Foresight and forward planning?

[Martin_T]

Do Hearts plan anything in advance? It just seems to me that the club is run in the most anarchic, spontaneous, erratic manner. It's recently been made clear to us that we need to live within our means, young players are the future etc. Yet as recently as August we sack a manager with a proven track record of bring through young players and working with a tight budget and replace him with a high profile continental replacement with no track record in Scottish football. So a few questions I feel need answered:

 

• 
   
  
• Why did we sack Jim Jefferies given the scale of our ambition has been downgraded only two months later?
  
• Why were 4 new experienced professionals recruited in the summer?
  
• Why does the club continue to run with a squad that is ludicrous in size and what was the justifaction for retaining as many players in the first place?
  
• What is the justification for having a business plan that sees the club committed to spending ?2 for every ?1 it earns?
  
• Why are we seemingly planning to cover costs with potential earnings (the Craig Gordon transfer money)?
  

 

I am quite happy to see the club run within it's means, but I do not feel that the current ownership are capable of delivering this. What exactly is David Southern's role at the club? If he had full executive responsibility in any other business and had presided over this mess he would have been sacked. The fact that David probably has very limited executive responsibilty leads me to my next point, the club should appoint a professional management at executive level to run the club and be allowed to run the club with it's own banking facilities. The way we seem to run currently is that all income is spirited away to Lithuania and dispensed to the club when it needs it (if it's available!), that is farcical.

 

There just seems to be no medium or long term strategy in place at Hearts, they seem to just make it up as they go along. That for me above all other issues is worrying.

[John McClure]

its been like this since vlad arrived

[Robbo-Jambo]

Do Hearts plan anything in advance? It just seems to me that the club is run in the most anarchic, spontaneous, erratic manner. It's recently been made clear to us that we need to live within our means, young players are the future etc. Yet as recently as August we sack a manager with a proven track record of bring through young players and working with a tight budget and replace him with a high profile continental replacement with no track record in Scottish football. So a few questions I feel need answered:

 

• 
   
  
• Why did we sack Jim Jefferies given the scale of our ambition has been downgraded only two months later?
  
• Why were 4 new experienced professionals recruited in the summer?
  
• Why does the club continue to run with a squad that is ludicrous in size and what was the justifaction for retaining as many players in the first place?
  
• What is the justification for having a business plan that sees the club committed to spending ?2 for every ?1 it earns?
  
• Why are we seemingly planning to cover costs with potential earnings (the Craig Gordon transfer money)?
  

 

I am quite happy to see the club run within it's means, but I do not feel that the current ownership are capable of delivering this. What exactly is David Southern's role at the club? If he had full executive responsibility in any other business and had presided over this mess he would have been sacked. The fact that David probably has very limited executive responsibilty leads me to my next point, the club should appoint a professional management at executive level to run the club and be allowed to run the club with it's own banking facilities. The way we seem to run currently is that all income is spirited away to Lithuania and dispensed to the club when it needs it (if it's available!), that is farcical.

 

There just seems to be no medium or long term strategy in place at Hearts, they seem to just make it up as they go along. That for me above all other issues is worrying.

Well said. Good post. The way we are run is farcical and embarrassing.

[Francis Albert]

Agreed, but not sure it was much different before Vlad arrived, when somehow we seemed to overlook the fact that we owed SMG ?4m and spent the money instead.

[Paolo]

Agreed, but not sure it was much different before Vlad arrived, when somehow we seemed to overlook the fact that we owed SMG ?4m and spent the money instead.

 

Yes, Pieman treated it as an investment or a gift. He refused to acknoweldge that it was and always was a loan.

[Coco]

Agreed, but not sure it was much different before Vlad arrived, when somehow we seemed to overlook the fact that we owed SMG ?4m and spent the money instead.

 

The exasperating thing at the time was that the Pieman knew that there was overspending cooked into the books for the year. That overspending was leading to the club selling the ground and he said that Stewart Fraser's financial forecasts were turning out to be correct.

[Martin_T]

On the subject of the ludicrous squad size:

 

4 goalkeepers with senior game time for one position

 

Kello

McDonald

Balogh

Ridgers

 

10 defenders on the books with senior game time, including incredibly 6 players who have played right back but only one left back

 

J Thomson

C Thomson

Barr

Webster

Zaliukas

McGowan

Grainger

Balatoni

Hamill

Jonsson

 

An utterly ludicrous 19 players with first team game time in midfield currently on the books, fighting for 4 or 5 places

 

Skacel

Black

Mrowiec

Jonsson

Stevenson

J Stewart

J Holt

D Prychenko

Hamill

Driver

Templeton

Suso

Taouil

Novikovas

S Robinson

Obua

R McGowan

 

Strikers - 7 players fighting for what is usually one position in the team.

 

Elliot

Elliott

Glen

Kyle

Sutton

Smith

Stevenson

 

The squad is absolutely absurd in size and it really is no wonder that the wage bill is totally unsustainable. We should really be looking to have 18 senior professionals at best, backed up by Academy players. Why was this allowed to happen? Why did VR agree to this, as ultimately all of these players have now been signed or re-signed during his tenure. We could comfortably cut at least 10 players and still maintain a competitive squad for the SPL...and all of this is especially absurd when you consider that 4 games in Europe apart, we usually only contest 3 competitions and have regularly exited early from the cups under VR. The final absurdity being of course that there is no reserve league, so many of these players spend their weekends with their backsides sitting in the stands!

 

The UBIG/ VR era really has been an excellent lesson in how not to run a football club.

[Munch]

Yes, Pieman treated it as an investment or a gift. He refused to acknoweldge that it was and always was a loan.

 

err dont forget his 50 50 partner who seems to have riggled his way out like a snake erm nothing to do with me guv in all.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Agreed, but not sure it was much different before Vlad arrived, when somehow we seemed to overlook the fact that we owed SMG ?4m and spent the money instead.

 

 

That also goes for the ?2m borrowed by Robinson from Scottish & Newcastle, which was paid off by the sale of Bednar.

[Chaps]

On the subject of the ludicrous squad size:

 

4 goalkeepers with senior game time for one position

 

Kello

McDonald

Balogh

Ridgers

 

10 defenders on the books with senior game time, including incredibly 6 players who have played right back but only one left back

 

J Thomson

C Thomson

Barr

Webster

Zaliukas

Grainger

Balatoni

Hamill

 

 

An utterly ludicrous 19 players with first team game time in midfield currently on the books, fighting for 4 or 5 places

 

Skacel

Black-Maybe

Mrowiec

Jonsson

Stevenson

J Stewart

J Holt

D Prychenko

Hamill

Driver

Templeton

Suso

Taouil

Novikovas

S Robinson

Obua

 

Strikers - 7 players fighting for what is usually one position in the team.

 

Elliot

Elliott

Glen

Kyle

Sutton- Maybe

Smith

Stevenson

 

The squad is absolutely absurd in size and it really is no wonder that the wage bill is totally unsustainable. We should really be looking to have 18 senior professionals at best, backed up by Academy players. Why was this allowed to happen? Why did VR agree to this, as ultimately all of these players have now been signed or re-signed during his tenure. We could comfortably cut at least 10 players and still maintain a competitive squad for the SPL...and all of this is especially absurd when you consider that 4 games in Europe apart, we usually only contest 3 competitions and have regularly exited early from the cups under VR. The final absurdity being of course that there is no reserve league, so many of these players spend their weekends with their backsides sitting in the stands!

 

The UBIG/ VR era really has been an excellent lesson in how not to run a football club.

 

 

Their the players that I think that will be shifted on.

[Debut 4]

Do Hearts plan anything in advance? It just seems to me that the club is run in the most anarchic, spontaneous, erratic manner. It's recently been made clear to us that we need to live within our means, young players are the future etc. Yet as recently as August we sack a manager with a proven track record of bring through young players and working with a tight budget and replace him with a high profile continental replacement with no track record in Scottish football. So a few questions I feel need answered:

 

• 
   
  
• Why did we sack Jim Jefferies given the scale of our ambition has been downgraded only two months later?
  
• Why were 4 new experienced professionals recruited in the summer?
  
• Why does the club continue to run with a squad that is ludicrous in size and what was the justifaction for retaining as many players in the first place?
  
• What is the justification for having a business plan that sees the club committed to spending ?2 for every ?1 it earns?
  
• Why are we seemingly planning to cover costs with potential earnings (the Craig Gordon transfer money)?
  

 

I am quite happy to see the club run within it's means, but I do not feel that the current ownership are capable of delivering this. What exactly is David Southern's role at the club? If he had full executive responsibility in any other business and had presided over this mess he would have been sacked. The fact that David probably has very limited executive responsibilty leads me to my next point, the club should appoint a professional management at executive level to run the club and be allowed to run the club with it's own banking facilities. The way we seem to run currently is that all income is spirited away to Lithuania and dispensed to the club when it needs it (if it's available!), that is farcical.

 

There just seems to be no medium or long term strategy in place at Hearts, they seem to just make it up as they go along. That for me above all other issues is worrying.

It was one of the things that struck me after the announcement from Vlad recently.....why sack JJ, walk in all chuffed with himself as he appoints PS and then say the club is up for sale just a couple of months or so later????

 

Its a vlad vlad world indeed.

[Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC]

I doubt the ?1.5 million tax bill was in the start of the season plan and it's all went tits up from there.

[Paolo]

err dont forget his 50 50 partner who seems to have riggled his way out like a snake erm nothing to do with me guv in all.

Fair point. Deans' own company owed a fortune at that point too.

[gowestjambo]

I doubt the ?1.5 million tax bill was in the start of the season plan and it's all went tits up from there.

 

Business's know a year in advance what the Tax liability is going to be. To suggest otherwise is absurd.

[Koolkeith]

Balogh

J Thomson

C Thomson

Barr

Balatoni

J Stewart

Suso

Glen

Kyle

Elliot

Driver

 

That's a full team of players who've either never or hardly kicked a ball all season. If they're on an average of say 2k a week each, that's over ?1,144000 a year in wages for nothing in return.

[J Cheever Loophole]

Fair point. Deans' own company owed a fortune at that point too.

 

And to think I used the same company to buy my house, only because he is a Jambo.

How many more of us fell to the all for one and one for all schecht.

[andrew]

err dont forget his 50 50 partner who seems to have riggled his way out like a snake erm nothing to do with me guv in all.

 

Did Deans not step down around the time of the SMG investment because he's wasn't happy with the Pieman's plan to spunk it all away?

[Charlie-Brown]

Business's know a year in advance what the Tax liability is going to be. To suggest otherwise is absurd.

 

Not in this instance GWJ - I think it was an assessment from HMRC investigations with a pay now or else we'll close you down notice attached.

[Francis Albert]

It was one of the things that struck me after the announcement from Vlad recently.....why sack JJ, walk in all chuffed with himself as he appoints PS and then say the club is up for sale just a couple of months or so later????

 

Its a vlad vlad world indeed.

 

But he didn't say that. That is what is now reported as fact by the media and swallowed by too many fans. The main part of the statement was that he would continue to support Hearts. He said he'd consider a partner or a sale. As he has said before and as any club owner would say.

[gowestjambo]

Not in this instance GWJ - I think it was an assessment from HMRC investigations with a pay now or else we'll close you down notice attached.

 

Fair point Charlie, but to suggest this would be unaccounted for is no way to run a business. If indeed it was an assessment it means this matter is far from finalised!

[Sydney]

But he didn't say that. That is what is now reported as fact by the media and swallowed by too many fans. The main part of the statement was that he would continue to support Hearts. He said he'd consider a partner or a sale. As he has said before and as any club owner would say.

 

There's no doubt the club is up for sale. Vlad hoped that Hearts would be a successful football club, hoped that it would be a pathway to further business success in the UK, so he pumped money into it, it tanked, it loses money, he needs to get rid of it.

[Sydney]

Fair point Charlie, but to suggest this would be unaccounted for is no way to run a business. If indeed it was an assessment it means this matter is far from finalised!

 

Hearts spend two pounds for every pound they earn. We already know, and have known for 120 years, that no matter who has been in charge, no one has run it like a business. Professional football clubs are money pits. Anyone who tries to make a profit from them (apart from a lucky few at the very, very top of the game) is kidding themselves on.

 

Barcelona, Real Madrid, Man City, Chelsea, Rangers are all run terribly - and Hearts are no different. Even Hibs, with their "prudent financial bollocks" are run badly. They always make a loss unless they're lucky enough to 1) find some land to sell or 2) sell players. When neither of these options are available, they make a loss. Arsenal make a loss when they're not selling flats. Killie make a loss. Celtic often make a loss. Dunfermline have been promoted and are struggling financially.

 

Football, everywhere, is badly run.

[gowestjambo]

Hearts spend two pounds for every pound they earn. We already know, and have known for 120 years, that no matter who has been in charge, no one has run it like a business. Professional football clubs are money pits. Anyone who tries to make a profit from them (apart from a lucky few at the very, very top of the game) is kidding themselves on.

 

Barcelona, Real Madrid, Man City, Chelsea, Rangers are all run terribly - and Hearts are no different. Even Hibs, with their "prudent financial bollocks" are run badly. They always make a loss unless they're lucky enough to 1) find some land to sell or 2) sell players. When neither of these options are available, they make a loss. Arsenal make a loss when they're not selling flats. Killie make a loss. Celtic often make a loss. Dunfermline have been promoted and are struggling financially.

 

Football, everywhere, is badly run.

 

I do not dispute anything you say.However, just because it has always been that way does not mean it will never change!

 

Football Clubs can make a loss year after year, but they can only run out of money once!

 

Time for a dose of realism, not just in Football but in the current economic climate we find ourselves in. The Never Never has just got a whole lot closer........

[jamboinglasgow]

Not in this instance GWJ - I think it was an assessment from HMRC investigations with a pay now or else we'll close you down notice attached.

 

I do think if it is the tax case that has been hinted we were getting assessed for it would make sense, Hearts realised with an amnesty offered by the HMRC we are better paying it now as we have seen what is about to happen to Rangers, so we went to HMRC and they agreed the fee, but we asked them for either installments or delayed payment, the HMRC are fed up with more waiting or felt they had been generous enough with an offer and putting it into installments would be taking the piss demanded it now, thus forcing Hearts to pay it now. I do hope its that tax charge and we have just accepted and payed, if it is I will sleep a bit easier about the long term future of Hearts.

[Guess The Crowd]

Do Hearts plan anything in advance? It just seems to me that the club is run in the most anarchic, spontaneous, erratic manner. It's recently been made clear to us that we need to live within our means, young players are the future etc. Yet as recently as August we sack a manager with a proven track record of bring through young players and working with a tight budget and replace him with a high profile continental replacement with no track record in Scottish football. So a few questions I feel need answered:

 

• 
   
  
• Why did we sack Jim Jefferies given the scale of our ambition has been downgraded only two months later?
  
• Why were 4 new experienced professionals recruited in the summer?
  
• Why does the club continue to run with a squad that is ludicrous in size and what was the justifaction for retaining as many players in the first place?
  
• What is the justification for having a business plan that sees the club committed to spending ?2 for every ?1 it earns?
  
• Why are we seemingly planning to cover costs with potential earnings (the Craig Gordon transfer money)?
  

 

I am quite happy to see the club run within it's means, but I do not feel that the current ownership are capable of delivering this. What exactly is David Southern's role at the club? If he had full executive responsibility in any other business and had presided over this mess he would have been sacked. The fact that David probably has very limited executive responsibilty leads me to my next point, the club should appoint a professional management at executive level to run the club and be allowed to run the club with it's own banking facilities. The way we seem to run currently is that all income is spirited away to Lithuania and dispensed to the club when it needs it (if it's available!), that is farcical.

 

There just seems to be no medium or long term strategy in place at Hearts, they seem to just make it up as they go along. That for me above all other issues is worrying.

 

 

Everything you say is correct, and another way of looking at it is this.

 

Given that Hearts' wage bill has been at least, say, three times bigger than it needed to be for the last six and a half years, the amount already invested in wages by Vlad /UBIG should have actually sustained the club for about twenty years!

 

That, for me, is the most galling thing about running out of cash now.

[Floyd]

Anyone for a euro millions ticket this weekend??

[Thunderstruck]

But he didn't say that. That is what is now reported as fact by the media and swallowed by too many fans. The main part of the statement was that he would continue to support Hearts. He said he'd consider a partner or a sale. As he has said before and as any club owner would say.

 

Exactly. I was beginning to think I had missed some important announcement or the placement of a "For Sale" sign over the main stand.

 

While it is fair to say that everyone has their price, to say that the club is actively being sold is an exaggeration fueled by the media on the one hand and some wishful thinking on the other.

[Martin_T]

I doubt the ?1.5 million tax bill was in the start of the season plan and it's all went tits up from there.

 

How much do you think it would have cost to sack Jim Jefferies and replace them with Paulo Sergio and staff? Was that necessary and in line with the apparent new direction of the club?

[Debut 4]

But he didn't say that. That is what is now reported as fact by the media and swallowed by too many fans. The main part of the statement was that he would continue to support Hearts. He said he'd consider a partner or a sale. As he has said before and as any club owner would say.

Ok then FA, you know what i mean though and my point remains. Why sack a manager if you don`t really have a long term project or aim for the club? That you really want out if possible or someone else to take the heat/pick the te...eh...buy players

[Francis Albert]

Ok then FA, you know what i mean though and my point remains. Why sack a manager if you don`t really have a long term project or aim for the club? That you really want out if possible or someone else to take the heat/pick the te...eh...buy players

 

Maybe his decision to try to sell the club (now apparently confirmed) hadn't been made at the time of the decision to sack JJ. Far-sightedness is not one of Vlad's qualities.Or maybe he felt a continuation of JJ's one win in fourteen form would make the club even less attractive to any potential buyer. In the grand scheme of things the cost of replacing the manager is chicken feed (although admittedly the cost of doing it 8 times in 5 years would feed quite a few chickens).