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jack D and coke

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Aye typical. I disappear for 5 minutes and you go and have a really good watch thread.

 

I've been buying, selling and flipping for ages but have now gravitated to a Breitling Superocean II Abyss on the high polish professional bracelet ( blue chapter ring ). Seriously, if you can afford a brand new Breitling or if you can be patient enough to save up the cash then look no further. By far the highest quality watch I've ever owned... and I've gone through a good few.

 

 

 

Just back from a stretch at Her Majesty's Pleasure.

 

NAP.

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Aye typical. I disappear for 5 minutes and you go and have a really good watch thread.

 

I've been buying, selling and flipping for ages but have now gravitated to a Breitling Superocean II Abyss on the high polish professional bracelet ( blue chapter ring ). Seriously, if you can afford a brand new Breitling or if you can be patient enough to save up the cash then look no further. By far the highest quality watch I've ever owned... and I've gone through a good few.

 

stacks_image_487.jpg

 

I do like that!!! :wub:

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Just back from a stretch at Her Majesty's Pleasure.

 

NAP.

 

Ha ha. Well I suppose if you call Mrs Miggins across the road Her Majesty... I know I had to. I was only supposed to be there to do the garden.

 

Re the Superocean : Yeah it's quite something. It has what Breitling call their Calibre 17. It's not their own in-house movement though. They basically take an off the shelf ETA 2824-2 movement ( one of the most robust and reliable catalogue movements ) and do an in-house tuning job on it. They custom rebuild it with a few higher grade parts and make some adjustments. The RRPs mentioned earlier are about right but I paid nowhere near that for my 42mm. I doubt that any authorised dealers would refuse to give a fairly hefty discount on that RRP. Rolex ADs are notoriously difficult to get a discount from but you should manage between 10 and 20% on a brand new Breitling. Two year warranty helps but if you're going to spend this kind of cash then be prepared to spend a bit more every now and then in the way of servicing it.

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jack D and coke

Got this email from amazon. At the lower end of the scale but one or two decent watches in there and some good looking discount too....

http://www.amazon.co...&qid=1383587848

 

60% off Seiko....

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=pe_255301_41199381_pe_epc_fl?rh=i%3Awatches%2Cn%3A328228011%2Cp_4%3ASeiko%2Cp_6%3AA3P5ROKL5A1OLE%2Cp_8%3A40-&hidden-keywords=-B001ELSSOO%20-B000J1YMX6%20-B005HIRE8Q%20-B000J1YMWW%20-B000KKO84O%20-B005HIREJK%20-B004JY6X90&ie=UTF8

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Got this email from amazon. At the lower end of the scale but one or two decent watches in there and some good looking discount too....

http://www.amazon.co...&qid=1383587848

 

60% off Seiko....

http://www.amazon.co...4JY6X90&ie=UTF8

 

Seiko are good watches.

 

If this thread has made you think you want to spend more on a watch than your ?500 why dont you get a cheap Seiko there are ones I linked to earlier that are on your links too

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Seiko-Mens-Automatic-Watch-SNK807K2/dp/B006CHML4I/ref=sr_1_2?s=watches-outlet&ie=UTF8&qid=1383588240&sr=1-2

 

This will sort you out. A good quality watch to enjoy whilst you save up to splurge on something more expensive...

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jack D and coke

 

 

 

Seiko are good watches.

 

If this thread has made you think you want to spend more on a watch than your ?500 why dont you get a cheap Seiko there are ones I linked to earlier that are on your links too

 

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Seiko-Mens-Automatic-Watch-SNK807K2/dp/B006CHML4I/ref=sr_1_2?s=watches-outlet&ie=UTF8&qid=1383588240&sr=1-2

 

This will sort you out. A good quality watch to enjoy whilst you save up to splurge on something more expensive...

Aye since this thread has started my ?500 just isn't enough so I'm gonna save up for a wee bit yet and push the boat out a bit more next year. It was supposed to be for my 40th so I want a watch I'm going to keep forever and I want to make a good one. Cheers anyway though mate.

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My mate who's a watch collector told me not to make do with the watch you can afford. Just keep on saving and get the one that you really want and then you'll have your watch for life. If you get the inferior one, you'll always want the better one as well.

Not sure if I explained that well but there you go anyway.

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My mate who's a watch collector told me not to make do with the watch you can afford. Just keep on saving and get the one that you really want and then you'll have your watch for life. If you get the inferior one, you'll always want the better one as well.

Not sure if I explained that well but there you go anyway.

Your mate is :spoton:

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That's certainly the way I would look at it. If you're particularly serious about putting money into watches then I would say it's much better to concentrate your money in a very small number of higher quality than to 'waste' it on pieces that can never hold their value.

 

If you're going to put a large amount of money into a watch and you also want to retain value in it then you needn't look any further than 'the big 3' of the mid-market, namely Rolex, Breitling and Omega. I have seen it said that a Rolex Submariner - if looked after - will begin to appreciate quite markedly after about 10 years since it was new. It seems less likely that a Breitling Superocean or an Omega Planet Ocean will eventually appreciate value but they will most certainly retain good value for quite some time from new.

 

TAG Heuer is a bit of a pariah brand for serious watchies. Seen as a bit of a fashion brand in fine Swiss clothing. Their best automatic movements are also base ETA calibres that have been tweaked. Their chronograph pieces have been enhanced with higher grade chronograph modules for instance. The Monaco and Monza watches are very nice but I found that they don't carry the same presence as the bulkier watches of similar price from Breitling and Omega. If you really like TAG Heuer or older Heuer watches then you might be better trying to source a really nice vintage watch. Vintage Heuer Carrera, Silverstone or Autavia watches are highly collectible and should also retain decent residual value.

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Captain_Peacock

As others have said, buy something by a watchmaker not a clothes company. New, for 500 you could look at watches by Hamilton, Sinn, Christopher Ward Tissot or maybe something like a Seiko Monster if you want a good dive watch. But have a look on eBay and you could pick up a good vintage Omega or something, just make sure you buy it from a jeweller rather than some random.

 

Great choice, one of my favourites is the 556. OP would need to stretch his budget a little to land it ?645 from chronomaster on leather.

http://www.chronomaster.co.uk/sinn/watches/sinn-556-i-stainless-steel-automatic-wristwatch/sin-64a/

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Captain_Peacock

I'm not sure if they allow them to be sold in the UK Taz.

 

It was Rolex only for the UK although that may have changed.

 

Strong rumours Tudor will re-launch again in the UK in Summer 2014. I'm told that some UK authroised Rolex dealers are willing to supply on a special order basis (you specify the watch ref and then pay all / an agreed % up front).

 

You can sorce some on the gray market, see the Tudor Pelagos for sale at Iconic Watches at Balckburn http://www.iconicwat...gos-25500tn.htm

 

I'd rather avoid the grey market so will sit tight until they re-launch in the UK or buy from an authorised dealer overseas.

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I look at my 10 year old TAG as almost a disposable watch, but my Breitling is more like an heirloom watch that should be enjoyed by the next generation.

 

The same can be said for the real desirable timepieces such as Patek Philipe, Audmars Piquet and IWC.

 

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Don't understand the fascination with the Tudor watch.

 

It's clearly made to look like a Rolex.

 

It's basically like saying, hey, I couldn't afford the real deal.

 

Much rather spend good cash on a watch that doesn't try to imitate.

 

Just my personal opinion.

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Don't understand the fascination with the Tudor watch.

 

It's clearly made to look like a Rolex.

 

It's basically like saying, hey, I couldn't afford the real deal.

 

Much rather spend good cash on a watch that doesn't try to imitate.

 

Just my personal opinion.

 

Well a Tudor watch is a Rolex. They are sister brands, sharing the same heritage and designs. Not only do the two brands share designs but they have also shared the same model names in effect. The Oysterdate and Submariner as examples.

 

Tudor watches occupy a useful niche in the market. All (or most) of the Rolex quality and durability and much less of the 'flashy' factor. Ideal for someone who appreciates the quality of the product but wouldn't be seen dead wearing a Rolex. The prestige factor is reflected in the much more affordable price tags.

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Captain_Peacock

Don't understand the fascination with the Tudor watch.

 

It's clearly made to look like a Rolex.

 

It's basically like saying, hey, I couldn't afford the real deal.

 

Much rather spend good cash on a watch that doesn't try to imitate.

 

Just my personal opinion.

Just to add a couple of things to what Col Robert Neville MD Posted (I agree with his points btw)

 

First up I have nothing against Rolex, I admire the brand and the heritage. However some people just prefer not to wear one, perhaps because of the job that they do, or they don't want to face many people querying if the watch is real or not, maybe they feel the watch will be easily recognised and could make them a target of crime or they want a watch that passes under the radar & isn't instantly recognised.

 

As has been mentioned Tudor is a sister company to Rolex, the goal seems to have been to try and make a modern version of the timless Rolex Sub design rather than make an imitation, for my money they pulled it off (if you take a look through Rolex forums you'll see many Rolex owners agree).

 

I have no problem with Rolex in house movement but the Pelagos uses a modified Swiss ETA movement which costs far less to service and from everything I've read is very accurate.

 

The Pelagos is Titanium, Rolex don't offer a watch in this material, snowflake hands, larger case, brushed titanium rather than SS and auto adjustment clasp all spring to mind as differences between the Pelagos & the Sub.

 

For me and many others there is a place from Rolex & Tudor, I appreciate everybody has there own opinion of course and acknowledge yours.

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Great post Peacock. I'm buying a a Rolex next year (sub date or GMT II) partly because I love the watches but mainly as value-holding heirlooms that I'll pass on to my son (son number two will get one as well) - I'll be buying second hand birth year watches. But I completely understand why some people hate them and that there are situations where I wouldn't wear one, and that's where Tudor comes in. Lovely watches.

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But if Tudor watch looks like a Rolex.

 

Does that not kinda negate the whole idea of not wanting to wear a Rolex?

 

To all intents and purposes, to others, you are wearing a rolex?

 

Who's going to be so close to tell that you're not?

 

Confused.

 

Or are there models that look totally unique?

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Captain_Peacock

But if Tudor watch looks like a Rolex.

 

Does that not kinda negate the whole idea of not wanting to wear a Rolex?

 

To all intents and purposes, to others, you are wearing a rolex?

 

Who's going to be so close to tell that you're not?

 

Confused.

 

Or are there models that look totally unique?

 

I don't think there is a global answer to the question how much a Tudor looks like a Rolex, Rolex / Tudor make many different watch references and the answer is variable from model to model.

 

If the question relates to the Rolex Sub / Tudor Pelagos, I don't think they look the same at all, at a distance or close up.They certainly feel very different to wear. Made from different materials, different surface finish, different physical size, different strap design / size, different hands snowflake / mercedes, different dial indices, different dial finish, if you take a look at lume shots they don't even look the same in the dark

 

The Rolex Sub in my opinion has a well deserved place in the watch world but there are many differences between the Sub & the Pelagos, I like some of those differences and that's why the Pelagos appeals to me.

 

Earlier you mentioned that purchasing a Pelagos over a Sub is a bit like saying hey I couldn't afford the real deal. Two points on that front.

 

1.If you follow that through, you buy the sub and it's a bit like saying "hey I couldn't afford the Rolex Sea Dweller", so you buy the Rolex Sea Dweller but that's a bit like saying "Hey I couldn't afford the etc etc & on on. For me you should purchase the watch you like & not one to gain the approval of others.

 

2. It would be a mistake to assume somebody wearing a Tudor couldn't afford the "Rolex", there are many that will have several Rolexs sitting at home whilst the Tudor is on the wrist. There doesn't need to be a choice between Rolex or Tudor you can purchase both and lots do.

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Looking to but myself a decent watch seeing I've got a spare few quid lying about from my birthday a few months back. Anybody got any good links to anywhere? I guess roundabout the ?500 mark.

Cheers.

You can pick up an antique Longine for around that money. Classic looking watch and reliable too. Good luck.

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I don't think there is a global answer to the question how much a Tudor looks like a Rolex, Rolex / Tudor make many different watch references and the answer is variable from model to model.

 

If the question relates to the Rolex Sub / Tudor Pelagos, I don't think they look the same at all, at a distance or close up.They certainly feel very different to wear. Made from different materials, different surface finish, different physical size, different strap design / size, different hands snowflake / mercedes, different dial indices, different dial finish, if you take a look at lume shots they don't even look the same in the dark

 

The Rolex Sub in my opinion has a well deserved place in the watch world but there are many differences between the Sub & the Pelagos, I like some of those differences and that's why the Pelagos appeals to me.

 

Earlier you mentioned that purchasing a Pelagos over a Sub is a bit like saying hey I couldn't afford the real deal. Two points on that front.

 

1.If you follow that through, you buy the sub and it's a bit like saying "hey I couldn't afford the Rolex Sea Dweller", so you buy the Rolex Sea Dweller but that's a bit like saying "Hey I couldn't afford the etc etc & on on. For me you should purchase the watch you like & not one to gain the approval of others.

 

2. It would be a mistake to assume somebody wearing a Tudor couldn't afford the "Rolex", there are many that will have several Rolexs sitting at home whilst the Tudor is on the wrist. There doesn't need to be a choice between Rolex or Tudor you can purchase both and lots do.

 

You are clearly very clued up on the watch world.

 

I'd say at least 95% of folk out there aren't!

 

So there's no way their chain of thought would be anywhere near as detailed or precise as yours.

 

When i scrolled past that Tudor pic I immediately thought, nice Rolex...... Until I studied it harder and saw it said Tudor. If there's differences between the two, I've no idea what they are, just like most others.

 

To me and almost everyone else, it's a Rolex. So if folk want a Tudor because they don't want the stigma of a Rolex, it's just not going to happen.

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Captain_Peacock

I'm buying a a Rolex next year (sub date or GMT II) partly because I love the watches but mainly as value-holding heirlooms that I'll pass on to my son (son number two will get one as well) - I'll be buying second hand birth year watches. But I completely understand why some people hate them and that there are situations where I wouldn't wear one, and that's where Tudor comes in. Lovely watches.

I think buying somethng like that for your sons is a great, best of luck with it.

 

I'm really hoping I haven't come accross as a "Rolex Hater" in this thread, I'm really not at all. Both have their place in my opinion.

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You can pick up an antique Longine for around that money. Classic looking watch and reliable too. Good luck.

I really like the vintage watches. Have a nice Omega from the 50s.

 

They are a lot smaller than some of the modern watches which makes them more discrete.

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Captain_Peacock

You are clearly very clued up on the watch world.

 

I'd say at least 95% of folk out there aren't!

 

So there's no way their chain of thought would be anywhere near as detailed or precise as yours.

 

When i scrolled past that Tudor pic I immediately thought, nice Rolex...... Until I studied it harder and saw it said Tudor. If there's differences between the two, I've no idea what they are, just like most others.

 

To me and almost everyone else, it's a Rolex. So if folk want a Tudor because they don't want the stigma of a Rolex, it's just not going to happen.

 

On the watch front I'm nothing more than an enthusiastic amateur although I will admit that I spend too much time looking at watches. Many on this thread with good input & Col Robert Neville MD's explantation above was both shorter and clearer than mine (hats off to him).

 

RE Pelagos / Sub, to me they appear very different in the photographs, on the wrist the difference is even more evident (to me at least).

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I have a Longine that's over twenty years old. A Movado that looks brill under a dress shirt cuff. I also have an old Seiko, and at the moment I'm wearing a cheap Fossil retro type watch. Get one that you feel comfortable with.

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Yeah I agree with everything that Capt.Peacock has said, only he gave a more thorough explanation. It perhaps used to be more so that a Tudor was the same as a Rolex, in that the Tudor watch would even have the same movement. There has been a move away from that with modern Tudors using base ETA movements. Rolex certainly aren't alone in employing a sister brand / sub-brand to occupy a price point in the marketplace in order to capture the budgets of people who either can't quite afford a Rolex Sub or who don't like the idea of having one. Rolex could easily develop and sell a less costly watch and brand it as a Rolex, but it would diminish the prestige of the brand. Perhaps even being detrimental to their sales of their existing pieces. The Tudor range is the perfect vehicle to capture a certain price point and demographic. The prestige and heritage of the brand is very high in it's own right. There are other examples of highly known brands using sub-brands in order to maximise sales. Seiko watches are also made under the brand names of Lorus, Pulsar, J.Springs and some others. Rotary watches also make R & Co as well as Swiss Legend. Maybe the owners of Rolex were well ahead of their time in that regard.

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Don't think you two are quite getting it.

 

The vast vast majority of the public don't have the same understanding as you guys.

 

Deciding not to wear a Tudor over a Rolex because of stigma is utterly pointless. It's a moot point.

 

The other reasons make sense, but that one doesn't wash unless you're in a very small percentage who know better.

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Don't think you two are quite getting it.

 

The vast vast majority of the public don't have the same understanding as you guys.

 

Deciding not to wear a Tudor over a Rolex because of stigma is utterly pointless. It's a moot point.

 

The other reasons make sense, but that one doesn't wash unless you're in a very small percentage who know better.

I don't think anyone is trying to say that they know something better. That's not the purpose at all. I can say with certainty though that there are people who will actively shy away from wearing a Rolex because of it's prestige factor. Instead preferring to have the Tudor because it's much more understated. The two Submariner style watches may look exactly the same but there are distinct differences. The Submariner style of watch can be seen throughout dozens of different watches from ?10 up to ?10,000. There are lots of watch enthusiasts who actively prefer to wear an unbranded watch - a sterile dialled watch in other words. There are lots of decent quality Japanese & Chinese sterile dialled watches on the market and they are very popular. Parnis & Alpha being two of the main brands.

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Captain_Peacock

Don't think you two are quite getting it.

 

The vast vast majority of the public don't have the same understanding as you guys.

 

Deciding not to wear a Tudor over a Rolex because of stigma is utterly pointless. It's a moot point.

 

The other reasons make sense, but that one doesn't wash unless you're in a very small percentage who know better.

 

If we consider the Tudor Pelagos / Rolex Sub alone for the sake of simplicity, I honestly think the differences between the two watches are too large to confuse them (even to those that don't have a real interest in watches). I think you have to of seen them in the flesh to appreciate the differences fully. However I accept your opinion even though I don't see it the same way.

 

For me it comes back to buy the watch you like rather than worry too much about the opinions of others.

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Don't think you two are quite getting it.

 

The vast vast majority of the public don't have the same understanding as you guys.

 

Deciding not to wear a Tudor over a Rolex because of stigma is utterly pointless. It's a moot point.

 

The other reasons make sense, but that one doesn't wash unless you're in a very small percentage who know better.

 

There is a huge market for homage watches - massive. If you look around you will see hundreds of watches that 'look' like Rolex watches.

 

Those ITK will appreciate a Tudor.

 

I buy watches because I like them. It is nice to get a 'nice watch' from someone else ITK but what the man on the street thinks doesnt bother me, really.

 

I am not a huge fan of Tudor. Nothing to do with their Rolex affiliation, just dont like the watches that much.

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At what stage does a homage become a copy?

rloy_zps6d29afdb.jpgFEF600DF-5511-4199-8D56-C0757E858A6A-6102-000005CCE243BA6C_zps31b113d1.jpg

 

When it purports to be something that it isn't.

 

The Steinhart doesn't even come close to being a copy. It is well signed on the dial, case back and crown as a Steinhart. It is actually a very good quality watch with an ETA movement and all round excellent build quality. They are about ?400 or so to buy. You aren't paying ?400 to buy something that closely resembles a GMT Master... you're paying ?400 for a ?400 quality watch that happens to resemble a GMT Master.

 

Why is it made to closely resemble a GMT Master? Because the GMT Master is a highly attractive watch.

 

Stick a dial that says "Rolex" on it and it's a very different story.

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I think buying somethng like that for your sons is a great, best of luck with it.

 

I'm really hoping I haven't come accross as a "Rolex Hater" in this thread, I'm really not at all. Both have their place in my opinion.

Not at all. Some people don't like them for one reason or another, and I can understand that. I like the watches, like the idea of birth year watches and want something that holds it value to pass onto them for their 21sts.

 

Then when they're passed on, I'll get a Patek for myself (in my dreams!)

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When it purports to be something that it isn't.

 

The Steinhart doesn't even come close to being a copy. It is well signed on the dial, case back and crown as a Steinhart. It is actually a very good quality watch with an ETA movement and all round excellent build quality. They are about ?400 or so to buy. You aren't paying ?400 to buy something that closely resembles a GMT Master... you're paying ?400 for a ?400 quality watch that happens to resemble a GMT Master.

 

Why is it made to closely resemble a GMT Master? Because the GMT Master is a highly attractive watch.

 

Stick a dial that says "Rolex" on it and it's a very different story.

 

Oh, don't get me wrong. I like Steinhart as a brand. I'd differentiate between a copy & a fake - and obvious an homage too.

 

For me, this Stein goes too far. Even If they just changed the GMT hand colour, or the shape of the hands..,

 

For me an homage should be a nod & a wink to the original. No more or it strays into copy territory.

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Captain_Peacock

When i scrolled past that Tudor pic I immediately thought, nice Rolex...... Until I studied it harder and saw it said Tudor. If there's differences between the two, I've no idea what they are, just like most others.

 

Sten Guns previously on this thread I've stated the differences between the Tudor Pelagos & the Rolex sub (see posts numbers 219,222 & 227). You have mentioned that in your opinion the "Tudor" watch looks almost identical to the Rolex Sub & we've exchanged posts back & forth a couple of times on the subject since.

 

I described the Tudor Pelagos which I posted an image of in post number 214. I suspect you were referencing a Tudor watch image posted by Sherlock in post number 104.

 

Were your comments related to the Tudor Pelagos pictured in post 214 or the Tudor watch image posted by Sherlock in post number 104?

Edited by Captain_Peacock
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Oh, don't get me wrong. I like Steinhart as a brand. I'd differentiate between a copy & a fake - and obvious an homage too.

 

For me, this Stein goes too far. Even If they just changed the GMT hand colour, or the shape of the hands..,

 

For me an homage should be a nod & a wink to the original. No more or it strays into copy territory.

Yeah you do have a point. There are a few small differences but there has been a deliberate effort to imitate as well.

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It's one of my grail watches

 

:sob:

 

The Pepsi bezel is a classic, but it is a bit 90s to say the least.

 

How much do they go for these days?

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Captain_Peacock

It was 214.

 

Although looked back to 104 it does look really similar, to me, like 214.....

 

Fair do's, I'm clearly grasping at this point.

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Fair do's, I'm clearly grasping at this point.

 

Possibly, but you've clearly got a great knowledge. Respect :)

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Why would anyone spend good money to buy an expensive watch that looks cheap?

 

What if it didn't look cheap to them though?

 

Not sure your opinion would affect someone's watch choice?

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