Therapist Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Shame. http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/sport/Scotland39s-standing-takes-hit-as.4558713.jp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is a shame cos when Hearts next get into europe we are more likely to be unseeded and get harder draws like AEK or Sparta-Prague than some of the more easier beatable teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King of the North Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is indeed a shame - we all need to get behind Celtic FC in their Champions League campaign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is indeed a shame - we all need to get behind Celtic FC in their Champions League campaign. I'd rather stand in from of a train that was travelling directly at me at 100 mph. I wouldn't p i s s on that bunch of s h i t, never mind offer them support of any sort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Sexington Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is indeed a shame - we all need to get behind Celtic FC in their Champions League campaign. I'm sure Therapist will heartily endorse that view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Therapist Posted October 4, 2008 Author Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is a shame cos when Hearts next get into europe we are more likely to be unseeded and get harder draws like AEK or Sparta-Prague than some of the more easier beatable teams. You have to face good teams at some point. PortobelloJambo sums it up perfectly. Basically, we are the Hearts and everyone else can GTF - especially plastic paddies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 The OF and Motherwell could go and **** themselves in their games this year. QOTS, never bothered me. Obviously there are after affects if there clubs dont perform. But hey ho. Would you like Motherwell getting a possible extra 1million or 1.5million in their bank account? Would I heck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 You have to face good teams at some point. PortobelloJambo sums it up perfectly. Basically, we are the Hearts and everyone else can GTF Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is indeed a shame - we all need to get behind Celtic FC in their Champions League campaign. Not a chance. But it was Rangers who were in the CL I'm sure one or two 'loyal' Hearts fans would get behind the 'Gers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 You have to face good teams at some point. PortobelloJambo sums it up perfectly. Basically, we are the Hearts and everyone else can GTF - especially plastic paddies. I'd rather face the better teams in the group stages of competitions than the qualifiers though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horatio Caine Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 This co-efficient stuff is all c**p anyway. What effect would improving the co-efficient have? More Scottish teams in Europe embarrassing themselves. Scottish teams seeded so's they get well humped by much better teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chad Sexington Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It will be a cold day in hell before I shout for the Mhanks in Europe. Like Therapist says, you have to play the decent side at some point, so I'll not lose any sleep over losing any standing in Europe. I don't give a toss how other Scottish teams do in Europe and often enjoy seeing them fall flat on their faces...ala McGhee and his Murderwell flops the other night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It will be a cold day in hell before I shout for the Mhanks in Europe. Like Therapist says, you have to play the decent side at some point, so I'll not lose any sleep over losing any standing in Europe. I don't give a toss how other Scottish teams do in Europe and often enjoy seeing them fall flat on their faces...ala McGhee and his Murderwell flops the other night. Exactly CS, if you are good enough you will progress under your own steam, whoever you meet. In Europe this year Rangers, Celtic, QoTS and Motherwell have proven to be s h i t, not our problem, theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Therapist Posted October 4, 2008 Author Share Posted October 4, 2008 I don't give a toss how other Scottish teams do in Europe and often enjoy seeing them fall flat on their faces...ala McGhee and his Murderwell flops the other night. The post of a true Hearts fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazo Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I agree with NMH we really need to be playing the decent sides in the group stages of europe rather than the qualifing. Or we will just be another side getting papped out in the first round. The problem with that is not a chance in hell I could want the OF to do well and I loved motherwell getting pumped the other night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Unless the Scottish Cup winners this season finish below 5th place in the SPL then the top 5 placed SPL will be playing in europe next season as the intertoto has been scrapped & merged into the new revised UEFA Cup and participation is now compulsory not optional at the early qualifying stages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 By far the worst european result of our teams this season was the Hobo's getting papped by a small band of Elf's.....but being a wee team themselves they possibly took sympathy on the little people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 By far the worst european result of our teams this season was the Hobo's getting papped by a small band of Elf's.....but being a wee team themselves they possibly took sympathy on the little people. Hibs was a tonking no doubt, and I loath to stick up for them - but they were seriously found out against a team that was already in to their new season. Dont know if its true, but did hear that Mixu never wanted to play the inter toto but his hand was forced by The mowzer man. Still, it was all very funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Hearts don't really have much cause to complain The last time we made it we lost to AEK and Sparta Prague, both of whom where teams we should have had the quality to beat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tynie b Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Fek the co-efficient...I wouldn't support the S C U M from the West if they paid for my Family Holiday next year!! As for Murderwell and McGhee...Well that cheered up my Thursday night!! Only 1 Scottish team I give a Fek about in Europe or any other compitition and that is Heart of Midlothian...**** the rest, AND the National Team!! I only bother about other teams when they're on my Coupon on a Saturday!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Hearts don't really have much cause to complain The last time we made it we lost to AEK and Sparta Prague, both of whom where teams we should have had the quality to beat Prancer that is one of the most deluded things you have ever posted on this forum - not only were both those teams better than us then both those clubs have european records far superior to Hearts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Prancer that is one of the most deluded things you have ever posted on this forum - not only were both those teams better than us then both those clubs have european records far superior to Hearts. At that time we where coming off a great season, had a massive squad of quite big name players and from my memory we where dreadful Yes they where always going to be hard games, but we simply never showed up and made too many schoolboy errors to have a hope Jamie Mole starting was just one example of such I remember both games and tbh our performances absolutely where disgraceful, it was like we didnt want to qualify I have no doubt that if the best hearts team had shown up to these games we would hae won. Teams like Basle and Braga had better pedigree and that didnt stop hearts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Hibs was a tonking no doubt, and I loath to stick up for them - but they were seriously found out against a team that was already in to their new season. Dont know if its true, but did hear that Mixu never wanted to play the inter toto but his hand was forced by The mowzer man. Still, it was all very funny. If Hearts or whoever finish 5th in the SPL this season or possibly 4th depending on which team wins the scottish cup then that team will have to enter the uefa cup / europa league at the very early qualifying stages which is the equivalent of the old inter-tattie and it will be compulsory participation not optional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 At that time we where coming off a great season, had a massive squad of quite big name players and from my memory we where dreadful Yes they where always going to be hard games, but we simply never showed up and made too many schoolboy errors to have a hope Jamie Mole starting was just one example of such I remember both games and tbh our performances absolutely where disgraceful, it was like we didnt want to qualify I have no doubt that if the best hearts team had shown up to these games we would hae won. Teams like Basle and Braga had better pedigree and that didnt stop hearts Sparta Prague in Europe http://www.uefa.com/footballEurope/Club=50033/domestic.html AEK http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=50129/domestic.html Hearts http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=50120/domestic.html Basle http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=59856/domestic.html Braga http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=52336/domestic.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colingwood Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 While I can understand the "Dont care about/hate other teams" attitude the problem is that all Scottish teams are interdependent in Europe. Poor results lower the co-eff which reduces the chances of getting any European games at all. In addition, as has been pointed out, the Scottish teams will meet better opposition earlier. This in turn will result in ever dropping standards with severe implicaations for the national team and all clubs playing in Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 While I can understand the "Dont care about/hate other teams" attitude the problem is that all Scottish teams are interdependent in Europe. Poor results lower the co-eff which reduces the chances of getting any European games at all. In addition, as has been pointed out, the Scottish teams will meet better opposition earlier. This in turn will result in ever dropping standards with severe implicaations for the national team and all clubs playing in Scotland. My outlook is that if we are good enough in our own league we will achieve qualification into Europe, and if we are good enough once in Europe we will progress within whichever competition we qualify for. Feck getting down on two knees and thanking anyone else, and feck even contemplating offering support to that bunch of low life s h i t from Glasgow's East End. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jambomickey Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I'd rather stand in from of a train that was travelling directly at me at 100 mph. I wouldn't p i s s on that bunch of s h i t, never mind offer them support of any sort. spot on mate! hate them and everything they stand for as i do the other bunch in glasgow who play in blue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 You don't have to support any of the other SPL teams in europe you can be ambivalent but them getting better results isn't a bad thing as far as the co-efficient is concerned and if they do get thumped then yes you can still laugh & enjoy it but Scottish teams getting better results will be to the benefit Scottish football and we are usually one of the clubs that is at least in contention for european places & have played in europe more frequently than Hibs, Aberdeen, Arabs, M'well etc in the last decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Would you like Motherwell getting a possible extra 1million or 1.5million in their bank account? Would I heck. Actually, I would. The more decent quality players that we can bring to a very poor league, the better. Will only be better for us also, in the long run. The worse they are, the worse we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is a shame cos when Hearts next get into europe we are more likely to be unseeded and get harder draws like AEK or Sparta-Prague than some of the more easier beatable teams. Actually the seedings are based on the Club Coefficient rather than National coefficient. The National coefficient does play a small part in determining the club coefficient but our seedings are based overwhelmingly on our own efforts (otherwise QOTS would have a similar seeding to Rantic). The real downside to a fall in Scotland's coefficient is that it might eventually lead to less places for Scottish teams in UEFA competitions giving us less margin for error when it comes to qualifying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 The worse they are, the worse we are. Not sure on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Not sure on that. Why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I'm torn between maintaining or co-efficient, so Hearts find it easier to get into and progress in Europe, and the schadenfruede at other clubs mishaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felix Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Sparta Prague in Europe http://www.uefa.com/footballEurope/Club=50033/domestic.html AEK http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=50129/domestic.html Hearts http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=50120/domestic.html Basle http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=59856/domestic.html Braga http://www.uefa.com/footballeurope/club=52336/domestic.html Prancer's point is correct. When we played AEK we did have the quality to beat them, only many of them were injured, and despite the 5-1 agg. drubbing, there wasn't that much between the sides. With a little luck, (and eleven men on the park) we could have been in the champions leaugue group stages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts Heritage Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 With the exception of Motherwell (and Celtic don't count) all the other sides were seeded above their opponents to qualify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Why? The more money Motherwell have in their coffers, the less chance there is of them accepting a bid come the Jan transfer window. Chaps like Clarkson and Reynolds are going to move on at some point - the money they recieve if they got through to the group stages may have taken the pressure of them to sell to the first decent bid - it may give them breathing space to hang on to the summer to accept bids for players. If the money came in, they would have no doubt been able to add quality to their squad. All in all, it may be the difference between Hearts getitng in to Europe and not. From an outide point of view looking in, the Scottish leauge would be stronger - but I cant see how a strong Motherwell will help out Hearts. It would just mean Motherwell picking up more points, which is not a good thing for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam Tarts 1874 Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Prancer's point is correct. When we played AEK we did have the quality to beat them, only many of them were injured, and despite the 5-1 agg. drubbing, there wasn't that much between the sides. With a little luck, (and eleven men on the park) we could have been in the champions leaugue group stages. Yes, I agree. Despite all the possession AEK had and all the long range shots they fired in, if it were not for Bruno's ridiculous red card and Berra we would have gone to Athens 1-0 up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 The more money Motherwell have in their coffers, the less chance there is of them accepting a bid come the Jan transfer window. Chaps like Clarkson and Reynolds are going to move on at some point - the money they recieve if they got through to the group stages may have taken the pressure of them to sell to the first decent bid - it may give them breathing space to hang on to the summer to accept bids for players. If the money came in, they would have no doubt been able to add quality to their squad. All in all, it may be the difference between Hearts getitng in to Europe and not. From an outide point of view looking in, the Scottish leauge would be stronger - but I cant see how a strong Motherwell will help out Hearts. It would just mean Motherwell picking up more points, which is not a good thing for us. The alternative viewpoint to that GA is that the stronger domestic competition we face then not only is the quality of our league improved but it also means we have to be stronger & better to compete.....an example of what iam talking about is 1985-86 season - we had an exceptional season and Rankgers had a stinker but for most of the campaign there was 4 teams (Hearts, Celtic, Aberdeen & Dundee Utd) who had a decent chance of winning and competing for the title and european places and the league was much better for it compared to the situation now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davemclaren Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Yes, I agree. Despite all the possession AEK had and all the long range shots they fired in, if it were not for Bruno's ridiculous red card and Berra we would have gone to Athens 1-0 up. An alternative view would be that if we hadn't had Craig Gordon we might have gone 5 - 1 down. My recollection is us getting totally dominated. Ifs and buts don't count in the end though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 The more money Motherwell have in their coffers, the less chance there is of them accepting a bid come the Jan transfer window. Chaps like Clarkson and Reynolds are going to move on at some point - the money they recieve if they got through to the group stages may have taken the pressure of them to sell to the first decent bid - it may give them breathing space to hang on to the summer to accept bids for players. If the money came in, they would have no doubt been able to add quality to their squad. All in all, it may be the difference between Hearts getitng in to Europe and not. From an outide point of view looking in, the Scottish leauge would be stronger - but I cant see how a strong Motherwell will help out Hearts. It would just mean Motherwell picking up more points, which is not a good thing for us. As an individual club and from a short term perpective, probably not, but our league needs investment across the board if we are going to improve. Look at how well our teams do in Europe. Every team has gradually gone out earlier and earlier in European competition since the early nineties. On the whole now, it doesn't matter who qualifies for the UEFA Cup as, realistically we can't compete. If we qualified for Europe next year, I'd expect us to go out in the first round, just like all the other Scottish teams, because we can't cope playing against opposition from what are now much superior leagues. Hearts will always come first for me, but I don't want to continue to see our league slide and slide the way it currently is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigO Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I'm a jambo, but i shout for the Scottish clubs in Europe (outwith the OF who aren't Scottish) Im a very proud Scot and want us to be well represented and thought of so I take pleasure in seeing teams like Aberdeen last year doing well. Just my feelings. I wish it was Hearts and you never know it maybe will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felix Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 An alternative view would be that if we hadn't had Craig Gordon we might have gone 5 - 1 down. My recollection is us getting totally dominated. Ifs and buts don't count in the end though. Correct Dave, ifs & buts dont count, but it's easily forgotten how close we got to the Champions League, group stages. Sadly, we're miles from there now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 Prancer's point is correct. When we played AEK we did have the quality to beat them, only many of them were injured, and despite the 5-1 agg. drubbing, there wasn't that much between the sides. With a little luck, (and eleven men on the park) we could have been in the champions leaugue group stages. The fact that we were 1-0 up after 89 minutes does lend a certain amount of credence to the idea that we did have the quality to beat them and then ran out of luck. In truth we'd probably used up all our luck in drawing AEK in the first place and missing the likes of Arsenal, Liverpool, Hamburg and Milan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i8hibsh Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 It is indeed a shame - we all need to get behind Celtic FC in their Champions League campaign. I hope you are on the wind up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i8hibsh Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I was shouting very loudly for Nancy on Thursday. I want no clubs in scotland apart from Hearts to win ANY game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted October 4, 2008 Share Posted October 4, 2008 I was shouting very loudly for Nancy on Thursday. I want no clubs in scotland apart from Hearts to win ANY game Do you always bet on draws then apart from the Hearts matches? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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