Scotland on Sunday gives Rangers pelters...

[King of the North]

A scottish newspaper at last giving the huns all they deserve...

 

 

1. No excuses...

http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/sport/No-hiding-place-for-the.4095438.jp

 

2. UEFA need to get involved ...

http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/sport/Tom-English-Silence-of-UEFA.4095433.jp

 

3. Exploding the Daily Record myth that 'heroic' huns fans rescued that copper. Turns out he was a manc, who dodged bottles to do it... http://scotlandonsunday.scotsman.com/latestnews/39I-didn39t-care-about-the.4095350.jp

 

 

I think the Scotsman Publications, by and large, has been an utter disgrace for years - but respect due here. This is EXACTLY what the Scottish Media should be doing - despite Murrays requests for smokescreens.

[Imeantasong]

Just read the bottom one.

 

Have a right go at the Record.

 

Just shows the lengths the Glasgow media will go to protect their own.

[shaun.lawson]

Magnificent articles, all of them. Halle-freaking-lujah.

[Drew Busby !]

Also a good one in similar vein in todays Times.

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/article3953311.ece

[Denny Crane]

Also a good one in similar vein in todays Times.

 

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/article3953311.ece

 

Out of interest, is that the same woman (who used to be on the Herald) who JKB had a run in with a couple of years back?

[269miles]

Thanks for posting these links.

 

My thoughts over the last few days have been about the acquiescence of the Scottish press and their refusal to condemn the Catholic apartheid that Rangers created and have profited from so handsomely since.

Perhaps the worm has turned. I'd like to think so.

 

Going off on a tangent , did anyone tune into the 606 programme tonight ?

We were treated to the nauseating sound of a Rangers fan who opened up with platitudes about Tommy Burns and how Rangers buses returning from Madchester stopped off at Parkhead to pay tribute to TM. Naturally we eventually got to the events of 'that night'. The caller was so well informed that he was able to blame Chelsea , Milwall & Stoke fans for all the trouble that night.

 

I thought that Alan Green would perhaps put the guy straight on all the complaints from Mancs about the sectarian pomp that was so proudly displayed by so many. But no. AG mumped on about the behaviour of the fans inside the stadium (which as far as I know had never been at issue).

As a man from Norn Iron I'd have thought he'd know sectarian behaviour when he sees it and with his reputation he might even condemn it. But , no. It didn't even rate a mention. A guy who is so fearless but seemed so reluctant to indulge in any criticism of Rangers.

 

I turned the radio off in disgust.

[Drew Busby !]

Out of interest, is that the same woman (who used to be on the Herald) who JKB had a run in with a couple of years back?

 

Think you might be right, that was the Rix thing wasn't it....

 

Anyway, Tom English's and her article are all right on the money as regards the Rangers problem.

[Only a Game]

And, after 4 full days, the head of the SFA has not uttered one word on the subject.

 

That, in itself, is an utter disgrace.

[Rick Grimes]

all excellent articles. the call for more action by UEFA is definitely right. i'd like to hear more from the SFA too

[269miles]

And, after 4 full days, the head of the SFA has not uttered one word on the subject.

 

That, in itself, is an utter disgrace.

 

Gordhun is waiting on Davros to tell him what to say.

 

As Bells' article points out , 40 arrests and a stabbing is probably a quiet wekend in Glasgow. What's the big deal.

For God's sake , the Russians invaded the pitch : I'm surprised the ****** hasn't run an article about how the Rangers players lives were put at risk (forgot to insert sarcastic smiley).

[Sparky]

Yeah, 606 and Alan Green were terrible.

 

Regarding the OP, Nice to see some media has the balls to report it.

[Rick Grimes]

Davros

 

 

[Beverley]

davros?

 

 

 

how offensive

 

 

davros, to my knowledge was never a bigoted, blinkered warmonger...

 

 

oh

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Surely it isn't coincidence that Tom English is actually Irish?

[Charlie-Brown]

probably as appropriate here as the other thread.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OITh-CnMcQc

 

 

Their greatest moment....John Grieg in a wee room...............

[Charlie-Brown]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CV7cmyJY0SM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJIm7dDl1DQ

 

Charming!

[lofer12]

***

[Only a Game]

8****

 

No no, he paid us a visit yesterday to give us all a row for wanting Celtic to win the league (or Rangers to lose it rather)

 

It was short and sweet and he says hello, hello.

[flecktimus]

Surely it isn't coincidence that Tom English is actually Irish?

 

Couldn't care less if he was the Pope himself. The point is a Scottish Newspaper has at last broke ranks and told it how most SCOTS see it.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Couldn't care less if he was the Pope himself. The point is a Scottish Newspaper has at last broke ranks and told it how most SCOTS see it.

 

Agreed. The point is that the insularity of Scottish hacks has contributed to this cover up.

[The cruckie cookie]

Superb article from Tom English.

 

It covers what most sane thinking people have been thinking since the riots.

 

The more coverage we get, the better imo as it shows up Rangers and their supporters for what they are... biggoted morons.

[7628mm]

Couldn't care less if he was the Pope himself. The point is a Scottish Newspaper has at last broke ranks and told it how most SCOTS see it.

 

 

I now await the Hootsman being fined by the blatantly bigotted Glasgow Football Association (Govan Branch) for bringing the game into disrepute.

The blatantly bigotted East End Branch will be told to keep quiet so as to protect them from the fall out.

[Imeantasong]

http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/opinion/columnists/gordon-waddell/2008/05/18/all-gers-fans-tarnished-by-same-brush-78057-20421499/

 

Ach well, looks like The Sunday Mail are in on the act now too. Mind you, the Zenit fans take a bit more bashing that I've seen.

 

Youtube, all day news coverage from non-Scottish stations etc means they can't get away with it like they used to could.

 

Still nowhere near as hard hitting as the Scotland on Sunday or Times articles.

[Charlie-Brown]

http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/opinion/columnists/gordon-waddell/2008/05/18/all-gers-fans-tarnished-by-same-brush-78057-20421499/

 

Ach well, looks like The Sunday Mail are in on the act now too. Mind you, the Zenit fans take a bit more bashing that I've seen.

 

Youtube, all day news coverage from non-Scottish stations etc means they can't get away with it like they used to could.

 

Still nowhere near as hard hitting as the Scotland on Sunday or Times articles.

 

Basically they can no longer hide or pervert the truth in the face of such pervasive & extensive news media available nowadays - the Sunday Mail / Daily Record are also being dragged into the 21st Century and being made to face uncomfortable truths about themselves as well as certain sporting institutions they cover........

[ToadKiller Dog]

Good to see that some of the scottish media taking a correct stance .Good articles from the hootsmon.

 

On a side.

Maybe that Tom Bardsley will get put forward for a medal from the queen for his bravey a bit like that smeaton bloke.

[Jarhead]

On the plus side, at least we won't have to listen to the OF slavering about how we're holding them back and they should be part of the Premiership, well, not for a while anyway.

I don't think they will be welcomed back anytime soon.

[heartscat]

The Daily Record reporter that penned the piece from Manchester - his own account of 'police brutality' - is a massive Rangers fan. Not that that was mentioned anywhere. Just thought I'd make that point. That newspaper's stance on this whole affair is shocking. I bought three papers that day, and it was laughable comparing the pieces - the Record claiming none of the fans involved were Rangers fans wearing colours, and then the front page of the Daily Mail with an image of Rangers fans wearing colours running at the police on the the front, and a guy in a red white and blue afro wig and full Gers kit inside, standing beside a smashed up car. But he was clearly a member of oneof the English hooligan organisations....

Pathetic.

[269miles]

Magnificent articles, all of them. Halle-freaking-lujah.

 

Maybe you should read it fully and carefully (the last link) : this bit is VERY interesting -

 

IN THE middle of the swelling crowd in Piccadilly Gardens, he was just another bloke in a Rangers shirt, trying to find a good spot to watch the big match. But this dedicated fan, caught up in last week's events in Manchester, was used to working on the other side of the riot lines.

 

The fan, who wishes to remain anonymous, is also a senior police officer in the Strathclyde force, with wide experience of crowd control. Yesterday, he launched a scathing attack on the policing of the event, calling into question the tactics used by colleagues south of the border. It was, he said, "a disaster waiting to happen".

 

The officer was in the throng in the city centre when he realised things were getting out of control. And it was not the crowd, but police who were behaving "excessively".

He said: "I am sorry to say that my impression of the Manchester public order officers is that things seemed to escalate almost immediately to shields, helmets and batons.

 

"I personally saw officers who were excessive in their behaviour. They were pushing people back with shields when those persons were just approaching them to ask questions.

 

"There's no doubt there were hooligans there and some of them got what they deserved, but it would appear that, perhaps on some occasions, the policing was excessive."

 

Part of the problem, he said, was an apparent lack of preparedness for the scale of the Rangers support. "They were caught out by the numbers of fans and where they were congregated.

 

"All the designated fan-zones were grossly overpopulated. I can speak from experience when I say it was a recipe for disaster. I went to Piccadilly and Albert Square, and I couldn't have turned round to get something out of my rucksack in either of them. I couldn't have tied my laces."

 

The actions of the riot police were, he said, questionable: "They had full public-order (riot] gear on and two officers had their batons above their heads. That should only have happened if there was an imminent threat, and to me that was excessive and shouldn't have happened.

"We in Strathclyde have only escalated to that level of public order once, and that was during G8, so that gives you some idea. We just wouldn't have done that. Maybe their training is different from ours."

 

The start of the trouble came quickly, he said. "Everything just came together: the screen going off; the English football casuals throwing things; it was so vastly overcrowded. I was in there for three minutes and came straight out. It was a disaster waiting to happen. It should have been spotted long before by the people in charge of the arenas, the security guards. But there would appear to have been no number-counting. People kept coming. It was crazy. Without a doubt, there should be an inquiry."

 

John O'Connor, a former commander of Scotland Yard's Flying Squad, called for an investigation by the Independent Police Complaints Commission into the "utter stupidity" of the policing operation.

 

He said: "Police were outnumbered and let down by senior officers. They have been almost conned into believing this was going to be a fun festival of football and all the jolly folk from Glasgow were going to come down

 

 

According to another thread the NOTW is running a story about English hoolies being involved in the violence. For some reason the English version of the paper isn't running that story. I know because I just read it 20 mins ago.

 

What the hell happened to NCIS or whatever it is called now ? I thought English/Scottish/British police were supposed to be gathering intelligence in advance of bigg ames like this. You'd have thought that with Rangers propensity to attarct right wing knuckle draggers that the police would be monitoring this very closely.

 

But to to the link : we have a hearsay account form a senior Strathclyde police officer who just hapens happens to have wide experience of crowd control. He is also a Rangers fan.

We then have ANOTHER police officer - well , acually that is ambiguous because it only says he is a 'former commander' - who is spouting off. It's not clear if he was also a Rangers fan who was in attendance or just a convenient rent a quote for Rangers apologists. He isn't quoted as actually saying anything of any substance in terms of his criticism. But if you Google his name ...well, this bloke seems to have an opinion on everything. But coser to home , he seems to have been involved with the Madeleine McCann case.

 

Know what I mean guvnor ?

[Sheriff Fatman]

Oh how I love the irony of a Strathclyde police officer accusing another force of being heavy handed with football supporters.

[Jarhead]

The anonymous qoutes from the "Strathclyde police officer" are almost laughable as part of the reason I no longer follow hearts to Parkhead and Ibrox is the treatment meated out by 'Glasgows finest'. Pots kettles and all that.

 

Also interesting that there were more arrests at the Ibrox beamback than there were at the last OF game.

 

Rangers, as a football club, can no longer deny their culpability for any of this.

[inspector]

The anonymous qoutes from the "Strathclyde police officer" are almost laughable as part of the reason I no longer follow hearts to Parkhead and Ibrox is the treatment meated out by 'Glasgows finest'. Pots kettles and all that.

 

Also interesting that there were more arrests at the Ibrox beamback than there were at the last OF game.

 

Rangers, as a football club, can no longer deny their culpability for any of this.

 

Bet they do though! And their apologists in the Glasgow press-rooms will assist them.

[Doc Rob]

Out of interest, is that the same woman (who used to be on the Herald) who JKB had a run in with a couple of years back?

 

Sure is - Joan McAlpine. 'Twas my words she misappropriated and quoted out of context when Rix was appointed. (Eventually they did print a retraction, if not an apology).

 

She's correct this time, but her style is still unpleasant to read. She's one of those self-appointed guardians of public morality - they always know where the moral high ground is, because they're standing on it!

[merseyjambo]

At least we know when Sellick fans complain the police are masons, they have something to back it up

 

When was the last time there was a full scale riot in Glasgow?

[shaun.lawson]

Maybe you should read it fully and carefully (the last link) : this bit is VERY interesting -

 

IN THE middle of the swelling crowd in Piccadilly Gardens, he was just another bloke in a Rangers shirt, trying to find a good spot to watch the big match. But this dedicated fan, caught up in last week's events in Manchester, was used to working on the other side of the riot lines.

 

The fan, who wishes to remain anonymous, is also a senior police officer in the Strathclyde force, with wide experience of crowd control. Yesterday, he launched a scathing attack on the policing of the event, calling into question the tactics used by colleagues south of the border. It was, he said, "a disaster waiting to happen".

 

The officer was in the throng in the city centre when he realised things were getting out of control. And it was not the crowd, but police who were behaving "excessively".

He said: "I am sorry to say that my impression of the Manchester public order officers is that things seemed to escalate almost immediately to shields, helmets and batons.

 

"I personally saw officers who were excessive in their behaviour. They were pushing people back with shields when those persons were just approaching them to ask questions.

 

"There's no doubt there were hooligans there and some of them got what they deserved, but it would appear that, perhaps on some occasions, the policing was excessive."

 

Part of the problem, he said, was an apparent lack of preparedness for the scale of the Rangers support. "They were caught out by the numbers of fans and where they were congregated.

 

"All the designated fan-zones were grossly overpopulated. I can speak from experience when I say it was a recipe for disaster. I went to Piccadilly and Albert Square, and I couldn't have turned round to get something out of my rucksack in either of them. I couldn't have tied my laces."

 

The actions of the riot police were, he said, questionable: "They had full public-order (riot] gear on and two officers had their batons above their heads. That should only have happened if there was an imminent threat, and to me that was excessive and shouldn't have happened.

"We in Strathclyde have only escalated to that level of public order once, and that was during G8, so that gives you some idea. We just wouldn't have done that. Maybe their training is different from ours."

 

The start of the trouble came quickly, he said. "Everything just came together: the screen going off; the English football casuals throwing things; it was so vastly overcrowded. I was in there for three minutes and came straight out. It was a disaster waiting to happen. It should have been spotted long before by the people in charge of the arenas, the security guards. But there would appear to have been no number-counting. People kept coming. It was crazy. Without a doubt, there should be an inquiry."

 

John O'Connor, a former commander of Scotland Yard's Flying Squad, called for an investigation by the Independent Police Complaints Commission into the "utter stupidity" of the policing operation.

 

He said: "Police were outnumbered and let down by senior officers. They have been almost conned into believing this was going to be a fun festival of football and all the jolly folk from Glasgow were going to come down

 

 

According to another thread the NOTW is running a story about English hoolies being involved in the violence. For some reason the English version of the paper isn't running that story. I know because I just read it 20 mins ago.

 

What the hell happened to NCIS or whatever it is called now ? I thought English/Scottish/British police were supposed to be gathering intelligence in advance of bigg ames like this. You'd have thought that with Rangers propensity to attarct right wing knuckle draggers that the police would be monitoring this very closely.

 

But to to the link : we have a hearsay account form a senior Strathclyde police officer who just hapens happens to have wide experience of crowd control. He is also a Rangers fan.

We then have ANOTHER police officer - well , acually that is ambiguous because it only says he is a 'former commander' - who is spouting off. It's not clear if he was also a Rangers fan who was in attendance or just a convenient rent a quote for Rangers apologists. He isn't quoted as actually saying anything of any substance in terms of his criticism. But if you Google his name ...well, this bloke seems to have an opinion on everything. But coser to home , he seems to have been involved with the Madeleine McCann case.

 

Know what I mean guvnor ?

 

Except that, while the behaviour of around a thousand Rangers supporters on Wednesday night was utterly sickening and completely beyond the pale, it does not follow that the police's actions shouldn't be scrutinised too. I've no idea if they got it right or wrong, and am in no position to judge - but John O'Connor, an extremely well known and effective Commander of the Metropolitan Police, is. So it makes sense to take his views on board, and not dismiss them because it somehow lets Rangers off the hook (which it quite plainly doesn't, nor should it either).

 

Shades of grey exist in every case, you know - and I say that as someone who loathes Rangers FC with every bone in my body!

[bean counter]

For me this quote from the SoS article speaks volumes

 

 

In the wake of the trouble in Manchester, there has been little focus at what went on at the beamback event at Ibrox. There was over-crowding there as well. Too many people turned up and the club struggled to cope. There was fighting and blood was spilled. There was too much drink. There was organisational chaos and arrests; 17 in and around the stadium, three times more than at the last Old Firm game. However, we have not heard Rangers people condemn the event as being "run by authorities that were ill-prepared".

[269miles]

Except that, while the behaviour of around a thousand Rangers supporters on Wednesday night was utterly sickening and completely beyond the pale, it does not follow that the police's actions shouldn't be scrutinised too. I've no idea if they got it right or wrong, and am in no position to judge - but John O'Connor, an extremely well known and effective Commander of the Metropolitan Police, is. So it makes sense to take his views on board, and not dismiss them because it somehow lets Rangers off the hook (which it quite plainly doesn't, nor should it either).

 

Shades of grey exist in every case, you know - and I say that as someone who loathes Rangers FC with every bone in my body!

 

 

You're missing the point of my post.

 

The Rangers fan/policeman/crowd specialist may well indeed have some value to add to any enquiry. But that's not why he is quoted and that is my point. Why is he an annoymous source ? Why doesn't come forward and ask to be contacted as part on any enquiry ?

 

As for the other bloke : the same questions apply. And as I pointed out , if you Google his name he seems to have an opinion on everything - and I mean everything. Whether he is qualified to talk about crowd control or safety is another matter - I didn't think this was the remit of Flying Squad members but who knows ?

[Hagar the Horrible]

Unless they give out their Name rank and collar number, you can take it with a pinch of salt that they were not quotes from Police officers as trust me they would back each other up.

 

None of the blame can be aimed at MCC or the GMP as both did not want that many Rangers fans there, but were bullied into it by rangers supporters groups (see Rangers Supports Trust) I quote

 

"Speaking of which, the attitude of Greater Manchester Police has been pathetic. Rangers fans have behaved magnificently on our travels this season and deserve to be treated with the respect others enjoy. As for their laughable insistence that fans without tickets should stay at home, I'd simply like to say that I'd prefer it if our law enforcement visited Planet Earth more often. There will be 100,000 Bears there - deal with it. And roll on next Wednesday - I simply cannot wait!"

 

David Edgar

 

Rangers have put Scotland back into the dark ages. What will happen probably next year to Motherwell is that they will be met with heavy handed policing abroad who will now expect the Well fans to behave in the same way?

 

Ranger cannot be allowed to sweep this under the carpet and get away with it. They have not taken any responsibility and show no remorse, just blame and recriminations on the innocents. The SFA silence is repugnant at least:mad: