lambojambo Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Now that everybody on here seems to have accepted that VR will not bring in a quality Manager or sign quality players, flog Kingston, etc - are we also accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season? Our fall down the table from our 2nd finish only a couple of years ago has been dramatic though unsurprising, and we now not only look like finishing in the bottom 6, but we ARE a bottom 6 standard team! This current Hearts team is not the poorest I have ever seen however, frankly they are not much better than the ones that got relegated a few years back. If we are relying on the likes of Neilson, Elliot, Mole as our back bone next season I just shudder! Remember next year there will be no Gretna, and Hamilton or Dundee look to me as if they can play a bit. St Mirren should be one of the relegation favourites however on Saturdays showing you tell me who had the better team! No "Hobo" or "gas oven" comments please - genuine concern here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makween Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I agree. The team that we have at the moment - particularly if we get rid of key players, which wouldn't surprise me - isn't a great deal better than teams that have gone down in recent seasons, Gretna aside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laranjinha Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Agree with the OP. We will be in a relegation battle next season if our glorious Fuhrer Mr Romanov carries on running the club the way he has this last 2 seasons. I fear Dundee coming up as I think they have the makings of a good manager in Alex Rae. Hamilton less so (even though they are above Dundee right now). Could be between us, Kilmarnock and St Mirren in a fight against the drop next season. If we lose Stewart, Berra and one or two others we could be right in it for sure. And we don't have a goalscorer. Worrying times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Now that everybody on here seems to have accepted that VR will not bring in a quality Manager or sign quality players, flog Kingston, etc - are we also accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season? Our fall down the table from our 2nd finish only a couple of years ago has been dramatic though unsurprising, and we now not only look like finishing in the bottom 6, but we ARE a bottom 6 standard team! This current Hearts team is not the poorest I have ever seen however, frankly they are not much better than the ones that got relegated a few years back. If we are relying on the likes of Neilson, Elliot, Mole as our back bone next season I just shudder! Remember next year there will be no Gretna, and Hamilton or Dundee look to me as if they can play a bit. St Mirren should be one of the relegation favourites however on Saturdays showing you tell me who had the better team! No "Hobo" or "gas oven" comments please - genuine concern here! Not blowing my own trumpet in any way,but pre this season their was a poll asking where we would end up at end of the season,myself and others did say bottom 6,I was a wee bit more exact I honestly did think dottom 3-4 and got a tad slated for it. Top 6 still can be achieved but that is looking an outside bet,as for next season I honestly cannot see us making any improvement at all. Relegation, don't think so,Europe next season ,no fecking way. Next season IMO will see Kingston,Berra,Wallace away and still have the likes of Audrey and Bennie hanging around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I'll start to worry about next season once we've got this one out of the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dipped Flake Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Had a look at our results since Stevie Frail was given (or we were told he was given) full control over the team. In that time, in the league we played 9, won 5, drew 2 and lost 2 (against the OF), an average of 1.88 points a game. Before that time we played 21 and gained 20 points, an average of 0.95 ponits a game. So under full Frail control, our record is twice as good as before and if we had that average point return from the start of the season we would currently be lying in 3rd place. Suppose what I am trying to say is, why are we facing a relegation battle next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Bateman Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 As things stand, I have no doubt we will be fighting relegation next season. The playing side of the club has been rotten for 2 years now. Romanov should have accepted this by now and should have made changes; but he hasn't and that is undeniable fact. He doesn't treat the club or fans with anything approaching respect and hasn't since he acquired over 80% of the shares. At the end of this season Frail should try and force Romanov's hand, but I'm sure he won't. Things will not change; we will continue to be an inconsistent and disorganised joke, fielding fifth rate Lithuanian non-entities and leaving wage thieves rotting in the reserves. That's why I urge people not to renew until May at the earliest, otherwise you're endorsing the status quo. I am not a pessimistic person, I welcomed Romanov and supported him when times were first tough, but things have gone sour for too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jammy T Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 In any normal season we would be currently 9 points above relegation spot. If we dont get better next season, yes, we are in grave risk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadKiller Dog Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 The only thing you can predict next season is that the ugly sisters will be at the top,I cant see how from here you can say a relegation fight is on for next season. Did Motherwell,dundee united expect to be going for third? or Aberdeen to be scraping it out for a top 6 place with us and Falkirk,nothing in recent seasons pointed out to how poor a league season Killie would have. The simple fact is we will not know what our squad is until te august kickoff ,i am not buying into the scare monger theory that we are all doomed yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laranjinha Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 I'll start to worry about next season once we've got this one out of the way. The Fuhrer and his management team already got this season "out of the way" when we lost to Motherwell in the Cup replay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambojambo Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 I'll start to worry about next season once we've got this one out of the way. Nothing to worry about this season - we're not fighting for a Euro spot, a cup or (thanks to gretna) relegation. Unless of course you are worried about us attaining the fantastic goal of a 6th place finish! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambojambo Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 The only thing you can predict next season is that the ugly sisters will be at the top,I cant see how from here you can say a relegation fight is on for next season.Did Motherwell,dundee united expect to be going for third? or Aberdeen to be scraping it out for a top 6 place with us and Falkirk,nothing in recent seasons pointed out to how poor a league season Killie would have. The simple fact is we will not know what our squad is until te august kickoff ,i am not buying into the scare monger theory that we are all doomed yet. I'll tap you on the back to get your head out of the sand in August then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 The Fuhrer and his management team already got this season "out of the way" when we lost to Motherwell in the Cup replay. Nothing to worry about this season - we're not fighting for a Euro spot, a cup or (thanks to gretna) relegation. Unless of course you are worried about us attaining the fantastic goal of a 6th place finish! Yes, a top six finish is all we have left and it is something that i want to see us attain. Not every other Hearts fan agrees but being the only club outwith rantic to consistently finish in the top six since the inception of the SPL is something i'm proud of and i don't want it to end this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambojambo Posted March 19, 2008 Author Share Posted March 19, 2008 Yes, a top six finish is all we have left and it is something that i want to see us attain. Not every other Hearts fan agrees but being the only club outwith rantic to consistently finish in the top six since the inception of the SPL is something i'm proud of and i don't want it to end this season. Fair enough, I can understand where you are coming from. However, with regards to the big picture, I fear that if we do scramble into the top 6, VR will take this as some kind of validation of the way he is managing our Club. As many on here have said, a bottom 6 finish might (just might) be a wake up call to Romanov! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paolo Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Now that everybody on here seems to have accepted that VR will not bring in a quality Manager or sign quality players, flog Kingston, etc - are we also accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season? Our fall down the table from our 2nd finish only a couple of years ago has been dramatic though unsurprising, and we now not only look like finishing in the bottom 6, but we ARE a bottom 6 standard team! This current Hearts team is not the poorest I have ever seen however, frankly they are not much better than the ones that got relegated a few years back. If we are relying on the likes of Neilson, Elliot, Mole as our back bone next season I just shudder! Remember next year there will be no Gretna, and Hamilton or Dundee look to me as if they can play a bit. St Mirren should be one of the relegation favourites however on Saturdays showing you tell me who had the better team! No "Hobo" or "gas oven" comments please - genuine concern here! When did everyone accept this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Gosling Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Dunno. We've played 10 league games under Frail. Won 5, draw 2, lost 3 (to the Old Firm in 2 of them). I've multiplied this by 4 and taken off a win and a defeat in the interests of fairness to make it 38 games. By my calculations, we'd have 65 points at the end of the season with 19 wins, 8 draws and 11 losses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Even if we only take 15 points from 33 available per third ie less than half the available points that still equals 45 points prior to the split - this is usually enough to be mid-table nevermind relegated. It is impossible to say how well or otherwise we will do next season but I certainly don't envisage us being relegated - even in our pre-Frail form of 0.95 points per match = 36 points in total is usually more than enough to be safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin_T Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Now that everybody on here seems to have accepted that VR will not bring in a quality Manager or sign quality players, flog Kingston, etc - are we also accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season? Our fall down the table from our 2nd finish only a couple of years ago has been dramatic though unsurprising, and we now not only look like finishing in the bottom 6, but we ARE a bottom 6 standard team! This current Hearts team is not the poorest I have ever seen however, frankly they are not much better than the ones that got relegated a few years back. If we are relying on the likes of Neilson, Elliot, Mole as our back bone next season I just shudder! Remember next year there will be no Gretna, and Hamilton or Dundee look to me as if they can play a bit. St Mirren should be one of the relegation favourites however on Saturdays showing you tell me who had the better team! No "Hobo" or "gas oven" comments please - genuine concern here! Depends on what is done about the managerial situation. If our high earning players such as Kingston, Pinilla and Goncalves are sold off, it wont make a terrible amount of difference as these guys have either not been playing or have been pash anyway. Most of the current team will probably stay, and in our last 8 games we have won 5, lost 1 and drawn 2. That form would be good enough for a European challenge next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clanmac Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Have to agree with Martin T about selling the high wage earners it probably would'nt make a slight bit of difference on the pitch in fact if I was to be honest imho there is'nt any players in our current squad that would have me panicing if they were sold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Gosling Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Have to agree with Martin T about selling the high wage earners it probably would'nt make a slight bit of difference on the pitch in fact if I was to be honest imho there is'nt any players in our current squad that would have me panicing if they were sold. I'd panic if we lost Banks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clanmac Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 To be fair thats the only name that came to mind as I typed this out.He has had a good season and has safed us a few times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMA MAROON Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Dunno. We've played 10 league games under Frail. Won 5, draw 2, lost 3 (to the Old Firm in 2 of them). I've multiplied this by 4 and taken off a win and a defeat in the interests of fairness to make it 38 games. By my calculations, we'd have 65 points at the end of the season with 19 wins, 8 draws and 11 losses. That would get us into Europe. Quite a few fans are starting to back Frail and would be happy for him to be manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 That would get us into Europe. Quite a few fans are starting to back Frail and would be happy for him to be manager.I'm fairly positive about most things Hearts, but I wouldn't be happy if Frail got the job full time:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 That would get us into Europe. Quite a few fans are starting to back Frail and would be happy for him to be manager. Kind of defeats the purpose when Frail doesn't have the badges to manage us in Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deevers Posted March 19, 2008 Share Posted March 19, 2008 Now that everybody on here seems to have accepted that VR will not bring in a quality Manager or sign quality players, flog Kingston, etc - are we also accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season?Our fall down the table from our 2nd finish only a couple of years ago has been dramatic though unsurprising, and we now not only look like finishing in the bottom 6, but we ARE a bottom 6 standard team! This current Hearts team is not the poorest I have ever seen however, frankly they are not much better than the ones that got relegated a few years back. If we are relying on the likes of Neilson, Elliot, Mole as our back bone next season I just shudder! Remember next year there will be no Gretna, and Hamilton or Dundee look to me as if they can play a bit. St Mirren should be one of the relegation favourites however on Saturdays showing you tell me who had the better team! No "Hobo" or "gas oven" comments please - genuine concern here! A somewhat sweeping and in the opinion of many inaccurate statement. I think I'll wait till this season finishes one way or the other before turning my attention to what may or may not happen next season. If we have no manager by the start of the pre season and we don't sign a few quality player, I might start to worry, but until then I concentrate on what's happenning in the here and now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 That would get us into Europe. Quite a few fans are starting to back Frail and would be happy for him to be manager. Have said it before, that you post to get reactions, but I do find your posts funny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobbyshambles Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 did neil macfarlane really sign for rangers for ?2.1million last night or was that just a dream?i'm still unsure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearts_crazy Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Absolute balls, attention seeking thread alert!!!! Relegation dogfight, talk about an overreaction. Can I just point out that we have played most of this season without our best players and are we in a relegation dogfight? Are we still only 10 points off 3rd place despite all our problems? (no I don't think we will get 3rd). Agreed this has been a pretty crappy season by all accounts but no need to go completely over the top about it, there are still far worse teams in the SPL than us. Too many pessimists on this board, I think some of you need to get laid or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Makween Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Dunno. We've played 10 league games under Frail. Won 5, draw 2, lost 3 (to the Old Firm in 2 of them). I've multiplied this by 4 and taken off a win and a defeat in the interests of fairness to make it 38 games. By my calculations, we'd have 65 points at the end of the season with 19 wins, 8 draws and 11 losses. Bit simplistic. Remember that this is the exact same sequence of games in which we went on a good run at the start of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobbyshambles Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Absolute balls, attention seeking thread alert!!!! Relegation dogfight, talk about an overreaction. Can I just point out that we have played most of this season without our best players and are we in a relegation dogfight? Are we still only 10 points off 3rd place despite all our problems? (no I don't think we will get 3rd). Agreed this has been a pretty crappy season by all accounts but no need to go completely over the top about it, there are still far worse teams in the SPL than us. Too many pessimists on this board, I think some of you need to get laid or something. "scoffs." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivan Drago Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I dont think we'll be in a relgation battle. Think we'll struggle to get into Europe though under Frail. (as some have stated we may well not be able to compete in Europe anyway with Frail in charge...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambojambo Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 Absolute balls, attention seeking thread alert!!!! Relegation dogfight, talk about an overreaction. Can I just point out that we have played most of this season without our best players and are we in a relegation dogfight? Are we still only 10 points off 3rd place despite all our problems? (no I don't think we will get 3rd). Agreed this has been a pretty crappy season by all accounts but no need to go completely over the top about it, there are still far worse teams in the SPL than us. Too many pessimists on this board, I think some of you need to get laid or something. Apart from Gretna (who will not be a factor next season) - WHO are "far worse"?? Killie maybe. I would have also said St Mirren however, THEY played us off the park on Saturday! I also don't know what you mean by "without our best players". I can only think of Kingston, who going by comments on here, is off next season anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougal Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Apart from Gretna (who will not be a factor next season) - WHO are "far worse"?? Killie maybe. I would have also said St Mirren however, THEY played us off the park on Saturday! I also don't know what you mean by "without our best players". I can only think of Kingston, who going by comments on here, is off next season anyway. Totally agree. I would say that only Gretna are "far worse" than us. The last time we played Killie at Rugby park we got pumped. Some people are not willing to face the truth, that at the moment we have a very average team, with no real goal threat, regardless of injuries. Our full backs are very poor. Our midfield minus Larry carries no real creative ability or threat and our strikers can't score. Unless a new manager is put in place and given full control over footballing affairs then I can only see more of the same for next season. Scrapping for a top six place instead of scrapping for a Euro spot, whether it be second or third. Something must be done or it will be the same rubbish as it is just now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lambojambo Posted March 20, 2008 Author Share Posted March 20, 2008 Totally agree. I would say that only Gretna are "far worse" than us. The last time we played Killie at Rugby park we got pumped. Some people are not willing to face the truth, that at the moment we have a very average team, with no real goal threat, regardless of injuries. Our full backs are very poor. Our midfield minus Larry carries no real creative ability or threat and our strikers can't score. Unless a new manager is put in place and given full control over footballing affairs then I can only see more of the same for next season. Scrapping for a top six place instead of scrapping for a Euro spot, whether it be second or third. Something must be done or it will be the same rubbish as it is just now. There speaks a realist! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 In our last 3 games we've lost 4-0, won 3-0 & drawn 1-1 which is 4 points from 9 available & those points gained away at Inverness & St Mirren - extrapolate that over a 38 game season & you could reasonably expect between 40-50 points which historically is more than enough to avoid relegation from the SPL. If nothing changes then there is the possibility we could have another poor season or the team could grow stronger collectively and improve - I can see why you might fear another poor season but why do you fear a relegation struggle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboGraham Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 St Mirren however, THEY played us off the park on Saturday! Played us off the park...really? Possession count was 59%-41% in our favour. We had 7 corners to their 3. We had more shots on and off target. The match ended a draw. I am not for a minute going to suggest that we were the better team on Saturday and a draw was, in my view, the fair result. However, to say "they played us off the park" is simply fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboGraham Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Totally agree. I would say that only Gretna are "far worse" than us. The last time we played Killie at Rugby park we got pumped. Some people are not willing to face the truth, that at the moment we have a very average team, with no real goal threat, regardless of injuries. Our full backs are very poor. Our midfield minus Larry carries no real creative ability or threat and our strikers can't score. Unless a new manager is put in place and given full control over footballing affairs then I can only see more of the same for next season. Scrapping for a top six place instead of scrapping for a Euro spot, whether it be second or third. Something must be done or it will be the same rubbish as it is just now. I can't disagree too much with your appraisal of the current team. However, the original post asked us if we were "accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season?" However, since January the team have performed at a level consistent with the 3rd/4th place in Scottish Football. What evidence have we to assume that this standard is about to drop? The reason we are where we are at present is not because of the current standard it is because of the unacceptable run of results between late November and early January. I am only prepared to accept that the current management/squad set up is likely to be top six next year but will need to improve to achieve the 3rd place position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Played us off the park...really? Possession count was 59%-41% in our favour. We had 7 corners to their 3. We had more shots on and off target. The match ended a draw. I am not for a minute going to suggest that we were the better team on Saturday and a draw was, in my view, the fair result. However, to say "they played us off the park" is simply fantasy. Some people just can't wait to rip the pish out of us even when the stats don't back them up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rods Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Played us off the park...really? Possession count was 59%-41% in our favour. We had 7 corners to their 3. We had more shots on and off target. The match ended a draw. I am not for a minute going to suggest that we were the better team on Saturday and a draw was, in my view, the fair result. However, to say "they played us off the park" is simply fantasy. statistics are like mini skirts though I had the pleasure or displeasure to be there on saturday what I seen was A team devoid off ideas Also as far as I was concerned St mirren had the more guilt edge chances on another day we get humped also take the celtic scottish cup game for example they had something like 70% possesion yet they lost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Our non-Old Firm results this season are as follows; Motherwell played 5 won 2 drawn 1 lost 2 Dundee Utd played 2 lost 2 Hibernian played 3 won 1 drawn 1 lost 1 Falkirk played 2 won 1 lost 1 Aberdeen played 3 won 2 lost 1 Inverness played 3 won 1 lost 2 St Mirren played 3 won 1 drawn 1 lost 1 [edited] Kilmarnock played 2 drawn 1 lost 1 Gretna played 3 won 1 drawn 2 I don't think that indicates we are a relegation candidates? Our last 2 games have been a-typical of our season, good at Inverness, struggled at St. Mirren - people focusing more on the poorer game at St Mirren yet forgetting the much better performance at Inverness which was an excellent result on the back of a thumping from Rangers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Gosling Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Our non-Old Firm results this season are as follows; Motherwell played 5 won 2 drawn 1 lost 2 Dundee Utd played 2 lost 2 Hibernian played 3 won 1 drawn 1 lost 1 Falkirk played 2 won 1 lost 1 Aberdeen played 3 won 2 lost 1 Inverness played 3 won 1 lost 2 St Mirren played 3 won 1 drawn 1 lost 1 [edited] Kilmarnock played 2 drawn 1 lost 1 Gretna played 3 won 1 drawn 2 I don't think that indicates we are a relegation candidates? Our last 2 games have been a-typical of our season, good at Inverness, struggled at St. Mirren - people focusing more on the poorer game at St Mirren yet forgetting the much better performance at Inverness which was an excellent result on the back of a thumping from Rangers. why not include the Old Firm? The results against them still count. From what I can see, we've lost to every team in the league apart from Gretna. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpyjambo Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Now that everybody on here seems to have accepted that VR will not bring in a quality Manager or sign quality players, flog Kingston, etc - are we also accepting that we are in for a relegation battle next season? I am not accepting either until they happen! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicTs Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I don't think that indicates we are a relegation candidates? It sure indicates that we are SHHHHHEEEEIIIITTTTTEEE though especially given our huge budget in comparison to all the teams you choose to mention nevermind the fact we have the biggest crowds and are alleged to have the best facilities and resources available. I think those stats speak volumes for the complete and utter breakdown of the first team at HMFC and it is frankly a disgrace the depth we have plummeted. Your hero is to blame 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 why not include the Old Firm? The results against them still count. From what I can see, we've lost to every team in the league apart from Gretna. I didn't include the Old Firm as we are realistically competing against every other team to avoid the relagation spot or qualify for europe or top / bottom 6 etc. It shows we have pretty much matched those teams quite evenly over the course in the games we've played them so how anybody can extrapolate that into us being relegation candidates I fail to see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deevers Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 I didn't include the Old Firm as we are realistically competing against every other team to avoid the relagation spot or qualify for europe or top / bottom 6 etc. It shows we have pretty much matched those teams quite evenly over the course in the games we've played them so how anybody can extrapolate that into us being relegation candidates I fail to see? It's because this board is permeated with self flagellant's just now. Sad, but unfortunately true, there are those who post regularly here who would love to see us relegated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dougal Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Our non-Old Firm results this season are as follows; Motherwell played 5 won 2 drawn 1 lost 2 Dundee Utd played 2 lost 2 Hibernian played 3 won 1 drawn 1 lost 1 Falkirk played 2 won 1 lost 1 Aberdeen played 3 won 2 lost 1 Inverness played 3 won 1 lost 2 St Mirren played 3 won 1 drawn 1 lost 1 [edited] Kilmarnock played 2 drawn 1 lost 1 Gretna played 3 won 1 drawn 2 I don't think that indicates we are a relegation candidates? While it doesn't suggest that we are relegation candidates, it doesn't suggest that we are good enough for the top six, never mind fighting for a European place. IF we take that next season all the other teams will get new players into their teams, presumably better than the ones that they have at the moment, and players that their manager has identified that should fit with the current squad, then unless we have a manager who is allowed to do the same and not just told who is arriving, whether or not they are A) any good or adaptable to the manager's team and method of playing. I really believe that we will struggle, maybe not relegation but for something like 8/9/10. And for a club our size with the resources we have compared to the rest, that is appalling. I hope that VR proves us all wrong but I for one won't hold my breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 While it doesn't suggest that we are relegation candidates, it doesn't suggest that we are good enough for the top six, never mind fighting for a European place. IF we take that next season all the other teams will get new players into their teams, presumably better than the ones that they have at the moment, and players that their manager has identified that should fit with the current squad, then unless we have a manager who is allowed to do the same and not just told who is arriving, whether or not they are A) any good or adaptable to the manager's team and method of playing. I really believe that we will struggle, maybe not relegation but for something like 8/9/10. And for a club our size with the resources we have compared to the rest, that is appalling. I hope that VR proves us all wrong but I for one won't hold my breath. Football is never static it is always in flux with teams improving & declining - we have seen this already this season with Motherwell & Dundee Utd having better than expected seasons whilst Hearts & Aberdeen having poorer SPL seasons. Despite their best showing in a decade both 'Well and the Arabs both get terrible home attendances probably about half those of Aberdeen & Hearts respectively so I fail to see how they can finance any improvement or indeed hold onto their better players - also Boyle & Eddie Thomson have long since spent their wealth on those clubs so they could both lose key players for next season and be weaker as a result nevermind get stronger - also is there any guarantee that either McGhee and/or Levein will both still be managing those clubs next season? Aberdeen will likely lose some key first team players in the summer as might Hibs & Falkirk - I don't see Inverness paying Marius Nicolae top wages beyond their salary scale indefinitely and promotion candidates Hamilton & Dundee could also well lose some of their top young prospects before they even play their first SPL match....... so it's surely wrong to only assume that everyone else will get better but that Hearts alone will deteriorate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboGraham Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 statistics are like mini skirts though I had the pleasure or displeasure to be there on saturday what I seen was A team devoid off ideas Also as far as I was concerned St mirren had the more guilt edge chances on another day we get humped also take the celtic scottish cup game for example they had something like 70% possesion yet they lost Fair enough, we both had a pretty depressing visit to Love Street on Saturday. I was really trying to demonstrate just how ridiculous the "played off the park" statement was. There is plenty to debate on the current rights and wrongs of our club without making things up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 Football is never static it is always in flux with teams improving & declining - we have seen this already this season with Motherwell & Dundee Utd having better than expected seasons whilst Hearts & Aberdeen having poorer SPL seasons. Despite their best showing in a decade both 'Well and the Arabs both get terrible home attendances probably about half those of Aberdeen & Hearts respectively so I fail to see how they can finance any improvement or indeed hold onto their better players - also Boyle & Yorkston have long since spent their wealth on those clubs so they could both lose key players for next season and be weaker as a result nevermind get stronger - also is there any guarantee that either McGhee and/or Levein will both still be managing those clubs next season? Aberdeen will likely lose some key first team players in the summer as might Hibs & Falkirk - I don't see Inverness paying Marius Nicolae top wages beyond their salary scale indefinitely and promotion candidates Hamilton & Dundee could also well lose some of their top young prospects before they even play their first SPL match....... so it's surely wrong to only assume that everyone will else will get better but that Hearts alone will deteriorate? The general point is right. But the Hearts budget is going to suffer from 1) stadium reconstruction costs (this may just be the demolition costs) and 2) the apparent reality that the Romanovs have run out of money and interest in Hearts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 20, 2008 Share Posted March 20, 2008 The general point is right. But the Hearts budget is going to suffer from 1) stadium reconstruction costs (this may just be the demolition costs) and 2) the apparent reality that the Romanovs have run out of money and interest in Hearts. Even without additional (new) investment in the team and also losing some of the higher earning players (say for example Kingston, Goncalves with Tall & McCann going at end of contract and with or without managing to offload any from Makela, Beslija and Pinilla / Nade) - and if season ticket sales fell to only 10K fans then Hearts would still be generating higher revenues for the team than all bar Hibs & Aberdeen of the non Old Firm SPL teams. We have to continue to reduce the wage bill until the football side of the club operates as close to break even as possible but it might not be until summer 2009 before Hearts can get rid of those high earners who have no signifanct profit potential and whose cost to the club is bigger than the benefit of having them provides. Assuming the teams that played at Inverness and St Mirren are closer to what Hearts can actually afford (in terms of finance not necessarily those personnel) then I think we'll do not too badly. We have to sort out the whole stadium / huge debt issue however we still have players we can profitably trade and even running the team at break even I don't see how Hearts are at any disadvantage to the other teams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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