XB52 Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 Ireland have made great use of the grandparent rule for years. Good to see them get done over for once. It is madness to have the grandparent rule anyway; always said it should be father/mother and no further Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
been here before Posted February 14, 2019 Share Posted February 14, 2019 Alfredo Di Stefano played for 3 international teams- Argentina, Colombia ans Spain where as Gordon Marshalls situation seems ludicrous. Born to a Scottish dad who was stationed in Aldershot, he moved to Edinburgh before he was a month old but under the rules at the time he was considered English. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Easy to stop all this chopping and changing, and patronising a country because you are not good enough to play for your real national team., just make the rule when you sign and register as a pro you choose your footballing nationality, and it's written on the forms, never to be changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allowayjambo1874 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 I think I heard on talksport (so undoubtably bull) that there is talk again of insisting on a quota of English players in your squad for EPL in the future so by declaring himself as English he is actually increasing both his value and his earning power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spacerjoe Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 3 hours ago, H2 said: Easy to stop all this chopping and changing, and patronising a country because you are not good enough to play for your real national team., just make the rule when you sign and register as a pro you choose your footballing nationality, and it's written on the forms, never to be changed. Bingo. The whole point is that you are representing YOUR country. Not playing for any international team so you can improve your next contract. I'm sure for the vast majority of people if you asked them 'what nationality are you?' the answer is obvious. And for those edge cases where you feel you are split, well they just have to pick. And if they genuinely feel 50/50 then it shouldn't matter who they pick; they'll be proud no matter what, so win-win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, spacerjoe said: Bingo. The whole point is that you are representing YOUR country. Not playing for any international team so you can improve your next contract. I'm sure for the vast majority of people if you asked them 'what nationality are you?' the answer is obvious. And for those edge cases where you feel you are split, well they just have to pick. And if they genuinely feel 50/50 then it shouldn't matter who they pick; they'll be proud no matter what, so win-win. Just what Rice has done. He has chosen England. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 On 14/02/2019 at 13:50, LeftBack said: Totally agree. It does make a mockery of things. I never felt comfortable with elliot, mattaeo or Hutchinson to name but a few although Don's goal v England did soften that! Tbh it's one of the things I hate about international rugby - over the past few years how many Scottish internationals have been born here? (genuine question - it might be a very high figure). You would also assume rice has been given some sort of assurance he will be in England's next squad. Note: I know what I've said is slightly different from changing allegiances but rules for international selection need to be tightened up. I also appreciate other countries have exploited it but that doesn't make it right I have more of a problem with the English doing it as they don't need to...English Rugby have ten times more registered players than any other country yet still use the residency rules to snap up South Sea islanders etc... I can see why Rice may want to play for England but it would be funny if he were to be a one-cap wonder... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Has Andy Driver chosen yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Spellczech said: I have more of a problem with the English doing it as they don't need to...English Rugby have ten times more registered players than any other country yet still use the residency rules to snap up South Sea islanders etc... I can see why Rice may want to play for England but it would be funny if he were to be a one-cap wonder... It is an issue in English Rugby. They are stopping home grown players getting chance. Rice is English though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingantti1874 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Ireland’s strategy of poaching players at a young age backfires.. shame Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftBack Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 5 hours ago, Spellczech said: I have more of a problem with the English doing it as they don't need to...English Rugby have ten times more registered players than any other country yet still use the residency rules to snap up South Sea islanders etc... I can see why Rice may want to play for England but it would be funny if he were to be a one-cap wonder... Good point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torry Jambo Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 On 14/02/2019 at 14:11, John Findlay said: Bruce Rioch and Don Masson didnt do to badly. Bob Wilson earned a couple of caps too. Don Masson was born In Banchory.18 miles from Aberdeen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glottis Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 Irish player maximum value: £10m English player maximum value: £100m (and the wages that come with it) He's made the choice to boost his bank balance, fair enought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toggie88 Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 6 minutes ago, Glottis said: Irish player maximum value: £10m English player maximum value: £100m (and the wages that come with it) He's made the choice to boost his bank balance, fair enought I don't think that's completely fair. What would that make a Welsh player worth? Because Gareth Bale would prove it incorrect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glottis Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 7 minutes ago, Toggie88 said: I don't think that's completely fair. What would that make a Welsh player worth? Because Gareth Bale would prove it incorrect. Exactly as I was typing that I was thinking the exact same thing but Bale is the exception. He is exceptional. He is world class. Only Giggs before him and Rush before him could be classed similarly. Bog standard English players get paid bucketloads more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted February 15, 2019 Share Posted February 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Glottis said: Exactly as I was typing that I was thinking the exact same thing but Bale is the exception. He is exceptional. He is world class. Only Giggs before him and Rush before him could be classed similarly. Bog standard English players get paid bucketloads more. I think it is more about his earning power than his transfer fee. Sponsorships and basic wages will be more if he is an England international. Also Damien Duff was once a £17m transfer about 15 years ago, when that was a lot for England. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussAsia Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 On 14/02/2019 at 23:14, Jamhammer said: Decent wee player. I’d have stayed with ROI I reckon but, I think International football should be led by your heart. As a Welshman I’m not arsed either way as long as he doesnt get injured Why would you have stayed with ROI? With the current players coming through for England they have as good a chance as any other nation in winning the world cup. ROI will be nowhere near.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTT Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 Born: London Raised: London How is this even a debate? The laddie is English, yet again Ireland are trying to play players that aren't Irish because their domestic league is pish and they can't develop enough decent players. After McGeady and McCarthy I can't have any sympathy for them whatsoever. If you base your international recruitment policy on such flimsy footing then you can't be annoyed when an Englishman decides he'd rather play for England. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 On 14/02/2019 at 19:44, XB52 said: Ireland have made great use of the grandparent rule for years. Good to see them get done over for once. It is madness to have the grandparent rule anyway; always said it should be father/mother and no further Too simplistic and here's an example. I'm born and raised in Edinburgh. Support Hearts and no other club. Will be cheering on the Scots at Twickenham next month as I've done at countless internationals. No one meeting me would question my Scottishness. Neither of my parents was born in Scotland and none of my sons was either. Two of my sons support only Hearts (the other seems to like Chelsea but I'm looking at getting him treated for that); all three of them support Scotland. But they all talk with English accents and can't pronounce the letter R between them. If they were to be selected for England, I'd take the money but still support Scotland against them. If they had kids who had a chance of playing for Scotland, I'd be delighted, regardless of where they were born. We can't afford to turn our noses up at good players who identify, through family bonds, with our country and we shouldn't stop others from doing likewise. The idea of changing minds, though...? That's wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VALDOS Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 I'll be honest here, I'm not even sure who that lad is, so I will assume he isnt all that good as his name has not been force fed to us as the next big thing. However, given the circumstances, please let these two arrange a "friendly" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamhammer Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 8 hours ago, RussAsia said: Why would you have stayed with ROI? With the current players coming through for England they have as good a chance as any other nation in winning the world cup. ROI will be nowhere near.. More competition with England. More chance of game time with ROI. Better fans too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamhammer Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 As a terrible footballer it's never been an issue but I have a Scottish Dad, a Welsh Mum and I was born in London. My folks split up when I was a baby and I grew up in North Wales. I could never consider playing for any other country but Wales. I've lived in Scotland since I was 17, the majority of my life but Wales will always be "home". For me, International football should be heart led and, if Declan's heart is English then he should play for them and let someone with an Irish heart have his place there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted February 16, 2019 Author Share Posted February 16, 2019 https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/declan-rice-theres-no-decision-to-be-made-if-i-didnt-want-to-be-playing-for-ireland-i-wouldnt-be-here-36723118.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 9 hours ago, OTT said: Born: London Raised: London How is this even a debate? The laddie is English, yet again Ireland are trying to play players that aren't Irish because their domestic league is pish and they can't develop enough decent players. After McGeady and McCarthy I can't have any sympathy for them whatsoever. If you base your international recruitment policy on such flimsy footing then you can't be annoyed when an Englishman decides he'd rather play for England. Totally. He's English. The issue was he played for all the Rep of Ireland youth teams and then 3 friendlies for the full side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ibrahim Tall Posted February 16, 2019 Share Posted February 16, 2019 (edited) Born in England, lived his whole in England, plays in England, and his parents are English. Given the huge number of players Ireland have basically stolen from Scotland, Northern Ireland and even England themselves they’re the last people in the world who can criticise. Oddly the didn’t criticise the rules when the likes of Shane Duffy(capped at B level) and McLean switched. Edited February 16, 2019 by Ibrahim Tall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussAsia Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 13 hours ago, Jamhammer said: More competition with England. More chance of game time with ROI. Better fans too. The fact is that he clearly thinks he is good enough to play for England so that's why he will choose them.. Not much point having the best fans if you are sat at home watching the World Cups on TV. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Brow Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 16 hours ago, Jamhammer said: More competition with England. More chance of game time with ROI. Better fans too. Hes clearly competing with Eric Dier, who has been fairly average for a couple of seasons now. Ive seen several West Ham games this year and his positioning, passing, comfort on the ball and general 'where the **** did he just come from' are pretty exceptional for his age. He stands out in a half decent west ham team and *should* progress to the England team fairly easily. He can also play at the back and is a decent size. ROI are, to be blunt, shite. They have a crap squad, old players, sectarianism and Mick McCarthy in charge. The poor ***** was probably doing all he could to get a switch and fair play to him. England have lots of good players coming through and he'll fancy his chances at a Euros win in a few years. good luck to him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted February 17, 2019 Author Share Posted February 17, 2019 19 hours ago, Ibrahim Tall said: Born in England, lived his whole in England, plays in England, and his parents are English. So why did he pull on a Ireland shirt and represent them ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftBack Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Apparently Scotland are looking at Birmingham striker Che Adams as he has Scottish grandfather Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronJambo Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 On 16/02/2019 at 02:39, OTT said: Born: London Raised: London How is this even a debate? The laddie is English, yet again Ireland are trying to play players that aren't Irish because their domestic league is pish and they can't develop enough decent players. After McGeady and McCarthy I can't have any sympathy for them whatsoever. If you base your international recruitment policy on such flimsy footing then you can't be annoyed when an Englishman decides he'd rather play for England. I agree. The Irish for him to play for them because his grandparents are Irish, it's them that have caused the conflict here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SE16 3LN Posted February 17, 2019 Share Posted February 17, 2019 Where people are born makes no ****ing difference to anything. Master racers are out in force today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted March 12, 2019 Author Share Posted March 12, 2019 Rice has just won The Football Association of Ireland young player of the year award Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnthomas Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 4 minutes ago, Maroon Sailor said: Rice has just won The Football Association of Ireland young player of the year award Brilliant ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor jambo Posted March 12, 2019 Share Posted March 12, 2019 On 17/02/2019 at 08:56, Maroon Sailor said: So why did he pull on a Ireland shirt and represent them ? Lets face facts- to be an England international puts several zeros onto your pay packet compared to Ireland. If England came along for most players they would try and find a granny. Sentimentality is in short supply these days vs the millions you can earn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted March 12, 2019 Author Share Posted March 12, 2019 35 minutes ago, doctor jambo said: Lets face facts- to be an England international puts several zeros onto your pay packet compared to Ireland. If England came along for most players they would try and find a granny. Sentimentality is in short supply these days vs the millions you can earn That's not the issue though I agree with another post on this thread that when you sign your first professional contract you should declare what country you would like to represent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey1874 Posted March 25, 2019 Share Posted March 25, 2019 Plays tonight for England Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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