Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 With the FTSE down to under 4000 points & the Economic downturn so bad, Britian IS in resession. What will this mean for our Football Clubs & Leagues? Jimmy Hill started the Boom, now I feel The Scottish game is going Bust & SPL fans will Struggle to fork out on ticket prices for watching sub stanard football being offered for the ridiculous prices being offered to away fans. This is not healthy for the whole would of football & i feel more clubs are walking the 'gretna' tightrope. You see it in the news every week about premiership clubs, man ure, west ham, arsenal, chelsea & now the richest club in the world - man city, cant afoard to keep up the challenge of being top dog in English football. Now in scotland, 42 professional clubs for a small nation of just over 5 million is going to stretch the limit of who has the fane base & credit to survive the next season or year. Interesting times lie ahead in scotland & the demise of over ?20 a ticket & ?3 for a programe for the fans in top flight scottish football should be over. Players will be unwilling to take a pay cut because they have family's & mortgages to pay. The good will leave & move on to clubs willing to pay their salaries. will this now mean that the dominace of scottish football is to end & the structure is going to get a radical shake up that it so badly need's? Time will tell. Is it interesting times ahead for scottish football or a resession that will kill or merge lower division clubs? discuss please, interesting post IMO Juve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighusref Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Not having a go at you in the slightest Juve, but this question has a similar theme to the one about VR and his future (hopefully a long, long time away) passing. As long as VR is alive and interested in our club we will have no "Gretna" style worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Not having a go at you in the slightest Juve, but this question has a similar theme to the one about VR and his future (hopefully a long, long time away) passing. As long as VR is alive and interested in our club we will have no "Gretna" style worries. Hi bighusref, This topic has nothing to do with VR & his future, it has to do with World football, more inpaturicular, Scottish football's ability to survive the resession. I believe teams like, arbroath, cowdenenbeath, east fife will struggle to survive & believe that a new structure is badly needed in scottish football. Teams living outwith their means, hearts, rangers & celtic are & will struggle (hearts more so) to survive the next finantual year. we will still be here because we have the fan base, but lower league teams like the names mentioned will struggle to commit to their schedule for the next season/year. I believe more than now the SFA must expand the SPL to 18 teams & drop the 3rd division & make a pyramid system so teams can survive. Only time will tell. Over to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richiehmfc Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 The bottom line is the cost of going to watch Scottish Premier league football is not value for money. The quality on show is dreadful and I don't believe it will be the end of the prawn sandwich brigade but the end of the working class man watching football on a Saturday afternoon. ?27 for Easter road on Sunday is a disgrace. The atmosphere will be good of that their is no doubt but the actual quality of football is very bad. Tickets for Scottish Premier league games should be capped at around ?15, if hearts sold tickets for ?15 they would sell out every week, increasing revenue and interest in the club hugely and making tynecastle a more intimidating place to visit. Tickets for your average premiership games cost ?25-?30 and the quality is 10x the rubbish we watch. I find it pretty disgusting that clubs charge the lifeblood of football so much and basically take us for mugs due to our unequivocal support of our chosen team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighusref Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Hi bighusref, This topic has nothing to do with VR & his future, it has to do with World football, more inpaturicular, Scottish football's ability to survive the resession. I believe teams like, arbroath, cowdenenbeath, east fife will struggle to survive & believe that a new structure is badly needed in scottish football. Teams living outwith their means, hearts, rangers & celtic are & will struggle (hearts more so) to survive the next finantual year. we will still be here because we have the fan base, but lower league teams like the names mentioned will struggle to commit to their schedule for the next season/year. I believe more than now the SFA must expand the SPL to 18 teams & drop the 3rd division & make a pyramid system so teams can survive. Only time will tell. Over to you I didn't misunderstand the question, I merely answered from a Hearts point of view. Other clubs will struggle, yes, however we will be fine if VR is alive and as long as he keeps his interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 I didn't misunderstand the question, I merely answered from a Hearts point of view. Other clubs will struggle, yes, however we will be fine if VR is alive and as long as he keeps his interest. well take off the maroon tinted glasses & give your opnion on where the direction of football is likley to go please. Hearts are 1 club in a country of 42 others. what are your feelings on where the scottish leagues are going. IMO theyre going down the swanny & the SFA should intervine & take the matter seriously & re structure the leagues to 18, 2 divisons, dropping the 3rd divsion & introduce a pyramid system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Not sure what you are on about to be honest. Keano's "prawn sandwich brigade" were the people on hospitality tickets who took extended half-time refreshments and didn't return to their seats until well after the 2nd half had kicked off. He also bemoaned the fact that they are less vocal than the many regular fans. For as long as rich men have egos there will be football. We may see a change in ticket prices as some people forego away tickets but the majority of supporters at Tynie are still ST ticket holders who are paid up anyway. The OF fans will follow their teams for as long as they can get away with singing their songs in away grounds. It will take a while for any recession to bite as big companies are still making money and still spending on advertising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Francis Albert Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 It will take a while for any recession to bite as big companies are still making money and still spending on advertising. Not so sure. Corporate hospitality is one of the first things to go when budgets are tight. Apart from anything else it is conspicuous spending of a dangerously visible kind ... as AIG has found out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nade ate my sausage Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Restructure the league to a 16 or 18 team competition, bring back standing areas and cap ticket costs at ?18 max (?15 for standing) for all clubs. Evenly distribute league sponsorship and television money across all teams rather than bending over and letting the old firm rape scottish football again and again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 If the incomes of football clubs in general falls then In the medium term (years not months) this will cause players wages will come down as well to whatever level is now almost affordable. Clubs like Hearts will attract smaller fees from the big clubs we tend to sell to but smaller clubs will command similarly smaller fees from Hearts. In the short term however clubs will find themselves locked into contracts that they can't really afford any longer. Luckily however some of this will be passed on to broadcasters who will still be paying the same big prices for the rights despite advertising revenues falling. The last time football got hit by a speculative bubble bursting was quite recently with the collapse of ITV Digital (march 2002). As soon as that happened the market for sports rights collapsed. The SPL ended up crawling back to Sky and accepting a deal that was worth about half as much as the one that they'd turned their back on while Johny Vegas and Monkey were still in business. The clubs that got hit hardest at the time were Clubs who were pursuing ambitious 'speculate to accumulate' policies. We got hit hard and almost ended up at Murrayfield, Leeds United, Champions League Semifinalists the previous year now struggling to get out of the third tier, are the most spectacular victims. The clubs who were overextended were unable to get out of trouble, as they might have anticipated, with a fire sale of players to raise cash and reduce wages because few other clubs had enough money to pay them at their pre-crash wage rate never mind pay big fees for them In this respect the current Hearts regime seem to have got something right. By accident or design they've been offloading the big earning players just before the market crashed rather than just after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 interesting post IMO Bit big-headed don't you think? I'd like to know in what way you think it will affect football clubs? The clubs having 'problems' down south, are those that are privately owned. Its not the clubs themselves in 'trouble', but the owners. Most of it is media nonsense though. Half the real problems created to do with this credit crisis are caused by the fear factor created through our over-exposure to modern day media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Not so sure. Corporate hospitality is one of the first things to go when budgets are tight. Apart from anything else it is conspicuous spending of a dangerously visible kind ... as AIG has found out. Depends on the nature of the business. The company I work for has tickets paid up for the season at Chelsea, Arsenal, Manu, Celtic, Twickenham, Murrayfield, Cardiff, various club rugby grounds in England & Wembley... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Interesting times lie ahead in scotland & the demise of over ?20 a ticket & ?3 for a programe for the fans in top flight scottish football should be over. Sorry, what does this sentence mean? "The demise....... should be over" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Depends on the nature of the business. The company I work for has tickets paid up for the season at Chelsea, Arsenal, Manu, Celtic, Twickenham, Murrayfield, Cardiff, various club rugby grounds in England & Wembley... This season or next though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 This season or next though? Some are STs/boxes whilst some are debentures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Bit big-headed don't you think? I'd like to know in what way you think it will affect football clubs? The clubs having 'problems' down south, are those that are privately owned. Its not the clubs themselves in 'trouble', but the owners. Most of it is media nonsense though. Half the real problems created to do with this credit crisis are caused by the fear factor created through our over-exposure to modern day media. You would think so. British football has been in decline for years now. the standard has fallen & the clubs that are being owned by private buyers, are excelling & that is not heathy for football as a whole. Yes i believe the media has caught on to the finantual banwagon, but you cant say its down to the media that the USA, UK, europe & now china & asia have fallen. banks have been irresponciably lending to everyone (included are football clubs) and now they are feeling the brunt of the bust after the boom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Sorry, what does this sentence mean? "The demise....... should be over" exactally what it means, the demise is over & I think it is. croud levels at all spl clubs have dropped, time for a rethink, because players are being overpaid & clubs are living outwith their mean, thats why they have to chage more for a poor product. people will pay but for how long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Some are STs/boxes whilst some are debentures. So, in theory, you could have the ST/boxes cut from next years budget and transfer the debentures? (they are normally transferable I think?) Anyways, I guess its moot, as even if one company did decide to not renew, another would snap them up. Clubs will never have trouble selling this kind of thing, I don't think. Especially the big ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 exactally what it means, the demise is over & I think it is. croud levels at all spl clubs have dropped, time for a rethink, because players are being overpaid & clubs are living outwith their mean, thats why they have to chage more for a poor product. people will pay but for how long Ahhh, right - thanks for clearing that up then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Ahhh, right - thanks for clearing that up then. http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&defl=en&q=define:demise&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=title death: the time when something ends; "it was the death of all his plans"; "a dying of old hopes" A conveyance of an interest in property for a set period of time (such as in a lease). Demise the way i ment is, that the demand for the product has fallen & the effects will be felt by all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&defl=en&q=define:demise&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=title death: the time when something ends; "it was the death of all his plans"; "a dying of old hopes" A conveyance of an interest in property for a set period of time (such as in a lease). Demise the way i ment is, that the demand for the product has fallen & the effects will be felt by all You meant the demand is over - that makes much more sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest juvehearts Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 You meant the demand is over - that makes much more sense? nope the demise, then demand was over 3 seasons ago, the demise has started Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Whittaker's Tache Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 The demise is over? That sentence doesnt make any sense to me. I'll harp on again about Bayern and my tenner seat and my 90p programme and getting to watch world class talent. I was listening to Radio 4 this morning and I caught the end of an article about this subject and how Hamburg were owned by a commitee of fans. Not sure how it worked as I missed the start of it. I'll not be at Easter Road at the weekend cos I think ?54 for two of us to sit in that sh*thole is taking the p. Plus the fact that most of the football we've played this season has been diabolical in terms of entertainment and over ?50 to watch it seems masochistic in my eyes. If that makes me less of a fan, then I'll be less of a fan with a spare ?54 in my hip Oh and yes I have a season ticket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 exactally what it means, the demise is over & I think it is. croud levels at all spl clubs have dropped, time for a rethink, because players are being overpaid & clubs are living outwith their mean, thats why they have to chage more for a poor product. people will pay but for how long nope the demise, then demand was over 3 seasons ago, the demise has started So hang on has the demise just started?, or is it now over? By saying that the demise of should be over you're suggesting that the demise is ongoing and will soon finish. Presumably you meant to say the opposite; The demise of ?20+ tickets will start happening soon. Try rewriting your sentence substituting "end" for "demise" and see if it still makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 nope the demise, then demand was over 3 seasons ago, the demise has started There was a serious downturn in the world economy late 80's early 90's so why would this particular one be the death of the game? Football has survived 2 world wars, a depression and countless recessions, communism and a whole lot more. I suspect it will survive the FT dropping below the 4k mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven98 Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 The demise is over? That sentence doesnt make any sense to me. Well that's two of us. Perhaps Joov's gone all poetic and is intimating that "the dying is over." Deep words from a powerful intellect. Interesting reply IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123kid Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 No restructure (in terms of making larger leagues in Scotland) will ever happen, thats a fact. Due to the short sides and greedy objections of mid table SPL chairman. ****e league, will get ****er. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
123kid Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Restructure the league to a 16 or 18 team competition, bring back standing areas and cap ticket costs at ?18 max (?15 for standing) for all clubs. Evenly distribute league sponsorship and television money across all teams rather than bending over and letting the old firm rape scottish football again and again. If only mate, lol. Your dreamin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 You meant the demand is over - that makes much more sense? Agree with what you say on the basis that the demand is over you then express the follow up as interest is fading (often referred to as a demise). If you were to say the demise is over you would then expect interest to pick up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Genghis Khan Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 Agree with what you say on the basis that the demand is over you then express the follow up as interest is fading (often referred to as a demise). If you were to say the demise is over you would then expect interest to pick up. I've long since given up trying to guess what the OP was meaning TBH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heaven98 Posted October 17, 2008 Share Posted October 17, 2008 I've long since given up trying to guess what the OP was meaning TBH. I think it's worth persevering, GK. It's not often you stumble across such a high level of cogent insight on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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