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Europa League

joe.gausden

By joe.gausden
in The Terrace

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joe.gausden

joe.gausden

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Don't know if this has been posted previously. Just noticed on EEN site that to qualify for Europa League you are far better winning your domestic cup than finishing third. Surely finishing third is a harder achievement than (say) a lucky cup run.

 

Thoughts.

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Brandt

Brandt

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Don't know if this has been posted previously. Just noticed on EEN site that to qualify for Europa League you are far better winning your domestic cup than finishing third. Surely finishing third is a harder achievement than (say) a lucky cup run.

 

Thoughts.

 

Its all good, getting another Euro spot can only be of benefit to the Scottish Game. Make it more competitive.

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Guest JamboRobbo

Guest JamboRobbo

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I see where the OP is coming from.

 

But at the same time, so long as it's only for teams WINNING the domestic cup, and not runners up, then maybe it's a good thing.

 

Afterall, what is the bigger acheivement for say HMFC? Winning the cup? Or finishing third in the league.

 

Overall, winning the cup IMO. But runner up in the cup would be less of an acheivement than third IMO, as anyone can be a runner up. Winning it is a bit special IMO.

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joe.gausden

joe.gausden

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I agree with getting the extra spot but i thought finishing third in league would get the easiest route into the groups but you go into third qualifying round whereas SC winners get into the last qualifier before groups. My point is surely a (lucky) cup run shouldn't be compared to a consistent league run over 38 games.

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Charlie-Brown

Charlie-Brown

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This was a compromise, uefa wanted to boost national cup competitions with a champs league place for the winners but the big clubs were against it.

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Flimsy

Flimsy

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This was a compromise, uefa wanted to boost national cup competitions with a champs league place for the winners but the big clubs were against it.

 

Not really, it has long been the case that cup-winners start in a later round than the 3rd place finishers, but that 3rd place starts in a later round than cup runners-up. It's just that Scotland always seem to be represented by the cup runners-up.

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Guest juvehearts

Guest juvehearts

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This was a compromise, uefa wanted to boost national cup competitions with a champs league place for the winners but the big clubs were against it.

 

 

well they would be,

 

that means one of the big 4 in engueland would have to win the FA, one of rht 4 in italy to win the Italian super cup, the same in germany, holland. do you see the picture?

 

would be amazing if the same was applied to the Scottish cup IMO.

 

this Europa League, whilst im princiable i agree with the consept, but i really wish they'd bring back the cup winners cup.

 

the uefa now europa league is still gonae be second fiddle to the CL.

 

they should bring back the CWC & make the wee cup soemthing to play for

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Gibbo

Gibbo

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This has been the situation ever since the Cup Winners Cup was abolished and the cup winners entered into the UEFA. The cup winners have gone into a later round of the UEFA than the 3rd place team but a team entering the UEFA as cup runners have entered in an earlier round.

 

It's never, however, been an issue in Scotland as since the abolition of the ECWC, the Scottish Cup has always been won by a team that's qualified for the Champions League so the team qualifying for the UEFA from the Scottish Cup has always been the runners up.

 

The last team to win the Scottish Cup and not qualify for the Champions League was us in 1998, which put us into the last ever season of the ECWC.

 

PS: Took too long to type this and point was already made by Flimsy

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Guest JamboRobbo

Guest JamboRobbo

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I agree with getting the extra spot but i thought finishing third in league would get the easiest route into the groups but you go into third qualifying round whereas SC winners get into the last qualifier before groups. My point is surely a (lucky) cup run shouldn't be compared to a consistent league run over 38 games.

 

kindof agree mate. If "a lucky cup run" regularly allowed teams to win the SC.

 

But as it is, HMFC are the only non OF team to win the SC since ??? well about 15 years ago or something.....

 

So it's not as though lucky cup wins happen all that often.

 

The likes of dunfy and Gretna and qos have got in via lucky cup runs, but only as runners up, not winners.

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shaun.lawson

shaun.lawson

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Don't know if this has been posted previously. Just noticed on EEN site that to qualify for Europa League you are far better winning your domestic cup than finishing third. Surely finishing third is a harder achievement than (say) a lucky cup run.

 

Thoughts.

 

Even if it's lucky, I certainly regard winning the Cup as a greater achievement than finishing 3rd - though losing in the final clearly isn't. NIT had an article at the end of the 90s attempting to rank clubs by their achievements throughout the decade. If I was to do something similar (which no doubt in my extreme sadness, I will), I'd award points as follows:

 

SPL winners: 12 points

SPL runners-up: 9 points

Scottish Cup winners: 8 points

SPL 3rd place: 6 points

League Cup winners: 4 points

Scottish Cup runners-up: 4 points

SPL 4th place: 3 points

League Cup runners-up: 2 points

Scottish Cup semi-finalists: 2 points

League Cup semi-finalists: 1 point

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Jambo in Yorkshire

Jambo in Yorkshire

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I started a thread on this a few weeks ago - the attached link shows the entry points for our teams (and all other countries) into the Europa League

 

I would remind everyone that winning the cup or 3rd/4th in the league is the basis for entering the competition but once in any given round its co-efficients that decide the seedings

 

We could enter the round before another Scottish team and win our match but then we could be seeded and they might not be!!

 

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/access2009.html

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topcat

topcat

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This has been the situation ever since the Cup Winners Cup was abolished and the cup winners entered into the UEFA. The cup winners have gone into a later round of the UEFA than the 3rd place team but a team entering the UEFA as cup runners have entered in an earlier round.

 

It's never, however, been an issue in Scotland as since the abolition of the ECWC, the Scottish Cup has always been won by a team that's qualified for the Champions League so the team qualifying for the UEFA from the Scottish Cup has always been the runners up.

 

The last team to win the Scottish Cup and not qualify for the Champions League was us in 1998, which put us into the last ever season of the ECWC.

 

PS: Took too long to type this and point was already made by Flimsy

 

Even if this sytem had been in place in 1998 it would have made no difference as we were the 3rd place team as well as cup winners.

 

In the last 20 years there are three times whan a team from outside the old firm has won the cup without finishing in the top 3 and only Killie's look to have had a seriously "Lucky" route to the final.

 

Kilmarnock 1997 (7th in League)

East Strilingshire (H), Clyde(A), Greenock Morton(A), Dundee United, Falkirk

 

Dundee Utd. 1994 (6th in League)

Arbroath(A), Motherwell(H), Airdrie(A), Aberdeen, Rangers

 

Motherwell 1991 (6th in League)

Aberdeen(A), Falkirk(H),Greenock Morton(H), Celtic, Dundee United

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