Paisley Jambo Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Reading the Levein or Weir post when Paul Ritchie and Andy Webster were mentioned. I'm sure both wil be rich young men but.............. Interested to find out who people think was the biggest waste of talent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Reading the Levein or Weir post when Paul Ritchie and Andy Webster were mentioned. Interested to find out who people think was the biggest waster? Never thought of either of them as wasters, but not really interested in what players do after they leave Hearts. While at Hearts I thought both were excellent defenders for us, passing the ball wasn't their forte, but both knew how to defend the penalty box very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Thomson Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Paul Ritchie, what a waste of talent. i bet if he could do things differently, he would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistol1874 Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Andy Webster just doesn't stand comparison against Paul Ritchie who may well have gone on to be one of our finest ever defenders and who would certainly have played for bigger and better teams than he did IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eldar Hadzimehmedovic Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 TBH, I think Allan Johnston fecked it up more than the pair of them. He could have been a superstar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Ian Malcolm Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 I think the acrimony of Webster's departure overshadows how good a defender he'd become at Hearts. The 18 months before he left it was telling that we missed him more when he was out (in a purely playing sense) than Elvis. Would have been a stick on to be the next captain and, eventually, big money move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterion Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 i've gone for serves them right. the transfer system is that screwed up that the valuable commodity (the player) can walk away... well those two walked away (ok Webster crawled away) and didn't put anything back into the club that helped develop them so i am happy their careers nosedived. also not fussy about how petty that sounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 The pair of them want to contrast their attitudes and motives and subsequent misfortunes with those of Craig Gordon and how he chose to progress his career so that both Hearts & himself received maximum benefit when he did transfer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAYEL Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 I always liked Paul Ritchie and was a big fan. Could have been a Hearts and Scotland great. Solid defender and always good for a goal v Killie. Couldn't believe that crap he came out wiyh in the rangers programme. Dont even think he had signed for them by then. Even though , it still saddens me to think what might have been for him had he stayed at Tynie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfie22 Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 For me it's Webster I was 1 of his biggest fans, the lad strolled through games along side Elvis, often there to mop up behind him. Him and Berra at the heart of defence could have been some match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Tough one. Mabozza could, easily, have gone on to great things but I think that the great things for Webster were already beginning while he was at the Hearts. The fact that we were flying in the league and he was a cert for a Scotland place makes me think that, had he sat tight (and, of course, had Vlad not effed up our season with Burley) he'd have stayed at the top of his game. This assumes that the only reason he's injured is that he left the Hearts with a thousand curses from JKB!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm Tucker Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 I always liked Paul Ritchie and was a big fan. Could have been a Hearts and Scotland great. Solid defender and always good for a goal v Killie. Couldn't believe that crap he came out wiyh in the rangers programme. Dont even think he had signed for them by then. Even though , it still saddens me to think what might have been for him had he stayed at Tynie. Was pretty young at the time, what did he say in the programme? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAYEL Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Was pretty young at the time, what did he say in the programme? As you say was a while back. IIRC It was usual crap about the only team he wanted to play for. After telling us similar and i think how proud he made his grandfather when he played for us. Something along those lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denny Crane Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 As you say was a while back. IIRC It was usual crap about the only team he wanted to play for. After telling us similar and i think how proud he made his grandfather when he played for us. Something along those lines. From what I vaguely recall, it was something along the lines of: "I mark out Gers striker (Mols) and win dream move to Ibrox". Now while a sub-editor at the Rangers News may have been a bit creative with the headline, what on earth was Ritchie doing talking to them (and at best hinting at such a sentiment) when he was still a Hearts player? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rossi_1983 Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 I think overall, Ritchie was a better player for us, and could have had a very good career in the middle of the prem if he had stuck with us for another couple of years. Webster had a fairly slow start, but had really progressed and was starting to realise his potential. If he had stuck with us and avoided injury, I think he could have gone on to become a truly top class defender, and played at the top end of the premiership. Since both of them screwed us over, I am glad their careers stalled after leaving us. You reap what you sow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Say What Again Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 **** the both of them. I'm glad both of them went from strength to strength after weaseling their way out of Tynecastle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winston churchill Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Was pretty young at the time, what did he say in the programme? the usual sooking up to the weegies guff. always wanted to play for them,a dream come true,one of the bigest clubs in the world ect. that from a so called hearts man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munch Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Reading the Levein or Weir post when Paul Ritchie and Andy Webster were mentioned. I'm sure both wil be rich young men but.............. Interested to find out who people think was the biggest waste of talent? Both were hoof ball defenders, not much class, both equally made the wrong decisions and effectively ruined there careers. Ritchie was a classic wandering nomad, it remains to be seen if Webster wanders to as many clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 The pair of them want to contrast their attitudes and motives and subsequent misfortunes with those of Craig Gordon and how he chose to progress his career so that both Hearts & himself received maximum benefit when he did transfer. Aye, right enough, that would've stopped their careers being hampered by injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the king of hearts Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Voted for Andy Webster. Before it all went off the rails for him I thought he was not only an excellent central defender, but definite captain material. He always seemed quietly confident in his own ability and wasn't one for running about losing the head at other players. Absolute waste of a talent but no-ones fault but his own Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knoxyjambo Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Paul Ritchie was the biggest waste IMO. Think he would have gone on to win many, many scotland caps. He was marking the likes of Laudrup, Larsson at such a young age and always gave them a tough time, snuffed them out on more than one occasion IIRC. Was a really solid defender and had a lot of dig about him. I've never held as much as a grudge against Ritchie as some. He's one of the hero's of 98 and that can never be taken away from him. While Webster came on leaps and bounds at Hearts and was starting to look fantastic I still thought he could be a bit casual at times, looked a bit lost if Elvis wasnt beside him in a lot of games. Maybe it's just cause of what has happened but I dont have any time for Webster at all, think his attitude stinks and hope he rots. They've both wasted what could have been very good careers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveofthegame Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Both messed up big time- but Ritchie definitely had much more talent. He could have gone on to be a Hearts and Scottish legend. At the time he left us he was a Scottish Cup winner (guess he'll always maintain some legendary status for that) and Scottish International. I remember the goal he scored in a 3-2 defeat in the Czech Republic, amazing header. Sad to see guys like this leave and ruin their careers. Just wish they would learn, but doubt they ever will. Johnston as mentioned was another waste of talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveofthegame Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Paul Ritchie was the biggest waste IMO. Think he would have gone on to win many, many scotland caps. He was marking the likes of Laudrup, Larsson at such a young age and always gave them a tough time, snuffed them out on more than one occasion IIRC. Was a really solid defender and had a lot of dig about him. I've never held as much as a grudge against Ritchie as some. He's one of the hero's of 98 and that can never be taken away from him. While Webster came on leaps and bounds at Hearts and was starting to look fantastic I still thought he could be a bit casual at times, looked a bit lost if Elvis wasnt beside him in a lot of games. Maybe it's just cause of what has happened but I dont have any time for Webster at all, think his attitude stinks and hope he rots. They've both wasted what could have been very good careers. Spot on in all you say about Ritchie- what i was trying to say but put better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blairdin Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I actually met Paul Ritchie last Sunday - he played in the Hearts Youth Development fundraising match. The one thing that stands out is he is a big Jambo. It's difficult for us to understand as fans, but he explained that when a club like Rangers comes calling, offering big money, Champions League football and the opportunity to work with the best players in the league, some of the best in Europe even, you take it. In 1999 Rangers were streeets ahead of us and the rest. Unfortunately for Ritchie, he was Murray's choice, not Advocaats, (what was that you were saying about it only being mad Vlad that does that) and the rest is history. But to me this is the difference between between Ritchie and Webster - when Webster expressed a desire to move to Rangers, there wasn't such a big gap in the quality of players. So if the move wasn't motivated by a desire to work with better players and better his career, what was it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveofthegame Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I actually met Paul Ritchie last Sunday - he played in the Hearts Youth Development fundraising match. The one thing that stands out is he is a big Jambo. It's difficult for us to understand as fans, but he explained that when a club like Rangers comes calling, offering big money, Champions League football and the opportunity to work with the best players in the league, some of the best in Europe even, you take it. In 1999 Rangers were streeets ahead of us and the rest. Unfortunately for Ritchie, he was Murray's choice, not Advocaats, (what was that you were saying about it only being mad Vlad that does that) and the rest is history. But to me this is the difference between between Ritchie and Webster - when Webster expressed a desire to move to Rangers, there wasn't such a big gap in the quality of players. So if the move wasn't motivated by a desire to work with better players and better his career, what was it? Wasn't motivated by money either as we offered him more than Rangers pay him now. Sad fact is, like so many other Scots, him and his old man are diehard 'Gers fans. A shot stay at Wigan and he got his 'dream' move. Its bit him in the arse though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blairdin Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 In that case, I find it difficult to take exception to that. If I was a footballer, I'd crawl over broken glass to play for Hearts. Wasn't motivated by money either as we offered him more than Rangers pay him now. Sad fact is, like so many other Scots, him and his old man are diehard 'Gers fans. A shot stay at Wigan and he got his 'dream' move. Its bit him in the arse though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveofthegame Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 In that case, I find it difficult to take exception to that. If I was a footballer, I'd crawl over broken glass to play for Hearts. I know where you're coming from. I'm mates with one of his good mates from school, so its definitely true (the Rangers supporter bit i mean). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor Meldrew Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I actually met Paul Ritchie last Sunday - he played in the Hearts Youth Development fundraising match. The one thing that stands out is he is a big Jambo. It's difficult for us to understand as fans, but he explained that when a club like Rangers comes calling, offering big money, Champions League football and the opportunity to work with the best players in the league, some of the best in Europe even, you take it. In 1999 Rangers were streeets ahead of us and the rest. Unfortunately for Ritchie, he was Murray's choice, not Advocaats, (what was that you were saying about it only being mad Vlad that does that) and the rest is history. But to me this is the difference between between Ritchie and Webster - when Webster expressed a desire to move to Rangers, there wasn't such a big gap in the quality of players. So if the move wasn't motivated by a desire to work with better players and better his career, what was it? I'm afraid that I can't accept that. Of course he might have wanted to go on to bigger and better things: no-one begrudges Craig Gordon his move, nor do we harbour great resentment about Alan Maclaren going to Der Hun. The difference is that Ritchie appeared in the Rangers publication talking about a move to Ibrox while he was still a Hearts player. A 'big Jambo' would have had a little more respect for the CLub he professed to support. A 'big Jambo' wouldn't have tied HMFC's hands in their transfer dealings in the way Ritchie did (by essentially saying publicly that Rangers were the only Club he'd go to). He might now claim to be a Jambo, but that's probably only because he's realised the graa wasn't any greener elsewhere. As far as I can recall, he's never apologised for what he did. Until he does, I for one won't forgive him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jambomickey Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I'm afraid that I can't accept that. Of course he might have wanted to go on to bigger and better things: no-one begrudges Craig Gordon his move, nor do we harbour great resentment about Alan Maclaren going to Der Hun. The difference is that Ritchie appeared in the Rangers publication talking about a move to Ibrox while he was still a Hearts player. A 'big Jambo' would have had a little more respect for the CLub he professed to support. A 'big Jambo' wouldn't have tied HMFC's hands in their transfer dealings in the way Ritchie did (by essentially saying publicly that Rangers were the only Club he'd go to). He might now claim to be a Jambo, but that's probably only because he's realised the graa wasn't any greener elsewhere. As far as I can recall, he's never apologised for what he did. Until he does, I for one won't forgive him. seem to remember a young paul ritchie being in the squad for a game at kilmarnock and tommy the rat face mclean played one of our coaches at the time walter kidd ahead of him! maybe he deserved a apology for that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I'm afraid that I can't accept that. I knew him growing up from the age of about 12 years old. Jambo, without doubt. Everyone makes mistakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naeclue Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I think Richie had more skill, primarily due to his pace. I guess it was less critical 10 years ago, but in his limited Wigan career Andy looked incredibly slow. I doubt he'd have had much chance in the premiership at all, save as an older/wiser "big 'un" in the centre of defense. Left too early for that role. How old is Webster now? Maybe a bit early to write him off, I guess he could re-unite with Levein at some stage. For now he is regarded as inferior to Kirk Broadfoot..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor Meldrew Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 I knew him growing up from the age of about 12 years old. Jambo, without doubt. Everyone makes mistakes. Of course they do. He's never apologised for his though, has he? If he did, I'm sure many of us would forgive him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Of course they do. He's never apologised for his though, has he? If he did, I'm sure many of us would forgive him. I don't know mate. just saying that rightly or wrongly whatever he did, I can vouch for the fact he was a jambo when growing up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deevers Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Both Ritchie and Webster are testament to the pervasive influence Rangers have in Scottish football. Ritchie left Hearts probably two season too soon and should have left ensuring that the club that he always said meant so much to him would have benefited from his transfer. Webster (and his agent), made up his mind to work it up Hearts following Hearts rejection of Rangers advances for him at that time. His current situation certainly leaves me shedding absolutely no tears for him what so ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyJenkins Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Ritchie was better than webster IMO. Did he mark Baggio out a game or am I imagining that?! He was at my school, bit older than me tho, defo a jambo but he shouldnt have said what he did especially before he'd moved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Ritchie was better than webster IMO. Did he mark Baggio out a game or am I imagining that?! He was at my school, bit older than me tho, defo a jambo but he shouldnt have said what he did especially before he'd moved. That was an earlier defender that headed to the Huns - Alan McLaren...but at least we got ?1.2M transfer fee for him AND Dave McPherson back in part exchange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyJenkins Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 That was an earlier defender that headed to the Huns - Alan McLaren...but at least we got ?1.2M transfer fee for him AND Dave McPherson back in part exchange. Ahhhh thank you! The old memory aint what it used to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JamboRobbo Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Ritchie was better than webster IMO. Did he mark Baggio out a game or am I imagining that?! He was at my school, bit older than me tho, defo a jambo but he shouldnt have said what he did especially before he'd moved. Finally we agree on something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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