Swashbuckling, Attacking Football

[gedster]

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/nostalgia/how-hearts-late-comeback-against-rangers-saved-the-2015-title-party-3201945

 

Hard to believe that's how the article says we played that season when we see the current rubbish we have to suffer.

[Tazio]

What a difference a manager makes to a team.

Oh hang on a minute...

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

We've hit 6 three times this season, a five and a four. What more do people want, I just dont know 

 

 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Just now, Sir Gio said:

We've hit 6 three times this season, a five and a four, won the cup semi derby, denied by a whisker in possibly the most exciting cup final of all time.

 

What more do people want, I just dont know 

 

 

 

[Bull's-eye]

There's no such thing as bad or boring or negative or eye bleeding football. 

 

Thousands of pitches across the country prove that.

 

There is a lot of silly wee Sheep on here and social media that have extreme difficulty in thinking for themselves and deep down should really and probably have at one point followed the bigots.

 

 

[AlphonseCapone]

Just now, Bull's-eye said:

There's no such thing as bad or boring or negative or eye bleeding football. 

 

Thousands of pitches across the country prove that.

 

There is a lot of silly wee Sheep on here and social media that have extreme difficulty in thinking for themselves and deep down should really and probably have at one point followed the bigots.

 

 

 

What an utterly ridiculous claim. 

[Dia Liom]

The difference, imo, is that RN was able to sign a good few players that were suited to the league.  He was able to shape the squad from scratch, as we had barely any players.  

 

This time, with the state of the squad when RN arrived, I'm amazed we've cruised it again.  No surprises from me that the football hasn't been as good. 

[portobellojambo1]

10 minutes ago, Tazio said:

What a difference a manager makes to a team.

Oh hang on a minute...

Huge difference in that season compared with the one just finishing Tazio. The previous season Gary Locke had brought in a load of the youngsters, and while the 15 point deficit for that season played its part the youngsters enthusiasm and desire shone through. During that Championship season I had come to the conclusion that Robbie had been given freedom to let the team play as he wanted. The first season back in the top league I got the impression that Craig Levein had a huge say in how we played as every game, especially away from home, was analysed pre match to the nth degree. It was only this season that I came to the conclusion maybe Craig didn't have as much influence as I thought as this season every game is getting that same level of analysis, but this season there has been the addition of some pretty pathetic excuses for the shit performances. It just frightens me that having made winning the Championship a lot more difficult than it should have been we could witness the same analysis and excuses next season

[Tazio]

4 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

Huge difference in that season compared with the one just finishing Tazio. The previous season Gary Locke had brought in a load of the youngsters, and while the 15 point deficit for that season played its part the youngsters enthusiasm and desire shone through. During that Championship season I had come to the conclusion that Robbie had been given freedom to let the team play as he wanted. The first season back in the top league I got the impression that Craig Levein had a huge say in how we played as every game, especially away from home, was analysed pre match to the nth degree. It was only this season that I came to the conclusion maybe Craig didn't have as much influence as I thought as this season every game is getting that same level of analysis, but this season there has been the addition of some pretty pathetic excuses for the shit performances. It just frightens me that having made winning the Championship a lot more difficult than it should have been we could witness the same analysis and excuses next season

I’m fully aware of all that. My post was just mischief making. 

[portobellojambo1]

1 minute ago, Tazio said:

I’m fully aware of all that. My post was just mischief making. 

 

Apologies, I clearly took it in the wrong manner.

[Bull's-eye]

28 minutes ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

What an utterly ridiculous claim. 

 

It's not my fault you don't understand what your watching.

[Kev1998]

Maybe then bulls eye I should have got a half season ticket for neilsons first tenure.because the second half was mostly spent in the arms.

[plastic_bas]

Are there any fans outside of Rangers (and Celtic in recent years), that are happy with the standard of football their team plays? Hibs fans I know are pleased with the consistency they've found this year but not the quality. The lack of style dogged McInnes throughout his Aberdeen tenure. I can't defend some of the dross we've served up this season but the physicality, fitness and tactical awareness of even part-time players means teams cancel each other out.

 

I was a bit sniffy about Graeme Souness when he made these comments last year but I think there is something in them. Increasing the pitch size or reducing the number of players on each side could lead to more open football.

 

 

[jamboozy]

When BigZ knocked in the 2 nd and the whole of the Gorgie faithful starting singing “ That’s why we’re champions “   I felt tremendously proud 

[fast_blood]

41 minutes ago, portobellojambo1 said:

Huge difference in that season compared with the one just finishing Tazio. The previous season Gary Locke had brought in a load of the youngsters, and while the 15 point deficit for that season played its part the youngsters enthusiasm and desire shone through. During that Championship season I had come to the conclusion that Robbie had been given freedom to let the team play as he wanted. The first season back in the top league I got the impression that Craig Levein had a huge say in how we played as every game, especially away from home, was analysed pre match to the nth degree. It was only this season that I came to the conclusion maybe Craig didn't have as much influence as I thought as this season every game is getting that same level of analysis, but this season there has been the addition of some pretty pathetic excuses for the shit performances. It just frightens me that having made winning the Championship a lot more difficult than it should have been we could witness the same analysis and excuses next season

 

Also worth noting that we had a bit more freedom in terms of budgeting to stay down for 2 seasons so the expectations were lower all round. 

[David Black]

The big difference back then was that it was a completely new regime at the club. We had finally seen the back of the shambolic Romanov period and had everything to look forward to. The buzz around the entire club was fantastic giving it a great platform from which to build. The support, FoH and the Board were as one. Seven years on and what do we have, the complete opposite. The vast majority of the support are at odds with the Board, the Board are in hiding and our representatives, FoH are in the bunker with them. That is some achievement, back where we started and as big a divide as you could possibly get.

[RS86]

1 hour ago, Dia Liom said:

The difference, imo, is that RN was able to sign a good few players that were suited to the league.  He was able to shape the squad from scratch, as we had barely any players.  

 

This time, with the state of the squad when RN arrived, I'm amazed we've cruised it again.  No surprises from me that the football hasn't been as good. 

 

I also think Sow and Paterson largely carried us. It was around the time they both left our performances started to decline

[jimbojambo]

1 hour ago, Bull's-eye said:

There's no such thing as bad or boring or negative or eye bleeding football. 

 

Thousands of pitches across the country prove that.

 

There is a lot of silly wee Sheep on here and social media that have extreme difficulty in thinking for themselves and deep down should really and probably have at one point followed the bigots.

 

 

I am honestly stumped at any other teams other than the uglies who are playing attractive Roy of the Rovers football so would appreciate if anyone could point me in the right direction so we know where to go for the new Messiah 🤔

[siegementality]

1 hour ago, Dia Liom said:

The difference, imo, is that RN was able to sign a good few players that were suited to the league.  He was able to shape the squad from scratch, as we had barely any players.  

 

This time, with the state of the squad when RN arrived, I'm amazed we've cruised it again.  No surprises from me that the football hasn't been as good. 

Sad that Neilson’s limited managerial ability means he can’t get the best out of internationals such as Smith, Boyce and Naismith, or even the players he brought in himself. Beckham obviously missed a trick at Inter Miami. Neilson was the man to build a squad from scratch. Shame that rarely ever happens.

[GinRummy]

10 minutes ago, jimbojambo said:

I am honestly stumped at any other teams other than the uglies who are playing attractive Roy of the Rovers football so would appreciate if anyone could point me in the right direction so we know where to go for the new Messiah 🤔

Let’s face it, given the chasm between the quality of our players and the rest of the clubs in the championship, if we can’t manage to play attacking, fast football this season we probably never will. Fans failing to even acknowledge the turgid, ineffective, slow boring passing game just give RN the license to continue with it. We’ll be up against better teams next season and we’ll suffer for it if nothing changes. 

[Fort Vallance]

2 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

There's no such thing as bad or boring or negative or eye bleeding football. 

 

Thousands of pitches across the country prove that.

 

There is a lot of silly wee Sheep on here and social media that have extreme difficulty in thinking for themselves and deep down should really and probably have at one point followed the bigots.

 

 

Most people would put up with boring, negative or even eye bleeding football occasionally especially when they're winning. Watching it week after week after week is mind numbing.

 

[Bull's-eye]

19 minutes ago, Fort Vallance said:

Most people would put up with boring, negative or even eye bleeding football occasionally especially when they're winning. Watching it week after week after week is mind numbing.

 

 

Go down to your local park and watch a match, try and educate yourself in the finer points of the game, you'll see professional Football in a different light.

 

The problem with you and the rest of the sheep is you've already made your mind up before a game kicks off.

 

You've already decided what your watching next season in fact, really quite bizarre imo.

[siegementality]

2 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

There's no such thing as bad or boring or negative or eye bleeding football. 

 

Thousands of pitches across the country prove that.

 

There is a lot of silly wee Sheep on here and social media that have extreme difficulty in thinking for themselves and deep down should really and probably have at one point followed the bigots.

 

 

Lazy trolling. To be honest you’ve done a lot of that recently. You used to be half decent at trolling. Time for a wee visit out with your local authority area to recharge your batteries, get some fresh air and a change of scenery.

[Debut 4]

4 hours ago, gedster said:

https://www.edinburghnews.scotsman.com/sport/nostalgia/how-hearts-late-comeback-against-rangers-saved-the-2015-title-party-3201945

 

Hard to believe that's how the article says we played that season when we see the current rubbish we have to suffer.

Quite a few factors.  Club harmony plays a huge part and I think this is a big thing the board fail to recognise. We had it then. 

 

How can just 5,6 years ago feel like a world away?  The feelgood was back with the club surviving. FOH going into overdrive and other investment. 
 

The young players we brought through before this season and who’d did a valiant job, were still fighting for us. Even though we had some better players in particular positions than we do now, we just seem to have more intent and hunger in our game generally.  Then you look at the boss. Has his shelf life went past it’s date already?

[Dia Liom]

1 hour ago, RS86 said:

 

I also think Sow and Paterson largely carried us. It was around the time they both left our performances started to decline

That too!  It made me laugh at the time reading a comment about Paterson, 'he's not that good a right back' or similar.  Eh, how do you think we will cope with losing 8-10 goals a season from any player, let alone one playing majority in defence.  Losing Paterson made Cathro's job many times more difficult.

 

1 hour ago, siegementality said:

Sad that Neilson’s limited managerial ability means he can’t get the best out of internationals such as Smith, Boyce and Naismith, or even the players he brought in himself. Beckham obviously missed a trick at Inter Miami. Neilson was the man to build a squad from scratch. Shame that rarely ever happens.

 

Boyce has had a terrible season right enough, scoring 16 goals in under 30 games.  🙄

 

Your point is that we have some good players in the squad, which is clearly true.  My point having quite a few senior players that we couldn't shift wasn't ideal.  In 2014/15 we hardly had any senior players, and got rid of others that were out of contract, something we haven't been able to do as well this time.

[kila]

3 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

There's no such thing as bad or boring or negative or eye bleeding football. 

 

Thousands of pitches across the country prove that.

 

There is a lot of silly wee Sheep on here and social media that have extreme difficulty in thinking for themselves and deep down should really and probably have at one point followed the bigots.

 

You really don't understand football or tactics. But most on this forum already knew that anyway.

 

[Bull's-eye]

45 minutes ago, kila said:

 

You really don't understand football or tactics. But most on this forum already knew that anyway.

 

 

 

Cut to the quick.

[Bull's-eye]

1 hour ago, siegementality said:

Lazy trolling. To be honest you’ve done a lot of that recently. You used to be half decent at trolling. Time for a wee visit out with your local authority area to recharge your batteries, get some fresh air and a change of scenery.

 

You'll just be another sheep without a mind of your own then.

Duly noted.

[AlphonseCapone]

4 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

It's not my fault you don't understand what your watching.

 

If you don't think some football is subjectively boring compared to other football then you're dafter than you act on here. Maybe stick to colouring books. 

[Pasquale for King]

5 hours ago, Dia Liom said:

The difference, imo, is that RN was able to sign a good few players that were suited to the league.  He was able to shape the squad from scratch, as we had barely any players.  

 

This time, with the state of the squad when RN arrived, I'm amazed we've cruised it again.  No surprises from me that the football hasn't been as good. 

We had plenty of players they were just young, he seemed more happy to play them last time. Walker/Nicholson/Patterson/Mackay/Wilson/Hamilton/Holt/Robinson/King/McGhee/Oliver/Carrick all played a part in a season where we played just over 40 games and used 40 players. 

[Fort Vallance]

2 hours ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

Go down to your local park and watch a match, try and educate yourself in the finer points of the game, you'll see professional Football in a different light.

 

The problem with you and the rest of the sheep is you've already made your mind up before a game kicks off.

 

You've already decided what your watching next season in fact, really quite bizarre imo.

Sheep ? I'm 65 years old. I've played and watched more than enough football at all levels to know what's enjoyable to watch and what isnt. I don't need educated by judgemental dicks thanks. And as for next season, I can't predict what we're getting from one game to the next never mind months in advance. 

[Pasquale for King]

9 minutes ago, AlphonseCapone said:

 

If you don't think some football is subjectively boring compared to other football then you're dafter than you act on here. Maybe stick to colouring books. 

Hahahahaha 😆

[Thomaso]

1 minute ago, Fort Vallance said:

Sheep ? I'm 65 years old. I've played and watched more than enough football at all levels to know what's enjoyable to watch and what isnt. I don't need educated by judgemental dicks thanks. And as for next season, I can't predict what we're getting from one game to the next never mind months in advance. 

BOOM!! 👍

[GinRummy]

3 minutes ago, Fort Vallance said:

Sheep ? I'm 65 years old. I've played and watched more than enough football at all levels to know what's enjoyable to watch and what isnt. I don't need educated by judgemental dicks thanks. And as for next season, I can't predict what we're getting from one game to the next never mind months in advance. 

Great post. Get him telt. 

[Bull's-eye]

10 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Hahahahaha 😆

 

9 minutes ago, Thomaso said:

BOOM!! 👍

 

7 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Great post. Get him telt. 

 

The holy trinity of JKB with the usual contribution.

[GinRummy]

1 minute ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

 

 

The holy trinity of JKB with the usual 

 

 

good thread though. The thread where you moved up from being the best hearts fans in the world to the hearts fan that understands football better than anyone else. Managed to upset an OAP in the process. What’s the next level up for you now. How can you rise any further in your quest for complete kickback superiority. 

[Dia Liom]

2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

We had plenty of players they were just young, he seemed more happy to play them last time. Walker/Nicholson/Patterson/Mackay/Wilson/Hamilton/Holt/Robinson/King/McGhee/Oliver/Carrick all played a part in a season where we played just over 40 games and used 40 players. 

 

Yeah!  Definitely interesting to ponder what changed his attitude this season.  I'd say it was down to the current crop - Hamilton, Cochrane, Moore, etc. - having either little, or pretty poor, experience in the first team.  The previous lot had done quite a bit better in more difficult circumstances.  All the current lot have potential, but I'd be shocked if any go on to be better players than Walker or Paterson.  

 

The second thing is that in 2014/15, most of us were expecting to go up by the play-offs, at best.  RN may have felt that taking risks with younger players was unwise.  Judging by the reaction on here after winning the league by a mile, he was probably right!

[rudi must stay]

5 hours ago, Dia Liom said:

The difference, imo, is that RN was able to sign a good few players that were suited to the league.  He was able to shape the squad from scratch, as we had barely any players.  

 

This time, with the state of the squad when RN arrived, I'm amazed we've cruised it again.  No surprises from me that the football hasn't been as good. 

 

We have a squad that in my opinion should have won the league even more comfortably

[Jeffros Furios]

18 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

 

 

The holy trinity of JKB with the usual contribution.

[Pasquale for King]

12 minutes ago, Dia Liom said:

 

Yeah!  Definitely interesting to ponder what changed his attitude this season.  I'd say it was down to the current crop - Hamilton, Cochrane, Moore, etc. - having either little, or pretty poor, experience in the first team.  The previous lot had done quite a bit better in more difficult circumstances.  All the current lot have potential, but I'd be shocked if any go on to be better players than Walker or Paterson.  

 

The second thing is that in 2014/15, most of us were expecting to go up by the play-offs, at best.  RN may have felt that taking risks with younger players was unwise.  Judging by the reaction on here after winning the league by a mile, he was probably right!

The current crop aren’t as good no doubt about that, but Moore and Henderson have played well enough in the top league to play this season. 
Moore especially is unlucky to have been overlooked for Roberts/Frear/Kastaneer and even GMS who has been a huge disappointment so far. 
I did ponder at the time that signing Halliday would keep Irving out the team, he actually got in the way of Haring who also needed to play his way back to fitness and McGill/Cochrane to a lesser extent. 
Having the oldest squad in the country shows how needlessly negative he is as a manager as playing youngsters would’ve not only helped the older players but probably would’ve seen us play better too. 
No doubt he will play a few more in the upcoming games to make it look better. 

This was the league to use them in, hex unlikely to do it next season with even more pressure on his shoulders. 

[Pasquale for King]

32 minutes ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

 

 

The holy trinity of JKB with the usual contribution.

That’s a bit too religious for my liking. 

[Kiwidoug]

I hope our buckles are swashing all over the shop next season.  In fact I hope Morton next week is a sign of things to come.  Get out there and enjoy yourselves boys.  Absolutely tear right into them from the word go.

[OTT]

5 hours ago, jamboozy said:

When BigZ knocked in the 2 nd and the whole of the Gorgie faithful starting singing “ That’s why we’re champions “   I felt tremendously proud 

We should have found the money to have kept the big man. The most naturally gifted goal scorer since Robbo IMO. A damned shame. 

[glynnlondon]

Hobo loving rag talks shite shocker 

Let's concentrate on getting our own act together

 

 

 

[jimbojambo]

4 hours ago, GinRummy said:

Let’s face it, given the chasm between the quality of our players and the rest of the clubs in the championship, if we can’t manage to play attacking, fast football this season we probably never will. Fans failing to even acknowledge the turgid, ineffective, slow boring passing game just give RN the license to continue with it. We’ll be up against better teams next season and we’ll suffer for it if nothing changes. 

Watching Dundee United toiling against Forfar, Motherwell drawing against Morton and St Mirren struggled against ICT so not too sure the Premier teams are that far ahead in my opinion

[GinRummy]

5 minutes ago, jimbojambo said:

Watching Dundee United toiling against Forfar, Motherwell drawing against Morton and St Mirren struggled against ICT so not too sure the Premier teams are that far ahead in my opinion

 

 

We don’t need to play safety first, dull, slow football. It reduced us down to the level of bottom of the league spl sides under Levein and it’ll do the same under Neilson. The investment versus return from our playing squad over the last few years is nothing short of disgraceful.

[Fort Vallance]

1 hour ago, Bull's-eye said:

 

 

 

The holy trinity of JKB with the usual contribution.

Trinity. Nah mate, Craigroyston.

[jimbojambo]

22 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

 

 

We don’t need to play safety first, dull, slow football. It reduced us down to the level of bottom of the league spl sides under Levein and it’ll do the same under Neilson. The investment versus return from our playing squad over the last few years is nothing short of disgraceful.

It's the old argument as to whether you want to win 1-0 in a boring game or lose 5-4 in a thriller. Strange that Levein built from the back yet our defence has not been that secure for a long time.

[GinRummy]

9 minutes ago, jimbojambo said:

It's the old argument as to whether you want to win 1-0 in a boring game or lose 5-4 in a thriller. Strange that Levein built from the back yet our defence has not been that secure for a long time.

It’s what concerns me. If the defence isn’t great, the tactic seems to gradually regress to getting more players playing deeper and in more defensive roles. Happened under CL and has happened under RN this season. It just ends up with a bunch of players, not enjoying their football and having to drop deeper and do more defensive work than they should. It’s really negative and turns completely ineffective quite quickly. 

[jimbojambo]

7 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

It’s what concerns me. If the defence isn’t great, the tactic seems to gradually regress to getting more players playing deeper and in more defensive roles. Happened under CL and has happened under RN this season. It just ends up with a bunch of players, not enjoying their football and having to drop deeper and do more defensive work than they should. It’s really negative and turns completely ineffective quite quickly. 

Hopefully Souttar will make a big difference as no reason to be poor with Gordon, Smith, Kingsley and Halkett all good players also.