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Dannie Boy

FoH disposal of shares.

FoH GOVERNANCE FRAMEWORK – HAVE YOUR SAY ON THE SUPERMAJORITY  

280 members have voted

  1. 1. Which way will you vote.

    • 90%
      107
    • 75%
      173


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davemclaren
32 minutes ago, jr ewing said:

Fan ownership is the safest route. Learn from the past and never make the same mistake ever again. We may never get a second chance. 

I agree but it might not always be.  

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Mick Arthur
4 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

 The exception is local fan investors like Budge. 

Budge is NOT and investor ?  She loaned FOH £2.5m, repayable with interest.

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ToqueJambo
5 minutes ago, Mick Arthur said:

Budge is NOT and investor ?  She loaned FOH £2.5m, repayable with interest.

 

I know. She's still a large shareholder I believe.

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sandylejambo

Thanks, you see I'm the American millionaire that's giving twenty million to the club, I have no idea who Heart of Midlothian are, but I'm getting a twenty million pound stadium for my cash and some of the players must be worth something. Over the years I plan on taking out at least 20% of the incoming revenue and in ten years I'll have all the assets and my investment back,  then the fans either pony up or I sell the ground to some building company because the land is now worth more then the stadium. That's investment speak. For every Fergus McCann there's ten Robinsons

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Mick Arthur
2 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Can we at least give it a try 😂 

 

This whole change in governance is being driven by the hypothetical scenario that some sort of Hearts-loving billionnaire is just sitting waiting by the phone for the go ahead to hand us his money for probably no return. I don't see what's wrong with forcing him to convince 90% instead of 75% of his intentions.

An investor, Hearts fan or not could walk away if he was waiting for 90% to approve his investment.  I would.

Edited by Mick Arthur

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ToqueJambo

Can anyone name any scenario outwith the OF where an "investor" has come in, especially a foreign one, and been good for the club in question in the long term? Billy Bowie maybe recently but can Killie sustain their improvement? Dundee Utd are spending wildly and racking up losses. Hibs under the American guy, who knows. Aberdeen under Milne maybe but it took a long time and he's local. Thomson did OK for a while at Utd. The common denominator for the ones that at least don't ruin the clubs they buy into are that they are local fans. There are always problems when they want out though. Do we then run a new fan ownership scheme to bail the club out again?

Edited by ToqueJambo

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Mick Arthur

Donald Trump  🤗

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davemclaren
11 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

Can anyone name any scenario outwith the OF where an "investor" has come in, especially a foreign one, and been good for the club in question in the long term? Billy Bowie maybe recently but can Killie sustain their improvement? Dundee Utd are spending wildly and racking up losses. Hibs under the American guy, who knows. Aberdeen under Milne maybe but it took a long time and he's local. Thomson did OK for a while at Utd. The common denominator for the ones that at least don't ruin the clubs they buy into are that they are local fans. There are always problems when they want out though. Do we then run a new fan ownership scheme to bail the club out again?

For nearly 150 years all clubs were owned by ‘investors’ to a greater or lesser degree. Started off as successful smallish local businessmen ( Elias Furst ) then successful bigger businessmen ( Wallace Mercer ). 
 

I think the fan owned model will serve us well for the foreseeable future as long as contributions are maintained to a good level but... How many fan owned clubs in the UK have won a major trophy? 😄

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SUTOL
9 hours ago, davemclaren said:

 

I think the fan owned model will serve us well for the foreseeable future as long as contributions are maintained to a good level but... How many fan owned clubs in the UK have won a major trophy? 😄

 

 

Blackburn Rovers possibly the last one...

 

Quite a few in Germany though.

 

 

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fabienleclerq
9 hours ago, Mick Arthur said:

An investor, Hearts fan or not could walk away if he was waiting for 90% to approve his investment.  I would.

 

As a Hearts fan why would you be trying to make money off us? 

 

No one is a better investor than FOH or will be, donating £2m a year and the only return wanted is a better team on the park. 

 

 

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DETTY29
11 hours ago, Jambo-Fox said:

👍

 

I’m sure there are some that want to be fan owned forever come what may ....

 

”aye I’m one of the 10% that blocked investment ”

 

”I can remember when we were the

third biggest club in Scotland”


“Aye we are in the second division now and struggling BUT at least we are fan owned ... cannae beat it”!!

Or out of business completely dependent upon the investor coming in because at the outset he or she promised the world and any guarantees they provided were not the worth the paper they were written on with any decent lawyer could rip apart.

 

 

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Coco

Over the last couple of decades the best run clubs in Scotland have been the run within their means clubs - Celtic and St Johnstone.  They haven't suffered the ups and downs of the dreamers and shysters who have plagued almost all the other clubs at one time or another.  As fan owned we will have an opportunity to rule out these 'investors' ever being involved.

 

I would be going further than the 90% rule by exploring putting the shareholding in trust for the Hearts supporters.  A symbolic move to treat the club as s common good.

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Mick Arthur
5 hours ago, fabienleclerq said:

 

As a Hearts fan why would you be trying to make money off us? 

 

No one is a better investor than FOH or will be, donating £2m a year and the only return wanted is a better team on the park. 

 

 

You should realise that FOH have allowed Ann Budge to squander the fans' millions for an overpriced £21.5m new main stand which has affected the quality of the team on the park . . . and will continue to do so long after she has departed.

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Mick Arthur
2 hours ago, Coco said:

Over the last couple of decades the best run clubs in Scotland have been the run within their means clubs - Celtic and St Johnstone.  They haven't suffered the ups and downs of the dreamers and shysters who have plagued almost all the other clubs at one time or another.  As fan owned we will have an opportunity to rule out these 'investors' ever being involved.

 

I would be going further than the 90% rule by exploring putting the shareholding in trust for the Hearts supporters.  A symbolic move to treat the club as s common good.

Hearts only have a core support of 15,000.  The new £21.5m main stand has not increased attendances and will take years to recoup its cost from non-football income as suggested by Ms Budge.

 

However, I would agree with you if more than 90% Hearts fans could fill the Roseburn Stand every week with no more than 500 allocated to all away supporters including the OF, Hibs etc.  Until then we need all the income from wherever it comes from.

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queensferryjambo
8 minutes ago, Mick Arthur said:

You should realise that FOH have allowed Ann Budge to squander the fans' millions for an overpriced £21.5m new main stand which has affected the quality of the team on the park . . . and will continue to do so long after she has departed.

 

We needed a new stand. It also never cost £21.5M, that has been the cost of the stand + overall stadium upgrades and improvements.

 

We will make more money over a long period of time with the function suites and facilities in the new stand and of course increased stadium capacity. The revenue generated by Hearts off the park from the new suites has been excellent. 

 

The new stand will also need much less costly maintenance than the old one.

 

I would suggest that the budget has been very decent compared to other SPFL clubs and the reason we have poor quality isn't due to the cash put into the team it has been due to poor recruitment. There  have been an awful lot of very well paid crap players who have passed through the club in the last 3 to 4 seasons.

 

 

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fabienleclerq
2 hours ago, Mick Arthur said:

You should realise that FOH have allowed Ann Budge to squander the fans' millions for an overpriced £21.5m new main stand which has affected the quality of the team on the park . . . and will continue to do so long after she has departed.

 

We needed a new stand. It will also generate more money for us than the old one, so yes it will affe t the quality of the team but most likely positively long after she has departed. 

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Mick Arthur
2 hours ago, queensferryjambo said:

 

We needed a new stand. It also never cost £21.5M, that has been the cost of the stand + overall stadium upgrades and improvements.

 

The base price for a 7,000 seat capacity covered stand is £1000 per seat according to the architect James Clydesdale.

 

Hibs new 6,400 single tier stand cost them £6 million plus the catering franchises underneath.

 

Maybe Ann Budge was ripped off by 'her' chosen contractor and got carried away with expensive vanity additions paid for by the fans and not her.   However,  her loan has been repaid and she will be gone soon.

 

Hearts could have had a brand new 25,000 stadium built for the same money.

 

The main stand window cleaning contract will probably cost £25k per year (outside only)

Edited by Mick Arthur

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SUTOL
34 minutes ago, Mick Arthur said:

The base price for a 7,000 seat capacity covered stand is £1000 per seat according to the architect James Clydesdale.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Is that for a main stand with all the first team facilities included, plus: a shop, a bar, several function suites, offices, a nursery school, a landscaped 'plaza', integration into existing stands/structures, incorporating parts of the old stand and TV studio. Plus no doubt other things I have missed ?

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Saint Jambo
1 hour ago, Mick Arthur said:

The base price for a 7,000 seat capacity covered stand is £1000 per seat according to the architect James Clydesdale.

 

Hibs new 6,400 single tier stand cost them £6 million plus the catering franchises underneath.

 

Maybe Ann Budge was ripped off by 'her' chosen contractor and got carried away with expensive vanity additions paid for by the fans and not her.   However,  her loan has been repaid and she will be gone soon.

 

Hearts could have had a brand new 25,000 stadium built for the same money.

 

The main stand window cleaning contract will probably cost £25k per year (outside only)

 

You seem to believe you are remarkably well informed for someone who on Thursday posted:

"I heard that Ann Budge is leaving in April and handing control (and £20 million debt) to FOH."

 

Do you still believe Hearts are £20m in debt?

 

If I was you, I stop wasting your time posting on jkb and rush off to sell your services to Aberdeen FC. They are projecting £50m for a 20k capacity stadium. They'll be delighted to know that you can deliver them a 25k capacity stadium for well under half the cost.

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queensferryjambo
1 hour ago, Mick Arthur said:

Hibs new 6,400 single tier stand cost them £6 million plus the catering franchises underneath.

 

Yes but their stadium is made up from 4 disjointed lumps of shite :) 

 

 

 

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Mick Arthur
2 hours ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

You seem to believe you are remarkably well informed for someone who on Thursday posted:

"I heard that Ann Budge is leaving in April and handing control (and £20 million debt) to FOH."

 

Do you still believe Hearts are £20m in debt?

 

If I was you, I stop wasting your time posting on jkb and rush off to sell your services to Aberdeen FC. They are projecting £50m for a 20k capacity stadium. They'll be delighted to know that you can deliver them a 25k capacity stadium for well under half the cost.

*  I have been abroad for a while and came on here to catch up on the rumours that Ms Budge had announced the stadium cost had nearly doubled to £21.5m and she was stepping out after getting her £2.5m loan back. I would have expected her to donate the £2.5m to the Club after her shocking mismanagement which has cost the fans millions.

 

**  Hearts may not be in debt . . . but it's the FOH fans who are in hock to continue to pay their direct debits until the debt is paid and their money can be 100% allocated to the team on the park.  

 

*** I am not interested in Aberdeen FC but you seem to be well-informed about their new stadium costs..

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Saint Jambo
10 minutes ago, Mick Arthur said:

*  I have been abroad for a while and came on here to catch up on the rumours that Ms Budge had announced the stadium cost had nearly doubled to £21.5m and she was stepping out after getting her £2.5m loan back. I would have expected her to donate the £2.5m to the Club after her shocking mismanagement which has cost the fans millions.

 

**  Hearts may not be in debt . . . but it's the FOH fans who are in hock to continue to pay their direct debits until the debt is paid and their money can be 100% allocated to the team on the park.  

 

*** I am not interested in Aberdeen FC but you seem to be well-informed about their new stadium costs..

 

You claimed you thought Hearts were £20m in debt. If you've come on here to catch-up on the rumours, I'm happy to help. Hearts aren't £20m in debt. The loan from Budge to BidCo has been fully paid off.

 

Your numbers for the cost of of the stand and stadium were rubbish.

 

Wherever you have been hearing these rumours, I suggest you ignore them in the future because so far they have been garbage.

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Mick Arthur
22 hours ago, sandylejambo said:

Thanks, you see I'm the American millionaire that's giving twenty million to the club, I have no idea who Heart of Midlothian are, but I'm getting a twenty million pound stadium for my cash and some of the players must be worth something. Over the years I plan on taking out at least 20% of the incoming revenue and in ten years I'll have all the assets and my investment back,  then the fans either pony up or I sell the ground to some building company because the land is now worth more then the stadium. That's investment speak. For every Fergus McCann there's ten Robinsons

Why not just buy the stadium with your £20m and remove the financial burden from the fans and let their money be used to take up season tickets instead to increase Hearts fans attendances to 19,500 at every home game improve the team on the park ? 

 

Max 500 away fans including the OF & Hibs etc.

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Mick Arthur
12 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

You claimed you thought Hearts were £20m in debt. If you've come on here to catch-up on the rumours, I'm happy to help. Hearts aren't £20m in debt. The loan from Budge to BidCo has been fully paid off.

 

Your numbers for the cost of of the stand and stadium were rubbish.

 

Wherever you have been hearing these rumours, I suggest you ignore them in the future because so far they have been garbage.

I did not say Hearts were £20m in debt ?

 

Ms Budge received the final payment for her loan last month.

 

The cost of a basic seated stadium is £1000 per seat before fitting out.  Ref : James Clydesdale, Tynecastle architect and former director of the Club (not me 🙄)

Edited by Mick Arthur

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Saint Jambo
7 minutes ago, Mick Arthur said:

I did not say Hearts were £20m in debt ?

 

Ms Budge received the final payment for her loan last month.

 

The cost of a basic seated stadium is £1000 per seat before fitting out.  Ref : James Clydesdale, Tynecastle architect and former director of the Club (not me 🙄)

 

You posted on Thursday "I heard that Ann Budge is leaving in April and handing control (and £20 million debt) to FOH."

 

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Mick Arthur
22 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

I know. She's still a large shareholder I believe.

Believe HALF of what you see and NOTHING that you hear from Ms Budge.

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SUTOL
10 hours ago, Mick Arthur said:

 

The cost of a basic seated stadium is £1000 per seat before fitting out.  Ref : James Clydesdale, Tynecastle architect and former director of the Club (not me 🙄)

 

 

Eh?  

 

When was that? 

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Dannie Boy

Bump for match day. More people on the board today (? ) 

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