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Jambos_1874
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Absolutely delighted with the result today and also pleased with the team grinding out a result. But, why do we have such a reluctance to shoot!? We have so many shooting opportunities but we either take a touch too many, play it back or try to walk it into the goal. Is this a tactical thing or are we just shot shy? Was the same at Motherwell. We will need to take any chance that comes our way on Thursday in order to win and can't afford to be reluctant to shoot.

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Boyce helped in that we could try and hit him from the back today but he simply was not sharp In the box. 
 

Then Gino came on and could have had three assists but his decision making was terrible. 

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Arthur Morgan

Boyce is infuriating at times, he ALWAYS cuts back on to his other foot before attempting to shoot, meaning the chance is usually gone. Other players guilty of it too though. We don't have a midfielder that you could back to score a goal, we need something different in the middle imo and still would say we should go for 3 in the middle with a CAM behind so Boyce doesn't have to keep dropping back so deep. 

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I'd like to see Barrie McKay pull the trigger more often instead of laying it off to others that seem to just stumble over the ball.

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21 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Nobody calling for Gnando to get a start yet 😮

Never seen a player on the bench in my 30 years of supporting Hearts getting a PT session before coming on 😂 A good 5 min warm up with the fitness coach next to corner flag.

 

The boy can’t be trusted to warm himself up when he’s on the bench.

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11 minutes ago, Arthur Morgan said:

Boyce is infuriating at times, he ALWAYS cuts back on to his other foot before attempting to shoot, meaning the chance is usually gone. Other players guilty of it too though. We don't have a midfielder that you could back to score a goal, we need something different in the middle imo and still would say we should go for 3 in the middle with a CAM behind so Boyce doesn't have to keep dropping back so deep. 

 

McEneff looks like he can finish I guess. Agree with all of it. Gino, Gnando, GMS, Boyce and Mackay are all reluctant to take chances early. We could really use a predatory striker who lives to score goals. No idea who though.

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Been wanting us to try a 3412 for a while, Mceneff in behind the front 2. Boyce and whoever from the usual 4 depending on form. Gets another ball playing midfielder in there who likes a shot

 

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6 minutes ago, Stu_HMFC said:

Never seen a player on the bench in my 30 years of supporting Hearts getting a PT session before coming on 😂 A good 5 min warm up with the fitness coach next to corner flag.

 

The boy can’t be trusted to warm himself up when he’s on the bench.

 

 

Gnando?  

 

He did a warm-up/kickabout just with the physio when the players were out starting their pre-match warm up.

 

Maybe that's just what he has always done and prefers that. 

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Boyce is a good player, but not as a lone striker. He holds the ball up well and can put away the occasional chance but he takes too long on the ball, is normally pretty deep and hardly ever looks to take it first time. He needs someone beside him.

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54 minutes ago, Jambos_1874 said:

Absolutely delighted with the result today and also pleased with the team grinding out a result. But, why do we have such a reluctance to shoot!? We have so many shooting opportunities but we either take a touch too many, play it back or try to walk it into the goal. Is this a tactical thing or are we just shot shy? Was the same at Motherwell. We will need to take any chance that comes our way on Thursday in order to win and can't afford to be reluctant to shoot.

Couldn’t agree more. Absolutely sick shouting at players (when inside the box, at the very least) to just shoot… first time! Drives me mental. 

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Tom Hardy’s Dug

Totally agree with the OP and mentioned it on a couple of other threads today.

 

Either our attackers aren’t good/confident enough or they need better striker coaching.

 

As I understand it McCulloch isn’t actually that good a coach - we clearly need to sign a better striker, but we also need a better striker coach.

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Tom Hardy’s Dug
3 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

Couldn’t agree more. Absolutely sick shouting at players (when inside the box, at the very least) to just shoot… first time! Drives me mental. 


Best recent proof of this is Woodburn’s first goal for us. Clear sight of goal. Shoot. On target and hard. Keeper makes an error but if Ben ******s about to set himself up the keeper doesn’t ever need to try and save it.

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1 minute ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:


Best recent proof of this is Woodburn’s first goal for us. Clear sight of goal. Shoot. On target and hard. Keeper makes an error but if Ben ******s about to set himself up the keeper doesn’t ever need to try and save it.

Yep… I’d start Woodburn every game… he’s about the only one that isn’t afraid to have a pop. 

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HeartsandonlyHearts

We’ve given up a few $#!tty goals this season due to deflections. We definitely should be shooting more. You never know.

How can shooting be worse than not shooting.

As the great one always used to say

you miss 100% of the shots you don’t take

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HeartsandonlyHearts
11 minutes ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

Totally agree with the OP and mentioned it on a couple of other threads today.

 

Either our attackers aren’t good/confident enough or they need better striker coaching.

 

As I understand it McCulloch isn’t actually that good a coach - we clearly need to sign a better striker, but we also need a better striker coach.

No way is any striker coach telling Boyce to do what he does. Boyce was here and playing that way before Mc Culloch arrived.

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Completely agree. We need to get our shot count up. We're too reluctant to try and take the shot and seem intent on carving the 'perfect' opening. Invariably thats not going to happen and as long as we get the ball into the net, I couldn't care how it happens. If its a deflected bobble then great. Ugly goals are still goals. 

 

Rangers have scored 41 in 245 shots, Celtic 46 goals in 243, we have 35 goals in 185 shots. Both OF sides have played 2 games less too. We really need to start taking more pops at goal. We can't walk the ball into the net. The rest of the league aren't miles below us, nor are we miles above them that we can do that. Up our shots count and we should see more goals.

 

Boyce needs to start taking first time shots. If its his wrong foot, its his wrong foot. He's missing too many chances by being hell bent on getting it onto his preferred foot. I'd rather he just get the shot off and if he misses so be it. We're not miles better than the other sides in this league to mean we have the time to set things up exactly perfect. 

 

McKay needs to get a bit greedier. He's easily our best winger and is dangerous with the ball but seems to prefer to set up goals rather than score them himself. Maybe a confidence thing? Either way, should take a pop once in a while. 

 

Would like to see our wingers drive into the box rather than to the byline. We only have 1 man in the box most of the time, so probability of hitting him rather than the goalie/CB/CB/CM or fullbacks is slim to none. Drive into the box and either draw a foul (penalty) or create the chance to get a shot off. Trying to pick out a heavily marked Liam Boyce is just bloody stupid and wasteful. Gino, GMS and Mckay all have quick feet and once in the box the defenders will be shitting themselves not to give away the foul. Should be utilising that.

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34 minutes ago, SUTOL said:

 

 

Gnando?  

 

He did a warm-up/kickabout just with the physio when the players were out starting their pre-match warm up.

 

Maybe that's just what he has always done and prefers that. 

During the match 5 minutes before he came on , the players go out in 3s to warm up and down when the match is playing the fitness coach was out putting him through his paces 

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From open play. Liam Boyce couldn't score in a brothel with a wad of £50 notes tied to his tadger. He is so bloody infuriating. Just hit the ball first time. He is not the only guilty one, but for an alleged centre forward his shooting is abysmal.

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Arthur Morgan
45 minutes ago, EH11 2NL said:

Been wanting us to try a 3412 for a while, Mceneff in behind the front 2. Boyce and whoever from the usual 4 depending on form. Gets another ball playing midfielder in there who likes a shot

 

 

Yep, I've been calling for it for over a month now, either that or the 4231 for me. 

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Bazzas right boot

We do **** about too much. 

Side foot finishes, trying to get the perfect time. 

 

Just ****ing hit it. 

 

I know Bobs all for a total football philosophy, but sometimes simple is good. 

 

Hit shots when it opens up. 

Play direct, get the second ball. 

 

 

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Bazzas right boot
1 minute ago, Arthur Morgan said:

 

Yep, I've been calling for it for over a month now, either that or the 4231 for me. 

 

I'm here. 

 

 

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Just now, John Findlay said:

From open play. Liam Boyce couldn't score in a brothel with a wad of £50 notes tied to his tadger. He is so bloody infuriating. Just hit the ball first time. He is not the only guilty one, but for an alleged centre forward his shooting is abysmal.

 

Yup. Its awful to watch. Saw a few tweets saying he had a good game. Don't know what game they were watching because that was not the performance of a striker that is on the winning team. He needs to stop dropping deep and get the midfield to start playing forward balls. Its a farce our striker is having to drop that deep and nullify any attacking threat he does have because we don't seem capable of playing balls forward through our midfield. I don't think the entirety of the issue is his alone, because Beni and Devlin need to learn to pass the ball forward and find Boyce, Gino, McKay etc. rather than relying on the wingbacks (who aren't attack minded either). Its hugely frustrating to watch we have so much of the ball but 95% of it isn't productive its just ball retention with no attacking threat.

 

Absolutely needs to be a position we address in January. But for penalties his record would be woeful and he'd be under far more scrutiny. 

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1 hour ago, GinRummy said:

Nobody calling for Gnando to get a start yet 😮

I'm sure there must be a Youth Striker that deserves a place on the bench before him surely 

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2 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Yup. Its awful to watch. Saw a few tweets saying he had a good game. Don't know what game they were watching because that was not the performance of a striker that is on the winning team. He needs to stop dropping deep and get the midfield to start playing forward balls. Its a farce our striker is having to drop that deep and nullify any attacking threat he does have because we don't seem capable of playing balls forward through our midfield. I don't think the entirety of the issue is his alone, because Beni and Devlin need to learn to pass the ball forward and find Boyce, Gino, McKay etc. rather than relying on the wingbacks (who aren't attack minded either). Its hugely frustrating to watch we have so much of the ball but 95% of it isn't productive its just ball retention with no attacking threat.

 

Absolutely needs to be a position we address in January. But for penalties his record would be woeful and he'd be under far more scrutiny. 

First half today, they didn't play much forward, that changed in the second half, contrary to what many believe, Boyce's hold up play is poor. Once in the second half his first touch was a 20 yards pass back to a St Mirren player.

When he does lay it off the ball goes wide to be put in the box, he is imho to slow to get into the box.

I would bench him and play Woodburn up top like we did against Dundee United. Far more mobile and intelligent than Boyce, and the boy will shoot on sight too.

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Under the floodlight
14 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

We do **** about too much. 

Side foot finishes, trying to get the perfect time. 

 

Just ****ing hit it. 

 

I know Bobs all for a total football philosophy, but sometimes simple is good. 

 

Hit shots when it opens up. 

Play direct, get the second ball. 

 

 

Simplicity is what's needed, I remember the old Liverpool tactics were to shoot at every opportunity, if the ball goes directly out it gives you time to regroup, faff around looking for the perfect pass and the opposition can launch a quick counter with our players out of position.

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23 minutes ago, Arthur Morgan said:

 

Yep, I've been calling for it for over a month now, either that or the 4231 for me. 

The 4231 is an interesting one, we were shocking to watch last season playing it but this seasons squad does look like it would fit well into that formation.

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We have a few players in the team reluctant to shoot with their weaker foot. Cost us last week at Motherwell too (Ginnelly).

 

There is an army of coaches at the club - they should be working on this with the players.

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Captain Lithuania

I was losing my mind at that game today. So many chances to shoot and none taken. Boyce the worst culprit for it. 
 

None of the midfielders look capable of having a shot, McEneff must have been scratching his head wondering what needs to happen for him to get a run of games. Think he could be the missing piece of the puzzle. 

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Bazzas right boot
16 minutes ago, Under the floodlight said:

Simplicity is what's needed, I remember the old Liverpool tactics were to shoot at every opportunity, if the ball goes directly out it gives you time to regroup, faff around looking for the perfect pass and the opposition can launch a quick counter with our players out of position.

 

Yip, even our throw ins- just hit the line, twice we went inside today and lost it, ended up defending corners. Hit the line, win another thrown -in, they get a throw in or even if they win the ball they are 20-30 yards further back.

 

As you say if we are attacking  we are then exposed.

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2 hours ago, OTT said:

 

Yup. Its awful to watch. Saw a few tweets saying he had a good game. Don't know what game they were watching because that was not the performance of a striker that is on the winning team. He needs to stop dropping deep and get the midfield to start playing forward balls. Its a farce our striker is having to drop that deep and nullify any attacking threat he does have because we don't seem capable of playing balls forward through our midfield. I don't think the entirety of the issue is his alone, because Beni and Devlin need to learn to pass the ball forward and find Boyce, Gino, McKay etc. rather than relying on the wingbacks (who aren't attack minded either). Its hugely frustrating to watch we have so much of the ball but 95% of it isn't productive its just ball retention with no attacking threat.

 

Absolutely needs to be a position we address in January. But for penalties his record would be woeful and he'd be under far more scrutiny. 

I agree with you.  Boycie is a handful for most defenders - he puts in a power of work, but he doesn't have the predator instinct of a  goalscorer.   As you and others have said, none of our players seems willing to have a pot at goal when they have the chance - its as if  they think they need to get closer to the goal each time, and end up taking the ball too far or make the wrong decision for a lay-off.

 

I'd have thought Naisy would be the ideal man to drill the attacking players into the sort of mindset required to make more out of getting within 25 yds of goal.   Having said that, he was guilty of over-egging attacks a bit too in his last 2 years with us.

 

Barrie McKay looks our most potent threat, and if he had more self-belief when he gets near the penalty box he could notch up a few goals.

 

Contrast our reluctance to shoot today with St.Mirren.   Brophy tried several shots, and CG saved a us a few times.

 

I'd like to see us go for Brophy as a 2nd striker alongside Boycie.

 

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12 hours ago, Captain Lithuania said:

I was losing my mind at that game today. So many chances to shoot and none taken. Boyce the worst culprit for it. 
 

None of the midfielders look capable of having a shot, McEneff must have been scratching his head wondering what needs to happen for him to get a run of games. Think he could be the missing piece of the puzzle. 


Agree particularly the bit about McEneff. Beni and Devlin a great combo but SO DEFENSIVE. Robbie needs to be prepared to mix things up there. Devlin is a 90 minute man, and will run himself into the ground for the team the entire game. I think pairing him with McEneff would be a great combo because we know Aaron wants to get forward and make things happen. 99% of our play is through our wingers so this would add another dimension to our play. 

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14 hours ago, Stu_HMFC said:

Never seen a player on the bench in my 30 years of supporting Hearts getting a PT session before coming on 😂 A good 5 min warm up with the fitness coach next to corner flag.

 

The boy can’t be trusted to warm himself up when he’s on the bench.


I would love to see more of this tbh, for as long as I can remember players have done a wee jog up the sideline and a couple of stretches before coming on then take 10mins to get upto the speed of the game, one of the wimbledons, afc or mk dons have actually employed a subs coach to not only prep the subs physically for coming on but also to mentally help the players, personally I think it’s a great idea

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Ex member of the SaS
13 hours ago, Pilmuir said:

We have a few players in the team reluctant to shoot with their weaker foot. Cost us last week at Motherwell too (Ginnelly).

 

There is an army of coaches at the club - they should be working on this with the players.

The coaches are the problem, focusing on defending and not attacking. I was crying out for Boyce to be changed for Woodburn or Ginelly and Benghamine to be changed for McEneff.

I felt those changes would have made a huge difference. Still glad he brought on Haring though.

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The team would get a lot less stick if they put the laces through the ball when the chance comes.

 

Saying that, Michael Smith has a Welly at it and usually blooters it wide in most games and gets stick for it.

 

Agree about Boyce, his all round game is decent and he's clever but he's facing goal with the ball he has to blast it instead of passing the buck every time.

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21 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

The coaches are the problem, focusing on defending and not attacking. I was crying out for Boyce to be changed for Woodburn or Ginelly and Benghamine to be changed for McEneff.

I felt those changes would have made a huge difference. Still glad he brought on Haring though.

What a load of tosh. I think you will  find the coaches focus on both attacking and defending, if they didn't we wouldn't have a GD of plus eleven. Have a look it the goals scored column in the league, if I'm not mistaken, only Celtic have scored more than us. Some defensive play by us that.

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15 hours ago, Arthur Morgan said:

Boyce is infuriating at times, he ALWAYS cuts back on to his other foot before attempting to shoot, meaning the chance is usually gone. Other players guilty of it too though. We don't have a midfielder that you could back to score a goal, we need something different in the middle imo and still would say we should go for 3 in the middle with a CAM behind so Boyce doesn't have to keep dropping back so deep. 

Totally agree. You wonder if Neilson picks up Boyce about that? Time and time again he continues to take that extra touch as if he’s being clever.  
 

The argument can be that a player at his age will be what he is now, some players will never shake a habit. But I’d have thought with his experience he could take on board any advice on this part of his game?  If not, it shows some players just don’t have the presence of mind on the pitch and in the moment to tweak a part of their game for the better. 

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31 minutes ago, Ex member of the SaS said:

The coaches are the problem, focusing on defending and not attacking. I was crying out for Boyce to be changed for Woodburn or Ginelly and Benghamine to be changed for McEneff.

I felt those changes would have made a huge difference. Still glad he brought on Haring though.

As it stands we have scored 25 league goals. Sevco 29 and Celtic 30.

No other teams come close.

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18 hours ago, GinRummy said:

Nobody calling for Gnando to get a start yet 😮

No that shipped has sailed as the guy doesn’t want to play for Hearts and isn’t good enough for Hearts. However it’s becoming apparent that Boyce is getting past his best and frankly we need 2 new strikers this window or next

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Boyce is living in  centre circle knocking balls forward to nobody, needs to leave that to midfield and play on shoulder off defence, odd occasion he finds somebody with knockdown he is so far out off position it slows game right down waiting for him to get further forward.

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13 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

No that shipped has sailed as the guy doesn’t want to play for Hearts and isn’t good enough for Hearts. However it’s becoming apparent that Boyce is getting past his best and frankly we need 2 new strikers this window or next

There’s a guy on the transfer thread, who’s usually reliable, reckons Ellis Sims from Everton is a done deal for the next window. 

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Byyy The Light
4 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

There’s a guy on the transfer thread, who’s usually reliable, reckons Ellis Sims from Everton is a done deal for the next window. 

 


A loan deal?

Edited by Byyy The Light
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