Edinburgh will be Scotlands biggest city within 15 years

[FWJ]

The bypass isn’t really a bypass anymore - it’s a retail park distributor road.  

Should be at least 3 lanes and four going up the hill from Hermiston G.

 

Population-wise Edinburgh is booming but Glasgow’s population isn’t really only 600k - that doesn’t include places that are obviously part of the city like Bearsden, Rutherglen and Newton Mearns.  Nearer (at least) a million.

[Pans Jambo]

25 minutes ago, luckyBatistuta said:

 

That’s what happens when you put a ####wit who has never owned a driving licence in charge.

Ha! Said the very same thing for years. Some numpty gets a Uni degree in tree surgery or some shit & then they get a job as a “civil engineer”. Never been near a driving lesson in their puff or understand the roads. 

Im all for public transport but lets get that nailed down before we force folk onto overcrowded trains and buses that stop every 150 yards!

Was a crash on the bypass this morning around 10am. Bloody 40 mins to get past it. Some “bint” crashed into the back of the car in front! Probably on FB at the time!

[InNothingWeTrust]

1 hour ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

I seem to remember it was more technical than those but effectively that what they are.

 

 

[Greenbank2]

No easy answer. The bypass was designed and construction started in the 70's. Up until the late 90's it was possible to get on at Lothianburn by 8am and sit at 70mph all the way to Gogar. Then things started to deteriorate rapidly. They built the hard shoulder which helped a little. Adding an extra lane will simply deal with the problem for a short period and then it will become a car park again. Look at the M25 where they just keep adding more and more lanes. It makes zero difference at peak time, which seems to be 6am to 11pm!

 

The problem is that people are living further from their place of work, commuting more, in more cars. We need more and more houses primarily driven by more 1 and 2 person households and the fashion to move to bigger and bigger houses (often driven by our selfish, vanity based culture). They are built on greenfield sites where the councils rub their hands at the thought of extra tax, but place no demands on developers to stump up for additional infrastructure, and we get where we are. We are moving steadily towards a society which is dominated by a few major cities and towns surrounded by massive commuter estates. The councils and government will be playing catch up for ever in their ability to move people around. It''s not like they're not trying - the Waverley line, new train line to Broxburn etc, the tram, M8 extension etc etc. It's just not enough. And BTW these massive commuter estates are serviced by a massive supermarket and a few chain pubs - what do they contribute? Sure, the solution is to build more infrastructure, but the money has to come from somewhere, and the only realistic place is the developers. And that means more expensive housing. But long as people want to live in 4-bedroomed detached houses with a double garage and gardens as cheaply as possible, that isn't  going to happen.

 

On the Airport - the whole situation is appalling. The current owners bought it and had a (I think) a 5 year plan. They are now approaching the point of selling and are maximising revenue in order to make the biggest profit. They have been allowed to expand routes without any significant investment in infrastructure and now the terminal and roads are not fit for purpose. Buy hey, we don't need to go via Heathrow any longer! Right? I have a friend works there. Believe it or not,  Ryanair, Jet2 etc pay less in landing charges for many flights than many of us do to drop off and pick up!!!! The business plan has been to get routes in by virtually giving the facility for free to airlines, and generate revenue from the passengers using the ground facilities. When the current owners sell, there needs to be government intervention to force any prospective new owner to invest in adequate infrastructure.

[redjambo]

22 minutes ago, InNothingWeTrust said:

 

 

 

I was half expecting a frog to come out and start jumping across the road between the cars. A misspent childhood I'm afraid.

[pablo]

@Greenbank2 

 

Good post! I agree with many of your points. The only challenge I would have, is that you haven't considered how we might live differently in the future. 

 

I don't think nearly as many people will be making a daily commute to work, or will even own their own car by the time today's children reach working age.

[the jambo poet]

When you add in a tractor/JCB to the bypass it's an accident waiting to happen. Why are these allowed on a road that max speed is 70mph? They're not allowed on the motorways, why ring roads etc.? You go from 70/80 to 25mph in about 5 seconds...then up and down again and so on. If these same machines were driving through the city and not on the bypass you wouldn't have to worry as the max speed nearly everywhere is 20mph now. 

 

Whoever designed the bypass was also only thinking short term. It should be continuous from the M8 all the way through the A1. Where else in the UK has such donut ideas where the main road/motorway just ends. Go round a roundabout and begin again. Then again. Then again. There should be flyovers, unders, whatevers to keep the traffic flowing, not stop them at every intersection. Jeezo

 

[southcap]

1 hour ago, Greenbank2 said:

No easy answer. The bypass was designed and construction started in the 70's. Up until the late 90's it was possible to get on at Lothianburn by 8am and sit at 70mph all the way to Gogar. Then things started to deteriorate rapidly. They built the hard shoulder which helped a little. Adding an extra lane will simply deal with the problem for a short period and then it will become a car park again. Look at the M25 where they just keep adding more and more lanes. It makes zero difference at peak time, which seems to be 6am to 11pm!

 

The problem is that people are living further from their place of work, commuting more, in more cars. We need more and more houses primarily driven by more 1 and 2 person households and the fashion to move to bigger and bigger houses (often driven by our selfish, vanity based culture). They are built on greenfield sites where the councils rub their hands at the thought of extra tax, but place no demands on developers to stump up for additional infrastructure, and we get where we are. We are moving steadily towards a society which is dominated by a few major cities and towns surrounded by massive commuter estates. The councils and government will be playing catch up for ever in their ability to move people around. It''s not like they're not trying - the Waverley line, new train line to Broxburn etc, the tram, M8 extension etc etc. It's just not enough. And BTW these massive commuter estates are serviced by a massive supermarket and a few chain pubs - what do they contribute? Sure, the solution is to build more infrastructure, but the money has to come from somewhere, and the only realistic place is the developers. And that means more expensive housing. But long as people want to live in 4-bedroomed detached houses with a double garage and gardens as cheaply as possible, that isn't  going to happen.

 

On the Airport - the whole situation is appalling. The current owners bought it and had a (I think) a 5 year plan. They are now approaching the point of selling and are maximising revenue in order to make the biggest profit. They have been allowed to expand routes without any significant investment in infrastructure and now the terminal and roads are not fit for purpose. Buy hey, we don't need to go via Heathrow any longer! Right? I have a friend works there. Believe it or not,  Ryanair, Jet2 etc pay less in landing charges for many flights than many of us do to drop off and pick up!!!! The business plan has been to get routes in by virtually giving the facility for free to airlines, and generate revenue from the passengers using the ground facilities. When the current owners sell, there needs to be government intervention to force any prospective new owner to invest in adequate infrastructure.

So, unchecked capitalism and consumerism only leads to misery.

 

Consider me shocked.

[luckyBatistuta]

1 hour ago, redjambo said:

 

I was half expecting a frog to come out and start jumping across the road between the cars. A misspent childhood I'm afraid.

 

Thought exactly the same thing 

[Greenbank2]

51 minutes ago, pablo said:

@Greenbank2 

 

Good post! I agree with many of your points. The only challenge I would have, is that you haven't considered how we might live differently in the future. 

 

I don't think nearly as many people will be making a daily commute to work, or will even own their own car by the time today's children reach working age.

 

You raise a valid point, and I think that autonomous vehicles will be a reality within the next 5 years and will absolutely help.

 

I am seeing something different happen on Work From Home, which I think is a big part of your commute point. While I think this is valid, my experience is that there is a drift away from employees of big companies "working from home". The WFH culture exploded rapidly in the early naughties with second home telephone lines and broadband and was pioneered in the US and particularly in Silicon Valley. Many companies there have reversed the practice as they realised that "WFH" meant doing the weekly shop or taking the kids to school etc! I think that reversal will happen more and more here. Although I think there is a growing movement towards a 4 day work week, which by the time we get to the next generation, will be pervasive in many professions. Another point on that is the current burgeoning city model that places like London and San Francisco are seeing, where more and more companies are relocating to these city centres because they believe there is a critical mass of innovation that results from talented people being co-located. They all have to commute there though.

 

One additional thing that would really help, and is a major contributor to the current congestion, is kids getting dropped off a school. Investment in making it safe for them to walk there and back would make a huge difference. It could be done, as it was in the past when, as in my day, nobody got a lift to school.

[EIEIO]

5 hours ago, Shrekeo said:

On the bypass, why is it always so busy/gridlocked about 4:00 everyday going Westbound?

 

I can’t figure it out as it’s the wrong direction for commuters and it surely can’t be the school pick ups etc. It’s often worse than rush hour. 

If you live in West Lothian or Falkirk for example and work flexi time lots of people choose to work 7am to 3 or 3:30 pm. This allows you to avoid worst of the traffic in both directions. Though perhaps not if the bypass is so busy at 4pm.

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

It is time the M1 was extended north to Edinburgh. No other city of its size has no direct motorway south. A large arena for major acts is needed too so the burgeoning population don't have to travel to Glasgow or Manchester to see them. 

[Governor Tarkin]

6 hours ago, luckyBatistuta said:

 

My mates who are traffic cops tell me that it’s the lorries that cause the problems around Baberton, as they can’t get the speed up the hill?

 

It's also twats in the outside lane panicking af the thought or first sign of trafic coming on from the Baberton sliproad and trying to force their way into the inside lane. If everyone in the outside lane just let one car on at a time instead of weaving all about the road then there wouldn't be an issue. This is my pet rage at the moment. You see it everywhere but Baberton is particularly bad.

 

****s just don't know how to manage or read the road.

 

??????????

[Taffin]

A lot of people on this thread have clearly never lived/worked somewhere busy ??

 

I was working back in Edinburgh a few weeks back and my mum was giving it the whole "bypass and m8 rush hour will be a nightmare"...hardly the end of the world when it came to it.

[jack D and coke]

3 hours ago, All roads lead to Gorgie said:

It is time the M1 was extended north to Edinburgh. No other city of its size has no direct motorway south. A large arena for major acts is needed too so the burgeoning population don't have to travel to Glasgow or Manchester to see them. 

Someone told me the hydro was originally intended for Edinburgh and the council knocked it back. No idea if that’s true though. 

Wouldnt surprise me they only care for the fringe or Hogmanay and **** everything else. 

[jack D and coke]

10 minutes ago, Taffin said:

A lot of people on this thread have clearly never lived/worked somewhere busy ??

 

I was working back in Edinburgh a few weeks back and my mum was giving it the whole "bypass and m8 rush hour will be a nightmare"...hardly the end of the world when it came to it.

Hmm dunno. I’ve worked, driven and travelled around a lot of uk cities at rush hours and Edinburgh is as bad as any of them now. 

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

3 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Someone told me the hydro was originally intended for Edinburgh and the council knocked it back. No idea if that’s true though. 

Wouldnt surprise me they only care for the fringe or Hogmanay and **** everything else. 

That is condensed into about six weeks a year leaving an awful lot of time when nothing much happens. Thank **** for Heart of Midlothian 

If the city is growing with a younger population arriving here we might get an arena, if it is people coming here to retire then maybe not so likely. 

[Taffin]

16 minutes ago, jack D and coke said:

Hmm dunno. I’ve worked, driven and travelled around a lot of uk cities at rush hours and Edinburgh is as bad as any of them now. 

 

I agree that the city itself is awful to drive in but I've never experienced the bypass or the M8 to be anything like as consistently gridlocked as the M25 or parts of the M4 and M1. I have a particular dislike of the M40 too. 

 

 

[Maple Leaf]

Highway 401 through Toronto.

 

[Husky]

Also more houses to be built at cammo and the Maybury 

Queensferry road Maybury road are already gridlock 

[jack D and coke]

34 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

I agree that the city itself is awful to drive in but I've never experienced the bypass or the M8 to be anything like as consistently gridlocked as the M25 or parts of the M4 and M1. I have a particular dislike of the M40 too. 

 

 

Ooft the M25 is another ball game I’ll admit that. 

[Bozi]

23 hours ago, reaths17 said:

were gonna need a new stadium, not just a stand.

Unfortunately loads of armchair fans will be Celtic or TheRangers because their grandad once went to Ireland or visited Govan 

 

Arse holes 

[stirlo]

5 hours ago, All roads lead to Gorgie said:

It is time the M1 was extended north to Edinburgh. No other city of its size has no direct motorway south. A large arena for major acts is needed too so the burgeoning population don't have to travel to Glasgow or Manchester to see them. 

I've always found it ridiculous that significant sections of the main road between Edinburgh and Newcastle remain single lane carriageway as there would be clear benefits for both cities/areas in being better linked. There are actually plans to dual two sections of the A1 in Northumbria over the next few years but no such plans on this side of the border.

 

As for Edinburgh Airport, it is clearly great that we can fly to so many places directly from Edinburgh nowadays, but the infrastructure - both in terms of the terminal itself and the surrounding roads - is just not able to cope at times. It seems to me that the infrastructure is always being extended in a rather piecemeal way and that it never really keeps up with the needs created by increases in passenger numbers. 

 

In general, it's a very positive sign that Edinburgh is growing and projected to grow significantly over the coming decades - but much more focus needs to be placed on having the necessary infrastructure in place to support the growing population.  

[All roads lead to Gorgie]

1 hour ago, stirlo said:

I've always found it ridiculous that significant sections of the main road between Edinburgh and Newcastle remain single lane carriageway as there would be clear benefits for both cities/areas in being better linked. There are actually plans to dual two sections of the A1 in Northumbria over the next few years but no such plans on this side of the border.

 

As for Edinburgh Airport, it is clearly great that we can fly to so many places directly from Edinburgh nowadays, but the infrastructure - both in terms of the terminal itself and the surrounding roads - is just not able to cope at times. It seems to me that the infrastructure is always being extended in a rather piecemeal way and that it never really keeps up with the needs created by increases in passenger numbers. 

 

In general, it's a very positive sign that Edinburgh is growing and projected to grow significantly over the coming decades - but much more focus needs to be placed on having the necessary infrastructure in place to support the growing population.  

I think a second runway will be needed soon as during peak times you can be kept held in a queue for quite a while as planes land and take off alternately. Achieving that will be tricky due to finding space for a second runway and the opposition that will undoubtedly arise. 

[IronJambo]

On 19/09/2018 at 21:41, Geoff the Mince said:

No surprise with the amount of housing being built , shame no one thought to build more Schools and GP surgeries .

 

also the new housing from Sheriffhall all the way up past Straiton means the bypass ain't a bypass anymore .

Of course it is, the Edinburgh boundary hasn't moved. 

[red21]

Quote

Someone told me the hydro was originally intended for Edinburgh and the council knocked it back. No idea if that’s true though. 

 

Think I read that on Kickback - one possible reason for the knock back being that it was seen as a threat to the venues owned/managed by the council? Also not entirely sure if that's correct - but would be interesting to know why if that's not the reason.

[Jambo, Goodbye]

Off topic but with all the bypass chat, thought I'd share this vid.

 

It almost gets stressful when the traffic builds up but satisfying when you see it flowing 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yITr127KZtQ

 

 

Wish I knew how to embed the video on here

 

 

 

Edited September 21, 2018 by Jambo, Goodbye

[luckyBatistuta]

37 minutes ago, Jambo, Goodbye said:

Off topic but with all the bypass chat, thought I'd share this vid.

 

It almost gets stressful when the traffic builds up but satisfying when you see it flowing 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yITr127KZtQ

 

 

Wish I knew how to embed the video on here

 

 

 

 

 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

14 hours ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

I seem to remember it was more technical than those but effectively that what they are.

I've heard it described as a form of a standing wave. Don't know if that's what you were looking for.

[Pans Jambo]

A quick fix for the city bypass could be 40 mph average speed cameras during peak times. They seem to work as they piss everyone off & they all drive at exactly 40mph. That would keep the traffic flowing. 

Secondly. No Tractors on the bypass between 7-9am & 4-6pm. 

Third. No HGV on the overtaking lane. Ever!

Fourth.  Put cones on the exit of all slip roads to make traffic entering the bypass actually get up to the same speed as the traffic flow before cutting in instead of what they do now is creep up to the very start of the exit (at the chevrons) and then some arsehole stops & lets them in which then causes a queue to form on the bypass. That pisses me off!

 

Lastly. Stay in the fecking lane you are in ya feckin bassas!!!! Arseholes who keep swapping lanes get right on my titz!!!