Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Wouldn't. Would. God, what??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coconut doug Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 As i explained it doesn't apply because we have a not proven verdict. I cannot understand this point. If it does not apply why did Lord Bracadale say it? post 28 "McGarry's position is untenable as an MP. " post 40 "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police." Traditional Labour supporters constantly trying to argue both sides at the same time. thank goodness for Corbyn and the principled clarity he brings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 It's Coyote actually, hence the 'Coyote Ugly' film and bars. As regards the OP, can't make my mind up whether she should stick to the 'innocent until proved guilty' line or do the proper thing and resign her seat to protect the party. Actually it's Hyena and that was in the 70's long before Coyote Ugly was a twinkle in the writers eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoda Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 This. Also a big test for the SNP, but I saw a poll that showed SNP on 50% and Labour in 3rd with 16% for the Westminster elections? She could have burnt down a children's home, SNP supporters will still vote SNP, no matter what. Labour will be a distant 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboX2 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 (edited) I cannot understand this point. If it does not apply why did Lord Bracadale say it? Let me read the quote. My understanding, is that a Sheriff cannot say what you have noted. I know from English colleagues that it is used by Magistrates in their courts. Personally, never experienced it. But happy to read into it. post 28 "McGarry's position is untenable as an MP. " post 40 "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police." Traditional Labour supporters constantly trying to argue both sides at the same time. thank goodness for Corbyn and the principled clarity he brings. It's not untenable in a legal sense. It's untenable in a political one. She's a lame duck. Hopefully in a by-election Corbyn's straight talking can win us a seat. Edited September 28, 2016 by JamboX2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Australis Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Was it not her fellow women for Indy campaigners that grassed her up to the police and the papers? I don't think the her fellow SNP colleagues will be sorry to see the back of her if she is found guilty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XB52 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 She could have burnt down a children's home, SNP supporters will still vote SNP, no matter what. Labour will be a distant 2nd. Labour will be a distant 3rd I would suspect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deodato Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 FS That's like a ferret standing next to a chipmunk I just pissed myself laughing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sraman Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Let me read the quote. My understanding, is that a Sheriff cannot say what you have noted. I know from English colleagues that it is used by Magistrates in their courts. Personally, never experienced it. But happy to read into it. It's not untenable in a legal sense. It's untenable in a political one. She's a lame duck. Hopefully in a by-election Corbyn's straight talking can win us a seat. Given Scottish Labours new found autonomy Corbyn will have nothing to do with any by-election. Labours only chance is to go after the Unionist vote. I wonder how that will work out when Scottish Labour throw their kitchen sink at it, their kitchen sink consisting of Dugdale and Murphy?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaymarketJambo Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 (edited) She could have burnt down a children's home, SNP supporters will still vote SNP, no matter what. Labour will be a distant 2nd. Ah, but she didn't. Speaking of burning what's Labour's Lord Watson up-to these day's? Edited September 28, 2016 by HaymarketJambo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Murray Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 I'd imagine JK Rowling is having a little chuckle to herself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiewave Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 I'd imagine JK Rowling is having a little chuckle to herself She's probably earned the allegedly embezzled sum in royalties since yesterday. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 It's hyena. Not coyote. Well.. I suppose it's both but hyena is an old analogy that's been on the go here for decades. McGarry is not hyena imo. Sturgeon is a pack of the bassas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irufushi Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Me too! You would tackle anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coconut doug Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Let me read the quote. My understanding, is that a Sheriff cannot say what you have noted. I know from English colleagues that it is used by Magistrates in their courts. Personally, never experienced it. But happy to read into it. It's not untenable in a legal sense. It's untenable in a political one. She's a lame duck. Hopefully in a by-election Corbyn's straight talking can win us a seat. https://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/152596/nursery-manager-cleared-of-embezzlement/ Here's an alleged embezzler told she can go free without a stain on her character and there are others. You seem to be suggesting that those found not guilty still carry some sort of stigma simply for being charged in the first place. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that and I'm pretty sure the sheriffs and Lords agree in these cases and that is why they used the phrases attributed to them. I think you are getting "not proven" and "not guilty" mixed up. You never alluded to or pointed out in any way the notion of being untenable politically or legally. I don't understand the distinction and don't really think it exists. It can't be good for a politician to have these allegations hanging over them but if they are not guilty why should they capitulate on the basis of allegations. Their position is in no way untenable until they have been found guilty. They are allowed to protest their innocence are they not? I don't understand your statement "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police." The "not untenable" you speak of relates to her legal position you say but claim this is made worse by "being charged with embezzlement". There is no legal position other than being charged with embezzlement as far as I can tell. Can you tell me what being charged with embezzlement makes worse or "harder"? It seems to me that once again you are just making things up and when challenged you are squirming around trying to justify your smears. McGarry has been found guilty of nothing, yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoda Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Ah, but she didn't. Speaking of burning what's Labour's Lord Watson up-to these day's? Unfortunately, living it up in House of Lords, when he should still be in jail for attempted murder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambos are go! Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Over the period of the next Parliament we will consult with others to produce a fairer system based on ability to pay to replace the Council Tax and we will put this to the people at the next election, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboX2 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Given Scottish Labours new found autonomy Corbyn will have nothing to do with any by-election. Labours only chance is to go after the Unionist vote. I wonder how that will work out when Scottish Labour throw their kitchen sink at it, their kitchen sink consisting of Dugdale and Murphy?? It's a UK Parliament seat. The party is autonomous within the UK party. So Corbyn will be out. Whether that's good or bad who knows? It'll be getting a lot of finance and members at it imo. A lot more of both now being the biggest party in Western Europe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboX2 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 (edited) https://www.thecourier.co.uk/news/local/perth-kinross/152596/nursery-manager-cleared-of-embezzlement/ Here's an alleged embezzler told she can go free without a stain on her character and there are others. You seem to be suggesting that those found not guilty still carry some sort of stigma simply for being charged in the first place. I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that and I'm pretty sure the sheriffs and Lords agree in these cases and that is why they used the phrases attributed to them. I think you are getting "not proven" and "not guilty" mixed up. You never alluded to or pointed out in any way the notion of being untenable politically or legally. I don't understand the distinction and don't really think it exists. It can't be good for a politician to have these allegations hanging over them but if they are not guilty why should they capitulate on the basis of allegations. Their position is in no way untenable until they have been found guilty. They are allowed to protest their innocence are they not? I don't understand your statement "Her position is not untenable, but it is made harder by being charged with embezzlement by the police." The "not untenable" you speak of relates to her legal position you say but claim this is made worse by "being charged with embezzlement". There is no legal position other than being charged with embezzlement as far as I can tell. Can you tell me what being charged with embezzlement makes worse or "harder"? It seems to me that once again you are just making things up and when challenged you are squirming around trying to justify your smears. McGarry has been found guilty of nothing, yet. Untenable in a legal sense would mean legally unable to continue in her role. Which if charged she is pretty much done Untenable politically would mean impossible to discharge her duties fully with integrity with what has happened. Eg, Eric Joyce after his multiple problems or Keith Vaz and his select committee post. As for your last paragraph, gies peace mate. You make a good point and ruin it with that nonsense. As for not proven v not guilty; Guilty - evidence beyond reasonable doubt imparting guilt. Not guilty - evidence not beyond a reasonable doubt. Not proven - not enough evidenceto convict but enough to allow for not being not guilty. That is why I do not think your wording as quoted can, and from my work have not heard the, use of "no stain". However, I've been working all day and have enjoyed the footy tonight with a beer and intend to sleep away the night rather than debate this further for now. Edited September 28, 2016 by JamboX2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big D Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 Was it not her fellow women for Indy campaigners that grassed her up to the police and the papers? I don't think the her fellow SNP colleagues will be sorry to see the back of her if she is found guilty. Someone asked who a by election candidate might be. Go figure. And a word of caution, some of these comments may be actionable now that charges have been brought, so the misogynists might want to swallow their pish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister T Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 Wouldn't. Would. No nay never ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagger Is Back Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 FS That's like a ferret standing next to a chipmunk Wonderful! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagger Is Back Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 (edited) Wouldn't. Would. Could stash yer pieces in that belly button area. Maybe that's where the money's gone? Edited September 29, 2016 by Dagger Is Back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted September 29, 2016 Share Posted September 29, 2016 I'd shag her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Murray Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Found guilty, admitting two of the embezzlement charges. https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/former-snp-mp-natalie-mcgarry-pleads-guilty-to-embezzlement-1-4914528 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanks said no Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Would, Could, N/A, Absolutely would, Would, N/A, N/A, Even I wouldn't (unless of course alcohol was consumed) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigO Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 4 hours ago, The Frenchman Returns said: Would, Could, N/A, Absolutely would, Would, N/A, N/A, Even I wouldn't (unless of course alcohol was consumed) Why n/a? Fussy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcc Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 10 minutes ago, TheBigO said: Why n/a? Fussy! Already had a shot of those ones perhaps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackLadd Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 The missing £25k has already been swept under the SNP carpet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackLadd Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 On 29/09/2016 at 15:17, Dawnrazor said: I'd shag her. You'd shag a barman's drying cloth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 7 hours ago, JackLadd said: The missing £25k has already been swept under the SNP carpet. Really? In what way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackLadd Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 2 hours ago, Boris said: Really? In what way? Factually, spiritually, metaphorically... . To quote Steve Jones on the Bill Grundy show, "Fackin spent it". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, JackLadd said: Factually, spiritually, metaphorically... . To quote Steve Jones on the Bill Grundy show, "Fackin spent it". The money wasn't in the hands of the SNP though...and even if it was, she would have taken it from them, so not sure what your point is? Are you saying that the SNP benefited from this embezzlement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Gentleman Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 18 hours ago, The Frenchman Returns said: Would, Could, N/A, Absolutely would, Would, N/A, N/A, Even I wouldn't (unless of course alcohol was consumed) What's the collective noun for a bunch very odd-looking people? They look as though they'd score an average of 2 on the Glasgow Coma Scale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, John Gentleman said: What's the collective noun for a bunch very odd-looking people? They look as though they'd score an average of 2 on the Glasgow Coma Scale. A cabinet? It seems politicians in general are a bit odd... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XB52 Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 56 minutes ago, Boris said: The money wasn't in the hands of the SNP though...and even if it was, she would have taken it from them, so not sure what your point is? Are you saying that the SNP benefited from this embezzlement? SNP bad is his answer; well every previous answer has been Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwindonJambo Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 Another Politician found guilty of financial impropriety. I'm not a supporter of her party but not would I use it as a stick to beat said party with. There are rogues in every party and walk of life in general unfortunately, abusing their position for personal gain. I just wish more of them were caught and appropriately punished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig_ Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 The ravages of time appear to have been particularly ravaging in her case: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiewave Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 14 minutes ago, Craig_ said: The ravages of time appear to have been particularly ravaging in her case: Really? Still would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanks said no Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 3 hours ago, Craig_ said: The ravages of time appear to have been particularly ravaging in her case: I have to confess I zoomed in to see if that was a bit of fluff just right of her bag strap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super T Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 11 hours ago, John Gentleman said: What's the collective noun for a bunch very odd-looking people? They look as though they'd score an average of 2 on the Glasgow Coma Scale. A Crash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manaliveits105 Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 Latest survation poll 21% in favour of Indyref2 poll bye Jimmy don’t let the door hit your shoulder pads on the way oot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 11 hours ago, manaliveits105 said: Latest survation poll 21% in favour of Indyref2 poll bye Jimmy don’t let the door hit your shoulder pads on the way oot The same poll that has the SNP winning 51 out of 59 seats at the next general election. The schizophrenic nature of the Scottish electorate, eh? "Jimmy" doesn't seem to be going anywhere with figures like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiewave Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 4 minutes ago, Boris said: The same poll that has the SNP winning 51 out of 59 seats at the next general election. The schizophrenic nature of the Scottish electorate, eh? "Jimmy" doesn't seem to be going anywhere with figures like that. But she only has one policy and her party only has one purpose. Independence is not happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 4 minutes ago, Gorgiewave said: But she only has one policy and her party only has one purpose. Independence is not happening. Not true regards one policy, otherwise why would they be returned so massively at a GE? The electorate obviously like the other policies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiewave Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 Just now, Boris said: Not true regards one policy, otherwise why would they be returned so massively at a GE? The electorate obviously like the other policies. They'll certainly be loving the education policies: they're really, truly working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 Just now, Gorgiewave said: They'll certainly be loving the education policies: they're really, truly working. Well, polls for Holyrood show the SNP doing very well again, so the electorate seem to think so. I'm not really sure what your point is, I mean the SNP could shit gold doubloons and give them to the people making everyone super rich, but you'd still find fault with that, just because it's the SNP. I get you don't like the concept or idea of independence, that's cool, your choice. Most people in Scotland, it would seem, don't want independence yet either. But, and perhaps it's because they actually live here and so are affected first hand by government, both Holyrood and Westminster, policies, that they elect those to represent them based on a number of issues. As such, the SNP remains most popular political party in Scotland. As I said, the schizophrenic nature of Scottish politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjcc Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 11 hours ago, manaliveits105 said: Latest survation poll 21% in favour of Indyref2 poll bye Jimmy don’t let the door hit your shoulder pads on the way oot Very selective of your figures there if it’s the same (“Scotland in Union” run) poll. 34% said there should NOT be another referendum. 8% were undecided. The 21% you quote was for there to be a referendum “within 2 years” as Nicola had suggested. The remainder was for 2-5 years, 5-10, years and over 10 years. So 58% ARE in favour of a referendum at some point, regardless of how they may choose to vote in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiewave Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 54 minutes ago, Boris said: Well, polls for Holyrood show the SNP doing very well again, so the electorate seem to think so. I'm not really sure what your point is, I mean the SNP could shit gold doubloons and give them to the people making everyone super rich, but you'd still find fault with that, just because it's the SNP. I get you don't like the concept or idea of independence, that's cool, your choice. Most people in Scotland, it would seem, don't want independence yet either. But, and perhaps it's because they actually live here and so are affected first hand by government, both Holyrood and Westminster, policies, that they elect those to represent them based on a number of issues. As such, the SNP remains most popular political party in Scotland. As I said, the schizophrenic nature of Scottish politics. Don't patronise people with the "yet" patter. The USSR thought it was the future, but the United States outlasted it. The SNP will slowly die off, as will independence as a concept. At the moment it looks like hyenas and lionesses squabbling over the rancid corpse of a gazelle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boris Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 6 minutes ago, Gorgiewave said: Don't patronise people with the "yet" patter. The USSR thought it was the future, but the United States outlasted it. Bizarre analogy. Patronising? If you say so, but all these non independence supporters still seem to vote SNP at elections so I doubt it is outwith the realms of possibility that some of them may switch sides. Given the current nick of UK politics, maybe even more so. 6 minutes ago, Gorgiewave said: The SNP will slowly die off, as will independence as a concept. At the moment it looks like hyenas and lionesses squabbling over the rancid corpse of a gazelle. They may well do, but at the moment they seem to be in as strong a position as they ever have been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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