Celtic or Rangers

[Only a Game]

Assuming you dont think we are the favourites for the league, who out of Rangers and Celtic are best equipped and in the best position currently.

 

Celtic would go 10 points ahead of us should they win on Wednesday. Yes we'd have a game in hand but that game in hand is to Rangers at Ibrox. Is ten points too much to make up at this stage of the season. Are they going to stop being able to grind out results like they have been doing in some recent games.

 

Rangers, a better first 11 than all 3 of the contenders in my opinion but lacking in goals threat at the moment, lacking in squad depth and starting to look a bit battle weary.

 

Personally I think Celtic need to stumble pretty soon (they have a fairly hard run coming up) and we must not lose on Wednesday or winning it probably becomes a bridge too far for us.

 

Thoughts

[Sergio Garcia]

I thought our game in hand was at Tannadice.

 

Isnt the Rangers game when the whole SPL card got wiped out therefore no game in hand as such?

[shaun.lawson]

Assuming you dont think we are the favourites for the league, who out of Rangers and Celtic are best equipped and in the best position currently.

 

Celtic would go 10 points ahead of us should they win on Wednesday. Yes we'd have a game in hand but that game in hand is to Rangers at Ibrox. Is ten points too much to make up at this stage of the season. Are they going to stop being able to grind out results like they have been doing in some recent games.

 

Rangers, a better first 11 than all 3 of the contenders in my opinion but lacking in goals threat at the moment, lacking in squad depth and starting to look a bit battle weary.

 

Personally I think Celtic need to stumble pretty soon (they have a fairly hard run coming up) and we must not lose on Wednesday or its just about over as far as winning it is concerned.

 

Thoughts

 

A little like in 97/8 (though obviously there's no comparison in terms of personnel), Rangers look on the slow downward slope to me. I think Uncle Wattie has something of a demob happy demeanour about him: he probably suspects they're unlikely to make it 3 in a row, but he's heading for retirement safe in the knowledge of the very strong, stable job he's done there in hellishly trying times.

 

And also a little like in 97/8 (though arguably 85/6 too), Celtic - while having many obvious flaws - look to have slightly more than them. I think they're the team to beat now; they're the favourites, even with a very challenging run of games coming up. But in our favour is our extraordinary momentum, and that Jefferies has the ability to put Lennon in his pocket - and I even have this odd sense that, such has been the doom and gloom surrounding Scottish football for so long, people at Rangers FC at least wouldn't mind seeing us do it if they don't.

[Victor Meldrew]

Assuming you dont think we are the favourites for the league, who out of Rangers and Celtic are best equipped and in the best position currently.

 

Celtic would go 10 points ahead of us should they win on Wednesday. Yes we'd have a game in hand but that game in hand is to Rangers at Ibrox. Is ten points too much to make up at this stage of the season. Are they going to stop being able to grind out results like they have been doing in some recent games.

 

Rangers, a better first 11 than all 3 of the contenders in my opinion but lacking in goals threat at the moment, lacking in squad depth and starting to look a bit battle weary.

 

Personally I think Celtic need to stumble pretty soon (they have a fairly hard run coming up) and we must not lose on Wednesday or winning it probably becomes a bridge too far for us.

 

Thoughts

 

I think it's a tough call. I sort of agree with you about the Rangers first XI being the best, but as yesterday demonstrated, there is a really big question as to where the goals are going to come from now Miller has departed for Turkey.

 

What I was really surprised by was the SPL stats on Sky (before yesterday's game) which said that in their previous 10 SPL games Celtic had won 5, drawn 4 and lost 1 - that's pretty poor and they'll need to step up quite considerably.

 

We won't have a better chance of winning this for quite a while!

[Buffalo Bill]

Agree, that a loss on Wednesday would probably be curtains as far as winning the championship is concerned by a draw would keep us in the hunt.

 

 

We will know very soon if we are still in that hunt.

 

 

As for Rangers and Celtic, it's too close to call for me.

[vegas-voss]

Rangers have the better manager,goalkeeper and midfield,Celtic the better forwards and the defence is about the same.Although if Jelevic gets proper fit they will have the best forward in the league.I would say out of the two of them Rangers would be favourites for the league as they can usually grind out the nitty gritty results better.But if it's not be Hearts that wins it I really couldn't care who does out of the two of them.

[Only a Game]

I thought our game in hand was at Tannadice.

 

Isnt the Rangers game when the whole SPL card got wiped out therefore no game in hand as such?

 

I stand corrected. I thought Celtic had no game next midweek but in fact they are at Aberdeen on the Tuesday night

[Le Chat]

The Bheggars have got the points on the board and less games to play with the Huns still being in Europe.

 

If we don't win it (and I don't think we will) I think they will as Rangers don't have the squad to cope imo.

[Only a Game]

Celtics next 6 league games

 

Hearts (H)

Aberdeen (A)

Dundee Utd (A)

Rangers (H)

Motherwell (A)

Kilmarnock(A)

 

 

Thats a bloody tough set of fixtures and if they come out of that lot still in a lead of 5 or 6 points, you have to say its all over bar the shouting.

[Victorian]

if we lose at septic it's pretty much curtains for us IMO. not completely but our chances would appear to be slim. i think celtic would then become favourites over rangers.

 

if we win then we really do have a superb chance. i would estimate our odds of winning the league at about 5/1, possibly even better then that.

 

overall i think celtic have the advantage over rangers because of their superior squad size. rangers would be performing miracles to cope with such a small group.

 

the only question for us is whether or not we can stay in contention for when they both start dropping points, which undoubtedly will happen.

 

i agree that we will probably not get a better chance. if only we could just get a top striker because the winning and losing of a league championship could easily come down to it.

[bighusref]

The Bheggars have got the points on the board and less games to play with the Huns still being in Europe.

 

If we don't win it (and I don't think we will) I think they will as Rangers don't have the squad to cope imo.

 

I agree.

 

Whilst I also agree with you about us, I think the next three games are key*.

 

We cannot lose on either Wednesday, our only chance to be involved in the title hunt will go out of the window with any sort of midweek defeat. If we happen to win both, extremely unlikely though it is, we would be favourites for the league.

 

 

* I recognise that sort of thing has been said loads on here for weeks now, but I have honestly been saying that we need to get results in Glasgow since this run got serious.

[Only a Game]

I agree.

 

Whilst I also agree with you about us, I think the next three games are key*.

 

We cannot lose on either Wednesday, our only chance to be involved in the title hunt will go out of the window with any sort of midweek defeat. If we happen to win both, extremely unlikely though it is, we would be favourites for the league.

 

 

* I recognise that sort of thing has been said loads on here for weeks now, but I have honestly been saying that we need to get results in Glasgow since this run got serious.

 

More or less agree with all of that , although if we win at Celtic, taking something at Ibrox isnt quite so vital IMO. Ensuring we dont trip up against St Johnstone (AGAIN) would be far more important.

[DETTY29]

I don't think we can say at this stage.

 

Better to wait until after Wednesday.

 

If I was to stick my neck out though, it would be Celtic just now.

 

As 2003 and 2008 showed neither of the OF are very good at prioritising and would rather try and go for everything rather than say, play virtual reserve teams in the cup competitions.

 

Rangers for example would be better putting their best team out only in league games - and anything in Europe should be seen as a bonus.

[Buffalo Bill]

When we dropped out of the title race in 1998 with about six games to go, we had to endure Rangers and Celtic playing pass the parcel with each other.

 

 

Both will drop unexpected points. If we happen to be in there come the split, things could get absolutely crazy.

[shaun.lawson]

More or less agree with all of that , although if we win at Celtic, taking something at Ibrox isnt quite so vital IMO. Ensuring we dont trip up against St Johnstone (AGAIN) would be far more important.

 

On the contrary. The one thing we can't afford to do is lose points to our rivals: that's why these games are called six-pointers. Our record against St Johnstone is pretty shocking: has been throughout the last dozen or so years, to the point whereby they're not far off being our bogey team, our November win in Perth notwithstanding. I sense anti-climax brewing next weekend; but a little voice in my ear says that four points minimum in Glasgow is more than feasible.

 

Overall, seven points from the next nine has to be the target. Six points would only be OK if, believe it or not, we lose to Saints but win the other two (!); five would keep us in the race, but only just.

[jayjay]

Lots of football still to be played. If we lose on wed we go 10 points behind but with a game in Hand and Celtic still to come to us and united plus 2 old firm games. Long long way to go. I it's not us I could see rangers sneak it. They have more players who know how to get over the line whereas Celtic don't.

[Victorian]

When we dropped out of the title race in 1998 with about six games to go, we had to endure Rangers and Celtic playing pass the parcel with each other.

 

 

Both will drop unexpected points. If we happen to be in there come the split, things could get absolutely crazy.

 

exactly.

 

we weren't in a position to take advantage. if similar happens again it will just make it all the more painful.

 

anyone else remember the motherwell match at tynie in midweek? that was the beginning of the end of our challenge that season. IIRC we also drew at home to st,johnstone or kilmarnock, as well as losing at the festerdome.

 

7 points dropped. we finished 7 points behind.

[Luton Jambo]

I stand corrected. I thought Celtic had no game next midweek but in fact they are at Aberdeen on the Tuesday night

But they don't have a league game next Saturday, playing the sheep in the league cup semi-final, so by the end of Saturday we will have played the same number of games as them, and with a bit of luck be just 1 point behind. Next Tuesday we will then have a game in hand again until we play Rangers on the Wednesday.

[shaun.lawson]

exactly.

 

we weren't in a position to take advantage. if similar happens again it will just make it all the more painful.

 

anyone else remember the motherwell match at tynie in midweek? that was the beginning of the end of our challenge that season. IIRC we also drew at home to st,johnstone or kilmarnock, as well as losing at the festerdome.

 

7 points dropped. we finished 7 points behind.

 

I think we all do. ******* Tommy Coyne! Sad, sad night; we could all feel it was over. Also in the run-in, we got walloped 3-0 by Rangers, and with us mathematically out of it, drew 2-2 at Pittodrie as the away fans celebrated news of the exploits of Sir Kjell of Olafsson.

 

But yes: I always look back at the Killie, Motherwell, Hibs and St Johnstone games as critical. That said, I don't think I ever felt we quite had enough to do it, and have always wondered what might've happened had we stayed in the hunt right til the last, only to come up fractionally short. In that scenario, would the team have been able to get back up for the Cup Final? Falling out of contention when we did may have been a blessing - but this time, there's no Cup campaign to distract us, and we can throw the kitchen sink at the title race.

[Victorian]

I think we all do. ******* Tommy Coyne! Sad, sad night; we could all feel it was over. Also in the run-in, we got walloped 3-0 by Rangers, and with us mathematically out of it, drew 2-2 at Pittodrie as the away fans celebrated news of the exploits of Sir Kjell of Olafsson.

 

But yes: I always look back at the Killie, Motherwell, Hibs and Sr Johnstone games as critical. That said, I don't think I ever felt we quite had enough to do it, and have always wondered what might've happened had we stayed in the hunt right til the last, only to come up fractionally short. In that scenario, would the team have been able to get back up for the Cup Final? Falling out of contention when we did may have been a blessing - but this time, there's no Cup campaign to distract us, and we can throw the kitchen sink at the title race.

 

good point. quite an interesting thing.

 

it's all very much ifs and buts but yes, it could be argued so that we could have cost ourselves a cup win along those lines.

[bighusref]

More or less agree with all of that , although if we win at Celtic, taking something at Ibrox isnt quite so vital IMO. Ensuring we dont trip up against St Johnstone (AGAIN) would be far more important.

 

It's the swing of points that would be the concern for me. If we lose to either, it is a three point stumble. If we draw or lose against anybody else, it is not certain that they will capitalise and allows for movement. A draw at least means that they do not go ahead of us that day.

[Only a Game]

It's the swing of points that would be the concern for me. If we lose to either, it is a three point stumble. If we draw or lose against anybody else, it is not certain that they will capitalise and allows for movement. A draw at least means that they do not go ahead of us that day.

 

 

I suppose I'm thinking more psychologically and about what any given result might do to team morale, because its that morale which will keep us going more than anything.

 

If you feel you're forever playing games that YOU MUST WIN or at least MUST NOT LOSE, eventually you'll lose one. What effect would that have on us ? Are we really just one defeat away from being out of contention ? I'm not sure that type of mentality would be something that would be felt by Rangers or Celtic. I think we'll have to face up to a defeat sooner or later and we have to be able to afford that defeat, take it on the chin and bounce back for the next game. If we're thinking that our next defeat, whoever it comes against, is going to be fatal then perhaps we're not as equipped for this as we might think we are.

 

I also think that going to Ibrox with the mentality that a defeat isnt fatal would actually help us.

 

I'd like us to go to Celtic Park thinking a defeat wouldnt be fatal, but thats a bit of a stretch right now, I think we'd have the mountain to climb all over again.

[Only a Game]

good point. quite an interesting thing.

 

it's all very much ifs and buts but yes, it could be argued so that we could have cost ourselves a cup win along those lines.

 

I always though that the 98 team was running out of legs and JJ saw the cup as the better trophy bet. Probably not deliberately but I think subconsciously we spent the last 3-4 weeks of the season conserving ourselves for the big effort in the cup final

[shaun.lawson]

I always though that the 98 team was running out of legs and JJ saw the cup as the better trophy bet. Probably not deliberately but I think subconsciously we spent the last 3-4 weeks of the season conserving ourselves for the big effort in the cup final

 

I thought so too. Once we'd lost at Hibs ( ), our whole approach seemed to change completely, and the players started focusing on a game six weeks ahead. In the St Johnstone and Rangers league games especially, we appeared to be just going through the motions; and it was no coincidence at all that only in the final game of the season - home to Dunfermline - did we suddenly recover our fluency and confidence.

[Victorian]

I always though that the 98 team was running out of legs and JJ saw the cup as the better trophy bet. Probably not deliberately but I think subconsciously we spent the last 3-4 weeks of the season conserving ourselves for the big effort in the cup final

 

it's certainly possible.

 

IIRC we beat dunfermline at tynie in the final match so i suppose there was still some effort going in. i guess dunfermline may have already been in holiday mood though.

[bighusref]

I suppose I'm thinking more psychologically and about what any given result might do to team morale, because its that morale which will keep us going more than anything.

 

If you feel you're forever playing games that YOU MUST WIN or at least MUST NOT LOSE, eventually you'll lose one. What effect would that have on us ? Are we really just one defeat away from being out of contention ? I'm not sure that type of mentality would be something that would be felt by Rangers or Celtic. I think we'll have to face up to a defeat sooner or later and we have to be able to afford that defeat, take it on the chin and bounce back for the next game. If we're thinking that our next defeat, whoever it comes against, is going to be fatal then perhaps we're not as equipped for this as we might think we are.

 

I also think that going to Ibrox with the mentality that a defeat isnt fatal would actually help us.

 

I'd like us to go to Celtic Park thinking a defeat wouldnt be fatal, but thats a bit of a stretch right now, I think we'd have the mountain to climb all over again.

 

I see what you are saying, I just think these two games are vital and defeat signals the end of any consideration towards the title. We are far enough behind them as it is, it's unfortunate but these games cannot be considered anything other than must not lose IMO.

[Only a Game]

I see what you are saying, I just think these two games are vital and defeat signals the end of any consideration towards the title. We are far enough behind them as it is, it's unfortunate but these games cannot be considered anything other than must not lose IMO.

 

If only we hadnt had daft defeats at home earlier in the season. Ach well onwards and upwards and as we speak, we're right in it. If we're still in it come next Wednesday night we've an easier run coming up.