Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 Well what do people think? I think we do, yes we have a lot of younger players in the team, however, these boys have been around a while now, the next generation seem to have spent the best part of a season doing nothing now. Take Templeton, stand out all season for the reserves, yet 5 minutes to go and we take off Nade and bring on a player who is well on his way out the door. Husband has been pushing at the door for 18 months now and still hasnt had a chance of a little run out. McGowan has been excellent for ages too and is still not being given a chance. Ditto with Rapnik. We had the same problems when Driver and Eggert first broke through, they were superb in the reserves and then were basically left to do nothing for 18 months with players like McCann given their spots instead, this wouldnt be so bad if they had delivered, but they didnt. It seems ok once they finally do get a chance, however I think we hold them back a bit too long. For me the likes of Rapnik, Templeton, Husband and McGowan have all shown more than enough to have justified some first team exposure, especially since if players do go they will likely be the ones to replace them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxteth O'Grady Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 It's a tricky one, I'd love to see some of the youngsters mentioned getting a chance but..... The trouble is results are seen as more important and we've been grinding these out in an unconvincing manner. In an ideal situation Templeton/Glen/Wallace/Cowan/Robinson would come on when we were 2 or 3 goals up with 15 minutes to go and have the chance of bagging a goal, there lies the problem. Last season we didn't give the young guys a chance til our season was over, When Zaliukas was suspended recently I'd have given Rapnik or McGowan a shot but you can't argue with the recent results. I'm sure there time will come if they are good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N User Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 I think the best example of putting a player in at the right time was Eggert. He was brought in gradually and allowed time to get accustomed to the SPL. Calum Elliot and Jamie Mole were chucked in at the deep end and it didn't help. It could be argued they weren't/aren't good enough but it's safe to say they weren't brought into the team correctly. Likewise Driver: he was chucked into the team when he was too raw. He is only now starting to show some real promise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 I said on another post last night that if we keep grinding out one goal victories(which are great) there will be little chance of seeing a youngster being given his chance from the bench imo. If we get to the stage of winning a game by 2or3 goals with 15mins left then we might see them being introduced, but that dosent look likely just now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123kid Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 You need the right type of experienced players around them on the park though, whic we don't. Rapnik and McGowan should be put on loan for the 2nd half of the season, and temps or glen brought in - its less risky to play an inexperience attacking player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victorian Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 prancer is right, one or two have to be integrated into the side. not wholesale, one at a time. first up... templeton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Rob Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 For God's sake, Prancer, give it a rest, can't you? Hearts have won four games on the trot. Where are the negatives? Oh yes, we're not bringing the youth players through quickly enough! We already have one of the youngest squads in the SPL. I'm all for giving youth a chance, but, as people have mentioned above, not in the manner of Mole and Elliot. Eggert was clearly the best example of how to introduce a new player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jambomickey Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 12 points out of 12 says it all imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArmiyaRomanova Posted November 23, 2008 Share Posted November 23, 2008 How are the reserves doing this season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
speedbump Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Repeat until your throat goes:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboinglasgow Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 How are the reserves doing this season? Hearts are 5th in the league, having only lost one match (annoyingly to Hibs.) There is usually no more than 3 over 23 players in the team and considering they are against some older teams they do very well. If they continue like they do it could prepare some to be ready for the first team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Is this the same OP who said our youths weren't good enough in numerous threads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamcow1 Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 when is the rite time to bring in a young player? some of them would come in and do well! others it mite set them back months! im sure some of them will start to make a appearance over the next few months as i think csaba wants to utilise the youth set up. guess he just has to use the current crop of first team wasters in the hop that someone will want to buy them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Is this the same OP who said our youths weren't good enough in numerous threads? At various times I'd suggest he thinks or has thought that none of our youths have what it takes. Ironic he is now calling for their introduction to the 1st team. Unless it a cynical ploy to, if they have a poor game, start a thread telling everyone I told you so!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam Tarts 1874 Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 As the season goes on there will be injuries and suspensions, so I'm sure there will be some opportunities. We do not have the luxury of being 3 goals up in a game to give young players a chance, neither do we have the luxury of the "no expectation mid-table sides" who can experiment without their fans getting on their backs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Bapswent Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Interesting that such a prolific poster, who rarely lets up on an argument has started this thread...controversially, then disappeared... Some might think he was just stirring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jammy T Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 There are 2 positions where youth deserves a chance ahead of the incumbent in the team - the Zaliukas spot and right midfield. IMO I know there would be disagreement on Zali but right midfield is a no brainer with the current injuries and with Jonsson suffering from being punted around the team in any position but his best one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 Interesting that such a prolific poster, who rarely lets up on an argument has started this thread...controversially, then disappeared... Some might think he was just stirring. Or maybe you know I was just sleeping since most of the disagreement came over night? And re youths I am all for giving the best ones a chance, I think we have some very good ones, my issue is we also have far too many poor ones who should have been released a long time ago, and their presence is hampering the development of others. Ultimately if your good enough your old enough and if we have to call up on one of these guys one week I would be a bit more confident if it wasnt their debut. For me Makela should dissapear and when he was due to come on, one of the youths do. agreed defence is slightly more risky, but we need to see what these guys can co and warming a bench every week isnt helping anyone I certainly am not suggesting they should all start every game every week like Elliot or Mole, but they do need to start getting 10 and 15 minutes between them every so often. and Jammy T I agree, Why the hell have Husband and/or Templeton not even been given a subs chance at RM. Eggert isnt doing anything wrong but hes clearly not a natural right midfielder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Or maybe you know I was just sleeping since most of the disagreement came over night? And re youths I am all for giving the best ones a chance, I think we have some very good ones, my issue is we also have far too many poor ones who should have been released a long time ago, and their presence is hampering the development of others. Ultimately if your good enough your old enough and if we have to call up on one of these guys one week I would be a bit more confident if it wasnt their debut. For me Makela should dissapear and when he was due to come on, one of the youths do. agreed defence is slightly more risky, but we need to see what these guys can co and warming a bench every week isnt helping anyone I certainly am not suggesting they should all start every game every week like Elliot or Mole, but they do need to start getting 10 and 15 minutes between them every so often. and Jammy T I agree, Why the hell have Husband and/or Templeton not even been given a subs chance at RM. Eggert isnt doing anything wrong but hes clearly not a natural right midfielder. I agree that if they're good enough, they're old enough but disagree re the poorer ones. Some develop later than others and the ones who look poor today may indeed be the ones who make it tomorrow. I think you should leave it to the professionals who constantly monitor their progress. You may also have noticed, or perhaps you did not, that Laszlo tends not play over 23s in the reserves, which means that if we played youths when a regular first teamer was injured/substituted, our fringe players would never attain any sort of match fitness - and sometimes when things are not going too well, an experienced sub can be more than useful. Clearly a balance needs to be struck and I have a feeling that when we have a "safe" number of points on the board we may well see more of the youths Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 I agree that if they're good enough, they're old enough but disagree re the poorer ones. Some develop later than others and the ones who look poor today may indeed be the ones who make it tomorrow. I think you should leave it to the professionals who constantly monitor their progress.You may also have noticed, or perhaps you did not, that Laszlo tends not play over 23s in the reserves, which means that if we played youths when a regular first teamer was injured/substituted, our fringe players would never attain any sort of match fitness - and sometimes when things are not going too well, an experienced sub can be more than useful. Clearly a balance needs to be struck and I have a feeling that when we have a "safe" number of points on the board we may well see more of the youths I think thats a problem tbh, it seems in this country and board that you can't slate youth. I would say with very few exceptions that if by 19/20 that you are not making semi regular appearences you wont make it. We have around 10 youths who imo really shouldnt be here any longer such as Sives, Thomson,Macdonald, Armstrongs, Mackle ,Kelly, McLaughlin, Divine and Branny who are simply showing nothing to me to suggest they will be SPL players long term. However whilst we have them they are taking resources off younger guys who might make it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 TEN of saturdays squad of 18 came thru our youth system, 5 started (neilson berra wallace jonsson driver) & 5 subs (macdonald mole thomson brown templeton) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 TEN of saturdays squad of 18 came thru our youth system, 5 started (neilson berra wallace jonsson driver) & 5 subs (macdonald mole thomson brown templeton) My point though is we are not giving youth a chance over others. Imo Makela is clearly not wanted or going to be here beyond the end of the season thus, he should be told were to go and Glen or Templeton given his place and sub appearences. We do already have a lot of youths yes, but I think we just smother them a bit at the final stage and hold them back a bit too long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David McCaig Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 If we qualify for next seasons Europa League, then the increase in games will see increased opportunities for youngsters to play, which is surely a win-win situation for everyone at the club. The important thing is that we now have an outstanding crop of youngsters banging on the first team door. Maybe this in itself is one of the contributory factors to the improved performances of the senior players currently (deservedly) in possession of the first team jerseys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morry Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 What the hells happening with Gary Glen?!!! And whens Matej Ratpnik going to break through? http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=JwHCYkLEXJU&feature=related Is there a future Robbo in there?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 What the hells happening with Gary Glen?!!! And whens Matej Ratpnik going to break through? http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=JwHCYkLEXJU&feature=related Is there a future Robbo in there?! I am more intrigued about what has happened to Ryan McGowan who was on the fringes of the first team at the beginning of last season and made his debut in the Barcelona game and has since dissapeared. I am amazed he is still waiting for a competitive debut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David McCaig Posted November 24, 2008 Share Posted November 24, 2008 Ryan McGowan made his senior debut against Gretna last season. He has been away on international duty with his Australian age-group side for much of this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted November 24, 2008 Author Share Posted November 24, 2008 Ryan McGowan made his senior debut against Gretna last season. He has been away on international duty with his Australian age-group side for much of this season. Ahh had forgotten about that Still think he hasnt had as much as he should have in the way of first team football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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