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Winning in Glasgow


gorgie_rebel

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Should never send the wife and kids to the xmas party at Riccerton and then open a 12 pack......but

 

Team P W D L F A W D L F A GD PTS

1 Cel 22 8 3 1 30 9 8 1 1 16 5 32 52

2 Ran 20 7 1 2 20 9 8 1 1 24 11 24 47

3 Hea 21 6 3 3 18 10 8 0 1 18 6 20 45

 

Is our chances defined on the next two games??

 

2 wins = game very much on!!!

 

2 draws = ??

 

2 defeats = ????

 

Does our chances of splitting the uglies/ pushing for the title rest on the next two games?

 

or

 

Will they stumble and drop more points to other teams regardless of the results at the Tattie bowl and Ipox??

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Should never send the wife and kids to the xmas party at Riccerton and then open a 12 pack......but

 

Team P W D L F A W D L F A GD PTS

1 Cel 22 8 3 1 30 9 8 1 1 16 5 32 52

2 Ran 20 7 1 2 20 9 8 1 1 24 11 24 47

3 Hea 21 6 3 3 18 10 8 0 1 18 6 20 45

 

Is our chances defined on the next two games??

 

2 wins = game very much on!!!

 

2 draws = ??

 

2 defeats = ????

 

Does our chances of splitting the uglies/ pushing for the title rest on the next two games?

 

or

 

Will they stumble and drop more points to other teams regardless of the results at the Tattie bowl and Ipox??

Rangers will deffo drop points due to

 

1) fixture pile up and

 

2) refusal to drop Weir and replace him with Webster.

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Dont forget St Johnstone on Saturday. No point winning on Wednesday then dropping points at home on Saturday.

 

Yeah fair do's

 

but I was taking it that we'd get the 3 points on sat

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It would help if we win in Glasogow.

 

I think we will need 28 wins by the end of the season and we are half way there. :thumbsup:

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Should never send the wife and kids to the xmas party at Riccerton and then open a 12 pack......but

 

Team P W D L F A W D L F A GD PTS

1 Cel 22 8 3 1 30 9 8 1 1 16 5 32 52

2 Ran 20 7 1 2 20 9 8 1 1 24 11 24 47

3 Hea 21 6 3 3 18 10 8 0 1 18 6 20 45

 

Is our chances defined on the next two games??

 

2 wins = game very much on!!!

 

2 draws = ??

 

2 defeats = ????

 

Does our chances of splitting the uglies/ pushing for the title rest on the next two games?

or

 

Will they stumble and drop more points to other teams regardless of the results at the Tattie bowl and Ipox??

 

I think so yes.

I always remember Sir Awex saying this in his Aberdeen days. You've got to able to win in Glasgow.

 

The one thing that does give me hope is the fact that as far back as I can remember the bigot brothers could always buy thier way out of trouble in the January window - much less so nowadays.

:unsure:

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Thing is we need other teams to do us a favour and take points away from the OF AND,it's a huge AND we win all our games,not out of the question but a very long shot,if we play like that again then you can forget it.

 

 

I'm not going to get over exited yet,there is still loads of football to be played,seen this kind of thing to many times.

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I think so yes.

I always remember Sir Awex saying this in his Aberdeen days. You've got to able to win in Glasgow.

 

The one thing that does give me hope is the fact that as far back as I can remember the bigot brothers could always buy thier way out of trouble in the January window - much less so nowadays.

:unsure:

 

I said the exact same thing on Friday at work. thumbsup.gif

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I said last weekend that if we took 10 points from the run of games starting Killie away, Rankgers home, Sellic away, St Johnstone home and Rankgers away then we were very much in the title mix.

 

That's us got maximum points from the first two matches in that run.

 

I stand by my 10 point prediction and I'm quietly confident that we'll achieve it.

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It's not just the points won in Glasgow. Everyone else we face would be thinking " This mob came out on top at the Old Firm! They're hardly going to be bricking it here "

 

But it's not game over if we don't either.

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Drylaw Hearts

We really could do with at least winning one of the matches in Glasgow but I'd happily take avoiding defeat.

 

We'll have plenty opportunities to close the gap as they will both drop points before the split.

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It would help if we win in Glasogow.

 

I think we will need 28 wins by the end of the season and we are half way there. :thumbsup:

 

I was doing some sums in my head earlier, and entirely agree. Needless to say, 14 wins from the last 17 games is a very, very tall order. We have practically no margin for error, and will need Dame Fortune to remain very much on our side.

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Of course we forgetting that if Hearts win at Darkhead on Wed then 3pts at Perth where will Hearts be TOP as the Evils are in cup semi's

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Of course we forgetting that if Hearts win at Darkhead on Wed then 3pts at Perth where will Hearts be TOP as the Evils are in cup semi's

 

Are we not 7 back?

 

So 7-6 (two wins) = 1 point behind..........?

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Captain Price

We have to treat every game like its against the Old Firm. We can't just sit back and expect to win because the team we play are pish. We are the 3rd force in Scotland so teams like St Mirren, Hamilton etc will be up for it against us. This is where we lost it last season. The season before that when we finished 3rd, we could have achieved a lot more if we played for 90 minutes, not just until we scored. JJ has changed that-we've been playing and fighting, thats why we won yesterday, thats why we won against Killie on Tuesday. This season we have the dig to win the title.

 

Dunno if that made any sense I just said what was in my head but hopefully you english literature experts can understand.

 

KH

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Francis Albert

As things stand I think we need a win, probably two, in Glagow. If we'd not had such a poor atart and our home record was closer to our away record we might have done it without winning in Glasgow.I don't thnk there is any absolute rule that you HAVE to win in Glasgow.Although we will.

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I have said it before and will say it again, if we want to achieve anything in this league we have to take points off the uglies in their own patch, simples.

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Of course we forgetting that if Hearts win at Darkhead on Wed then 3pts at Perth where will Hearts be TOP as the Evils are in cup semi's

 

We play St.Johnstone at Tynecastle.

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If we lose Weds we're 10 points behind with 16 games to play. Everyone keeps saying Celtic will drop points but so will we.

Can't see us catching them if we don't at least draw on Weds.

2 positives are, the game in hand we have (Dundee Utd away) and the fact the Uglies have 2 more derbies to drop points in.

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Of course we forgetting that if Hearts win at Darkhead on Wed then 3pts at Perth where will Hearts be TOP as the Evils are in cup semi's

 

Talking out your brown hole.

 

Hearts 7 points behind Celtic.

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Francis Albert

Realistically, if we reach the split 6pts off the top, we'll be doing well.

 

 

Not only that, with the top six plaing each other, we'll be in with a chance.

 

It's a very realistic target given our form over the last 13 games vs that of the OF. Having given them a 16 point start.

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Of the 17 games we have left, to have any chance of winning the league, we cant afford to lose any more than 2 and must win at least 12. Winning in Glasgow would be a huge step in that direction. We have 3 games to play in the weeg of the last 17 and i reckon we need to win at least 1 of them.

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While I agree that we can't afford to lose more than 2 or maybe 3 games if we want to win the title, the fact is that if we win our next 2 games in Glasgow, we can probably lose 3 or 4 games and win the title. Wednesday is massive - just as Saturday was. Every game is like a cup tie from now on. We win, we are still in with a shout - and a big one at that.

 

It is in our hands. We win the rest of our games, not even the GFA or bent referees can stop us winning the title.

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The psychological impact of winning in Glasgow would be just as, if not more, important than the points. The belief the team would take from back to back victories over Rantic would be phenomenal, and would set us up nicely for the run in. Lose at Parkheid this week, and Ibrox the next, and the heads could well go down. For that reason, I believe that it is necessary to win in Glasgow.

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We will need KK on Wednesday night.

 

I'm also wondering if Driver will make an appearance from the start ... I just have a feeling that this is the two games he's been aiming for and also been kept for.

 

That huge Darkhead pitch could suit us but we have to be much slicker than we were yesterday.

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We will need KK on Wednesday night.

 

I'm also wondering if Driver will make an appearance from the start ... I just have a feeling that this is the two games he's been aiming for and also been kept for.

 

That huge Darkhead pitch could suit us but we have to be much slicker than we were yesterday.

 

Remember this, Driver ripped them that day.........

Hewent4theball.jpg

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JamboAberdeen

As much as I love to see us winning two games in Glasgow, I'd be happy if we collect 5 points from next 3 games.

The most important thing at the moment is to avoid defeat against them in away games to make sure we keep up pace.

Remember they still have 2 OF derby games, so there are 6 points to make up and another 2 games against them after split, Celtic one is at home.

 

So I want JJ to take very cautious approach at Glasgow, rather than going for win.

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Hmmmmmmm.

 

Rangers have a minimum of 22 games left to play in 29 available weekend and midweek slots, taking into account three international dates, by the May 15th SPL season close. Progession in Europe and the cups adds to this substantially. They currently have 17 senior pros plus Fleck, Ness and maybe a couple of loan signings. They've just lost their most prolific scorer and look unlikely to replace him. Their defence is only the 3rd best in the league, and any disruption to their line up at the back will surely cost them dear. Injuries, suspensions and fatigue will play a huge part in their season. In my eyes, they are certain to drop at least a third of the remaining 54 points available to them. 83 points max.

 

Unfortunately Celtic are in much better shape. Out of Europe, played 2 games more than Rangers and a first team squad of around 25, fixture congestion and injuries will probably not take much of a toll on them. Lennon's SPL record as manager reads P30 W24 D4 L2. They have Stokes and Hooper scoring goals and the tightest defence in the league. At this season's rate of accumulation, they will finish up on 90 points, dropping 10 between now and the end of the season. On the bright side, after the split they will be away at Tynecastle, Ibrox and another away fixture. If the top 6 is completed by any 3 of Dundee Utd, Motherwell, Inverness or Killie then Lennon will get all riled up about having to go away to one of these sides 3 times in the season.

 

Ourselves? All we have left is the league so no issues with congestion and subsequent fatigue. With Driver and Suso coming back to add to Templeton, Skacel and Novikovas we have creative players in abundance. We've got plenty of depth in midfield, and the second best defence in the league which is remarkable considering Jonsson and Palazuelos have been our wing backs for much of the season. Assuming we don't sign or sell anyone we have good depth, but there are question marks over the quality of Kucharski, McGowan and Barr at the back and Elliot, Glen and Obua up front.

 

Essentially, to be in with a real shout of winning the title we need the following to happen:

1) Zaliukas, Bouzid and Kyle are all fit and available for the rest of the season. With 17 games left and plenty time to play them this is not a massive ask, though Kyle's current injury problem is a worry.

2) An absolute minimum of 4 points from our two games with Celtic. A 3/3 split isn't too bad but ideally we need to be making up some of the ground ourselves, and if we get a 4/1 split in our favour then Celtic will be half way to dropping the 10 points I mentioned above so they will probably drop more than that. A draw at Parkhead on Wednesday and a win at Tynecastle after the split is certainly not beyond the realms of possibility.

3) 12 wins in our other 15 games. If we do get a 4/1 split against Celtic and they drop 10 further points, we would still need another 37 points in our other 15 games to sneak a point above them. Even if they do drop more than that, we still have Rangers close by so this is a standard we have to meet. Although we've won 12 of our last 14, getting good points out of trips to Ibrox twice, Pittodrie, Tannadice, two further away games after the split and a visit to Easter Road (yes, I know they're garbage but they ruined our title chances in 97-98 when they were garbage and wrecking our season might be all they have left to play for come April) along with impeccable home form is a massive ask for us to be honest. On a game to game basis I am confident of us beating any of the other 9 sides home or away this season, but when its stacked up like that I have to be skeptical.

 

BUT, its going to be brilliant fun being involved at the top of the table through the run in (and a win over Celtic on Wednesday would really make things interesting).

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Hmmmmmmm.

 

Rangers have a minimum of 22 games left to play in 29 available weekend and midweek slots, taking into account three international dates, by the May 15th SPL season close. Progession in Europe and the cups adds to this substantially. They currently have 17 senior pros plus Fleck, Ness and maybe a couple of loan signings. They've just lost their most prolific scorer and look unlikely to replace him. Their defence is only the 3rd best in the league, and any disruption to their line up at the back will surely cost them dear. Injuries, suspensions and fatigue will play a huge part in their season. In my eyes, they are certain to drop at least a third of the remaining 54 points available to them. 83 points max.

 

Unfortunately Celtic are in much better shape. Out of Europe, played 2 games more than Rangers and a first team squad of around 25, fixture congestion and injuries will probably not take much of a toll on them. Lennon's SPL record as manager reads P30 W24 D4 L2. They have Stokes and Hooper scoring goals and the tightest defence in the league. At this season's rate of accumulation, they will finish up on 90 points, dropping 10 between now and the end of the season. On the bright side, after the split they will be away at Tynecastle, Ibrox and another away fixture. If the top 6 is completed by any 3 of Dundee Utd, Motherwell, Inverness or Killie then Lennon will get all riled up about having to go away to one of these sides 3 times in the season.

 

Ourselves? All we have left is the league so no issues with congestion and subsequent fatigue. With Driver and Suso coming back to add to Templeton, Skacel and Novikovas we have creative players in abundance. We've got plenty of depth in midfield, and the second best defence in the league which is remarkable considering Jonsson and Palazuelos have been our wing backs for much of the season. Assuming we don't sign or sell anyone we have good depth, but there are question marks over the quality of Kucharski, McGowan and Barr at the back and Elliot, Glen and Obua up front.

 

Essentially, to be in with a real shout of winning the title we need the following to happen:

1) Zaliukas, Bouzid and Kyle are all fit and available for the rest of the season. With 17 games left and plenty time to play them this is not a massive ask, though Kyle's current injury problem is a worry.

2) An absolute minimum of 4 points from our two games with Celtic. A 3/3 split isn't too bad but ideally we need to be making up some of the ground ourselves, and if we get a 4/1 split in our favour then Celtic will be half way to dropping the 10 points I mentioned above so they will probably drop more than that. A draw at Parkhead on Wednesday and a win at Tynecastle after the split is certainly not beyond the realms of possibility.

3) 12 wins in our other 15 games. If we do get a 4/1 split against Celtic and they drop 10 further points, we would still need another 37 points in our other 15 games to sneak a point above them. Even if they do drop more than that, we still have Rangers close by so this is a standard we have to meet. Although we've won 12 of our last 14, getting good points out of trips to Ibrox twice, Pittodrie, Tannadice, two further away games after the split and a visit to Easter Road (yes, I know they're garbage but they ruined our title chances in 97-98 when they were garbage and wrecking our season might be all they have left to play for come April) along with impeccable home form is a massive ask for us to be honest. On a game to game basis I am confident of us beating any of the other 9 sides home or away this season, but when its stacked up like that I have to be skeptical.

 

BUT, its going to be brilliant fun being involved at the top of the table through the run in (and a win over Celtic on Wednesday would really make things interesting).

 

 

Great post. Saves me doing any critical thinking but it confirms what my gut was already telling me.

 

If we're going to do this (and I don't think we will, but hope so ******* much we can) then Celtic are the biggest worry.

 

And Wednesday night is huge.

 

Game on.

 

 

 

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Unfortunately Celtic are in much better shape. Out of Europe, played 2 games more than Rangers and a first team squad of around 25, fixture congestion and injuries will probably not take much of a toll on them. Lennon's SPL record as manager reads P30 W24 D4 L2. They have Stokes and Hooper scoring goals and the tightest defence in the league. At this season's rate of accumulation, they will finish up on 90 points, dropping 10 between now and the end of the season.

 

Take heart from the fact that their last 17 games is W11 D4 L2. Still a good record and if they were to maintain it they'd be hard to catch but cracks have been appearing. My opinion fwiw is that Rangers have a far superior first xi and that I'm more worried about them. However, Rangers we hope have a lot of games and lack depth and with them both to play twice and them to play each other twice there is no reason to give up the ghost if we suffer two defeats in the weej but IF we could avoid defeat in the next nine days with at least one game out of three (even St J) ending in victory then I might, just might start to get really really excited!

 

I think we've given them too much of a start to win the league but it's been and continues to be an immense effort.

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Hmmmmmmm.

 

Rangers have a minimum of 22 games left to play in 29 available weekend and midweek slots, taking into account three international dates, by the May 15th SPL season close. Progession in Europe and the cups adds to this substantially. They currently have 17 senior pros plus Fleck, Ness and maybe a couple of loan signings. They've just lost their most prolific scorer and look unlikely to replace him. Their defence is only the 3rd best in the league, and any disruption to their line up at the back will surely cost them dear. Injuries, suspensions and fatigue will play a huge part in their season. In my eyes, they are certain to drop at least a third of the remaining 54 points available to them. 83 points max.

 

Unfortunately Celtic are in much better shape. Out of Europe, played 2 games more than Rangers and a first team squad of around 25, fixture congestion and injuries will probably not take much of a toll on them. Lennon's SPL record as manager reads P30 W24 D4 L2. They have Stokes and Hooper scoring goals and the tightest defence in the league. At this season's rate of accumulation, they will finish up on 90 points, dropping 10 between now and the end of the season. On the bright side, after the split they will be away at Tynecastle, Ibrox and another away fixture. If the top 6 is completed by any 3 of Dundee Utd, Motherwell, Inverness or Killie then Lennon will get all riled up about having to go away to one of these sides 3 times in the season.

 

Ourselves? All we have left is the league so no issues with congestion and subsequent fatigue. With Driver and Suso coming back to add to Templeton, Skacel and Novikovas we have creative players in abundance. We've got plenty of depth in midfield, and the second best defence in the league which is remarkable considering Jonsson and Palazuelos have been our wing backs for much of the season. Assuming we don't sign or sell anyone we have good depth, but there are question marks over the quality of Kucharski, McGowan and Barr at the back and Elliot, Glen and Obua up front.

 

Essentially, to be in with a real shout of winning the title we need the following to happen:

1) Zaliukas, Bouzid and Kyle are all fit and available for the rest of the season. With 17 games left and plenty time to play them this is not a massive ask, though Kyle's current injury problem is a worry.

2) An absolute minimum of 4 points from our two games with Celtic. A 3/3 split isn't too bad but ideally we need to be making up some of the ground ourselves, and if we get a 4/1 split in our favour then Celtic will be half way to dropping the 10 points I mentioned above so they will probably drop more than that. A draw at Parkhead on Wednesday and a win at Tynecastle after the split is certainly not beyond the realms of possibility.

3) 12 wins in our other 15 games. If we do get a 4/1 split against Celtic and they drop 10 further points, we would still need another 37 points in our other 15 games to sneak a point above them. Even if they do drop more than that, we still have Rangers close by so this is a standard we have to meet. Although we've won 12 of our last 14, getting good points out of trips to Ibrox twice, Pittodrie, Tannadice, two further away games after the split and a visit to Easter Road (yes, I know they're garbage but they ruined our title chances in 97-98 when they were garbage and wrecking our season might be all they have left to play for come April) along with impeccable home form is a massive ask for us to be honest. On a game to game basis I am confident of us beating any of the other 9 sides home or away this season, but when its stacked up like that I have to be skeptical.

 

BUT, its going to be brilliant fun being involved at the top of the table through the run in (and a win over Celtic on Wednesday would really make things interesting).

Brilliant analysis of the situation.

 

IMO, Rangers will implode before the end of the season, especially without Miller. Too many games to play with a stretched squad. 2nd place should be well achievable for Hearts if they maintain their current form.

 

Catching Celtic is another issue. Pleasing though it has been, Hearts have been lucky to get a couple of wins without KK, it may not always be the case and I can see dropping points from draws. Wednesday night will be a big indicator. I'm predicting Celtic 0.

 

I'm lovin' it.

 

 

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Yeah fair do's

 

but I was taking it that we'd get the 3 points on sat

 

I was taking it that we'd have Falkirk in the next round of the Scottish Cup...

 

Funny old game.

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Dont forget St Johnstone on Saturday. No point winning on Wednesday then dropping points at home on Saturday.

so, we`ll not bother winning on Wednesday then??? only kidding mate, i know you don`t mean that.

 

Im of the opinion you must go all out to beat your closest rivals when that time comes. The Old Firm have done it for years when the chance arises to go ahead or close the gap.

 

Why should we rely on others to take points off the Old Firm if we don`t aim to do it ourselves??? Go out to beat EVERYONE. You can`t pick and chose when you want to win.

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I was doing some sums in my head earlier, and entirely agree. Needless to say, 14 wins from the last 17 games is a very, very tall order. We have practically no margin for error, and will need Dame Fortune to remain very much on our side.

 

That would give us a minimum of 87 points. It just shows you how hard it is to to win the title. If we were to win 14 of our last 17 games and still not win the league I'd be absolutely gutted.

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That would give us a minimum of 87 points. It just shows you how hard it is to to win the title. If we were to win 14 of our last 17 games and still not win the league I'd be absolutely gutted.

 

If we don't win the title with 87 points this season, then Rangers or Celtic will drop out of the race way before the end of the season. In a genuine 3-way race, 87 points is more than enough to win the title.

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Charlie-Brown

To start with I'd settle for not losing in Glasgow over the coming 2 matches. That would still boost our confidence and enable us to keep touch with them with a potentially 'easier' run of fixtures up to the split. let's keep ourselves grounded and not look to far ahead of ourselves. We saw the pitfalls of that in the Cup game already this month.

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We need to make sure we treat every single game the same. Saturday's game is worth the same 3 points as the two that sandwich it and is the kind of game that ultimately cost us the title in 98. The last 9 games of that season saw us drop 11 points to Killie, Hibs, Motherwell, Aberdeen and St Johnstone.

 

The most important thing from our trips to Glasgow at this stage are not to build them up beyond their importance. we win them, great. If we lose them we get back on the horse and keep winning our other games. if we win 13 out of 17 games between now and the end of the season, even if, worst case scenario, we lost all 4 to the OF, we'll be close to winning the league.

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Yeah fair do's

 

but I was taking it that we'd get the 3 points on sat

 

This kinda post scares me more than defeat in Glasgow does.

 

Sorry but there is far too many folk taking a win against St Johnstone for granted. I'm not sure where that belief is coming from, the dust has barely settled since that same team papped us out the cup. Most of us have been in this football supporting malarky to know that a supposedly easy home tie against St Johnstone is EXACTLY the kinda stumbling block which we've struggled with over the years.

 

I'd suggest that folk should perhaps give St Johnstone the respect they deserve. Winning in glasgow will count for diddly squat if we chuck away silly points at home to lesser teams.

 

Dont get me wrong, we've gotten ourselves in a fandiddlytastic position, and I can fully understand folk getting excited - i'm struggling to keep my feet on the ground myself..... but lets not get carried away. We're not invincible and with each game we play, that eventual defeat makes its way ever closer.

 

Really hope we dont make a pigs ear of the game on Saturday. Dropping 3 points against St Johnstone as a result of an arrogant lacklustre performance where we thought we'd just have to turn up will infuriate me infinitely more than if we come away from our Glasgow double header with 0 points having at least gone about it in the right way.

 

Ibrox is still a long way off in footballing terms - things could look VERY different by the time we go there if we're not careful. Lets just take each game one at a time and treat it with the respect it deserves.

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Neil Lennon and Celtic will be going all out CRUSH us on wednesday. He'll know that if we take anthing from this game then we could end up being a problem for them this season.

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Charlie-Brown

Jim Jefferies is correct that winning 1 and losing 1 yields more points than 2 draws however i think that staying unbeaten would do more for our confidence and belief than losing a game would. If i was to strategically choose which games would be better to win/lose then at this moment I think winning at Celtic / losing at ibrox would be less damaging than winning at Ibrox but losing a Celtic would. If we can remain unbeaten on wednesday it then sets us up nicely for playing St Johnstone & Rangers.

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The psychological impact of winning in Glasgow would be just as, if not more, important than the points. The belief the team would take from back to back victories over Rantic would be phenomenal, and would set us up nicely for the run in. Lose at Parkheid this week, and Ibrox the next, and the heads could well go down. For that reason, I believe that it is necessary to win in Glasgow.

 

 

Or.......... could make us complacent, thinking we just need to turn up to beat the other teams. I believe we just need to keep taking one game at a time......and keep winning them. Do that and things will be OK. I think we will lose at some stage, it is how we react to that that will determine our chances.

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Charlie-Brown

The early years of the breakaway SPL had some of the most expensively assembled Old Firm teams ever in Scotland who battered most teams most weeks and finished the SPL with the highest points totals, since then they have been moving gradually slightly closer back to the pack as they have declined in quality however it is only really Hearts in 2005-06 that have presented them with anything remotely resembling a season long challenge to their domination. If a close 3-way title race is to be maintained you can expect the eventual champions to accrue a lesser points total than normal as the teams will have been taking points from each other.

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