3fingersreid Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Sullivan not Sutherland.Fekin autocorrect you're right cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riccarton3 Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Beckham v Sutherland , (Scotland keeper) Rooney v Adrian (1Spanish cap ?) Adam v Courtois (Belgian keeper) Shock it happens to male keepers too!! Still puzzled as to why people -and not just yourself Ray Gin - dislike women's football so much yet still seem to watch it? Fantastic final to watch if your a Yank or a neutral and will hopefully continue to drive on the development of the women's game in the future Seaman v Zaragoza (Nayim) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSTR Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 See one things that's always baffled me about womens football. Why don't the best female teams correlate to the best male teams. You'd think if Argentina, Colombia, Spain etc. Can produce excellent male talent then why are their womens teams not as good? Like Japan, there mens team is nothing special, yet they are one of the best womens teams The USA women have won the WWC 3 times now compared to the mens team who have never been close to winning one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WSTR Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Howard v Bogdan was another. Robinson v Foster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3fingersreid Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Seaman v Zaragoza (Nayim)Was it not him who lost a goal to Brazil from distance too ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3fingersreid Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 See one things that's always baffled me about womens football. Why don't the best female teams correlate to the best male teams. You'd think if Argentina, Colombia, Spain etc. Can produce excellent male talent then why are their womens teams not as good? Like Japan, there mens team is nothing special, yet they are one of the best womens teams The USA women have won the WWC 3 times now compared to the mens team who have never been close to winning one. I appreciate where that logic comes from but honestly to see the game for what it is you need to stop any comparison to the men's game and the sooner the commentators and pundits grasp this the better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Does this actually happen? Have they started playing 5 set matches?No, still the best of 3 sets.It's just that they tire easily with all the housework they have to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riccarton3 Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Was it not him who lost a goal to Brazil from distance too ? Yes. Ronaldinho chipped him from 45 yards. I haven't seen the Japan blunder but Nayim's goal sprung to mind - goalkeeping back peddling, weak hand to ball - just like a poster described above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homme Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 See the FA tweeted about the England players going back to be Mothers, Sisters and Daughters now they are home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Z Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 The USA women have won the WWC 3 times now compared to the mens team who have never been close to winning one. The issue in the States is that our universities are required to give out an equal number of scholarships for women's sports as they are men's. Therefore any women's sport that is not terribly "professionalized," American women are going to have a bit of an advantage built in. Here's an article about this phenomenon and its effects: http://thinkprogress.org/alyssa/2012/08/10/674531/title-ix-and-the-success-of-women-at-the-olympics/ And then of course by contrast, almost none of our national team attended university because NCAA soccer is not high quality at all. One curious exception to that is Clint Dempsey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watt-Zeefuik Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 The issue in the States is that our universities are required to give out an equal number of scholarships for women's sports as they are men's. Therefore any women's sport that is not terribly "professionalized," American women are going to have a bit of an advantage built in. Here's an article about this phenomenon and its effects: http://thinkprogress.org/alyssa/2012/08/10/674531/title-ix-and-the-success-of-women-at-the-olympics/ And then of course by contrast, almost none of our national team attended university because NCAA soccer is not high quality at all. One curious exception to that is Clint Dempsey. Exactly -- Title IX is basically responsible for US WWC dominance. Well, that, and it being seen as a game equally for both boys and girls at the grade school level. On the other hand, the dominance of US men's soccer by prep school douchebags for decades is the reason we're still pretty meh at it. We're starting to do it right in places at the youth level, but it'll be a decade at least before the results start to show up on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regal Kingston Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 All the countries that performed well in the Women's World Cup were from nations where women are respected and encouraged to fulfil their potential as footballers. I can't say for certain but perhaps that's not the case in South America? Its certainly not in most if not all of the Arab countries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carowitz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 All the countries that performed well in the Women's World Cup were from nations where women are respected and encouraged to fulfil their potential as footballers. I can't say for certain but perhaps that's not the case in South America? Its certainly not in most if not all of the Arab countries. Not sure I agree with this. England did well, however, if you take a look over on the Women's football thread the one word you would struggle to attach to the majority of the posts is respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Not sure I agree with this. England did well, however, if you take a look over on the Women's football thread the one word you would struggle to attach to the majority of the posts is respect. Women are respected in this country on the whole when it comes to sport in general. Think there is a bit to go before the footballers have that respect from the average Joe in the street who will always view it as a man's game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 See one things that's always baffled me about womens football. Why don't the best female teams correlate to the best male teams. You'd think if Argentina, Colombia, Spain etc. Can produce excellent male talent then why are their womens teams not as good? Like Japan, there mens team is nothing special, yet they are one of the best womens teams The USA women have won the WWC 3 times now compared to the mens team who have never been close to winning one. Places like Colombia, Spain and Argentina are more traditional than the other ones you mention and women maybe want to act like women have in the past and football will be a mans game, like it was here until recently. Im in my 30s and it was unheard of for girls to play footy at school, well apart from Gregorys girl. The likes of USA amd Japan have obviously got a heads start over the years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carowitz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Women are respected in this country on the whole when it comes to sport in general. Think there is a bit to go before the footballers have that respect from the average Joe in the street who will always view it as a man's game. You are correct the attitude is improving (slowly) but at least it's moving in the right direction.Women's football however remains behind other female sports in terms of funding and sponsorship. Compare and contrast the money given to Jess Ennis Hill, Laura Robson or Heather Watson with any female footballer and you will see a huge gap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Beckham v Sutherland , (Scotland keeper) Rooney v Adrian (1Spanish cap ?) Adam v Courtois (Belgian keeper) Shock it happens to male keepers too!! Still puzzled as to why people -and not just yourself Ray Gin - dislike women's football so much yet still seem to watch it? Fantastic final to watch if your a Yank or a neutral and will hopefully continue to drive on the development of the women's game in the future I haven't stated any strong dislike for women's football. I just thought that goal was a terrible display of goalkeeping - definitely worse than those mentioned above. There have undoubtedly been worse clangers by male keepers though - even Craig Gordon managed one in the last minute versus Celtic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 No, still the best of 3 sets. It's just that they tire easily with all the housework they have to do. That's a pisstake. They get the same pay for 60% of the court-time? I'm all for them getting equal pay, but that's not equal pay if they are doing less work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3fingersreid Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 I haven't stated any strong dislike for women's football. I just thought that goal was a terrible display of goalkeeping - definitely worse than those mentioned above. There have undoubtedly been worse clangers by male keepers though - even Craig Gordon managed one in the last minute versus Celtic.Fair enough I respect your opinion ,but I am curious as to how you think it was worse than those mentioned above , Sullivan was definetly worse IMHO he never got a hand to it at all and as for Adrian's well he just fell over at the end Running backwards ,trying to get off the ground , and still trying to get a strong hand to the ball is difficult even for the best keepers ,never mind a woman who has a long way to go to get to that level As I say I respect your opinion but I feel it's unjust to say it was worse than her male counterparts Your point on tennis is however justified equal pay equal hours Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homme Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 My step-daughter plays for an u11 team. It's encouraging to see how popular the game is becoming for young female kids. Big kudos must go to the coaches who have chosen to coach young girls too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Fair enough I respect your opinion ,but I am curious as to how you think it was worse than those mentioned above , Sullivan was definetly worse IMHO he never got a hand to it at all and as for Adrian's well he just fell over at the end Running backwards ,trying to get off the ground , and still trying to get a strong hand to the ball is difficult even for the best keepers ,never mind a woman who has a long way to go to get to that level As I say I respect your opinion but I feel it's unjust to say it was worse than her male counterparts Your point on tennis is however justified equal pay equal hours vs Japan it doesn't have a particularly massive amount of dip on the strike. It also actually touches the ground before reaching the line. She seemed to be slow at trying to get back and then just kind of feebly fell over and flapped a hand at it. Beckham's just creeps under the bar. No chance for the keeper. Rooney's strike starts much higher and dips massively so is harder to judge. Keeper should have done better though. Adam's, the keeper is far quicker at getting back and makes a decent effort at getting a hand on it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzJbtQY6DvY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carowitz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 That's a pisstake. They get the same pay for 60% of the court-time? I'm all for them getting equal pay, but that's not equal pay if they are doing less work.The Women have said on numerous occassions that they are ready, willing and able to play 5 sets. I think you will find that the reason they don't get to is because this would greatly increase court time and may lead to grand slams having to be extended. It would also mean scheduling court issues. The women demanded equal pay because they train the same amount of hours during the week as the men. So effectively they don't do 60% of what the men do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 The Women have said on numerous occassions that they are ready, willing and able to play 5 sets. I think you will find that the reason they don't get to is because this would greatly increase court time and may lead to grand slams having to be extended. It would also mean scheduling court issues. The women demanded equal pay because they train the same amount of hours during the week as the men. So effectively they don't do 60% of what the men do.So what if they train the same number of hours a week.It's on court that counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carowitz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 So what if they train the same number of hours a week. It's on court that counts. Is it? Lets put this into real world context. You and a colleague have to each deliver a presentation. During the week you put exactly the same amount of hours (e.g 37.5) into your respective presentations. Your colleagues presentation is however longer then yours because they have been allocated a longer time slot. Your colleague gets 40% more money that you do. I'm sure you would be delighted for them and perfectly happy to accept the scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Is it? Lets put this into real world context. You and a colleague have to each deliver a presentation. During the week you put exactly the same amount of hours (e.g 37.5) into your respective presentations. Your colleagues presentation is however longer then yours because they have been allocated a longer time slot. Your colleague gets 40% more money that you do. I'm sure you would be delighted for them and perfectly happy to accept the scenario. It's not comparable. Nobody gets paid for training and you can do as many hours as you like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3fingersreid Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 vs Japan it doesn't have a particularly massive amount of dip on the strike. It also actually touches the ground before reaching the line. She seemed to be slow at trying to get back and then just kind of feebly fell over and flapped a hand at it. Beckham's just creeps under the bar. No chance for the keeper. Rooney's strike starts much higher and dips massively so is harder to judge. Keeper should have done better though. Adam's, the keeper is far quicker at getting back and makes a decent effort at getting a hand on it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vzJbtQY6DvY I think we'll need to agree to disagree on this tbh the Japanese keeper is falling backwards as she gets a hand to it ,perhaps if she been able to keep her feet for another step or two it might have been different, however the mistakes made by her male international counterparts remain worse for me ,although I agree Courtois did have a right good go at it What each of these goals show is no matter how good you are ,or whatever sex you are, to stop a ball at pace and height whilst running backwards is bloody difficult regardless of standard , to which I prefer to give credit to the scorer rather than being overly critical to the keeper ( might be cause that was my position) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 It's not comparable. Nobody gets paid for training and you can do as many hours as you like. Correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carowitz Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 It's not comparable. Nobody gets paid for training and you can do as many hours as you like.Nope not correct. Look at football.Amateur status not paid Semi professional paid expenses or paid per game Professional paid to train and play. All of the current first team have mandatory training written into their contracts. Paid only for playing would leave a lot of very unhappy squad members. We already know our team don't like not being paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Future's Maroon Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 What each of these goals show is no matter how good you are ,or whatever sex you are, to stop a ball at pace and height whilst running backwards is bloody difficult regardless of standard , to which I prefer to give credit to the scorer rather than being overly critical to the keeper ( might be cause that was my position) Agree 100% with the above. Unless you have played in goals (not just down the local park with your mates) in a proper game no-one will understand how difficult it actually is to run backwards, keep eye on ball and have your bearings as to where your goal is....played that position myself, and been lobbed from just inside my own half....will never forget that goal, I took the ribbing for it but to be fair the kudos should go to the player hitting the ball for his vision (and pure brass neck to try it)! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Gin Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Nope not correct. Look at football. Amateur status not paid Semi professional paid expenses or paid per game Professional paid to train and play. All of the current first team have mandatory training written into their contracts. Paid only for playing would leave a lot of very unhappy squad members. We already know our team don't like not being paid. We're not talking about football, we're talking about tennis. You don't get paid to train. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3fingersreid Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 On the subject of same pay in sport ,women golfers play 4 rounds ,albeit on a slightly shorter course , what's the difference in pay in tournaments in comparison to their male counterparts ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 On the subject of same pay in sport ,women golfers play 4 rounds ,albeit on a slightly shorter course , what's the difference in pay in tournaments in comparison to their male counterparts ?Not sure but viewingfigures, prestige and sponsorship will be miles apart as well as the quality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RudiHMFC Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Mens sport is miles better than womens that's why millions more people watch it and that's why they are paid millions more. Simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watt-Zeefuik Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Mens sport is miles better than womens that's why millions more people watch it and that's why they are paid millions more. Simple. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/07/sports/soccer/womens-world-cup-final-was-most-watched-soccer-game-in-united-states-history.html One-game finals in four-year events are hard to compare to others, but the only sport that beat WWC in the US in the past 12 months (that I can find) is the NFL. No NBA, MLB, or NHL game passed it, nor did any golf, tennis, or other individual sport event come close to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/07/sports/soccer/womens-world-cup-final-was-most-watched-soccer-game-in-united-states-history.html One-game finals in four-year events are hard to compare to others, but the only sport that beat WWC in the US in the past 12 months (that I can find) is the NFL. No NBA, MLB, or NHL game passed it, nor did any golf, tennis, or other individual sport event come close to it. It certainly generating a hell of a lot of interest. I was at the NASCAR race at Daytona on Sunday. It was delayed by four hours due to rain (starting at 11.45pm!), and like many, we sat watching the final in a local BW3s, which was rammed with both football fans and hillbillys getting tanked before the race. Everyone seemed pretty into it. Also a factor there was **** all else on TV that night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 http://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/07/sports/soccer/womens-world-cup-final-was-most-watched-soccer-game-in-united-states-history.html One-game finals in four-year events are hard to compare to others, but the only sport that beat WWC in the US in the past 12 months (that I can find) is the NFL. No NBA, MLB, or NHL game passed it, nor did any golf, tennis, or other individual sport event come close to it. Those figures are for the US, where the womens team is substantially more successful than the mens team. I doubt you'd see them in any other country with substantial numbers of potential viewers of the mens WC final.. Also, the NFL is the only sport that has a Championship game, the other 3 sports you mentioned play a series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watt-Zeefuik Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 Those figures are for the US, where the womens team is substantially more successful than the mens team. I doubt you'd see them in any other country with substantial numbers of potential viewers of the mens WC final.. Also, the NFL is the only sport that has a Championship game, the other 3 sports you mentioned play a series. On the other hand, nearly 30 million people watched it even with a horrific announcing team. Folks everywhere like a winner. England's 8.5% share for the third place game was respectable, although as you say, certainly far lower than the men would get in a similar circumstance, but it also probably would have been 2-3 million had England made the final. ( I'm not making the case that women are as popular as the men or anywhere near it, but the notion that nobody's watching is silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 On the other hand, nearly 30 million people watched it even with a horrific announcing team. Folks everywhere like a winner. England's 8.5% share for the third place game was respectable, although as you say, certainly far lower than the men would get in a similar circumstance, but it also probably would have been 2-3 million had England made the final. ( I'm not making the case that women are as popular as the men or anywhere near it, but the notion that nobody's watching is silly. I don't disagree to the rising popularity, and long may it continue, but your post above was in response to the idea that men are paid more than women because many, MANY more people watch the mens game. An idea that I think is entirely valid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peebo Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I don't disagree to the rising popularity, and long may it continue, but your post above was in response to the idea that men are paid more than women because many, MANY more people watch the mens game. An idea that I think is entirely valid. Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankblack Posted July 8, 2015 Share Posted July 8, 2015 I am sure that Women's beach volleyball is more popular than mens and makes more money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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