Police Scotland

[Doctor FinnBarr]

Now, I can only talk about Blackburn West Lothian but since our police station closed and have no bobbies pounding the beat the village has turned to shit (wasn't a great place to begin with). 

Drug dealers able to operate openly in the streets, First Bus and Lothian Country change their routes after dark because of feral kids bricking them, wheelie bins getting nicked (lots) and getting torched on football pitches.

Where does it all end? Our nearest police stations are Whitburn and Bathgate which both close at 6pm, after that we've got to rely on Livi who TBH don't give a shit.

Thoughts folks. 

[il Duce McTarkin]

Even the police hate Police Scotland. 

 

Under-funded and over-managed. 

 

 

 

[Doctor FinnBarr]

1 minute ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

Even the police hate Police Scotland. 

 

Under-funded and over-managed. 

 

 

 

 

Aye but the fun thing for them to do now is to post it on FB and expect someone to grass. Thats not policing.

[il Duce McTarkin]

5 minutes ago, FinnBarr Saunders said:

 

Aye but the fun thing for them to do now is to post it on FB and expect someone to grass. Thats not policing.

 

In terms of finding out whodunnit on low-level stuff, social media does most of the policing for them. 

 

Hope you're not looking for a pro-active police force at the local level for your tax buck, mind. Those days appear to be over. None of the rozzers in my social circle seem particulary chuffed about it. 

[jack D and coke]

Feels like just about everything is going down the kazi nowadays. 
The cuts are about to get deeper too. 
Im not criticising anyone here either before it turns into yet another indy debate. 
 

[Doctor FinnBarr]

7 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Feels like just about everything is going down the kazi nowadays. 
The cuts are about to get deeper too. 
Im not criticising anyone here either before it turns into yet another indy debate. 
 

 

No no mate, didn't want some sort of indy/union fight either, just want proper policing back to reclaim the streets from the Neds/dealers.

[henrysmithsgloves]

Same all over Scotland I'm afraid 😳 

[The Mighty Thor]

Hugely underfunded and as Jack D says about to get much worse. 
 

Anyone looking to criticise should try walking a mile in their shoes. 
 

There’s gangs of wee scrotes roaming the streets of most of Scotland’s towns. My observation would be what the **** are their parents doing? 

[chuck berrys hairline]

Sounds like the Starrs are still running the place then?? 

[The Gorgie]

My brother in law is a policeman down the borders. A Saturday during the summer he was the only cop between kelso and gala. Absolute shambles.

[Australis]

Neighbour across the road had his garage broken into and quite a few things stolen.

 

Called the police, nobody came out to look or take details.

 

Police told him there were 6 things on their list they respond to in a timely manner and burglary was not one of the 6.

 

Say a man who dresses as a woman is not a real woman on twitter though, and they will probably be at your door before you have even posted it.

 

 

 

 

 

[Harry Potter]

34 minutes ago, The Gorgie said:

My brother in law is a policeman down the borders. A Saturday during the summer he was the only cop between kelso and gala. Absolute shambles.

deary me , thats shocking, 

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

The Scottish Government is to blame they have lost their moral compass on essential everyday issues to the vast majority of law abiding citizens and cater for the  minority  

It must be mind boggling for a Police officer to fight crime and make our streets safe with the changes instigated from both Holyrood and Westminster 

It's going to be everybody for themselves to deal with problems 

The management of resources should be looked at as you never see a local presence on the street and only recently I saw 3 (three) officer's with a speedometer device in a 20mph zone 

Just no common sense these days and will be a university degree in the future 

Shambles, society is in the bin

 

[Japan Jambo]

5 minutes ago, The Maroon Pound said:

The Scottish Government is to blame they have lost their moral compass on essential everyday issues to the vast majority of law abiding citizens and cater for the  minority  

It must be mind boggling for a Police officer to fight crime and make our streets safe with the changes instigated from both Holyrood and Westminster 

It's going to be everybody for themselves to deal with problems 

The management of resources should be looked at as you never see a local presence on the street and only recently I saw 3 (three) officer's with a speedometer device in a 20mph zone 

Just no common sense these days and will be a university degree in the future 

Shambles, society is in the bin

 

 

Stabbings left right and centre but drive at 22 in a 20 and it's off to the stocks for you, no better down here in London I'm sorry to say.

[Shooter McGavin]

The only police presence round my way is them being out with speed cameras hiding round corners trying to catch people driving 34mph in a 30….

I suppose they’re just interested in making some easy cash these days.

 

I always cringe on Twitter when a police authority in Scotland puts up a post to show how they’ve bravely confiscated a few cans off a supporters bus, or confiscated some wee guys bag of weed with a street value of about £5.

 

Seems like Police Scotland are closer to being a school headteacher these days, than they are an actual authority on tackling real crime.

[Randy Marsh]

It may be more a case of Police Scotland wasting their resources in the wrong places.  For example, I was at a music event at Ingliston back in April and there were at least 30 police officers standing at the entrance with a few sniffer dogs trying to catch out revellers with gear on them.😂 Total waste of time and priorities all wrong if you ask me.

[the posh bit]

Take to the streets to protest about it, you'll see plenty of the ****ers about then. 

 

 

[henrysmithsgloves]

We need more cops like this guy😎😎.

 

[Mikey1874]

Another area because of good pensions and other factors they've lost a lot of good staff to early retirement. 

[The Hogfather]

The downward spiral seems to have picked up pace after ScotGov centralised the police service. Has there been any identifiable benefits to this?

[Maroon Sailor]

Fair play to them.

 

They often sit in a van with their video camera on Murrayburn Road.

[The Mighty Thor]

28 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Another area because of good pensions and other factors they've lost a lot of good staff to early retirement. 

Good pensions that they pay a huge amount of salary into every month. 

 

They've lost a lot of experienced staff recently due to the changes to the pensions. Quite right too. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

3 hours ago, The Gorgie said:

My brother in law is a policeman down the borders. A Saturday during the summer he was the only cop between kelso and gala. Absolute shambles.

 

Yup, it's often a rare sight to see Polis in the Borders, let alone on the beat, can't remember the last time I seen a policeman walking the streets, I think the last one I seen must have forgotten where he'd parked the car.

[il Duce McTarkin]

23 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Good pensions that they pay a huge amount of salary into every month. 

 

They've lost a lot of experienced staff recently due to the changes to the pensions. Quite right too. 

 

My mate retires in a couple of years with a good pension. Can't come a moment too soon either, as the stresses of the job have taken their toll on him over the years. 

[JudyJudyJudy]

I actually Work alongside  the police and I’m very impressed with how they deal with “ customers” almost like social workers now but can also use their authority when necessary. And the  uniform  😎

[the posh bit]

14 minutes ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

 

My mate retires in a couple of years with a good pension. Can't come a moment too soon either, as the stresses of the job have taken their toll on him over the years. 

 

We need more stressed plod, IMO. 

Edited December 10, 2022 by the posh bit

[The Real Maroonblood]

55 minutes ago, The Hogfather said:

The downward spiral seems to have picked up pace after ScotGov centralised the police service. Has there been any identifiable benefits to this?

I agree on your first sentence.

Your second sentence I can’t see any benefits.

Maybe someone has seen benefits.😉

[jack D and coke]

2 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I agree on your first sentence.

Your second sentence I can’t see any benefits.

Maybe someone has seen benefits.😉

Cost effective IIIRC. There was literally no other sense in doing it.
All parties were behind it too. 

[indianajones]

Just dont question the government responsible.

 

To question the cult instantly makes you a far right tory. 

[Japan Jambo]

1 hour ago, the posh bit said:

Take to the streets to protest about it, you'll see plenty of the ****ers about then. 

 

 

 

aye watching and supping tea

[JudyJudyJudy]

7 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

IIIRC

What does that mean ? 

[jack D and coke]

2 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said:

What does that mean ? 

If I recall correctly 👍🏼

[the posh bit]

5 minutes ago, indianajones said:

Just dont question the government responsible.

 

To question the cult instantly makes you a far right tory. 

 

I have a friend who has been in the police for over 30 years. He doesn't lije his job now as he doesn't think the police should be policed like they are now. 

[The Mighty Thor]

34 minutes ago, Dirk McTarkin said:

 

My mate retires in a couple of years with a good pension. Can't come a moment too soon either, as the stresses of the job have taken their toll on him over the years. 

I know a few who have gone in the last 12 months as their pension and lump sum wouldn't have got any better. 

They'd had enough of scraping humanity off the roads, chasing wee scrotes or more lately doing the job of the mental and social care sector which they're neither trained or equipped to do. 

 

The tropes you read on threads like this boil my piss. 

[Ray Gin]

4 hours ago, Australis said:

Say a man who dresses as a woman is not a real woman on twitter though, and they will probably be at your door before you have even posted it.

 

 

These days, if you say you're English you get arrested and thrown in jail.

[JudyJudyJudy]

33 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

If I recall correctly 👍🏼

Cheers 👍

[JudyJudyJudy]

26 minutes ago, The Mighty Thor said:

I know a few who have gone in the last 12 months as their pension and lump sum wouldn't have got any better. 

They'd had enough of scraping humanity off the roads, chasing wee scrotes or more lately doing the job of the mental and social care sector which they're neither trained or equipped to do. 

 

The tropes you read on threads like this boil my piss. 

They are very well trained in dealing with people who have “ issues” I’ve been very impressed with some I have worked alongside in their skills . Admittedly their role primarily is to detect crime and catch offenders but it’s changed quite significantly . Most of the police I work with enjoy this expansion of their role . 

[Mikey1874]

57 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

I agree on your first sentence.

Your second sentence I can’t see any benefits.

Maybe someone has seen benefits.😉

 

Police Scotland discovered Strathclyde Police had lost key evidence in murder cases. Preventing notably the likely conviction of Worlds End murderer Angus Sinclair (now dead) for 3 unsolved murders in Glasgow.

 

Moved the Police horses from Fettes in Edinburgh to somewhere else presumably Glasgow.

 

Want to introduce handguns to officers on routine basis. 

 

Progress of sorts. 

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

I’d apply this to UK policing generally rather than just Police Scotland but we’re at the point where you almost have to accept that the police aren’t going to help you with most smaller scale things.

[The Real Maroonblood]

1 hour ago, jack D and coke said:

Cost effective IIIRC. There was literally no other sense in doing it.
All parties were behind it too. 

It was.

 

49 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

Police Scotland discovered Strathclyde Police had lost key evidence in murder cases. Preventing notably the likely conviction of Worlds End murderer Angus Sinclair (now dead) for 3 unsolved murders in Glasgow.

 

Moved the Police horses from Fettes in Edinburgh to somewhere else presumably Glasgow.

 

Want to introduce handguns to officers on routine basis. 

 

Progress of sorts. 

A mixed bag. 

[il Duce McTarkin]

1 hour ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I’d apply this to UK policing generally rather than just Police Scotland but we’re at the point where you almost have to accept that the police aren’t going to help you with most smaller scale things.

 

There are simply not enough police and related resources/services.

 

Increased funding would go a long way to fixing this, but the job needs to be made more attractive.

 

 

[Doctor FinnBarr]

15 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Hugely underfunded and as Jack D says about to get much worse. 
 

Anyone looking to criticise should try walking a mile in their shoes. 
 

There’s gangs of wee scrotes roaming the streets of most of Scotland’s towns. My observation would be what the **** are their parents doing? 

 

My OP wasn't actually a dig at the run of the mill officers (my brother was one) but more of a dig about the underfunding of them and the selling off of local police stations leaving villages and towns with no police presence.

Now, the parents. I've said for a long while the the neds running wild are not just the children of neds they are now have ned grandparents thats how long this shitshow has been allowed to run for. The only way to deal with this is more funding and more police patrolling the streets cause as sure as hell the grandparents ain't going to give a shit and stop the parents and now the grandchildren causing havoc.

[Daktari]

Ok, full disclosure first. I used to be a police officer and retired about ten years ago. I come not to defend or decry Police Scotland, just to give some historical perspective... First of all, I tend not to get into the whole 'it was better in my day' thing. When I joined in the early 80's, there were people coming to the end of their career telling me 'the job's ****ed'. I heard people saying that for the next 30 odd years....  

 

Here's my point though. Folks above speak about under funding, and that may be part of it. However, when I started the total police establishment for Scotland's eight forces was about 14,000. Now, under Police Scotland it's 17,000 plus (or has been). I remember being out on the nightshift, and we were falling over each other to answer calls. In reference to the OP, this was in West Lothian. We would have two at Blackburn, Sergeant plus 4 or 5 at Whitburn, two each  at Fauldhouse and Armadale, Sergeant and six at Bathgate and so on... Livingston would have high teens at least. Calls never went unanswered and there was always assistance if you needed it. Why, with 3000 more cops, is this not the case and calls go unanswered for days, if they get answered at all?

 

I don't know if there's a simple answer like 'underfunding' but back then there was the beat cops, a specialist Traffic and CID support in each division, and that was about it. I think that there are now many more 'specialisms' and lots of supporting departments that we didn't have. I'm not saying that would be easy to roll back because they have grown into their work areas, many of which are very important, but those cops not answering calls on the nightshift must be getting hoovered up somewhere. 

 

I loved my time and in the same circumstances would do it again, but policing now has become so politicised and scrutinised that I really feel sorry for people starting out in a much different job. I wouldn't say it's ****ed though, because I've had my time and it's up to them now to make of it what they will.

[Doctor FinnBarr]

11 minutes ago, Daktari said:

Ok, full disclosure first. I used to be a police officer and retired about ten years ago. I come not to defend or decry Police Scotland, just to give some historical perspective... First of all, I tend not to get into the whole 'it was better in my day' thing. When I joined in the early 80's, there were people coming to the end of their career telling me 'the job's ****ed'. I heard people saying that for the next 30 odd years....  

 

Here's my point though. Folks above speak about under funding, and that may be part of it. However, when I started the total police establishment for Scotland's eight forces was about 14,000. Now, under Police Scotland it's 17,000 plus (or has been). I remember being out on the nightshift, and we were falling over each other to answer calls. In reference to the OP, this was in West Lothian. We would have two at Blackburn, Sergeant plus 4 or 5 at Whitburn, two each  at Fauldhouse and Armadale, Sergeant and six at Bathgate and so on... Livingston would have high teens at least. Calls never went unanswered and there was always assistance if you needed it. Why, with 3000 more cops, is this not the case and calls go unanswered for days, if they get answered at all?

 

I don't know if there's a simple answer like 'underfunding' but back then there was the beat cops, a specialist Traffic and CID support in each division, and that was about it. I think that there are now many more 'specialisms' and lots of supporting departments that we didn't have. I'm not saying that would be easy to roll back because they have grown into their work areas, many of which are very important, but those cops not answering calls on the nightshift must be getting hoovered up somewhere. 

 

I loved my time and in the same circumstances would do it again, but policing now has become so politicised and scrutinised that I really feel sorry for people starting out in a much different job. I wouldn't say it's ****ed though, because I've had my time and it's up to them now to make of it what they will.

 

So, 3k more officers but roughly 20 have vanished from the west side of West Lothian? I really do think we have been abandoned.

More missile attacks on traffic in Blackburn tonight and still no police presence.

[Lone Striker]

10 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said:

I’d apply this to UK policing generally rather than just Police Scotland but we’re at the point where you almost have to accept that the police aren’t going to help you with most smaller scale things.

I think you're right.   There was a senior police commissioner/leader in England on the TV news recently saying that a big drain on their resources is dealing with people who haven't committed a crime - e.g. missing persons, folk with mental health issues, homeless folk on the streets etc    She admitted these were all examples where  public agencies are needed to support people in these circumstances, but it shouldn't fall to the police.

 

The OP is right to raise this as a growing issue in communities though.   Despite all the hi-tech equipment they have, the police seem to be less accessible to ordinary citizens.   Are there any walk-in police stations left ?   

 

I had reason to call the non-emergency number last year on a Sunday morning to report something - spent 30 minutes on hold listening to recorded instructions about how they were too busy to answer my call  ...... but NOT to call 999 unless it was a life-threatening issue .... or else send them a msg via their  website.      Dire stuff - I gave up after 30 mins.  

 

Its not a new thing though, and not peculiar to Scotland or even the UK.   Americans have a standing joke that if you want  a quick response by the police, don't bother phoning 911 - just go to your local Dunkin' Donuts, there'll be a few cops sitting in their  cars  in the car park.  😄

 

 

[Gizmo]

11 hours ago, jack D and coke said:

Cost effective IIIRC. There was literally no other sense in doing it.
All parties were behind it too. 

 

11 hours ago, indianajones said:

Just dont question the government responsible.

 

To question the cult instantly makes you a far right tory. 

Curious.

[Gizmo]

11 hours ago, Ray Gin said:

 

These days, if you say you're English you get arrested and thrown in jail.

What, just for saying your English, you'll be, you'll be thrown in jail?

[Doctor FinnBarr]

11 minutes ago, Gizmo said:

What, just for saying your English, you'll be, you'll be thrown in jail?

 

Seems harsh but then again if you do it in Blackburn you'd be fine.

[highlandjambo3]

12 hours ago, Daktari said:

Why, with 3000 more cops, is this not the case and calls go unanswered for days, if they get answered at all?

 

I don't know if there's a simple answer.

It would seem to me that a 3k increase in officers over a 30odd year time span is nowhere near a percentage of increase in population/demographics of the Edinburgh area.  So, in comparison to the population as a percentage, there are likely much less officers to population to go round.

Edited December 11, 2022 by highlandjambo3

[jack D and coke]

On 10/12/2022 at 13:05, Ray Gin said:

 

These days, if you say you're English you get arrested and thrown in jail.

😂