People moaning about our build play?

[Gregorski]

One word.......BORING

 

A derby should be about aggression and getting the ball into the mix not pissing about in our own half where we were nearly caught out a few times.

 

 

Lets put it plainly.

 

If. Sergio. Does. This. Then. Romanov. Will. Fire. Him.

 

Doing what you're suggesting is clearly not an option.

 

It's playing like this that got Laszlo and Jefferies shown the door in the first place. It's no longer how Hearts are going to play while Romanov is the owner.

Get used to it. It's how it's going to be from now on.

 

I welcome it. I'm actually really interested to see if a Scottish team can actually do it.

[db211833]

Maybe I'm just old fashioned and used to the Gladitorial style we used to play against the Hibees?

 

One man's trash is another man's treasure, it's all about opinions

No it isn't! It's all about modern possession football and we have a lot of dinosaurs in our support. We may not have been fitter than them, but we looked it, because we made them chase the ball.

[Erik]

For years now there's been a guy in B lower who's battle cry each time ANY player has played the ball back the way or any defender has passed along the back line has been "FORWARD!!!".

 

What worries me is that he's not exactly in a minority.

[Neilson's Shank]

Loved JJ to bits but his (and BB's) tactical awareness consisted of two sets of hand gestures, one to urge the team team and the ball forward and the other to calm things down when we inevitably lost the ball. I hope PS sticks with his philosophy but like others agree that he may need better (or better coached) players to make this a reality.

[Paolo]

A guy behind me, throughout the game (and every game) kept on shouting 'Get the ball up the park.'

 

I like what PS is trying to do and I think we done it well in the main yesterday. My only disappointment is we could have put another three or four past them

[Walter Bishop]

We have a mentality in this country where people would rather see a crunching tackle than a great pass. Paulo is about to change that.

[Drylaw Hearts]

Zal was forced into 2 simple errors (he should still have done better) by the fans groans and moans for us to move forward.

 

 

It's the fans fault that Zaliukas made bad passes.

 

[Spellczech]

Anyone spot the ITV4 commentators creaming themselves over a huge diagonal ball from Grainger to Temps last Thursday. If that had been the previous week they would have concluded it was just a fortunate long clearance, but the style Hearts were playing made them conclude that it was an intentional pass. Now personally I was not convinced it was an intentional pass but am willing to give Grainger the benefit of the doubt for the same reasons as the ITV guys.

[somakeanoise]

50% of people on this post are what is wrong with Scottish football. We battered Hibs and some are disappoitned we kept possession and it seems they'd rather watch Hearts just hump the ball up the park. Incredible. A good number around Section A should hang their heads in shame singing the managers name at the end as they didn't agree with any decision made by him before and during the game.

[mac]

This really - it is blatantly obvious what PS is trying to get them to do and I am liking it. Skill levels don't match the EPL and it's a new system so of course, we are going to see a lot of balls being passed around at the back to draw opponents on. They were desperately trying to catch us in possession and running themselves out up-front - I dare say we will get caught out sooner rather than later.

 

But I am like many others - i like it and want to see it build week-on-week.

 

Hoof-balls to Kyle & Sutton is only going to get you so far - The O.F. and teams like Dundee Utd lap that play up too as it's predictable and relatively easy to deal with most of the time.

 

Yes, Hibs are very average but they were playing as hard as they could to stop their rot - our system ensured they lost 2-0...and it should have been more, let's face it.

 

Perhaps, hoof-ball would have beat them 2-0 too - I'd rather we won 2-0 as we did today though and I don't believe hoof-ball would have seen as many chances offered...as a footnote, it's this kind of football that breeds confidence when it is working..something hoofball never really does regardless of wins being wrought out as we have seen over the past few seasons.

 

Al Bundy, you utter, utter Psycho Dad hero - both you and SD are correct IMHO, this is the way to go and I'm enjoying it, OK a few errant passes but we will get better as we become more accustomed to this style of play

[Gregory House M.D.]

Ian Black was everywhere yesterday, picking up passes, drawing the full back then releasing Grainger/Driver/Hammil/Elliott/Stevenson.

 

Zaliukas and Mrowiec killed the passing at times but when they weren't involved we created an attack. If there's any truth in the Aguiar rumour, i reckon we'll be one player away from a good passing team, a passing CB. Line-up if Bruno does sign:

 

Kello

 

Hammil Zaliukas Webster Grainger

 

Robinson Black

Suso Aguiar Driver

 

Stevenson/Smith

[fabienleclerq]

I think we can see what PS wants to do i.e play the ball out from the back but it will take time for the players to get the movements right.I do though find it funny the young lads managed it better against spurs than the "first team"!!

 

I have a total hoofball fanatic behind me quotes:

 

"Get it forward" "Fire it in the box" Both when in our half!

 

My favourite was "well played hammill...your still shite though"

 

Spent more time abusing "his" team rather than supporting them.

[Cut The Crap]

I think the passing is fine, it's the movement that's still lacking. It shouldn't really be necessary for Zal or Mrowiec to thread the ball through the eye of needle in order to find a player in a forward position.

 

Still far too much hoof from the goalie for my liking yesterday, but admittedly less than the execrable performance against Aberdeen.

[I.T.K]

I like the idea of what PS is trying to do, but at times today we looked like being caught out with it.

The players didn't look comfortable with the ball at the back at times, but I guess they will improve the system if they persevere with it.

 

I just felt that Zal and Webby were desperate to get rid of the ball, and you could tell they wanted to hoof it, but had the gaffers words in their head warning them not to.

 

We might well lose a goal from a misplaced pass, but will it be any worse than giving possession away by punting it long with the outcome being the same. How many goals have we gifted in the past with the latter method?

 

Got to agree with that. I think Zal and Webby need the players in front of them to give them an option of a pass. This will take time for the players to adapt, and they will need to instinctively know where to stand, where to move to, and what to do after that. You might think they should know this but it will take time for them to adapt to a new system.

 

As an example, I keep myself fit and play squash regularly. I'm not amazing but do okay and I do know instinctively where to stand and what shots to make, even if they don't always come off. Then I started to badminton with Miss I.T.K. who is not that fit but does play some times. The first few times we played she had me running all over the court and was kicking my ass. She was hardly moving, making simple shot, and taking the piss out of me for being all over the place. She just knew instinctively where to stand and what shots to make, I did not. After a playing a few more times I started to work out what was needed. First I had to really think about it what to do, then it became instinctive and started to kick her ass.

 

We just need to be patient with Paulo and team and let get used to the system. ;-)

[marcus]

Anyone spot the ITV4 commentators creaming themselves over a huge diagonal ball from Grainger to Temps last Thursday. If that had been the previous week they would have concluded it was just a fortunate long clearance, but the style Hearts were playing made them conclude that it was an intentional pass. Now personally I was not convinced it was an intentional pass but am willing to give Grainger the benefit of the doubt for the same reasons as the ITV guys.

 

Yup, I remember thinking what a great pass it was. I really think Grainger meant it....was just a shame Temps fecked up his touch.

[Statto]

I feel Mrowiec is quite an important part of this tactic. He is always coming short when Kello or Zal/Webster has the ball giving them an option and then he plays it wide to a full back or back to Zal/Webster/Kello is there is no option and we start again, pretty simple really.

[Craig Herbertson]

My ten year old is learning this at football academy in Germany. They often play two touch football, pass and run looking for space, keeping possession. I would say he'll be very good at it by the age of eleven and I think our players will fairly quickly get in the swing of it too, particularly the young guys. Any player signed for Hearts from across the water will be used to it anyway.

 

We always hear about players making the adjustment to the Scottish game. Now like it or not Sergio will be ensuring that we play like this and the rest of the SPL will have to adjust to us. Scottish football was built on courage, tenacity, aggression. Much as I like all that and would have been happy to see it carry on, the times have changed. International football has softened up. We can't change FIFA so we'll have to change. If Hearts are the foremost in Scotland to seriously work at developing individual skills and this kind of play we'll be the first to win anything as well.

 

We could play the dullest type of football in the world but if we won the league and the cup I couldn't care less. However, this type of play can be a joy to watch when it works which with a bit of luck it will.

 

We comfortably beat Hibs and we haven't mastered what Sergio wants yet. Give it time.

[4marsbars]

The most striking feature of our play in 1985-86 was that we didn't punt the ball up the park.

 

OK, we had Levein and Jardine at the back and there was no pass-back law then but it seems pretty obvious to me that retaining possession is a good way of denying the opposition the opportunity of scoring, which is half the battle.

 

Also, punting the ball into a crowded midfield is such a good tactic with our gigantic midfielders.

[savage]

i cannot believe some of the dinosaurs posting on here. i for one definately like the way we are now trying to play. when you have the ball keep the ball don't just play a hopeful ball up the park. be patient and wait for the opening. everyone creams themselves watching barcelona do the same thing. we are not anywhere near that level but the style of play is the same.

 

zal appears to be getting pelters from some on here but some have touched on the reasons for it. when zal get sthe ball played to him from kello he is in turn looking for a midfielder coming deep or a striker showing around the half way line with room to take a pass along the ground. if that is not on he is turning and passing it back to kello keeping possession before trying again.

 

at the moment the player probably best at taking the ball in midfield in this position is Ian Black who i think is comfy on the ball and is always keen to show for it. Mrowiec is trying but it is not really his game and he is too cumbersome to look comfy in these positions.

 

give the players another month or two and i really think we will see a real marked improvement. this style of play is all about movement off the ball and any player who cannot do this or learn it, i fear will be moved on.

 

i read the sutton comments on another thread and he is one whose movement is poor off the ball and he is very static compared to Eliott who buzzes about constantly looking for space. at the moment he is the striker we have who is best equipped for the role. i also think kyle could play in this team as he is immense at holding the ball up so PS would be looking to get the ball into his feet followed by a lay off get the ball wide cross in the box for KK who will have spun off raced into the box and met the cross with a bullet header to score. SIMPLES.

 

be patient guys i have good feelings about PS and think he is an excellent appointment.

 

on another note i have taken a while to be taken by Ryan Stevenson but he just seems to get better

 

 

[David McCaig]

I think the passing is fine, it's the movement that's still lacking. It shouldn't really be necessary for Zal or Mrowiec to thread the ball through the eye of needle in order to find a player in a forward position.

 

Still far too much hoof from the goalie for my liking yesterday, but admittedly less than the execrable performance against Aberdeen.

 

I think the important thing is that we are getting significantly better with each passing match, no pun intended.

 

The embarassing thing from a Scottish perspective, is that Paulo Sergio is almost having to give the players a beginners guide in how to play football.

 

The passing and movement was almost non-existent against Aberdeen, showed spluttering signs of life against Killie and the matches against Spurs (away) and Hibs have suggested that we are capable of re-inventing ourselves.

[gorgiedad]

I always find the idea of the goalkeeper punting it up the park an odd thing people in this country get behind. It is basically gambling with the ball. At best you have a 50/50 chance you will still have the ball to do something with it. So you can lose the ball and immediately be put on the back foot. Passing it from the back is a more controlled way, you still have posession and you need to look for other players who are able to pick it up. Of course you could lose it, but there is less chance then a punt up the park. Yes its slower then punting it, but you can think more with it, get players to run of it and that way you can create openings in the opposition. We as fans just need patience.

 

Against Aberdeen I remember a point where the ball was being passed among the defence and Kello, looking for an chance to move it forward, a few times of around the defence and back to Kello, Kello punted it up field, a guy near me yelled "You should have done that 5 minutes ago" at which pointed the punted ball was picked up by an Aberdeen player who went forward and created a move which they almost scored.

[Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC]

Was cringing for a lot of Hearts fans yesterday, booing us keeping the ball. Absolutely clueless and they'd be better off staying away.

[Bluesy1874]

i think it may well be a good thing that we are trying to work it from the back but generally i couldn't care less how good or bad we played as long as we score one more goal than the opposition. don't get me wrong it would be good to win with style every game but then its also good to win with a hoof up the park a knock down and a shot because i don't think in this league the passing game will work against every team for example if a team comes to tynecastle looking for a draw they will let us pass it round the back all day without pressing our back four and will just double up on the midfeild

[Richard Luffnan]

I suppose this style of play would suit a lot of folk. It would allow them time to text to all their friends and maybe even the students could write their thesis while waiting for something other than the ball getting passed back and forward in our own half for most of the game to happen. It's SPL no Champions League FFS

The Gulag awaits

[Bert Le Clos]

One word.......BORING

 

A derby should be about aggression and getting the ball into the mix not pissing about in our own half where we were nearly caught out a few times.

 

 

Wrong. A derby should be first and foremost about winning. Doesn't matter how it's done though. Second to winning is playing good football. If we can win ugly then fine, but I'd much rather we taught the "flair" team a lesson in how to play.

 

I was in section A of the Wheatfield and was getting pretty pissed off at the amount of moaning going on as Webster and Zal kept control of the ball. Yes Zal gave it away twice (once he slipped though) and I agree we would be better placed to play this game with Robinson or Bruno in the midifield.

 

But Gary O'Connor did sweet FA yesterday as he spent the majority of the afternoon sprinting after passes he was never going to get near.

[Flimsy]

I want to see Hearts play passing football but I want to see the passing the ball forward with pace that I saw in the second half rather than the pedestrian borefest that was the first half.

[GazzaBroon]

That was the point I was trying to make

[Feeno]

I suppose this style of play would suit a lot of folk. It would allow them time to text to all their friends and maybe even the students could write their thesis while waiting for something other than the ball getting passed back and forward in our own half for most of the game to happen. It's SPL no Champions League FFS

 

 

this here was a red flag, now your other thread makes it a stick on that you are nothing but a hurting hobbit

[henry]

Lot of moaners in section F today moaning because we were keeping possesion and not playing hoofball? Have to admit im loving the way Paulo Sergio has us playing, only problem Mrowiec doesnt have the technical ability to play the role he is looking for him to play.

 

Totally agree with this.

 

Some fans need educated, keeping hold of the ball is a must and if we have to go backwards a couple of times then so

what ? A new centre mid player that can take the ball would help the way he wants to play.

 

Also, dont know if anybody noticed but Sergio has the team working on set plays, with the corner kick taker for example

holding the ball in the air or a hand up to let team mates know what kind of ball is being played in, we even worked a

freekick that came straight off the training ground which ended up giving blackie a free shot on goal, no long throws or balls

just lobbed into the box either. It's refreshing to see what Sergio has them doing after just 3 weeks in the job, makes you wonder what

JJ had the players doing in training all week. Fans need to be patient and give the manager time.

[GazzaBroon]

Oh, I get it now, you're allowed an opinion as long as it is the same as everyone else's or you're a Hobo. I really get it now, thanks for pointing me in the right direction.

[Francis Albert]

Hope Paulo has told the players that when they hear fans jeering when we play to retain possession they shoud treat it as a sign they are playing the right way. Of course we are not particularly comfortable or adept at this style yet, but with practice and maybe a couple of new players we will improve. We also still play a lot of long balls, but fewer aimless punts.

 

One of my favourite myths is that European style football can't work in the unique environment of the SPL, a theory that ignores the fact that whenever Scottish clubs play European sides which are even moderately competent at a passing game, they invariably lose.

[deejtee]

All for the change from JJ's style which was not good to watch. The problem showing itself is having signed players for JJ who may not fit / be able to adapt to the style of play. The fact the club are trying to sign a defender and midfield player suggests that the problem is not the system but the players available and there were times that we allowed a poor Hibs team to give us a scary moment or two which possibly accounts for the concern from some sections. Anyway so long as the under19's are playing the same style they should ensure their transition to the 1st team if the older players cannot adapt and we don't get new signings.

[jamboinglasgow]

The most striking feature of our play in 1985-86 was that we didn't punt the ball up the park.

 

OK, we had Levein and Jardine at the back and there was no pass-back law then but it seems pretty obvious to me that retaining possession is a good way of denying the opposition the opportunity of scoring, which is half the battle.

 

Also, punting the ball into a crowded midfield is such a good tactic with our gigantic midfielders.

 

This is a very good video about Barcelona's tactics under Guardiola which talks about (among other things) the key to possesion football and how it is not just attacking, but defensive as you say if you have the ball and the opposition doesn't then they cant score. Also has some other good points in the style of tactics. (please note I am not trying to say that a) we can be as good or anywhere near Barcelona, or that we will play the same style. Barca are the very highest level of the passing/possession style of football, but there are still things you can learn from them.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6A_K8oWqfk&feature=BFa&list=FLfJp_gPZve2aIcy0faC-uGw&lf=plpp

[Debut 4]

No it isn't! It's all about modern possession football and we have a lot of dinosaurs in our support. We may not have been fitter than them, but we looked it, because we made them chase the ball.

It`s not about "modern" anything...hate when folk refer to things as modern...no personal dig mate seriously though.

 

Just watch videos of Hearts teams in the past, particularly the 80`s when we were back up from division 1. We had good footballers who played some great stuff and yes, we did sometimes use Sandy Clark to knock it forward for a flick on....but we also done that yesterday... its becauase the standard of coaching and the game in general has went backwards in recent years is to why we don`t see basic, good football enough in this country.

 

As long as the nature of the team is to try and play the right way im happy. Football isn`t perfect, sometimes you have to go long but if we stick to our style as much as we can im sure we`ll see progress.

[Grendel]

I think this post encapsulates all that is wrong with the mindset of Scottish football

 

Spot on Mike.

[Cut The Crap]

I think the important thing is that we are getting significantly better with each passing match, no pun intended.

 

The embarassing thing from a Scottish perspective, is that Paulo Sergio is almost having to give the players a beginners guide in how to play football.

 

The passing and movement was almost non-existent against Aberdeen, showed spluttering signs of life against Killie and the matches against Spurs (away) and Hibs have suggested that we are capable of re-inventing ourselves.

 

To be fair, Celtic, Rangers, Motherwell, Killie and Dundee United have all played decent passing football for the past few seasons. Add in St Mirren this season too (apparently). So it actually seems to mainly a problem localised around Tynecastle.

 

Personally I'm at a loss to understand how we've ended up paying ?9 million a year in wages to a squad of players who apparently find it so difficult to play the game properly.

[Walter Bishop]

This style of play is becoming more and more popular and quite simply its the way forward. I thought St Mirren yesterday passed Celtic off the park playing this way, however they are not at a level yet where they can win playing this way mainly down to personnel.

 

We ran O`Connor, Sproule and Agogo ragged in the 1st half yesterday to the extent they were done in terms of fitness by half time, also our play led to frustration on their behalf and should have seen Sproule sent off before half time!!Its a no brainer as far as im concerned as you have to work twice as hard without the ball as you do with it.

 

As i said already Scottish football "supporters" would rather see a crunching tackle than a great pass, this is why Charlie Adam was hounded out of Rangers as we wsnt a "workhorse" or why no Scottish club would take a chance on Graham Dorrans!

[Captain America]

My only problem with the build play yesterday was I lost count of the amount of times Andy Driver was in acres of space and the ball was never passed to him, I think once most of the fans get used to this is the way we are going to play then the jeering will stop ( well hopefully it should.)

 

[Walter Bishop]

Ruben Palazuelos would be perfect for this style of play, he would slot into Mrowiec postion.

[Nelly Terraces]

It's early days ffs, the players are going to have to get used to playing in a different way, I'm happy with what Senor Super Serge is trying to get us to do, if there's mistakes along the way, then sobeit, it's far more pleasing, and above all, EFFECTIVE, than watching garbage like h**s trying to hoof the ball up the park every time they have it.

 

Hoofball - do one.

 

Passing game - "I'd like to make you an offer...."

[Captain America]

Ruben Palazuelos would be perfect for this style of play, he would slot into Mrowiec postion.

 

Or play Eggert there?

[wavydavy]

TBF there are a scary number of people at Tynecastle who scream for a hoof..Personally I'm loving the new manager. I hated the ways we played under Csaba and JJ, absolutely loathed it.

 

 

I agree but it would be better still if we can secure a central midfield player who wants the ball and can do something with it.

[4marsbars]

Totally agree with this.

 

Some fans need educated, keeping hold of the ball is a must and if we have to go backwards a couple of times then so

what ? A new centre mid player that can take the ball would help the way he wants to play.

 

Also, dont know if anybody noticed but Sergio has the team working on set plays, with the corner kick taker for example

holding the ball in the air or a hand up to let team mates know what kind of ball is being played in, we even worked a

freekick that came straight off the training ground which ended up giving blackie a free shot on goal, no long throws or balls

just lobbed into the box either. It's refreshing to see what Sergio has them doing after just 3 weeks in the job, makes you wonder what

JJ had the players doing in training all week. Fans need to be patient and give the manager time.

 

This post is a variation on the (now banned) reports about what the players do at training.

[Francis Albert]

This post is a variation on the (now banned) reports about what the players do at training.

 

 

No it's not. It's based on observations of what happens during the game. Is that banned too?

[heartsfanno1]

I'm not against the way we're playing just now but it has to be done faster and further up the park. Its all good passing about at the back but when it goes back to Kello to get punted up whats the point. There has to be more movement from midfield. Also Mrowiec and Zal cant pass for toffee so one of these times its all going to end in tears! I would much prefer Eggert in DM because at least he can play a pass.

[Francis Albert]

I'm not against the way we're playing just now but it has to be done faster and further up the park. Its all good passing about at the back but when it goes back to Kello to get punted up whats the point. There has to be more movement from midfield. Also Mrowiec and Zal cant pass for toffee so one of these times its all going to end in tears! I would much prefer Eggert in DM because at least he can play a pass.

 

Hoofball ended in tears often enough. Even passing back to Kello to punt it is better than an aimless punt from the back four, as the opposition at least have to think about and try to cover the possibilty we will play it out from the back, as Paulo encourages the full backs to get out wide and make themselves available. What what is lacking is players making themselves available in midfield - yesterday there was often a fifty yard gap in front of the back four, and that would make even good passers struggle to make forward passes. But that'll come with perseverance.

[Johanes de Silentio]

Its all good passing about at the back but when it goes back to Kello to get punted up whats the point.

 

That doesn't always happen, though - that's clearly a last-resort.

 

This is how we are playing now, and the players are still getting used to it - of course it would be better with players who are more comfortable on the ball - maybe guys like Taouil, or a new signing or two will help.

 

The thing is, though, that Paulo Sergio is unlikely to change it, so we'd better get used to it, and stop ******* moaning about it.

 

"No' back way - NO BACK THE WAY!"

 

 

******* idiots.

[Jambo83]

Lot of moaners in section F today moaning because we were keeping possesion and not playing hoofball? Have to admit im loving the way Paulo Sergio has us playing, only problem Mrowiec doesnt have the technical ability to play the role he is looking for him to play.

 

I'm all for building from the back, but only when the players receiving the ball do not have their backs to the rest of play or don't have a few spare yards to take a touch and play the next pass.

 

There were far too many incidents when we played the ball wide, only for Grainger or Hamill to come under pressure immediately and had to return it to Kello who was also then under pressure or try and play a rushed pass to someone else.

 

Do it when it's a valid option only.

 

I also hate when some of our players pass it about 5 yards behind one of their team-mates who are trying to make a forward run, it broke down a few of our counter attacks and let Hibs get back behind the ball.

 

I have confidence it'll come though, they've only been trying to play Sergio's way for a few weeks. I think we'll look a better side in a couple of months.

[VargasDa]

I think we can see what PS wants to do i.e play the ball out from the back but it will take time for the players to get the movements right.I do though find it funny the young lads managed it better against spurs than the "first team"!!

 

I have a total hoofball fanatic behind me quotes:

 

"Get it forward" "Fire it in the box" Both when in our half!

 

My favourite was "well played hammill...your still shite though"

 

Spent more time abusing "his" team rather than supporting them.

Spot on, was in section A and there were loads of "hoof it" shouts. Also some people must only go to the game to moan like feck, 75% of the shouts were negative. How does this help the players. I know you pay your money etc but lets try and help the team not hinder.

[wright1989]

We have a mentality in this country where people would rather see a crunching tackle than a great pass. Paulo is about to change that.