Non-EU immigration to be restricted

[Therapist]

At last, the government has heeded the wishes of the vast majority of the electorate and looks like it is going to restrict immigration for very valid socio-economic reasons.

 

In my opinion this is great news, but what I find interesting is that just a few years ago the PC hand-wringers would have been shouting "BNP racists", whereas now there's so much as a peep. In my opinion this is because even the hand-wringers realise we could not go on without some controls, but what do others think?

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7605455.stm

[The Mighty Thor]

At last, the government has heeded the wishes of the vast majority of the electorate and looks like it is going to restrict immigration for very valid socio-economic reasons.

 

In my opinion this is great news, but what I find interesting is that just a few years ago the PC hand-wringers would have been shouting "BNP racists", whereas now there's so much as a peep. In my opinion this is because even the hand-wringers realise we could not go on without some controls, but what do others think?

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7605455.stm

 

Evening.

 

I also think this is a great bit of news. It's about time the UK government took a pro-active approach on immigration for a number of reasons. The skills shortage in the UK is becoming quite pronounced and the ageing population exacerbates this. The situation in Scotland is worse still.

 

The only down side to this is that this proposed policy only applies to non EEC citizens for the time being.

[JWL]

So long as nice young Polish girls are excluded from any tightening of the immigration laws, then fine.

[VeraNT]

At last, the government has heeded the wishes of the vast majority of the electorate and looks like it is going to restrict immigration for very valid socio-economic reasons.

 

In my opinion this is great news, but what I find interesting is that just a few years ago the PC hand-wringers would have been shouting "BNP racists", whereas now there's so much as a peep. In my opinion this is because even the hand-wringers realise we could not go on without some controls, but what do others think?

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7605455.stm

 

If governments heeded the wishes of the vast majority of the population we would all be on holiday all year with a million pounds social security payment every week and anyone caught stealing would have both hands cut off.

 

Are you worried about being "swamped"? Too many "non EU" faces walking along Gorgie Road? Have a look at world demographic trends and you better get used to non EU people living and working in Scotland - if not there will be nobody to look after you and drive your buses and serve your pints in your old age.

 

Of course we could start by sending some of Hearts non EU players back to where they came from - that would get the Hearts socio-economic situation sorted right away.

 

My signature says it all......

[Therapist]

So long as nice young Polish girls are excluded from any tightening of the immigration laws, then fine.

 

It's non-EU immigration.

 

You still suffering from Murray being defeated?

[The Mighty Thor]

So long as nice young Polish girls are excluded from any tightening of the immigration laws, then fine.

 

Some of the nice young Polish girls i've seen around Edinburgh have been responsible for a degree of tightening in my 'immigration laws'

[Therapist]

If governments heeded the wishes of the vast majority of the population we would all be on holiday all year with a million pounds social security payment every week and anyone caught stealing would have both hands cut off.

 

I don't think even you believe that Vera. The electorate - even rabid fantasists like SNP voters - can normally differentiate between what is ridiculous and what is achievable/beneficial.

 

What is being proposed is quite sensible. If we have a shortage of certain skills then we'll bring people in that can fill the gap. By constant monitoring and review, the requirements/opportunities can be adjusted every so often. Remember, if we don't have jobs that immigrants can fill, they will end up very unhappy and be wasters/criminals/scroungers. Doing nothing is not an option.

[JWL]

It's non-EU immigration.

 

You still suffering from Murray being defeated?

 

Well that's fine then, Aegon could do with more.

 

Next year for Murray;)

[speedbump]

So long as nice young Polish girls are excluded from any tightening of the immigration laws, then fine.

 

Non EU, last time I looked Poland was part of the EU.

[wright1989]

Well that's fine then, Aegon could do with more.

 

Next year for Murray;)

 

Working in the deli with them for a week untill college starts, please imigration laws, let them flow in freely!!

[JWL]

Non EU, last time I looked Poland was part of the EU.

 

What about Poland?

[Miller Jambo 60]

Some of the nice young Polish girls i've seen around Edinburgh have been responsible for a degree of tightening in my 'immigration laws'

 

Never used to feel like this but they are taking our jobs (FACT)

And they thrive on the min wage.

TBH would send the lot back now.

As for the burds keep a few back as lap dancers:eek:

[VeraNT]

I don't think even you believe that Vera. The electorate - even rabid fantasists like SNP voters - can normally differentiate between what is ridiculous and what is achievable/beneficial.

 

What is being proposed is quite sensible. If we have a shortage of certain skills then we'll bring people in that can fill the gap. By constant monitoring and review, the requirements/opportunities can be adjusted every so often. Remember, if we don't have jobs that immigrants can fill, they will end up very unhappy and be wasters/criminals/scroungers. Doing nothing is not an option.

 

They could end up doing a lot of other stuff apart from being wasters/criminals/scroungers. Arnie is governor of California. For long periods of his acting career he was unemployed. You should attempt to have a better perspective on human potential. There are complex restrictions on non EU citizens attempting to move to the UK.

 

I'm speaking from an immigrants perspective - though now I have moved from a "legal alien" to "permanent resident" status in the US of A.

[Nucky Thompson]

About time:rolleyes: If you drive past Wester Hailes nowadays it's like being in the Congo.

[Therapist]

I have moved from a "legal alien" to "permanent resident" status in the US of A.

 

No reason for you to rush back here then..........

[leginten]

Some of the nice young Polish girls i've seen around Edinburgh have been responsible for a degree of tightening in my 'immigration laws'

 

There's been some unrest in my Eastern Bloc.

[upthehill]

If they can pass basic tests like speaking English, not having any serious illness, being prepared to work for a living and respecting our way of life then great.

 

And if we can pass basic tests like kicking out the workshy and the people that do come here and claim benefits and disrespect our way of life then so much the better.

[The Mighty Thor]

There's been some unrest in my Eastern Bloc.

 

Thank fork someone tumbled to that.

 

I thought JKB was losing its edge of schoolboy smuttiness.

[leginten]

Thank fork someone tumbled to that.

 

I thought JKB was losing its edge of schoolboy smuttiness.

 

As long as I'm around...never!

[VeraNT]

If they can pass basic tests like speaking English, not having any serious illness, being prepared to work for a living and respecting our way of life then great.

 

And if we can pass basic tests like kicking out the workshy and the people that do come here and claim benefits and disrespect our way of life then so much the better.

 

So, where does that leave Michael Essien - I suppose he should be sent back to Ghana now he has a serious disability?

 

the "vast majority of the electorate" can get all the relevant facts here ...

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/documents/managingourborders/pbsdocs/

 

piece of cake moving and settling in the UK.

[Therapist]

So, where does that leave Michael Essien - I suppose he should be sent back to Ghana now he has a serious disability?

 

That's totally different.

 

Michael Essien is a seriously talented individual who brings joy to football fans everywhere. He may be injured but it's temporary and I'm fairly confident he has enough money to ensure he won't be sponging off the UK taxpayer during his recovery.

[Do you know where hell is]

So, where does that leave Michael Essien - I suppose he should be sent back to Ghana now he has a serious disability?

 

the "vast majority of the electorate" can get all the relevant facts here ...

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitecontent/documents/managingourborders/pbsdocs/

 

piece of cake moving and settling in the UK.

 

I am not trying to be offensive but people like yourself really get on my wick. I base my opinions on my quality of life, on what i see and hear for myself, through my life experiances.

 

Gorgie is awash with foreginers, and your tired and tested rouitine of the ageing population and the, doing the jobs we wont is old news. A goverment select commitee has already dismissed the notion that mass immigration is of any relevant benefit to the indigenious population.

 

I suggest you have a look at the recent troubles in south africa to see true xenephobia and how "foreigners" were treated there. People accept that immigration is a part of the modern world and that is part of the reason we have the european union. To suggets that we are to continue to sustain unrealistic growth is utter madness, and considering you dont stay here i suggest you keep your opinion to yourself.

[The Vulture]

Never used to feel like this but they are taking our jobs (FACT)

And they thrive on the min wage.

TBH would send the lot back now.

As for the burds keep a few back as lap dancers:eek:

 

The employees are to blame too then. If you run a business and someone wants to work for peanuts, well why would you not employ them ?

 

Australia and NZ have had skilled workers visas. You can also get a temporary work visa where you can do low skilled jobs (e.g. seasonal fruit picking, bar work etc).

 

To say they thrive on the minimum wage, well that's life where people can work in a supply and demand society. They move somewhere where there is a higher minimum wage. In NZ, many young NZers are leaving this country and heading for Australia to live because of the better wages and 'lifestyle' that is available to them.

[Sheriff Fatman]

If they can pass basic tests like speaking English, not having any serious illness, being prepared to work for a living and respecting our way of life then great.

 

And if we can pass basic tests like kicking out the workshy and the people that do come here and claim benefits and disrespect our way of life then so much the better.

 

Christ, three quarters the people at the job centre wouldn't be able to pass those tests, and that's just the ones who were born in Edinburgh.

 

Could be not get shot of the useless, workshy, sponging homegrown population first as they massively outnumber the comparitavly tiny number of foreigners on benefits.

[Do you know where hell is]

Christ, three quarters the people at the job centre wouldn't be able to pass those tests, and that's just the ones who were born in Edinburgh.

 

Could be not get shot of the useless, workshy, sponging homegrown population first as they massively outnumber the comparitavly tiny number of foreigners on benefits.

 

Show me the figures that back up your statement.

[leginten]

 

Gorgie is awash with foreginers...

 

I hope you're not one of these anti-Lithuanian posters.

 

Show me the figures that back up your statement.

 

Hard to know where figures like that would be available. But the sentiments he expressed are spot on. Which section of the community in Edinburgh and in Scotland generally contains the higher proportion of workshy, lazy bampots - the indigenous population or the immigrants? The answer isn't difficult.

I thought you said you used the evidence of your eyes. If so, I suggest a visit to the optician.

[Boris]

At last, the government has heeded the wishes of the vast majority of the electorate and looks like it is going to restrict immigration for very valid socio-economic reasons.

 

 

Immigration has always been restricted though. All this is doing is making it harder for non-eu nationals to stay and work in the UK.

 

If there were no restrictions previously i assume Mr Gogua would be playing for us at the moment!

[Sheriff Fatman]

Show me the figures that back up your statement.

 

The figures definately wouldn't come from the Daily Wail or other scaremongering little englander rags that like to print scare stories about how johnny foriegner is over-running our quaint little green and pleasant land, and how they are demanding that our culture bow to their evil ways.

 

Scotland's population is 95% British with no other single demograph making up even 2% of the population. That is hardly being over-run.

 

My statement also comes from actually being in job centres and seeing the amount of wasters and spongers and hearing their accents.

[VeraNT]

That's totally different.

 

Michael Essien is a seriously talented individual who brings joy to football fans everywhere. He may be injured but it's temporary and I'm fairly confident he has enough money to ensure he won't be sponging off the UK taxpayer during his recovery.

 

Yeah, but would he actually qualify in the points system? Not sure, there are abundant UK born players who could do a good enough job playing for Chelsea. There is hardly a shortage of skilled UK footballers that is a threat to economic stability or whatever else you were drumming up.

 

And I wouldn't be too sure about the sponging of UK taxpayers stuff. There could just as well be some bookeeping clause that allows Chelsea to be reimbursed for Essiens wages from a combination of public and private health insurance policies.

 

What exactly does sponging of UK taxpayers mean? There is a high chance that you could be young enough that you are still in tax deficit in terms of what the total cost of the UK governments contributiuons has been to your education, health and general care. You could be a tax deficit individual.

 

 

All of that conjecture just like your big fuzzy reactionary statements.

[VeraNT]

I am not trying to be offensive but people like yourself really get on my wick. I base my opinions on my quality of life, on what i see and hear for myself, through my life experiances.

 

Gorgie is awash with foreginers, and your tired and tested rouitine of the ageing population and the, doing the jobs we wont is old news. A goverment select commitee has already dismissed the notion that mass immigration is of any relevant benefit to the indigenious population.

 

I suggest you have a look at the recent troubles in south africa to see true xenephobia and how "foreigners" were treated there. People accept that immigration is a part of the modern world and that is part of the reason we have the european union. To suggets that we are to continue to sustain unrealistic growth is utter madness, and considering you dont stay here i suggest you keep your opinion to yourself.

 

What a laugh, just because I don't live in Gorgie now, I can't have any opinion. Better be careful or people from Tollcross will be telling you what to do.

[The Real Maroonblood]

[quote=Miller Jambo 60;502626[Never used to feel like this but they are taking our jobs (FACT)

And they thrive on the min wage.

TBH would send the lot back now.

As for the burds keep a few back as lap dancers:eek:

 

The weegies are gutted about that fact.

[Boris]

I kinda like the vibe that Gorgie/Dalry has these days with people from different parts of the world setting up their shops.

 

I'm comfortable with it.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

The employees are to blame too then. If you run a business and someone wants to work for peanuts, well why would you not employ them ?

 

Australia and NZ have had skilled workers visas. You can also get a temporary work visa where you can do low skilled jobs (e.g. seasonal fruit picking, bar work etc).

 

To say they thrive on the minimum wage, well that's life where people can work in a supply and demand society. They move somewhere where there is a higher minimum wage. In NZ, many young NZers are leaving this country and heading for Australia to live because of the better wages and 'lifestyle' that is available to them.

 

Spot on. My wife was the primary applicant for our visa over here as she's a nurse and they are desperate for nurses in Australia. Therefore, we have the highest class of visa which gave us permanent residency straight away.

 

If the UK is copying the Australian system, it's about time.

[The People's Chimp]

all these rules are actually going to achieve is to drive up illegal immigration.

 

Can't a get a work permit for your indian restaurant, because you need to pay your kitchen staff ?24'000 a year and they need to have 3 a level euqivalents? then why not employ the guy who turned up at the back door of the restaurant last week looking for work and willing to work 7 days a week for ?10'000. It's not rocket science. make it night on impossible for people to come legally, they'll come illegally. Oh, and whose job has this exploited chef stolen, exactly?

 

What they should be concentrating on is accepting the reality and not bowing to knee jerk tabloid reactions. The reality is that there is a demand for workers in a lot of areas; they should be concentrating on short term visas and allowing people to work here, legally, and contribute. What is also needed is an effective border control. The problem the current Govt. have had with immigration has been a succession of reactionary legislative manouevres.

 

The area of Immigration and asylum has been over legislated upon, with new acts every year, with not a single one taking an honest amd pragmatic appraoch. The system is a shambles, but dont for one minute think that the Home Office are a soft touch or pro immigration. Unfortunately, they are moronic, dogmatic and bound from above. The rules don't even come from the labour party, but whitehall mandarins heel bent on figures and very little else.

[VeraNT]

I am not trying to be offensive but people like yourself really get on my wick. I base my opinions on my quality of life, on what i see and hear for myself, through my life experiances.

 

Gorgie is awash with foreginers, and your tired and tested rouitine of the ageing population and the, doing the jobs we wont is old news. A goverment select commitee has already dismissed the notion that mass immigration is of any relevant benefit to the indigenious population.

 

I suggest you have a look at the recent troubles in south africa to see true xenephobia and how "foreigners" were treated there. People accept that immigration is a part of the modern world and that is part of the reason we have the european union. To suggets that we are to continue to sustain unrealistic growth is utter madness, and considering you dont stay here i suggest you keep your opinion to yourself.

 

It was awash with foreigners when I was a kid to. But what a ****ing ridiculous phrase. Mario, the Italian, who had the ice cream shop on Gorgie Rd opposite Wardlaw Place, the other Mario (another Italian) who had the chip shop at the top of Wheatfield Street, the English guy with the Bomax toy shop next to the main entrance, David and Margaret (both English) who ran the Marvid cafe, Ronnie Proudfoot the venezuelan/american who played football for Tynie, there was a liitle enclave of eastern european jewish people who lived around the bottom of Wheatfield Place and so on and so on............. brought a lot of interest and diversity to a plain vanilla Scottish culture..........

[felix]

all these rules are actually going to achieve is to drive up illegal immigration.

 

Maybe not.

 

A huge proportion of illegal immigration in the UK is borne by non-EU immigrants who illegally outstay the course of their visa or work permit. Proposals are tied in to this new legislation to ensure this is tightened up.

 

It's been quoted by a House of Lords Committee, who halped frame this policy, that:- no country in the world knows the true extent of their own illegal immigration; except perhaps Australia, who count everyone in, and everyone out.

 

Any points-based system similar to the Australian one, sounds good to me.

[The People's Chimp]

Maybe not.

 

A huge proportion of illegal immigration in the UK is borne by non-EU immigrants who illegally outstay the course of their visa or work permit. Proposals are tied in to this new legislation to ensure this is tightened up.

 

It's been quoted by a House of Lords Committee, who halped frame this policy, that:- no country in the world knows the true extent of their own illegal immigration; except perhaps Australia, who count everyone in, and everyone out.

 

Any points-based system similar to the Australian one, sounds good to me.

 

But the highest proportion of overstayers are of antipodean or american origin, that's not going to change under these proposals, which will simply make it harder for people from outside these places to come here and work legally. There is always going to be a demand for cheap unskilled labour in kitchens and so on, and if the rules mean that kitchen staff can't come legally, they'll come illegally.

 

If you look at, for example, the pakistani community, the majority of their immigration is through legal means; spousal or fiance visas in the main. Now, as long as people can bring in a wife through an arranged marriage, that will continue to be the case, and now, following the introduction of these rules, you'll probably see a rise in these kind of applications.

 

What is needed is an honest and pragmatic look at immigration, not the current joke which throws legislation around like a clown trying to keep spinning dozens of plates, running from each one to the next, throwing down another law here, some new rules there.

 

Yes, a points based system is a good idea, but don't come out with disjointed thinking which, for example, allows graduates to stay on after uni for 2 years and work, but offer them no means of extending their stay, if employers cannot go through the expensive work permit process, or which refuses people who have stayed here and worked legally for ten years because of a one week break in their visa, but allows a family of 8 to remain indefinitely because the children have started school.

 

These are all live issues and unfortunately the pressure on the Home Office leads them to lose all sense of proportionality.

[felix]

But the highest proportion of overstayers are of antipodean or american origin, that's not going to change under these proposals

 

I'm not sure where that statistic comes from tbh.

 

Most non-EU Work Permit holders in the UK are from Asia (mostly India) . Only 5% are from Oceania.

Most overseas Students in the UK are from China, closely followed by India. Australia & the US make up only a small proportion.

 

More tellingly, over 50% of work permit holders in the UK are from Asia (mostly India) - Applications for Grants of Extension to Student Visas come mostly from Chinese students,follwed by students from Pakistan, India Nigeria and Bangladesh - in that order.

 

Grants of Extension of Leave to remain in the UK do come mostly from students - but not from the US or Austrralia;- Asia, the Indian sub-continent and Africa make up the bulk of applications.

 

I'm sure Australians and Americans overstay their visas too, but proportionatley they form a tiny number of UK settlers and, and ultimately they return home to warmer climates ! Your figures are true in reverse however - the highest number of illegal overtstayers in Australia are Brits !

 

For the record, the top 10 countries offered "grants of settlement" in the UK (including work-related grants) are India, Pakistan,Philippines,Iraq,South Africa,Zimbabwe,Nepal,Nigeria,China & Bangladesh.

It's workers from these countries that will be mainly affected by the new points based system - yes they'll come illegally anyhow - but the new system should make it harder to flout the law.