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Smith's right boot
10 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

So did quite a few teams in that list.  What you are suggesting is utterly ridiculous.  You are saying Kelty Hearts win rate should be compared to that of Celtics?

 

This is top flight only and even has a win ratio so doesn't even matter about the number of wins - just number of wins to games played.

 

The win ratio for a club should include the games we've won imo. 

 

What it is has to do with Souttar is beyond me tho. 

What was your point in all this in regards to Souttar, I forget?

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2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

The win ratio for a club should include the games we've won imo. 

 

What it is has to do with Souttar is beyond me tho. 

What was your point in all this in regards to Souttar, I forget?

 

 

The comparison should only be between your peers.

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4 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

I think he's crucial to this current team, their formation and structure.

 

And the knock on effect of being 2nd or 3rd in league outweighs a fee in January (though I do get the sell on fee argument). 


The recruitment team are being paid to find us players……they should have a list of potential replacements ready now.

 

And if Souttar leaves on a free in the summer there is zero chance of a sell-on clause….

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Rogue Daddy
1 minute ago, DH1986 said:


I’d rather he went down south in January for a reasonable fee and managed to include a sell-on clause in the deal.

 

 

I think this is what will happen TBH… I’d even go as far as to say it’s probably already ‘done’. 

 

 

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Smith's right boot
6 minutes ago, i8hibsh said:

 

 

The comparison should only be between your peers.

 

Not in context to evaluating Souttars time with us and our relative success or not with him which is where this journey begun.

 

You are now on about Hearts % and Bobs %- you're away off on one. The Bongo Batton has been passed.

All irrelevant to this thread but it's just another way for certain folk to slag Hearts then Bob.

 

It does have to be admired how folk do swing each thread that way tho- imaginative.

 

 

 

 

 

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Fozzyonthefence
31 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Because we can't win games v top flight clubs when we are demoted and Souttar was a player for us in the championship. 

 

And as I said compared to some  clubs, but not others. 

 

Tbh I don't even know what his point is anymore. 

 

 

 


His point was quite obvious and a very valid one - a top flight comparison, in answer to your post about us being a winning team, with the teams ranked by win ratio, therefore not dependent on number of games played (although admittedly you’re both taking it off topic, as am I now!).  


How can we possibly have a comparison of Championship games against teams that haven’t played in the Championship?  That’s mental, even by your standards. 

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1 minute ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

Not in context to evaluating Souttars time with us and our relative success or not with him which is where this journey begun.

 

You are now on about Hearts % and Bobs %- you're away off on one. The Bongo Batton has been passed.

All irrelevant to this thread but it's just another way for certain folk to slag Hearts then Bob.

 

It does have to be admired how folk do swing each thread that way tho- imaginative.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Ok, read it this way then if you may:

 

 

We are no more successful with John Souttar in the team.  We are still a club that has won **** all and has a win rate of less than a third.

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Fozzyonthefence
13 minutes ago, DH1986 said:


The recruitment team are being paid to find us players……they should have a list of potential replacements ready now.

 

And if Souttar leaves on a free in the summer there is zero chance of a sell-on clause….


It’s highly unlikely I suppose but we did get a sell on clause when Paterson was out of contract (only on CP’s insistence of course).  Not that did us much good with CP.  

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Smith's right boot
Just now, Fozzyonthefence said:


His point was quite obvious and a very valid one - a top flight comparison, in answer to your post about us being a winning team, with the teams ranked by win ratio, therefore not dependent on number of games played (although admittedly you’re both taking it off topic, as am I now!).  


How can we possibly have a comparison of Championship games against teams that haven’t played in the Championship?  That’s mental, even by your standards. 

 

His point wasn't obvious, It's a Souttar thread and he started out suggesting Souttar was a waste of money, then Hearts don't win games and then **** knows what his point is now as he rambles on about win percentages for Bob.

 

He won't even know his own point anymore other than that he hates Bob and everything about Hearts is shite. We've taken the bus route to get to the place he always ends up,  and in doing so   went off topic.

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

His point wasn't obvious, It's a Souttar thread and he started out suggesting Souttar was a waste of money, then Hearts don't win games and then **** knows what his point is now as he rambles on about win percentages for Bob.

 

He won't even know his own point anymore other than that he hates Bob and everything about Hearts is shite. We've taken the bus route to get to the place he always ends up,  and in doing so   went off topic.

 

 

 

 

Less likely to win 🏆 without him. 

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Smith's right boot
11 minutes ago, jr ewing said:

Less likely to win 🏆 without him. 

 

I'd say so as well. 

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Finlay James
2 hours ago, i8hibsh said:

 

We are not a winning club.  Taking the top flight since 2014/2015 here is how we compare (up to 25/11/2021):

 

  Games Played Games Won Win %
Celtic 271 196 72.32
Rangers 184 125 67.93
Aberdeen 272 152 55.88
Hibs 156 63 40.38
St Johnstone 270 98 36.30
Inverness 114 40 35.09
Motherwell 272 95 34.93
Dundee United 128 42 32.81
Kilmarnock 258 83 32.17
Hearts 196 61 31.12
Livingston 119 36 30.25
Partick 152 42 27.63
Ross County 233 63 27.04
Hamilton 258 64 24.81
Dundee   203 50 24.63
St mirren 158 38 24.05

 

 

Im willing to bet that you're a virgin

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Tommy Brown
1 hour ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

His point wasn't obvious, It's a Souttar thread and he started out suggesting Souttar was a waste of money, then Hearts don't win games and then **** knows what his point is now as he rambles on about win percentages for Bob.

 

He won't even know his own point anymore other than that he hates Bob and everything about Hearts is shite. We've taken the bus route to get to the place he always ends up,  and in doing so   went off topic.

 

 

 

 

yawn yawn

I'm a real card calling Robbie Bob on every post

 

Really, your just a ***** that needs to grow up

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Smith's right boot
13 minutes ago, Tommy Brown said:

yawn yawn

I'm a real card calling Robbie Bob on every post

 

Really, your just a ***** that needs to grow up

 

I disagree strongly that I need to grow up. 

 

Starts with "yawn yawn"...  Calls me a name, Then advises me to grow up.... 

 

irony-meter.jpg

Edited by Smith's right boot
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I'm not sure what to expect regarding John Souttar. 

I always thought we would be stuck with him for good. Not that he isn't an excellent player it's just that I thought he would be like Craig Levein mrk 2.

Great when he is free of injury but the downside being no use to us if he is on the treatment table half the time. 

I thought his injury history would scare clubs off. 

I feel he might be tempted to take the security of a contract rather than wait it out on a pre contract with the uncertainty that it could come crashing down leaving him with nothing if he gets injured again. 

I just hope the certainty of a contract is with Hearts. 

Edited by luckydug
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soonbe110
4 hours ago, DH1986 said:


The recruitment team are being paid to find us players……they should have a list of potential replacements ready now.

 

And if Souttar leaves on a free in the summer there is zero chance of a sell-on clause….

Not if he insists on it when he joins his next club.  Is that not what CP did? 

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ToqueJambo

Listened to a really interesting Scarves over Funnel podcast with Andy Driver and Ryan McGowan talking about how players think at times like this. Both said what we've said that Souttar could go south for more money to the Championship and find himself not playing due to a manager change or something and then miss out on a. World Cup. Stay at Hearts another year or so and he's a regular for Scotland when fit looking forward to a possible World Cup and with a chance of trophies he won't have in the championship. Both think he should stay a bit longer and prove his fitness, establish himself with Scotland etc.

 

Another interesting point was that there's a big difference between going to Stoke for example for free or a low fee and going there for 3-4m or whatever. Driver and Ryan said clubs will give a player signed with a big fanfare for a good fee more chances. A player signed for nothing can be dropped or replaced very easily.

 

Driver said although he missed out on huge money by not going to Burnley he wouldn't swap the cup win for anything. Lesson being it's not the money you look back on when you're done playing.

Edited by ToqueJambo
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1971fozzy
2 hours ago, davemclaren said:

Ann said tonight we’ve given him our best offer so it’s over to him. 


yeah and said we won’t be going higher which is fair enough. Fingers crossed but must be a great offer so let’s hope

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Smith's right boot
9 hours ago, davemclaren said:

Ann said tonight we’ve given him our best offer so it’s over to him. 

 

 

She must have read jkb as that was suggested on here. 

 

No one at Hearts had thought of that before, the Jkb brains trust could have just  sorted this out for us. 

 

 

 

 

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Smith's right boot
7 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

Listened to a really interesting Scarves over Funnel podcast with Andy Driver and Ryan McGowan talking about how players think at times like this. Both said what we've said that Souttar could go south for more money to the Championship and find himself not playing due to a manager change or something and then miss out on a. World Cup. Stay at Hearts another year or so and he's a regular for Scotland when fit looking forward to a possible World Cup and with a chance of trophies he won't have in the championship. Both think he should stay a bit longer and prove his fitness, establish himself with Scotland etc.

 

Another interesting point was that there's a big difference between going to Stoke for example for free or a low fee and going there for 3-4m or whatever. Driver and Ryan said clubs will give a player signed with a big fanfare for a good fee more chances. A player signed for nothing can be dropped or replaced very easily.

 

Driver said although he missed out on huge money by not going to Burnley he wouldn't swap the cup win for anything. Lesson being it's not the money you look back on when you're done playing.

 

 

All makes sense and the last point is interesting. 

 

The big thing is with Souttars Injury record he could be tempted with the security of more money now. 

 

Will depend on how much more is being offered as well Tbh. 

 

If it's 3/4 x more then he'll likely leave, if its maybe only 50% more he may feel Hearts are worth the risk financially. 

 

 

 

 

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Neilson says it would take a huge bid for Hearts to release him early.  Hearts have offered a competitive contract and talks are ongoing.

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davemclaren
1 minute ago, Braminho said:

Just been told he’s deep In talks with Celtic 🤦🏼‍♂️

He’s in deep breach of contact then. 

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soonbe110
8 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

He’s in deep breach of contact then. 

Not if it’s just his agent that’s deep in talks, which he almost certainly is. 

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Just read on the BBC that he will be part of their coverage of the Monday night Scottish Cup game between Brechin and Darvel.

Seems interesting timing as he must know he will be asked about his contract situation...

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Der Kaiser
1 minute ago, Costanza said:

Just read on the BBC that he will be part of their coverage of the Monday night Scottish Cup game between Brechin and Darvel.

Seems interesting timing as he must know he will be asked about his contract situation...

 

Flat hunting in Brechin?

 

And we thought it was just the old firm in for him.....how silly do we all look?

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5 minutes ago, Costanza said:

Just read on the BBC that he will be part of their coverage of the Monday night Scottish Cup game between Brechin and Darvel.

Seems interesting timing as he must know he will be asked about his contract situation...

 

2 minutes ago, Der Kaiser said:

 

Flat hunting in Brechin?

 

And we thought it was just the old firm in for him.....how silly do we all look?

He lives in Brechin, doesn't he?

 

And his new Coffee business opens up there at the weekend.

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3 minutes ago, Der Kaiser said:

 

Flat hunting in Brechin?

 

And we thought it was just the old firm in for him.....how silly do we all look?

He's a big fan of historic Scottish monuments and Levein is a consultant at Brechin so it's not implausible 

 

 

b25lY21zOmZhZTY0NDdiLTcxMGEtNDA3Yy1iOGY0LTc2MDI4YjYxZjhjMDozMTcxM2M2YS00OTE0LTRhMGQtYjFkMy05YTAzMzJlMTJkNzQ=.jpg

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Der Kaiser
1 minute ago, Costanza said:

He's a big fan of historic Scottish monuments and Levein is a consultant at Brechin so it's not implausible 

 

 

b25lY21zOmZhZTY0NDdiLTcxMGEtNDA3Yy1iOGY0LTc2MDI4YjYxZjhjMDozMTcxM2M2YS00OTE0LTRhMGQtYjFkMy05YTAzMzJlMTJkNzQ=.jpg

 

Is that Colin Hendry?

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7 minutes ago, Barack said:

 

He lives in Brechin, doesn't he?

 

And his new Coffee business opens up there at the weekend.

Didn't know either of those but did see he was at some coffee festival with Naismith a few weeks ago.

Maybe if enough Hearts fans pledge to use his coffee business he might be persuaded to stay.

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5 minutes ago, Der Kaiser said:

 

Is that Colin Hendry?

Looks like him.....if his head was sculpted by that guy that did the Ronaldo bust.

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3 minutes ago, Costanza said:

Didn't know either of those but did see he was at some coffee festival with Naismith a few weeks ago.

Maybe if enough Hearts fans pledge to use his coffee business he might be persuaded to stay.

I'd imagine the business was dreamt up, roundabout his last achilles injury. So, there's at least an income if he ever got seriously injured again & football stopped. Which is good financial planning at his young age, tbf.

 

It will be coffee beans(pardon the analogy/pun) to him, should his move...and let's be honest...he IS leaving, and earns English level wages for a while. 

 

I've nothing against him, but I resigned myself to him leaving weeks ago. My only concern now, is Hearts & the potential deal they can strike with another club.

 

Fwiw, I think Souttar will see us right with a signing on fee too. Just a hunch.

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PhoenixHearts
18 minutes ago, Der Kaiser said:

 

Is that Colin Hendry?

 

Looks like Gary Busey

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Savage Vince
22 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

Driver said although he missed out on huge money by not going to Burnley he wouldn't swap the cup win for anything. Lesson being it's not the money you look back on when you're done playing.

 

I'm glad Andy thinks that way. He was outstanding in that match, particularly the first half. 

 

He was a great wee player. There was a lot of hype in the early years and he suffered badly from injuries however Driver was a good player for Hearts and noone deserved their medal that day more than him. 

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53 minutes ago, Barack said:

I'd imagine the business was dreamt up, roundabout his last achilles injury. So, there's at least an income if he ever got seriously injured again & football stopped. Which is good financial planning at his young age, tbf.

 

It will be coffee beans(pardon the analogy/pun) to him, should his move...and let's be honest...he IS leaving, and earns English level wages for a while. 

 

I've nothing against him, but I resigned myself to him leaving weeks ago. My only concern now, is Hearts & the potential deal they can strike with another club.

 

Fwiw, I think Souttar will see us right with a signing on fee too. Just a hunch.

I agree, don't blame the guy if he gets a life changing contract offer.

Also agree he would want a signing on fee added in.

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Led Tasso

From Ms Budge's comments and Robbie's it sounds like we put an offer on the table and he hasn't accepted or rejected it yet. Starting next week he can start finding out what other offers are likely to be as the pre-contract talks will start coming in.

 

Fair enough -- he wants to know what his market value is and then decide where he wants to be. If my read is right, he hasn't made the decision to leave Hearts yet and for that I'm glad.

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Jambo Moose

If he’s going at the end of the season. I’d like to see hearts take a fee in January. There’s only 16 games left and his heads not gonna be fully focussed on task if he’s signed a pre contract. 
the big disappointment is it seems like old firm or championship will be his destination. I believe he could’ve/could play right at the top so, although it’s financially great for him, I’m a bit gutted we’re no seeing him go higher like McGinn and tierney managed. 

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Parttimer1874
1 hour ago, Jambo Moose said:

If he’s going at the end of the season. I’d like to see hearts take a fee in January. There’s only 16 games left and his heads not gonna be fully focussed on task if he’s signed a pre contract. 
the big disappointment is it seems like old firm or championship will be his destination. I believe he could’ve/could play right at the top so, although it’s financially great for him, I’m a bit gutted we’re no seeing him go higher like McGinn and tierney managed. 


He’s good but not as good as those two and with his injury past I’d be surprised if any huge contract offers were on the table. 

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Smith's right boot
9 hours ago, Barack said:

 

He lives in Brechin, doesn't he?

 

And his new Coffee business opens up there at the weekend.

 

 

I never knew that, that news taken a long time to filter through. 

 

 

 

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Smith's right boot
1 hour ago, Parttimer1874 said:


He’s good but not as good as those two and with his injury past I’d be surprised if any huge contract offers were on the table. 

 

Tbf Nobody thought McGinn himself  was as good as they two when he was with hibs!

 

Won't find out until he moves. 

He has the raw materials and is twice the player that guys like Mckenna and Hanley are imo. 

 

He reminds me of Dave Weir and he played at Everton for a number of years so I think Souttar would be comfortable. 

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, Led Tasso said:

From Ms Budge's comments and Robbie's it sounds like we put an offer on the table and he hasn't accepted or rejected it yet. Starting next week he can start finding out what other offers are likely to be as the pre-contract talks will start coming in.

 

Fair enough -- he wants to know what his market value is and then decide where he wants to be. If my read is right, he hasn't made the decision to leave Hearts yet and for that I'm glad.

Have no doubt about it, John Souttar and his agent will have been well aware already what offers are on the table for a number of months now.

 

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Special Agent Dale Cooper
1 hour ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

I never knew that, that news taken a long time to filter through. 

 

 

 

He didn't want to mocha big deal of it.

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Smith's right boot
1 hour ago, Special Agent Dale Cooper said:

He didn't want to mocha big deal of it.

 

:jambobanana:

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Japan Jambo
12 hours ago, Costanza said:

He's a big fan of historic Scottish monuments and Levein is a consultant at Brechin so it's not implausible 

 

 

b25lY21zOmZhZTY0NDdiLTcxMGEtNDA3Yy1iOGY0LTc2MDI4YjYxZjhjMDozMTcxM2M2YS00OTE0LTRhMGQtYjFkMy05YTAzMzJlMTJkNzQ=.jpg

 

Didn't realise IKEA did monuments

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If he's a brechin fan, why not offer to put a 10% sell on fee if he signs a long term deal? With an agreement that he's kept in the loop about transfer bids and the club will work with him to get him the move he wants. 

 

Just don't want to lose him yet. He's in good form and back in the national side. Moving now to a cutthroat environment may not be the best plan. Driver and McGowans comments hopefully strike a cord with him and he does extend his contract so if a club really wants him they prove it. There is a big difference between a club paying 7 figures to nabbing you on a free and hopefully he realises that. His next move needs to be down south to a side that will allow him to establish himself and showcase what he can do. Make a mid table Championship side pay seven figures and he'll get the chance to show what he can do and move up quickly. They don't have the money to chuck a player they've paid big bucks for onto the trash heap lightly so will persevere if he hits a bad patch. 

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2 hours ago, Clerry Jambo said:


Hartley did not tarnish his bond with Hearts fans when he joined Celtic!

McLaren did not tarnish his bond with Hearts fans when he joined Rangers?

Pressley tarnished his bond when he returned to Tynecastle with Celtic and acted like an absolute dick at the wind up!

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Smith's right boot
3 minutes ago, Thomaso said:


Hartley did not tarnish his bond with Hearts fans when he joined Celtic!

McLaren did not tarnish his bond with Hearts fans when he joined Rangers?

Pressley tarnished his bond when he returned to Tynecastle with Celtic and acted like an absolute dick at the wind up!

 

 

He's right tho. 

 

If he goes to the OF, especially for nothing, not many Hearts fans will wish him well. That is already apparent. 

 

If he goes to the OF for a decent fee, the reaction will be mixed, if he goes to the championship for a fee most, if not all will wish him well. 

 

Knickers can be untwisted, Elvis is quite correct in what he says.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

He's right tho. 

 

If he goes to the OF, especially for nothing, not many Hearts fans will wish him well. That is already apparent. 

 

If he goes to the OF for a decent fee, the reaction will be mixed, if he goes to the championship for a fee most, if not all will wish him well. 

 

Knickers can be untwisted, Elvis is quite correct in what he says.

 

 

 

 

 

 


I don’t wear knickers Tosh but suggest you stop wetting yours when Pressley gets called out for the dick he was at Tynecastle that day. 

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