58% ARE in favour of a referendum at some point, regardless of how they may choose to vote in it. 

 

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Gorgiewave
54 minutes ago, Boris said:

 

Well, polls for Holyrood show the SNP doing very well again, so the electorate seem to think so.

 

I'm not really sure what your point is, I mean the SNP could shit gold doubloons and give them to the people making everyone super rich, but you'd still find fault with that, just because it's the SNP.

 

I get you don't like the concept or idea of independence, that's cool, your choice.  Most people in Scotland, it would seem, don't want independence yet either.  But, and perhaps it's because they actually live here and so are affected first hand by government, both Holyrood and Westminster, policies, that they elect those to represent them based on a number of issues.  As such, the SNP remains most popular political party in Scotland.

 

As I said, the schizophrenic nature of Scottish politics.

 

Don't patronise people with the "yet" patter. The USSR thought it was the future, but the United States outlasted it.

 

The SNP will slowly die off, as will independence as a concept. At the moment it looks like hyenas and lionesses squabbling over the rancid corpse of a gazelle.

 

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Boris
6 minutes ago, Gorgiewave said:

 

Don't patronise people with the "yet" patter. The USSR thought it was the future, but the United States outlasted it.

 

Bizarre analogy.  Patronising?  If you say so, but all these non independence supporters still seem to vote SNP at elections so I doubt it is outwith the realms of possibility that some of them may switch sides.  Given the current nick of UK politics, maybe even more so.

 

6 minutes ago, Gorgiewave said:

 

The SNP will slowly die off, as will independence as a concept. At the moment it looks like hyenas and lionesses squabbling over the rancid corpse of a gazelle.

 

 

They may well do, but at the moment they seem to be in as strong a position as they ever have been.

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